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AN OVERVIEW OF THE BIBLE:

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44 replies to this topic

#31
bbyrd009

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888

This is too vague.  Some take the words "take up your cross" to indicate you have to do some works to be saved.  The message of God's grace is that He has done all the works necessary for a person to be saved. They only have to believe it.

well, obviously something has to be done, that does not result in salvation, but rather manifests from it. And imo drone bombing innocents is not going to qualify.


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#32
bbyrd009

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***

All your reply does is make one verse defeat other verses.  If that is the way you study the Bible you will not see that they don't.

 

The child of God does not live in fear.  He/she has placed their Belief (faith, trust, confidence) in The gospel of grace that was given to Paul.  These only labor to keep those that want to put them back under works of man in religion.  As you are doing.

well you have to assimilate "pick up your cross and follow Me" for yourself, i guess. I don't see any verses defeating any other verses; i think these speak to different frames of reference, different states of a heart. Not interested in those who only cry "Lord, Lord" while denying any other responsibility any more, wadr. That is what has got us to here imo.


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#33
bbyrd009

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***

Give it up   I used the word we in general to say mankind.  I see that you are now wanting to make this discussion between us personal so as to side track the thread.  I am not going there so have fun.

"What are we supposed to "KEEP AT"??  We who are "IN CHRIST"" have already entered into God's rest."

 

 

so, all of mankind is "in Christ" in your opinion?


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#34
H. Richard

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so, all of mankind is "in Christ" in your opinion?

***
The truth is that all of mankind could be "in Christ" since their sins have been atoned for on the cross.  But the religious will oppose it

 

This thread is an invitation for anyone to make their own overview of the Bible.  Have you done so and given the scriptures that support it?  If not then why are you on this thread?


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#35
H. Richard

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well you have to assimilate "pick up your cross and follow Me" for yourself, i guess. I don't see any verses defeating any other verses; i think these speak to different frames of reference, different states of a heart. Not interested in those who only cry "Lord, Lord" while denying any other responsibility any more, wadr. That is what has got us to here imo.

***

What has got us to here is that I believe in God's grace and you believe you have to do something to get it. It is the same thing the Jews tried to get Paul's converts to do. In other words you seem to believe that you have to do something to get God's gift.

 

I don't think you understand that God will not look kindly on those that refuse His gift?


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#36
bbyrd009

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"Don't be deceived, little children; those who do the right thing are the righteous ones, just as He is righteous." 

***
The truth is that all of mankind could be "in Christ" since their sins have been atoned for on the cross.  

ya, quite possibly, i guess, although the phrase is usually used more specifically, right.


Edited by bbyrd009, 20 February 2017 - 03:53 PM.

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#37
bbyrd009

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This thread is an invitation for anyone to make their own overview of the Bible.  Have you done so and given the scriptures that support it?  If not then why are you on this thread?

um, i thought i was pretty much just replying to your questions here, sorry.


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#38
bbyrd009

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The only time the words FAITH ALONE are found together in the bible is in James 2:24 You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.

 

That seems opposite of what you are saying! 


Edited by bbyrd009, 20 February 2017 - 04:52 PM.

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#39
H. Richard

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1 John 5:4-5
4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world — our faith. 
5 Who is he who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God? 
NKJV

 

 

The only time the words FAITH ALONE are found together in the bible is in James 2:24 You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.

 

That seems opposite of what you are saying! 

 

***

James 1:1
JAMES Greeting to the Twelve Tribes  ---  1 James, a bondservant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, To the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad: Greetings. 
NKJV
 

 

You believe James when he wrote James 2;24  but you do not believe James when he wrote James 1;1.  Interesting.

 

Since the book of James was written to the Jews who were scattered abroad it was not to those under grace.  What is obvious to those that read the scriptures for what they say is that James considered the Jews to be under the law,  This is confirmed by Acts 21:20

 

In the book of James;

 

1. The word “Law” is found in 18 places
2. The word “grace” is found in 2 places
3. The word “Christ” is found in 2 places
4. The word “Justified” is found in 2 place with the words “by works” after them
5. The words “by faith” is found 1 time (justified by works and not by faith only)
 
6. The word “cross” is not found
7. The word “reconciled” is not found
8. The word “sanctified” is not found
9. The word “saved” is not found
10. The words “in Christ” are not found
11. The shed blood of Jesus on the cross is not mentioned.
 

Edited by H. Richard, 21 February 2017 - 08:10 AM.

