The Stone of Destiny

[Tambora]

And what does Steve Collins reference as the source of his information?

 

[manumuskin]

that can be fond on his website at www.stevecollins.com

 

[Tambora]

Would you mind posting the source he gives for his view that Goídel Glas (Gaedheal) descended from Shem instead of Japheth, and was the one who married Scota?I really don't want to have to search through an entire website to find that small tidbit.I just want to know what source he derived that from, because all the ancient history sources I have read say differently (such as the sources I posted earlier).Thanks.

 

[Christina]

Gaedheal[/COLOR]. Scota (daughter of Pharaoh) married Niul, and they were the parents of Gaedheal.Niul was a descendant of Japheth (son of Noah). Several generations later, their descendants landed in Ireland.But the Stone of Destiny (Lia Fail) was already there.It had been brought earlier by the Tuatha-de-Danann, who were also descendants of Japheth (son of Noah).

I was quoting from the link I posted in the previous post but here it says Tea Tephi brought the stone with her om Israel http://www.revelationsofthebible.com/Tea.htm

 

[Tambora]

Thanks Christina.I have read many books and websites that repeat this story.But rarely do they source their material, except for just quoting another book that said the same thing.Just as the page you just quoted, there is no source of where they got this information.There are very few who do source a little, such as Herbert Armstrong and Joseph Allen.They both gave the Irish Annals (better known as the Annals of the Four Masters) as their source. And the Annals reference The Book of Invasions.Both of which are old writings of the history of Ireland.So, I read them both.And I also read The History of Ireland by Geoffrey Keating (which was based on the Annals and The Invasions, along with other old writings).ALL of them say Goídel Glas (Gaedheal) was a descendant of Japheth.And also that Tea and Ollamh Fodhlah were also descendants of Japheth, as they were both descendants of Goídel Glas (Gaedheal).I don't mean married into the family, I mean were actually blood descendants of Goídel Glas (Gaedheal). The only person who is not said to be a descendant of Japheth is Scota, and she is said to be a daughter of Pharaoh.I think that most of these websites and books just repeated what Allen and Armstrong had started without checking out the sources. And the story just keeps going on and on.That's why I always question what source was used when I see this repeated.God bless.

 

[Christina]

When Zedekiah tried to escape, God said, I set my net, and it was My snare that caught him, and I took him to Babylon. God did this because He said He would, and it was done because Zedekiah broke his oath, and the covenant with God, and Nebuchadnezzar. Ezekiel 17:21 "And all his fugitives with all his bands shall fall by the sword, and they that remain shall be scattered toward all winds: and ye shall know that I the Lord have spoken it'." There will be little left of Zedekiah, his family and all those that supported and backed him. They became nothing but fugitives, that were slaughtered, and scattered to many nations. Notice that it only takes about the sons of Zedekiah that were destroyed, for his daughters escaped with Jeremiah, as part of the covenant with God for the triple overturning of the throne. These "twigs from the top of the cedar tree" were the daughters of Zedekiah, and they were planted in the thrones in Spain, and Ireland. heres another thread here on this http://www.christianityboard.com/showthread.php?t=7461&highlight=ezekial theres also a study of Eze 17 which is a riddle within a parablehttp://www.christianityboard.com/showthread.php?t=5496&highlight=Ezekiel

 

[Tambora]

Ezekiel 17(22) Thus saith the Lord GOD; I will also take of the highest branch of the high cedar, and will set it; I will crop off from the top of his young twigs a tender one, and will plant it upon an high mountain and eminent23) In the mountain of the height of Israel will I plant it: and it shall bring forth boughs, and bear fruit, and be a goodly cedar: and under it shall dwell all fowl of every wing; in the shadow of the branches thereof shall they dwell.There is only one that is cropped and planted, and it is planted in Israel.You think this tender twig is a prophesy of one of Zedekiah's daughters who is never spoken of again in scripture, instead of Christ? Isaiah 11(1) And there shall come forth a rod (twig) out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:

 

[Christina]

