Conversation with An Atheist

[Wrangler]

Everyone on the planet was born an atheist

It’s amazing to read such posts from one claiming it’s all subjective opinion.

 

[Wrangler]

This is incorrect. Atheism is a position that makes no claims about the existence of God.

You can’t believe this is true. What dictionary do you rely on?

 

[Wrangler]

Atheism is the default position, it's up to the person making the positive claim to prove it.

You are falsely equating an argument with facts. In this case, the very meaning of words.

I see why you shy away from claiming to be an atheist, which very much makes a positive claim as much as theists do.

 

[Wrangler]

Is your God perfectly good?
If so, why does he allow evil?

The price for Liberty is to allow others to make bad choices.

 

[Wrangler]

Is the Bible the word of God or the contradictory word of man...

Family Relationships
“Honor thy father and thy mother…”– Exodus 20:12

“If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple. ” — Luke 14:26

It’s a cheap shot to hold a highly metaphorical book to literal standards. The first is an absolute statement. The second is relative - even though it is worded poetically as absolute.

Consider the 1C. It doesn’t deny other gods, judges, law makers, master, rulers. It only positions them below the importance of the Creator.

 

[RandyDawson]

It is NOT merely nihilistic disbelief. Atheism, by definition, remains theocentric.

What does that mean in english?

 

[RandyDawson]

The price for Liberty is to allow others to make bad choices.

Yes and when voters in the US vote in the communists and the moslems, that's liberty at work!

They are using their liberty to embrace evil and darkness.

 

[Wrangler]

Yes and when voters in the US vote in the communists and the moslems, that's liberty at work!

They are using their liberty to embrace evil and darkness.

Over spiritualized Christians today are embracing evil and darkness by pretending they are to abstain from giving to Caesar what is Caesar's.

 

[Wrangler]

It is NOT merely nihilistic disbelief. Atheism, by definition, remains theocentric.

What does that mean in english?

I am Groot. I speak English where the words are already defined. Feel free to consult your favorite lexicon.

What part of what I wrote do you not understand as I wrote very precisely? I refer you to Atheism on Trial by Louis Markis.

 

[amigo de christo]

The price for Liberty is to allow others to make bad choices.

the price for rejecting Jesus Christ is absolute damnation . Never forget that .
I really love the approach of paul . For HIM it was JESUS or bust .
Preaching Christ and him crucified . Wish more would . I tried . Guess the good ol preaching of the gospel
thus having to have faith in JESUS , is just seen as religious extremism to some .
But as for me i see it as a dire necessity . And while i know full well i cannot make one beleive ,
i know full well HOW to preach the dire necessity for one to beleive on JESUS .

 

[Mancunian]

The price for Liberty is to allow others to make bad choices.

Or to make them make bad choices.

 

[Mancunian]

You are falsely equating an argument with facts. In this case, the very meaning of words.

I see why you shy away from claiming to be an atheist, which very much makes a positive claim as much as theists do.

I don't understand why you think that. Atheism is a single position on a single question, it's a lack of belief not a belief. I don't go around asserting that a God doesn't exist, that would be a positive claim.

I'm not making a positive claim, I'm simply rejecting that claim on the evidence provided.

Some claims don't require any evidence for belief.... If you told me that you woke up this morning and ate breakfast then went out to the store, I would believe you, I wouldn't have any reason not to. People eat breakfast and go to the store.
If you told me that you woke up this morning and walked a 120 mile round trip to the store, I would want proof of that before I could believe you. People don't walk 120 miles for groceries.... You telling me that other people saw you do it, or you family believe you (especially if their stories contradict eachother) isn't sufficient evidence.
I would take the sensible position of disbelief, BUT I'm not saying for certain that you didn't walk 120 miles.

 

[Mancunian]

And on top of that...
If you told me that something bad will happen to me if I don't believe you, then I would also want evidence of the bad thing.
If you can't provide me with sufficient evidence of the original claim, or the consequences then why would I be worried about the outcome?

That's where I'm at.

 

[Mancunian]

It’s amazing to read such posts from one claiming it’s all subjective opinion.

Are you saying that from the moment we are born, we believe in God?

 

[Mancunian]

You, being a father yourself must know the answer to that.

 

[Marvelloustime]

the price for rejecting Jesus Christ is absolute damnation . Never forget that .
I really love the approach of paul . For HIM it was JESUS or bust .
Preaching Christ and him crucified . Wish more would . I tried . Guess the good ol preaching of the gospel
thus having to have faith in JESUS , is just seen as religious extremism to some .
But as for me i see it as a dire necessity . And while i know full well i cannot make one beleive ,
i know full well HOW to preach the dire necessity for one to beleive on JESUS .

@amigo de christo

 

[Wrangler]

it's a lack of belief not a belief.

No. Atheism is inherently nihilistic. It’s not merely a denial but a positive determination; there is no God.

But why defend it since you do believe in a Creator?

 

[Wrangler]

@Mancunian,

I read Romans 2 in devotional reading today. I use it to justify our grace filled God will save people who don’t believe. Take a look and tell me what you think.

 

[LoveYeshua]

I'm an agnostic atheist. Until the creator truly reveals it's/ his or herself to me I will hold that position.
If the creator does reveal itself to me there's no saying that it will be a God in the traditional sense, it may well be a force that isn't interested in worship and has no grand plan for the inhabitants of it's creation.

I wouldn't like to speculate or give whatever it is/was a personality, I wouldn't guess at it's likes and dislikes. I certainly wouldn't take the word of the anonymous scribes of yesteryear....

Atheism is a disbelief pure and simple. Everyone on the planet was born an atheist.... Geography upbringing and societal norms made them into theists.

As I've said before, I can see why people buy into religion, it's comforting, there's a sense of belonging and so on. Atheism offers nothing, zilch, zip, nothing.
There's no catch with atheism... I know what I will become after my death.... Ashes, and I'm comfortable with that weighing it against the alternative.

I like the honesty in what you wrote. You aren’t posturing, and I’d like to answer in the same spirit.

You’ll hold your position until the creator reveals himself. Jesus made a promise that fits that condition: “If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God” (John 7:17). He also said, “Seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you” (Matthew 7:7). The invitation is to keep asking.

You’re wise not to guess at his likes and dislikes. The Gospel of John says, “No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son... he hath declared him” (John 1:18), and Jesus said, “He that hath seen me hath seen the Father” (John 14:9). The claim is that God answered “what is he like?” by showing up.

As for anonymous scribes, Luke wrote so that his reader “mightest know the certainty of those things” (Luke 1:3-4), and Peter wrote, “We have not followed cunningly devised fables... but were eyewitnesses of his majesty” (2 Peter 1:16). Weigh them like any witnesses, but they staked their lives on it.

Now a gentle push. If upbringing explains belief, it explains unbelief too, so geography can’t tell us which is true. Scripture says the sense of God goes deeper: “He hath set the world in their heart” (Ecclesiastes 3:11).

You also said, “I know what I will become... Ashes.” That is a claim to knowledge, not just disbelief, and nobody has come back to confirm it. The Bible says one has: “It is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment” (Hebrews 9:27), and Christ answered, “I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live” (John 11:25).

You said you weighed ashes against the alternative. I’d only ask whether you’ve looked at the alternative as hard. “Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD” (Isaiah 1:18).

 

[Wrangler]

Are you saying that from the moment we are born, we believe in God?

I‘m saying you are all over the place, denying objective truth while making objective truth claims.