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#40
dorian37grey

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sorry i am so late to this topic ;

i think an understanding that the over view of the bible is key to seeing what is going on here

after many years of looking ; i offer this

 

the bible

1- the problem

2- the issues ( to fix the problem)

3- the re set ( as the chosen people go into captivity; showing man's state )

4- the answer

5 response to the answer  

6 the end game 

 

did you notice ; how this conversation ended up ; not with the bible over view but rather in #5 response to the answer ( romans to jude ) ? 

imo; a true overview of the bible "must" fit all the pieces of the bible into one story 

 

if we only use romans to jude ; then we only get the responses of the early church and not what the rest of the book was implying *** 

 

the gospel story is contained in those first 4 books of the new testament ( matthew mark, luke and john) because they are the Jesus story ;

and it is that Jesus story that is the ANSWER 

 

but that answer isnt to the responses of the claims and ideas of romans to jude ; --THAT'S BACKWARDS 

 

not one word written by Pail or James etc ; changes what the gospel is ; because the gospel is done and completed by Jesus at the cross 

 

right? 


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#41
H. Richard

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sorry i am so late to this topic ;

i think an understanding that the over view of the bible is key to seeing what is going on here

after many years of looking ; i offer this

 

the bible

1- the problem

2- the issues ( to fix the problem)

3- the re set ( as the chosen people go into captivity; showing man's state )

4- the answer

5 response to the answer  

6 the end game 

 

did you notice ; how this conversation ended up ; not with the bible over view but rather in #5 response to the answer ( romans to jude ) ? 

imo; a true overview of the bible "must" fit all the pieces of the bible into one story 

 

if we only use romans to jude ; then we only get the responses of the early church and not what the rest of the book was implying *** 

 

the gospel story is contained in those first 4 books of the new testament ( matthew mark, luke and john) because they are the Jesus story ;

and it is that Jesus story that is the ANSWER 

 

but that answer isnt to the responses of the claims and ideas of romans to jude ; --THAT'S BACKWARDS 

 

not one word written by Pail or James etc ; changes what the gospel is ; because the gospel is done and completed by Jesus at the cross 

 

right? 

 

***

In this age of God's grace you are right when you say that salvation was completed at the cross.  Only those who put their trust (belief, faith, confidence) in what Jesus did on the cross will be saved in this age of grace.  In this age the law has been set aside for the children of God.


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#42
bbyrd009

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yet it is he who fulfills the law that will judge you, it seems. Break law at your own risk, Paul was pretty clear imo.


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#43
H. Richard

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yet it is he who fulfills the law that will judge you, it seems. Break law at your own risk, Paul was pretty clear imo.

***

Look at what you wrote and examine it.  You have to think that you do not break the law in order to write it.  Do you break the law at your own risk??

 

Don't you realize that mankind CAN NOT KEEP THE LAW?  If they could then Jesus' death on the cross would not have been necessary.

 

What Jesus did, by atoning for the sins of the whole world, made it possible for sinners, like you and me, to be sinless.  Not in the sinful flesh, but in the spirit that God has placed in His children. See Gal. 4:6 below

 

Gal 3:2-11
2 This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 
3 Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh? 
4 Have you suffered so many things in vain — if indeed it was in vain? 
5 Therefore He who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you, does He do it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? —  
6 just as Abraham "believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness."  
7 Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham. 
8 And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, "In you all the nations shall be blessed."  
9 So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham. 
The Law Brings a Curse
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them."  
11 But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for "the just shall live by faith."  
NKJV
 
Gal 4:4-7
4 But when the fullness of the time had come, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the law
5 to redeem those who were under the law, that we might receive the adoption as sons. 
6 And because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into your hearts, crying out, "Abba, Father!"
7 Therefore you are no longer a slave but a son, and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ. 
NKJV

Edited by H. Richard, Today, 07:18 AM.

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#44
bbyrd009

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Fulfilling the law is not the same as being under the law, that is pretty plain. Break the law at your own risk, most definitely. There is (i would say pretty obviously) a diff in falling short accidentally v believing and counseling others that some law is no longer valid, which seems to be the conclusion many reach. The Commandments are not invalidated by Grace; Grace makes allowance for someone who breaks a Commandment, when they evince works unto rebound from breaking the law. Just because we cannot keep every law perfectly does not mean "don't even bother."

 

Paul was pretty clear on this, and i would sure be wary of anyone advocating looking to Christ like a snake on a pole to "save" them from their sins, and relieve them from their responsibility to do righteousness. That is how you get to "Jesus is going to fly down and take me to heaven someday," imo.


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#45
dorian37grey

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i had brought out earlier the topic of issues ( to fix the problem) 

we see these brought out in the bible story form the time periods of Abraham to David

if we look at matthew one ; we would also see these 4 time periods each are marked as well by each time period having their own "WHOSE MOTHER WAS"

 

TAMAR ; genesis post flood ; and the issue brought out here ; the order of melchizedek

 

RAHAB;  journey to the promised land ; the issue brought out here is the law

 

RUTH;  time of judges ; and the issue here is kinsman redemption  

 

BATHSHEBA; time of kings ; which the issue of kingship 

 

looking at Jesus; he addresses the order of melchizedek with his birth ; the law with his life ; kinsman redemption with his death , and returns as king of kings 

 

looking at just the law is missing its place concerning those other issues 


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