Understanding The Sufficiency Of 'My Grace

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soul man

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I have been sparked this morning by a video of the great days of old for our generation. It was a time of a movement (of God in my opinion) when healing and many mighty miralces took place. Salvation was always at the forefront of what was said and done. No matter what was going on in a movement - the men and women kept salvation at the forefront of what was being done. That may not seem as exciting as seeing a healing or some other miracle of God but it is the greatest of all miracles and they knew it. I was saved with about 10 men and women around me in a church at an old fashioned altar - shouting the devil out of me - in their understanding. And the Lord knows they were not to wrong :)

The thoughts that come to me is through the years I have known people and they always ask me (just because I don't do what I did in ministry as I once did) 'why don't you believe in that no more?

What comes to my mind is; it is not that I don't believe it anymore. I believe God can do anything. He can do anything he pleases according to scripture. So it is not a 'not believe' in something - it is a 'believe' in something.

The scripture is;

And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. - 2 Corinthians 12:9.

The words 'My grace is sufficient' have to be a compelling factor in the understanding of a believer. Not a unbelief but a believing. Wanting to know the sufficiency of 'My grace.'

For instance healing; I still preach healing it just comes out different but you still pray and you still believe for healing - you still believe, you just need to KNOW the sufficiency of 'My grace. Attached to that Paul said is; 'the understanding of infirmities, maladies, with the mind the body - the soul.'

Understanding the sufficiency of 'My grace' can carry a believer into the knowledge of how something "just is in God." That is a bad explanation of what I'm trying to say - but grace is the all contributing factor to the believer moving on in their understanding and growing in the Lord in Grace and the knowledge of what he would have them to know and do and more importantly - be. Amen

Thank you rockytopva.
 

charity

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'And lest I should be exalted above measure
.. through the abundance of the revelations,
.... there was given to me a thorn in the flesh,
...... the messenger of Satan to buffet me,
........ lest I should be exalted above measure.
For this thing I besought the Lord thrice,
.. that it might depart from me.

And He said unto me, "My grace is sufficient for thee:
.. for My strength is made perfect in weakness."

Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities,
that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities,
in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake:
for when I am weak, then am I strong.'

(2 Corinthians 12:7-10)

Hello @soul man,

Yes, I believe I understand what you are trying to say. It is not always easy to put into words what is on our heart, is it? :)

* I have been blessed for the greater part of my life with good health, except for the onset of arthritis several years ago in my hips, which is increasingly debilitating, causing mobility problems and pain. Also, getting older I am finding that my memory fails me; especially when I am tired or stressed for some reason, and my ability to retain knowledge or even spell appears to be diminishing. This can make me anxious concerning the possibility of dementia or Alzheimer's; but these symptoms are all part of the aging process, through wear and tear, and I thank God that I have the assurance that, no matter what happens, God's strength will always be sufficient for me.

* Resting in that knowledge in the spirit, and not allowing the flesh to mar it by anxiety and fear, is the battle isn't it? For the power that God has towards us is immense: it is the same power with which He raised Christ from the dead to His right hand: living in the light of it, and drawing upon it by faith, is what should occupy us, now; giving thanks in all things and glorifying God by so doing.

* Our life expectancy is not for this life only, for we have a hope laid before us in resurrection: as our Lord Jesus Christ had, Who endured the cross, despising the shame and is now raised and glorified and seated at God's right hand.

'... ... let us lay aside every weight,
and the sin which doth so easily beset us,
and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,
Looking unto Jesus the Author and Finisher of our faith;
Who for the joy that was set before Him
endured the cross,
despising the shame,
and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.'
(Heb 12:1b-2)

Praise God!

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
 
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soul man

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'And lest I should be exalted above measure
.. through the abundance of the revelations,
.... there was given to me a thorn in the flesh,
...... the messenger of Satan to buffet me,
........ lest I should be exalted above measure.
For this thing I besought the Lord thrice,
.. that it might depart from me.

