Once Saved Always Saved

amigo de christo · May 8, 2021

GracePeace said:
God is kind.

He is very merciful . Its why all over the bible we see Him warning first and not just destroying .
Slow to anger and of great mercy our LORD is . Desiring none to perish but that all would come to repentance .
However as we know , if folks refuse correction , if folks refuse the love of the truth , well God will do as HE has said HE will do .
God loved us so much , He sent HIS SON to pay the price of our sins and that so all who do believe would be saved .
Let us ensure we are learning the biblical version of Christ , of GOD . For GOD desires good for the peoples .
But if they heed not HIS VOICE , then Severity will come upon them .
We must behold both the goodness and severity of God . its good to do so . Always keep in mind
that GOD says truth , and that truth works to our good if we heed it . IF we heed not HIM , then my advice is , prepare to wail .
But God is and has been very , very longsuffering . So my advice is , if any is lukewarm , or in error
SIMPLY REPENT . Let them be restored and then continue on in the Lord .
JESUS suffered immensely. GOD so loved the world that He sent His only begotten Son that all who do Believe would be saved .
But we both know GOD wont be mocked . Lip service without a heart to match it is vain .
And brethren should love one another and look out for one another . And if any does err , rebuke them quickly . For we desire
good for the peoples . GOD is faithful and just to forgive us . Confess and repent and follow the Spirit and heed not the flesh .

mailmandan · May 8, 2021

Ferris Bueller said:
When Jesus said only those who do the will of His Father will enter into the kingdom of heaven he meant a lot more than just believing in him.

If that's true then why didn't Jesus mention a lot more in John 6:40?

Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Matthew 7:21

Why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ but not do what I say? Luke 6:46

Jesus here is calling out hypocrites.

For it is God’s will that you should be holy: You must abstain from sexual immorality; each of you must know how to control his own body in holiness and honor, 5not in lustful passion like the Gentiles who do not know God; and no one should ever violate or exploit his brother in this regard, because the Lord will avenge all such acts, as we have already told you and solemnly warned you. For God has not called us to impurity, but to holiness. Anyone, then, who rejects this command does not reject man but God, the very One who gives you His Holy Spirit. 1 Thessalonians 4:3-8

If all a person has is a dead, empty confession of faith in Christ when He returns, that person is not going into the kingdom of God. But so many people in the church are being told that's all you have to have to be saved at the end of the age. Even Paul said the faith that justifies is the faith that acts. Galatians 5:6[/QUOTE] 1 Thessalonians 4:3-8 is also in regards to God's will AFTER WE HAVE BEEN SAVED. A dead, empty profession of faith (James 2:14) is not authentic faith, but a bare profession of faith. Man is saved through faith and not by works (Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9); yet genuine faith is substantiated, evidenced by works (James 2:14-24).

Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not based on the merits of our works.

It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not based on the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). *Perfect Harmony*

amigo de christo · May 8, 2021

Ferris Bueller said:
I look at it like this....we fear God like we fear fire. We don't shake in our boots every time the gas stove turns on, but we are afraid of what that fire can do and so we respect it accordingly. That's the healthy fear of a maturing Christian.

For it is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of a living God . Paul made sure to remind the church of that .
Yes indeed . Its wise for us to behold both the goodness and severity of God .
For every Word of GOD works good unto the hearer and the doer . Let us learn Christ well and all sound doctrine well .

Ferris Bueller · May 8, 2021

GracePeace said:
I don't want to be contrary, and I do agree the Bible doesn't teach OSAS, and I do agree that that passage is one reason people shouldn't hold to OSAS, BUT I also agree with Marks that the fear of the Lord is only the outset of wisdom.

The church of today reminds me of the Corinthians—conceited, arrogant, cocksure......

Already you have all you want. Already you have become rich. Without us, you have become kings. How I wish you really were kings, so that we might be kings with you! 1 Corinthians 4:8

...you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind, and naked. I counsel you to buy from Me gold refined by fire so that you may become rich, white garments so that you may be clothed and your shameful nakedness not exposed, and salve to anoint your eyes so that you may see. Revelation 3:17-18

And I'm not talking about the prosperity gospel churches. I'm mainly talking about the Osas churches. Especially, BB and Behold's style of Osas. Which does seem to be the predominant Osas belief in the church, and ever growing. It's the ultimate ear tickling doctrine—the doctrine that destroys the church in these end times, IMO.

amigo de christo · May 8, 2021

mailmandan said:
If that's true then why didn't Jesus mention a lot more in John 6:40?

