OSAS Question
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Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Yeah, that just means he knows how it all ultimately ends for everything and everybody.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Anti-Osas is not anti-eternal salvation/life. It only appears that way to Osasers because of what they say 'eternal life' means.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Free will in no way takes away God's sovereignty. No more than a rat that can freely move about in a scientist's maze somehow takes away the sovereignty of the scientist.
Nooo, context has everything to do with having respect for Exegesis and God's word.
The common tactic for those who do not approve what God has to say is to argue that God lied when he said it.
Verse 13 rebukes entirely the anti-eternal salvation agenda, false teaching. It is actually Satan that has been the liar from the beginning.
2 Timothy 2
KJV
1Thou therefore, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus.
2And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also.
3Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ.
4No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.
5And if a man also strive for masteries, yet is he not crowned, except he strive lawfully.
6The husbandman that laboureth must be first partaker of the fruits.
7Consider what I say; and the Lord give thee understanding in all things.
8Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to my gospel:
9Wherein I suffer trouble, as an evil doer, even unto bonds; but the word of God is not bound.
10Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.
11It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him:
12If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:
13If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.
14Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.
15Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
16But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.
17And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus;
18Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.
19Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
20But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.
21If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.
22Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.
23But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes.
24And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,
25In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
26And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Anti-Osas does not remove the doctrine of predestination. It understands it for what it actually means. God's predetermined plan and outcome will not be hindered. That's why we should make it a point to be a part of it by believing in the promises, and continuing to believe in the promises.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
That's why we should make it a point to be among the elect by believing the gospel, and continuing to believe the gospel.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Why does everyone who quotes that verse leave out vs. 12?Oh, that's true for those opposed to Gods word generally.
2 Timothy 2:13
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
2 Timothy 2:13 is entirely true in anti-Osas. What you're failing to do is recognize the difference between a believer being unfaithful while still being a believer (you know, like when you cheat on your taxes), and the believer who denies Christ altogether (vs. 12).
No. See, anti-eternal salvation proponents refusing to acknowledge those scriptures that tell us Christians don't make a habit of sinning, and those who do are not actually saved, doesn't make the scriptures go away.
Anti-eternal salvation proponents deny God, deny the purpose of the cross and the gospel.
They've already lost the argument because God's word is not in them.
God does not deny himself.
But anti-eternal salvation doctrine denies God again and again.
Until its time is over.
Eternity will be a long time to be proven wrong.
Nothing you say shall ever change God's word. He died to prove it is eternal. And he does not deny himself.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
That's why you need to remain His by continuing to believe to the very end. The believer who denies Him no longer belongs to Him, and so He is not denying Himself when He denies the person who has stopped believing.
We can only rebuke enemies of the gospel for so long.
We know it is a lie that eternal security in Christ, eternal salvation, is a license to sin. It is not.
What a transparent contrivance of the enemy of truth that is. The false teaching that insists eternal security in Christ is a license to sin is evidence Satan doesn't know scripture as well as he imagined. It's stupid in fact.
We're saved from sin. That's what it means to be eternally saved from sin.
That means we know we cannot live as we did when we were of the world because , and this is what Satan forgets in his zeal to make the Gospel out to be a lie, the holy spirit that is God is within us.
We have the seal of the holy spirit.
This is how we know the scripture refutes Satan when he tells the world eternal irrevocable salvation,security in Christ, is truth. Those sealed by the holy spirit cannot sin. Do not make a habit of sinning. KNOW it is not a license to sin.
Darkness and light cannot occupy the same space. The one who is in us is greater than that one, Satan, who is in the world. John 4.
Jesus died to seal the truth of eternal irrevocable salvation within us.
Don't ever be persuaded by the adversarial spirit that calls him a failure.
Our life began when we died to the world and Christ lives in us. Galations 2:20.
He knew us before he made the world. Do you think we can evict him by our behaviors? As if God lies? Lifts his seal, returns it when we leave faith and then return?
Omniscience doesn't foresee all?
If we leave the faith God doesn't leave us.