Many have that misunderstaning of scripture the word twig is not in the KJV and while rod can be translated twig ..the Word twigs in Eze is an entirley differnt hebrew word meaning young plant, young shoot and its pluarl not singlar Tea Tephi and her sister were daughters of Zedekiah that were brought by Jeremiah (also known as Ollamh Fodhla/meaning wise teacher, revealer or prophet) ............................................................................ Jeremiah & Tea Tephi JEREMIAH'S VOYAGE An old man arrives on an Island with a small group of people in 583 BC. He brings the daughter of a King, a scribe named Simon Brug and some relics. The powerful Milesian High King of all Ireland allows the old man complete control. Instituting laws, schools and congresses, the old man forever changes the face of the Island's history, and subsequently the history of the entire world. Apparently incidental to all this, is the fulfilling of a 500 year old prophecy.Few people know that Jeremiah was much more than a prophet. He tends to get lumped in with Isaiah, Ezekial, and the others. Jeremiah did more than go around speaking doom and gloom. He held a high level position in the kingdom of Judah. He was the grandfather of King Zedekiah. II Kings 24:18. Most importantly, Jeremiah was God's Trustee of the Bloodline and the Throne of David.Jeremiah's commission has always puzzled scholars. One can find where Jeremiah rooted out, pulled down, destroyed, and threw down kingdoms. History shows that his prophecies about the destruction of kingdoms came true. The mystery is, where did Jeremiah "build and plant?" The scriptural account doesn't contain any building and planting. There is also some confusion about Jeremiah's being put "over the nations." It would appear at first glance that this meant his prophesying against them. This is not the case. First, Jer 1:10 says that God set him "over the nations, not nations (in general). This is repeated with the word kingdoms; the kingdoms. The bible is concerned with only one people, the twelve tribes of Israelites. Jeremiah was to "throw down" AND "build and plant" the Israelite nations. We'll have to follow his trail to find where he accomplished his mission.First we'll look at the Biblical account. Jer 15:11-14 tells us Jerry is going to a brand new place he "knowest not." Isaiah fills out the picture a bit. Isaiah 41:1-3 tells us that a "righteous man from the east" was put over nations and kings. This man would not travel by foot ( on land). Jer 41:10 establishes the presence of the "king's daughters" in the group with Jeremiah. Jeremiah, as their great-grandfather, would certainly have assumed the postion of Guardian.Then we find Jeremiah and the girls going to the Egyptian city of Tahpanhes. In fact, there is an ancient structure there that bears the name, "Palace of the Jew's daughters." Isaiah helps us again with a last bit of confirmation, in chapter 37:31, telling us that a "remnant of Judah" shall escape and "take root downward."Before going on, we must take notice of what God had promised Jeremiah and his fellow travelers. God told Jeremiah that he'd be treated kindly by the Babylonians and die a natural death. Baruch, Jeremiah's scribe and Ebed-Melech, the Ethiopian, are also told they'd be spared. The probable number in Jeremiah's traveling band was five: Jeremiah, Baruch, Ebed-Melech Tea Tephi and her sister. It's not so hard to trace the migration of large groups of people. Not so with small groups. But God knows this too, and has left evidence that we may overcome our doubts about Jeremiah's destination. But we have to go the history books. Only one place in the world claims to have the grave of the prophet Jeremiah. Only one country's history tells of an old man, and his scribe Brug bringing a king's daughter from Egypt. Only one country claims the Harp of David for it's Arms. Only one country has Jerrys coming out of it's ears. IRELAND. Although, due to the Bards embellishing the story, accounts of Jeremiah's arrival and work in Ireland differ in some details, the basic elements of each tale are the same. The Stone, known as the "Stone of Destiny" came from Spain, and before that, from Egypt It came in the company of an aged guardian, who was called "Ollam Folla", (Hebrew for revealer or prophet) Accompanying the man was an eastern king's daughter Eochaidh (Eremhon) married the daughter, Tea Tephi The aged guardian became the most influencial Statesman and Spiritual leader of Ireland. Remember the evidence I mentioned, that God would supply us to confirm Jeremiah's trip? The following picture is of an inscription found in a tomb located in Schiabhla-Cailliche, near Oldcastle, County, Meath, Ireland, not far from Tara. Thirty-some stones with strange markings upon them, lie in the sepulchral chamber within the huge cairn of stones which make up the tomb. A large carved stone outside the tomb is till pointed out as Jeremiah's judicial seat. Our confirmation lies on those thirty stones in the cairn.One interperation, by George Dansie of Bristol, says the the stones show a Lunar Eclipse, in the constellation of Taurus and a conjunction of the planets Saturn and Jupiter in Virgo. The prow of a ship is shown in the center, with five lines indicating the number of passengers it carries. On the left, a part of the ship, perhaps the stern, is shown with only four passengers, one having been left behind, as indicated by the line falling away from the ship. The wavy line indicates the passage of the ship across the ocean, terminating at a central point on an island.The stellar and planetary alignment of the inscription gives a date of 583 BC. This date allows just the right amount of time for our little band to go to Egypt, and return to Palestine briefly before making their way to Spain, then Ireland. From "Forward" - Watchman What of the Dawnhttp://www.asis.com/users/stag/jerrytea.html