Jesus here is calling out hypocrites.

For it is God’s will that you should be holy: You must abstain from sexual immorality; each of you must know how to control his own body in holiness and honor, 5not in lustful passion like the Gentiles who do not know God; and no one should ever violate or exploit his brother in this regard, because the Lord will avenge all such acts, as we have already told you and solemnly warned you. For God has not called us to impurity, but to holiness. Anyone, then, who rejects this command does not reject man but God, the very One who gives you His Holy Spirit. 1 Thessalonians 4:3-8

If all a person has is a dead, empty confession of faith in Christ when He returns, that person is not going into the kingdom of God. But so many people in the church are being told that's all you have to have to be saved at the end of the age. Even Paul said the faith that justifies is the faith that acts. Galatians 5:6

1 Thessalonians 4:3-8 is also in regards to God's will AFTER WE HAVE BEEN SAVED. A dead, empty profession of faith (James 2:14) is not authentic faith, but a bare profession of faith. Man is saved through faith and not by works (Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9); yet genuine faith is substantiated, evidenced by works (James 2:14-24).

Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not based on the merits of our works.

It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not based on the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). *Perfect Harmony*[/QUOTE]
True faith indeed . Even the theif on the cross had true faith . For He knew he was guitly , He knew what awaited Him ,
YET by grace , HE CALLED UPON THE LORD and said remember me , and JESUS said today You will be with me in paradise .
Now some use this to justify a faith that has no works . But had that man been given the chance to come back
down from his cross , you would have seen a man going about doing good and praising God .
SO yes indeed faith does , has good works . If not its not true faith . If one is dying on their death bed and lived a wicked life
and yet at the end crys out to THE LORD , he shall be saved .
If one at the age of ten comes to Christ and has good works , lives a good honest life by the Spirit
and at the ripe age of ninety he loses faith , he continues not in Christ . THEN HIS END IS EVIL .
That is a simple truth . COME TO CHRIST for salvation , BUT CONTINUE YE IN HIM TO THE END . HEED the SPIRIT .
God desires good for the people . Let none take off from hearing His voice and heeding the flesh .
Let us walk with all hope in the LORD . Always thanking HIM , always praising HIM and always honoring HIM .

Ferris Bueller · May 8, 2021

mailmandan said:
If that's true then why didn't Jesus mention a lot more in John 6:40?

He did. Read all that he said leading up to Matthew 7:21 starting in Matthew 5:1. That's what he's talking about when he said....

“Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice..." Matthew 7:24

amigo de christo · May 8, 2021

Let the glorious Lord be praised and thanked continuously . Always behold both the goodness and severity of God .
And learn all that He did teach and later the apostels would teach and all sound doctrine .
Let us grow in the grace by heeding the Spirit and all sound doctrine . Let us not sit and heed men who teach contrary
to sound biblical doctrine . For in so doing we will surely make shipwreck of the faith , if we so heed the false ones .
Instead let us learn our bibles well . Feasting and embracing every word of Truth .
Which shall work good unto the hearer and doer of the word . But let none be a hearer only , deceiving them own selves .

Ferris Bueller · May 8, 2021

mailmandan said:
Christ saves us through faith based on the merits of His finished work of redemption "alone" and not based on the merits of our works.

It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not based on the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). *Perfect Harmony*

I agree completely with this. That's what I was saying in my post. The faith that justifies is the faith that acts.

mailmandan · May 8, 2021

Ferris Bueller said:
He did. Read all that he said leading up to Matthew 7:21 starting in Matthew 5:1. That's what he's talking about when he said....

“Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice..." Matthew 7:24

Putting the words of Jesus into practice is descriptive of believers and we must not confuse ‘descriptive’ passages of scripture with ‘prescriptive’ passages of scripture. Be careful that you don’t cross the line into salvation by works.

mailmandan · May 8, 2021

Ferris Bueller said:
I agree completely with this. That's what I was saying in my post. The faith that justifies is the faith that acts.

Maybe it’s just all in the semantics then.

amigo de christo · May 8, 2021

Ferris Bueller said:
He did. Read all that he said leading up to Matthew 7:21 starting in Matthew 5:1. That's what he's talking about when he said....

“Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice..." Matthew 7:24

Sometimes folks forget that JESUS had MANY sayings . And let us heed THEM ALL .
WHEN teachings of men gone wrong come along , you will always see that even the scripture they post
has been taken out of text to support their teaching . But if a man heeds EVERYTHING JESUS said and the apostles said
they will grow in the faith . many twist scrips unto their own destruction .
JESUS told the very first ones their very mission . and that mission is and still is today
GO ye into all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father , Son and Holy Ghost , TEACHING THEM
Oh yes , TEACHING THEM to OBSERVE , not some , not most , BUT ALL THINGS HE DID teach and command .
That is the summation of our faith . DO WE LOVE HIM , or do we love self . for self will always omit
certain teachings , but a lamb will embrace them all upon their heart . And will keep the pattern
that Christ and later the apostels set . TWISTING NOTHING , simply heeding every warning and embracing every promise .
HEARERS and DOERS and those whose hearts have been changed by the SPIRIT and they love CHRIST above all
and from that comes the love of the brethren as ourself . ALWAYS pointing to JESUS for if we love them , we point
them TO JESUS , TO HIS EVERY TEACHING with HIS Every reminder .

Ferris Bueller · May 8, 2021

Tong2020 said:
If one reads scriptures he will have knowledge of what the true Christian is like. And one such knowledge is that he have faith that comes from God that abides and continues to the end. And that is what I believe. So that, any one who claims to be a Christian who does not have such faith could not be a true Christian.

And the idea that a true Christian could stop believing is not compatible with such truth.

Tong
R3175

The problem is not with God's faith that he gives to a person so they can trust in God. The problem is whether or not the person is going to keep the revelation of the gospel God has given him.

BroRando · May 8, 2021

kcnalp said:
Believers who will burn in Hell.
Why, do you believe there are true “believers” who will burn in hell? Or are you referring to nominal “believers”?

Tong
R3182

Because kcnalp thinks Satan is more powerful than Jesus Christ. He claims Hell is eternal but it's not. Jesus Christ escaped hell and so did Jonah.... others will too. "death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works." (Rev 20:13)

He also claims works are a false gospel. But that is a lie because HOW are they to be judged? "they were judged every man according to their works." (Rev 20:13)

Jesus Christ is not in the trinity doctrine. In order to look up the trinity doctrine you would first have to close your Bible and look into Apostate teachings. Good people go to hell but Jesus Christ provides escape.

GRACE ambassador · May 8, 2021

Behold said:
ONLY JESUS SAVES.
A.) Final Answer.

The good news is that God accepts our faith ONE TIME< to give us the New Birth. = Born again.
You can't stop being born again.
Once you are born again, you are always born again.

Amen, And AMEN! +
Because Of God's Shed BLOOD, HE Did ALL of the Following to/FOR the
ONE-Time new-born {can NEVER BE UNborn!!} babe In CHRIST!:
God's OPERATION On All New-born babes In CHRIST!
+
58 Biblical Facts FOR God's Eternal Salvation!

See you in God’s Great GloryLand! ↑ ♫

GRACE ambassador · May 8, 2021

BroRando said:
Jesus Christ is not in the trinity doctrine. In order to look up the trinity doctrine you would first have to close your Bible

Precious friend, AU CONTRAIRE! We MUST "OPEN our BIBLE {KJV}, And Also:
believe EVERY WORD Of God!" Amen?:

The Case FOR The Triune GodHead

GracePeace · May 8, 2021

mailmandan said:
It is through faith "in Christ alone" (and not based on the merits of our works) that we are justified on account of Christ (Romans 3:24; 5:1; 5:9); yet the faith that justifies is never alone (unfruitful, barren) if it is genuine (James 2:14-24). *Perfect Harmony*

Oops! Only doers of good will be justified on the Day of Judgment, and be repaid eternal life Romans 2:6-16 Galatians 6:6-10!

mailmandan · May 8, 2021

GracePeace said:
Oops! Only doers of good will be justified on the Day of Judgment, and be repaid eternal life Romans 2:6-16 Galatians 6:6-10!

There is no ‘oops’ here and we must not confuse ‘descriptive’ passages of scripture with ‘prescriptive’ passages of scripture. If one reads Romans 2:6-10 in isolation from the rest of the book of Romans, one might conclude that Paul was teaching salvation by works. However, as we read and study these passages of scripture, it's critical to keep in mind that these verses do not describe how one becomes saved, but the way the saved (and unsaved) conduct their lives. These works done are the result of, not the means or basis of obtaining salvation.