And He said unto me, "My grace is sufficient for thee:
.. for My strength is made perfect in weakness."

Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities,
that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities,
in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake:
for when I am weak, then am I strong.'

(2 Corinthians 12:7-10)

Hello @soul man,

Yes, I believe I understand what you are trying to say. It is not always easy to put into words what is on our heart, is it? :)

* I have been blessed for the greater part of my life with good health, except for the onset of arthritis several years ago in my hips, which is increasingly debilitating, causing mobility problems and pain. Also, getting older I am finding that my memory fails me; especially when I am tired or stressed for some reason, and my ability to retain knowledge or even spell appears to be diminishing. This can make me anxious concerning the possibility of dementia or Alzheimer's; but these symptoms are all part of the aging process, through wear and tear, and I thank God that I have the assurance that, no matter what happens, God's strength will always be sufficient for me.

* Resting in that knowledge in the spirit, and not allowing the flesh to mar it by anxiety and fear, is the battle isn't it? For the power that God has towards us is immense: it is the same power with which He raised Christ from the dead to His right hand: living in the light of it, and drawing upon it by faith, is what should occupy us, now; giving thanks in all things and glorifying God by so doing.

* Our life expectancy is not for this life only, for we have a hope laid before us in resurrection: as our Lord Jesus Christ had, Who endured the cross, despising the shame and is now raised and glorified and seated at God's right hand.

'... ... let us lay aside every weight,
and the sin which doth so easily beset us,
and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,
Looking unto Jesus the Author and Finisher of our faith;
Who for the joy that was set before Him
endured the cross,
despising the shame,
and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.'
(Heb 12:1b-2)

Praise God!

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Oh Chris these frail bodies, they will have to have a special touch from time to time if they are to keep going. Thank you for the good word, I couldn't agree more. The scriptures are absolute and we can believe what is written.
 
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charity

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I have been sparked this morning by a video of the great days of old for our generation. It was a time of a movement (of God in my opinion) when healing and many mighty miralces took place. Salvation was always at the forefront of what was said and done. No matter what was going on in a movement - the men and women kept salvation at the forefront of what was being done. That may not seem as exciting as seeing a healing or some other miracle of God but it is the greatest of all miracles and they knew it. I was saved with about 10 men and women around me in a church at an old fashioned altar - shouting the devil out of me - in their understanding. And the Lord knows they were not to wrong :)

The thoughts that come to me is through the years I have known people and they always ask me (just because I don't do what I did in ministry as I once did) 'why don't you believe in that no more?

What comes to my mind is; it is not that I don't believe it anymore. I believe God can do anything. He can do anything he pleases according to scripture. So it is not a 'not believe' in something - it is a 'believe' in something.

The scripture is;

And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. - 2 Corinthians 12:9.

The words 'My grace is sufficient' have to be a compelling factor in the understanding of a believer. Not a unbelief but a believing. Wanting to know the sufficiency of 'My grace.'

For instance healing; I still preach healing it just comes out different but you still pray and you still believe for healing - you still believe, you just need to KNOW the sufficiency of 'My grace. Attached to that Paul said is; 'the understanding of infirmities, maladies, with the mind the body - the soul.'

Understanding the sufficiency of 'My grace' can carry a believer into the knowledge of how something "just is in God." That is a bad explanation of what I'm trying to say - but grace is the all contributing factor to the believer moving on in their understanding and growing in the Lord in Grace and the knowledge of what he would have them to know and do and more importantly - be. Amen

Thank you rockytopva
For this thing I besought the Lord thrice,
that it might depart from me.
And He said unto me, "My grace is sufficient for thee:
for My strength is made perfect in weakness."
(2 Corinthians 12: 8)

Hello again, @soul man,

Yes, Paul asked the Lord on three occasions that this 'infirmity' might 'depart' from him: but the Lord did not do so, did He? Why? We do not know why affliction comes our way, in whatever form, or why sometimes it has to be endured for a while, before it goes away; or even stays with us for the rest of our lives.