 

[manumuskin]

it looks as if there is something Christina and i agree onTambora i take it your a geneaologist.so am I though not a professional one.I have seen the same family tree you apparently have taken this info from.I don't believe it is a correct tree.I don't believe anyone except maybe some jews could trace their lineage back as far as the Flood.I believe Christina has related part of the story i believe here.Steve Collins actually provides evidence in his four books that traces the various migrations of the Israelite tribes starting as early as Simeons departure in the desert to the assyrian invasion in 721 b.c.all the tribes eventually by differebt routes end up in western europe.not to say there are vestiges of the tribes left in areas that were once inhabited in strength.It is possible to trace general migrations back into ancient history even if it is no longer possible to trace individual geneaologies that far.After reading Steve's books I have come to the conclusion if your forbears hail from western europe and scandanavia or from modern Israel or the nations descended from western european nations then you are likey Isarelite.No this does not make us any better then other nations it just means God is keeping his promise to our forbears Abraham,Isaac nad jacob to bless us and through us to bless the rest of the world.Some people teach british israelitism in a racist way.Steve does not.Being Israelite does not guarantee you salvation or place you above anyone,we are blessed because of a promise God made to Abraham and through no goodness of our own as you can see by studying our pagam history.Al

 

[Christina]

Well Im glad we found something to agree on ManumuskinI just wish it was based on your understanding of scripture rather than another book of men

 

[manumuskin]

Did you ever think someone besides yourself might understand scripture as well? Perhaps myself or mr. Collins? No I didn't think so. I see you are the self proclaimed no it all on scripture here,sorry to but in.Al

 

[Christina]

obviously you have no sense of humor but sense I have seen you post no scripture only books and links I only draw the obvious conclusion

 

[manumuskin]

I have been to your site and have read your posts here.You are constantly referring to these "books of men" you speak of.well all the info you post about jeremiah going to Ireland is not found in the Bible.The Bible states he took the daughters of Zedekiah to Egypt,finito,end of jeremiah as far as the Bible is concerned.All the other info you post had to have came from guess where? The "books of men"! that info is older then you are so I know you didn't figure it out yourself.Does every concept in the world have to have a Bible verse behind it to make sense?Are you telling me that any book in the world that is not the Bible is crap?Have you ever read C.S. Lewis?He is the best witness to aetheists there is because he uses reason to get a person to Christ because to an aetheist the Bible is a joke anyway so you can throw all the verses at them you want and they will laugh at you.I know because my best friend is an aetheist.He will not read lewis because he doesn't enjoy books written by people smarter then He is.But then again I suppose you haven't read him either since he falls into "books of men" category.As to my sense of humor I do have one.The joke of the day is that you believe that Jeremiah going to Ireland is in the Bible.Now thats funny! because if it isn't in the Bible it must be from "books of men".Did it occur to you that the Bible was also written by men?Though I do concur that it was also written under the divine inspiration from God but just because God wasn't whispering in someones ear while they wrote doesn't necessarily make it junk.Thats where discernment comes in.The stuff on your site is very good Israelite history but unfortunately much of it is not in the Bible.Some of it can be inferred from the Bible but much of it is just plain historical research by guess what?Men/Women.Also a bit of linguistice thrown in for good measure.I seen your smiley face which at first i thought you were being funny but when I read the text all i saw was arrogance.Maybe I am confused.If so I apologize otherwise i can be quite the sarcastic twit myself.Al

 

[Samuel Pickens]

This stone of scone: what color is it? It is report by some to be red. Other say: black, white, yellow and brown and still more grey.

There is a lot of myths from a lot of orgins.

Do you believe the stone speaks?

Do you believe the sword in the stone?

 

[Irish]

This stone of scone: what color is it? It is report by some to be red. Other say: black, white, yellow and brown and still more grey.