So patient continuance in well doing, seeking for glory, honor, and immortality; (verse 7) is not at all set forth as the means of their procuring eternal life, but as a description of those to whom God does render life eternal.

*Notice that ALL who receive eternal life are described as such, everyone who does good (vs. 10). Good deeds flow from a heart that is saved and evil deeds flow from a heart that is unsaved. Verse 8 - but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness--indignation and wrath. *Notice that ALL who do not receive eternal life are described as such, everyone who does evil (verse 9).

What those passages convey is that though our deeds are judged by God, it's not the good deeds themselves which are the basis or means of receiving eternal life, but the type of deeds expose whether our heart was saved, or not. Those good deeds done out of faith are the fruit, not the root of salvation. If Paul wanted to teach that we are saved by works, then he would have clearly stated that we are saved through faith and works in Ephesians 2:8,9 and that we are justified by faith and works in Romans 5:1 but that is clearly NOT what Paul said. *Also see (Romans 4:2-6; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9).

In regards to Galatians 6:6-10, the one who is continuously (Greek present tense) sowing to his own corrupt, sinful nature (descriptive of unbelievers) which is opposed to God and unregenerated by the Holy Spirit shall of the flesh reap corruption. Our life here is sowing of one kind or another. But he who sows to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap everlasting life. (descriptive of believers) *Only believers sow to the Spirit and from the Spirit will reap eternal life.

GracePeace · May 8, 2021

mailmandan said:
There is no ‘oops’ here and we must not confuse ‘descriptive’ passages of scripture with ‘prescriptive’ passages of scripture. If one reads Romans 2:6-10 in isolation from the rest of the book of Romans, one might conclude that Paul was teaching salvation by works. However, as we read and study these passages of scripture, it's critical to keep in mind that these verses do not describe how one becomes saved, but the way the saved (and unsaved) conduct their lives. These works done are the result of, not the means or basis of obtaining salvation.

So patient continuance in well doing, seeking for glory, honor, and immortality; (verse 7) is not at all set forth as the means of their procuring eternal life, but as a description of those to whom God does render life eternal.

*Notice that ALL who receive eternal life are described as such, everyone who does good (vs. 10). Good deeds flow from a heart that is saved and evil deeds flow from a heart that is unsaved. Verse 8 - but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness--indignation and wrath. *Notice that ALL who do not receive eternal life are described as such, everyone who does evil (verse 9).

What those passages convey is that though our deeds are judged by God, it's not the good deeds themselves which are the basis or means of receiving eternal life, but the type of deeds expose whether our heart was saved, or not. Those good deeds done out of faith are the fruit, not the root of salvation. If Paul wanted to teach that we are saved by works, then he would have clearly stated that we are saved through faith and works in Ephesians 2:8,9 and that we are justified by faith and works in Romans 5:1 but that is clearly NOT what Paul said. *Also see (Romans 4:2-6; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9).

In regards to Galatians 6:6-10, the one who is continuously (Greek present tense) sowing to his own corrupt, sinful nature (descriptive of unbelievers) which is opposed to God and unregenerated by the Holy Spirit shall of the flesh reap corruption. Our life here is sowing of one kind or another. But he who sows to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap everlasting life. (descriptive of believers) *Only believers sow to the Spirit and from the Spirit will reap eternal life.

In other words, you agree justification is by works of the Law at the eschatological judgment and only doers of the Law will be repaid eternal life... you just stipulate that this coming justification by works at this coming judgment and the repayment of eternal life will only be earnable by Christians. Good. Then you agree I was right.

mailmandan · May 8, 2021

GracePeace said:
In other words, you agree justification is by works of the Law at the eschatological judgment and only doers of the Law will be repaid eternal life... you just stipulate that this coming justification by works at this coming judgment and the repayment of eternal life will only be earnable by Christians. Good. Then you agree I was right.

I never said anything about eternal life being earned by works.

GracePeace · May 8, 2021

mailmandan said:
I never said anything about eternal life being earned by works.

Right, you failed to understand the argument and to address the text.

The argument is only the righteous are eligible for eternal life--you agreed justification was by works, but apparently failed to understand the outcropping of that : eternal life is repaid them.

Romans 2:6-7 explicitly teaches eternal life is a repayment for good deeds (v13 "doers of the Law").
Galatians 6:6-10 teaches the same--eternal life is a harvest reaped "in due time" by doers of good.

Once Saved Always Saved

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