God knew how bad the world was and that's why he sent salvation.
The book of eternal life. Not conditional life. Not works driven reward on contingency. Be good and I'll save you later.
Eternal irrevocable salvation seals us eternally.
It also sealed the fate of Satan and his faithful.
Boy are they mad.
Peter denied Jesus three times. He was still saved eternally.
Dear Satan, hear that? Oops!
We know it is a lie that eternal security in Christ, eternal salvation, is a license to sin. It is not.
What a transparent contrivance of the enemy of truth that is. The false teaching that insists eternal security in Christ is a license to sin is evidence Satan doesn't know scripture as well as he imagined. It's stupid in fact.
We're saved from sin. That's what it means to be eternally saved from sin.
That means we know we cannot live as we did when we were of the world because , and this is what Satan forgets in his zeal to make the Gospel out to be a lie, the holy spirit that is God is within us.
We have the seal of the holy spirit.
This is how we know the scripture refutes Satan when he tells the world eternal irrevocable salvation,security in Christ, is truth. Those sealed by the holy spirit cannot sin. Do not make a habit of sinning. KNOW it is not a license to sin.
Darkness and light cannot occupy the same space. The one who is in us is greater than that one, Satan, who is in the world. John 4.
Jesus died to seal the truth of eternal irrevocable salvation within us.
Don't ever be persuaded by the adversarial spirit that calls him a failure.
Our life began when we died to the world and Christ lives in us. Galations 2:20.
He knew us before he made the world. Do you think we can evict him by our behaviors? As if God lies? Lifts his seal, returns it when we leave faith and then return?
Omniscience doesn't foresee all?
If we leave the faith God doesn't leave us.
God knew how bad the world was and that's why he sent salvation.
The book of eternal life. Not conditional life. Not works driven reward on contingency. Be good and I'll save you later.
Eternal irrevocable salvation seals us eternally.
It also sealed the fate of Satan and his faithful.
Boy are they mad.
Peter denied Jesus three times. He was still saved eternally.
Dear Satan, hear that? Oops!
Peter denied Jesus three times.He was still saved. As Jesus assured him personally in this life.
We endure to the end as ones sealed eternally by the holy spirit. We endure to the end because he is within us.
"Saved"! Not, shall be on the condition one endures to the end. Otherwise, you're arguing holy spirit seals and resides within the sinner.
That's not true.
I'm surprised you're unaware of John 3:16.
His belief in and love for us is why The Word became flesh and dwelt among us to bring the good news of his free irrevocable gift of grace and eternal salvation. And why he died to seal the new covenant promise with his blood. And us, who were his before the world, Titus 1:2.
He, the father of lights, who knew our names before he made the world, made us in his image and likeness. And made us living souls with his breath.
Yes, I'd say there is ample evidence God believes in us. The sacrifice of Christ for our sakvation. And entire New Testament in fact is there to teach us.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Peter did not deny that Jesus was the Christ. He did not go back to his old life of sin in defiance of Christ being the Messiah. Peter got scared for his own skin. Peter denied knowing him, not denied he was the Messiah.
He was still saved. As Jesus assured him personally in this life.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Well, we sure don't endure to the end on our own. We will endure to the end, as long as we continue to believe to the very end.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
The new Osas is the one that make grace a license to sin. Which one do you believe in, the new Osas, or the old one?
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
Jesus died to establish a new Covenant of Priest and Sacrifice that never stops interceding for the person who believes in it (unlike the old covenant of priest and sacrifice that did stop interceding). That's why we're exhorted to keep believing in it.....
Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has ascended into heaven, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. Hebrews 4:14
See, the writer wouldn't say this if you can never lose the ministry of Jesus the high priest. He says this because you need to keep believing in the ministry of Christ that never ends. See, Christ is what is eternal and everlasting. Christ's ministry and sacrifice is what is eternal, not your possession of it......unless you continue to believe to the very end. Then you will possess it for eternity. The book of Hebrews is what opened up my eyes to the error of Osas thinking.
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