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Predestination, All Things are Determined by God, Even the Outcome of a Roll of a Dice

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#151
the_sign

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They still are, except that this time you got caught trying to blow him away with a sawed-off shotgun and a pack of lies.


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#152
Born_Again

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They still are, except that this time you got caught trying to blow him away with a sawed-off shotgun and a pack of lies.

What does that even mean??? Back on topic, folks. 


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#153
bbyrd009

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They still are, except that this time you got caught trying to blow him away with a sawed-off shotgun and a pack of lies.

ya, i can't relate this to any of the preceding either, sorry.


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Who told you that you were naked?


#154
the_sign

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What does that even mean??? 

 

It means you're trying to load the dice in your favor.


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#155
shnarkle

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On another note I do have a question for Stan because this is a very interesting conversation. When you are talking about God and saying that He can only love and not hate are you suggesting that God has no control over some aspects of his nature and character? Are you saying that God cannot hate evil? Almost like it's something he can't choose to do?


I'm not speaking for Stan, but I do have something to contribute. God has total control over his nature and character; they are one and the same. God does not have to hate evil. The love of God is agony and excruciating pain for Satan; it is wrath to Satan. I don't recall who said this, but it's as if the only thing keeping Satan going are the most beautiful, blissful, joyous words of God echoing in his mind, telling him to go to hell.

God doesn't tell anyone to go to hell, but his holiness, and love, are like an acid to those who are evil. As C.S. Lewis put it, the gates of hell are locked from the inside.
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#156
shnarkle

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and asked them, "Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?" They answered, "No, we have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit." (Acts 19:2 [NIV])[/size]

Paul taught that no one could believe without the enabling power of the holy spirit. These men could not have questioned the existence of the holy spirit and Paul would have rebuked them if they had. The reference can only be to the promised gifts of the holy spirit.
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#157
shnarkle

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He does hate, hence why Paul also explains,
 
What if God, although choosing to show his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the objects of his wrath--prepared for destruction? (Romans 9:22 [NIV])[/size]

 

Do you suppose he loved, or hated, these vessels that he himself prepared for destruction? You have a very one sided view of God, for God is indeed love, but God is also a consuming fire,
 
for our "God is a consuming fire." (Hebrews 12:29 [NIV])[/size]

I think the answer to this dilemma may be found in the parable of the wheat and chaff. The chaff is what is gathered up and burned while the wheat is gathered into the barn. Where was the chaff prior to being separated from the wheat? It was what was encapsulating the wheat itself. Jesus says to "deny yourself". Perhaps he's saying to see that the chaff isn't the wheat. Perhaps he's saying that we need to see that what we see as ourselves really isn't who we are; we need to deny that because regardless of how we look at ourselves we must deny ourselves. If we choose to identify with ourselves then we are identifying with what is going to be consumed by that fire.
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#158
bbyrd009

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I think the answer to this dilemma may be found in the parable of the wheat and chaff. The chaff is what is gathered up and burned while the wheat is gathered into the barn. Where was the chaff prior to being separated from the wheat? It was what was encapsulating the wheat itself. Jesus says to "deny yourself". Perhaps he's saying to see that the chaff isn't the wheat. Perhaps he's saying that we need to see that what we see as ourselves really isn't who we are; we need to deny that because regardless of how we look at ourselves we must deny ourselves. If we choose to identify with ourselves then we are identifying with what is going to be consumed by that fire.

i am seeing that this is a different concept from "wheat and tares," hmm.


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Who told you that you were naked?


#159
shnarkle

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i am seeing that this is a different concept from "wheat and tares," hmm.


It works on that level as well. Tares cannot become wheat, wolves cannot become sheep, what is flesh is flesh, what is spirit is spirit. chaff doesn't look like chaff until it has been winnowed.
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