There is a lot of myths from a lot of orgins.

Do you believe the stone speaks?

Do you believe the sword in the stone?

Go to Scotland where it resides now, ask them to show it to you, Tell them Samuel is here.

 

[Irish]

Check this out.....

[sup]25[/sup]And thou, profane wicked prince of Israel, whose day is come, when iniquity shall have an end,

[sup]26[/sup]Thus saith the Lord GOD; Remove the diadem, and take off the crown: this shall not be the same: exalt him that is low, and abase him that is high.

[sup]27[/sup]I will overturn, overturn, overturn, it: and it shall be no more, until he come whose right it is; and I will give it him.



So here we have a crown until Christ returns. The overturns were from Zedekiah to whom? This is where the prophecy concerning the two Judah twins come in,.....Pharez and Zerah. It exchanges hands, stays within Judah but passes to the scarlet thread boys and girls. Also if you read about Shiloh come you actually have at least these three scriptures fine tuning the event. The overturnings are from Jerusalem to Ireland, Ireland to Scotland, Scotland to Britain, however the stone that has followed these kings is back in Scotland, but this is not an overturning this time because Scotland is now part of Great Britain..........we're now waiting for him who's right it is.

So is it in the Bible, yes, in a mildly veiled way.




Irish

 

[Samuel Pickens]

Go to Scotland where it resides now, ask them to show it to you, Tell them Samuel is here.

The one on display is not that stone.

Here I am

Is; for He Is - He hath sent me.

Do you belive the stone of scone speaks? Remember the one on display is not it.

 

[0bed]

Am I seeing this correctly? The Celts might be Jews?

There were 12 tribes of Israel weren't there and when Solomon became king the 10 tribes were scattered abroad while the smallest tribe Benjamin united with the tribe of Judah and they became the Jews as we know them today. So although the Celts won't be of the tribe of Judah they may well be one of the other ten tribes.

 

[veteran]

Per Jer.1:10 God said He set Jeremiah as a prophet over the nations and kingdoms to...

1. to root out, and to pull down, and to destroy, and to throw down
2. to build and to plant.

The first part of Jeremiah's commission was about the destruction of Jerusalem and the throwing down of Judah's kingline rule in Jerusalem by God sending the king of Babylon to destroy. Jeremiah gave the house of Judah God's Message about those events, for which the people had Jeremiah put in prison.

One can choose to simply ignore that 2nd part of Jeremiah's commission from God and say he didn't fulfill that, and just died in Egypt. That would be to say that God didn't fulfill that second part of Jeremiah's commission. One can also totally ignore the fact that Jeremiah was kinsman redeemer of king Zedekiah's daughters, who were put in his charge and went with him.

As for the Celts being Israelites, that's not a big problem. Because there is evidence from the Assyrian Tablets of one of the names the ten tribes were known as during their captivity, and that's where the name Cimmerian comes from. And from the Cimmerians came the Celts, which the name Gauls and Normans are also other names for the Celtic peoples that came of the Cimmerians.

 

[veteran]

Thanks Christina.I have read many books and websites that repeat this story.But rarely do they source their material, except for just quoting another book that said the same thing.Just as the page you just quoted, there is no source of where they got this information.There are very few who do source a little, such as Herbert Armstrong and Joseph Allen.They both gave the Irish Annals (better known as the Annals of the Four Masters) as their source. And the Annals reference The Book of Invasions.Both of which are old writings of the history of Ireland.So, I read them both.And I also read The History of Ireland by Geoffrey Keating (which was based on the Annals and The Invasions, along with other old writings).ALL of them say Goídel Glas (Gaedheal) was a descendant of Japheth.And also that Tea and Ollamh Fodhlah were also descendants of Japheth, as they were both descendants of Goídel Glas (Gaedheal).I don't mean married into the family, I mean were actually blood descendants of Goídel Glas (Gaedheal). The only person who is not said to be a descendant of Japheth is Scota, and she is said to be a daughter of Pharaoh.I think that most of these websites and books just repeated what Allen and Armstrong had started without checking out the sources. And the story just keeps going on and on.That's why I always question what source was used when I see this repeated.God bless.

So let's see the source you're quoting from about Eochaidh and Ollam Fadhlah being descendents of Japheth, since I've read those Annals too. I can't quite recall that.