In Paul's case, in verse 10, he says that he
'takes pleasure' in infirmity, in reproach in necessity, in persecution, and in distress. Why? 'For Christ's sake'. ( For when he is weak then he is strong). For the power that enabled him to endure and to continue with the ministry that God had given him, in the face of such things, was so very obviously of God and not of Himself, therefore it resounded to the glory of God. Which was his purpose, and His goal. Praise God!

With Paul, whether he lived or died, as long as it was 'gain' for Christ, that was what mattered. What a mindset! May it be ours too: for Paul said,
'Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ' (1Cor 11:1)

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris



 
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VictoryinJesus

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.. for My strength is made perfect in weakness."

this reminds me of your thread on “mind” and the passage of turning them over to a reprobate mind. It begins with “examine yourselves” I think. Consider “My strength is made perfect in weakness” (you know I have trouble making sense) but how did Paul trust they shall know “we are not reprobates” in
2 Corinthians 13:6-9 But I trust that ye shall know that we are not reprobates. [7] Now I pray to God that ye do no evil; not that we should appear approved, but that ye should do that which is honest, though we be as reprobates. [8] For we can do nothing against the truth, but for the truth. [9] For we are glad, when we are weak, and ye are strong: and this also we wish, even your perfection.

My strength is made perfect in weakness
For we are glad, when we are weak
and you are strong (the Love of God perfected) this also we wish, even your perfection. 2 Corinthians 13:4 For though he was crucified through weakness, yet he liveth by the power of God. For we also are weak in him, but we shall live with him by the power of God toward you.

What I hear is Paul was willing to appear as a reprobate even though he was not a reprobate(as one who fails), willing to be weak that they may examine whether they were in love or despising …urging them to move on to perfection. Is perfection loving those who despise you and use you? To love your enemies and not just those that love you? Then if Paul was that (as reprobates) then is he not asking them…examine, where is your mercy?
 

charity

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this reminds me of your thread on “mind” and the passage of turning them over to a reprobate mind. It begins with “examine yourselves” I think. Consider “My strength is made perfect in weakness” (you know I have trouble making sense) but how did Paul trust they shall know “we are not reprobates” in
2 Corinthians 13:6-9 But I trust that ye shall know that we are not reprobates. [7] Now I pray to God that ye do no evil; not that we should appear approved, but that ye should do that which is honest, though we be as reprobates. [8] For we can do nothing against the truth, but for the truth. [9] For we are glad, when we are weak, and ye are strong: and this also we wish, even your perfection.

My strength is made perfect in weakness
For we are glad, when we are weak
and you are strong (the Love of God perfected) this also we wish, even your perfection. 2 Corinthians 13:4 For though he was crucified through weakness, yet he liveth by the power of God. For we also are weak in him, but we shall live with him by the power of God toward you.

What I hear is Paul was willing to appear as a reprobate even though he was not a reprobate(as one who fails), willing to be weak that they may examine whether they were in love or despising …urging them to move on to perfection. Is perfection loving those who despise you and use you? To love your enemies and not just those that love you? Then if Paul was that (as reprobates) then is he not asking them…examine, where is your mercy?
'This is the third time I am coming to you.
In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established.

(see Deuteronomy 19:15 & Deuteronomy 17:6 and Numbers 35:30)
I told you before, and foretell you, as if I were present, the second time;
and being absent now I write to them which heretofore have sinned,
and to all other, that, if I come again, I will not spare:'

(2 Cor 13:1-2)

Hi @VictoryinJesus,

Interesting thought process. thank you. I think you are right, Paul was not concerned about his own reputation in the eyes of his critics, he was concerned about the Corinthian's growth in Christ Jesus.

* These are final warnings being given by Paul to the Corinthians assembly, aren't they? For he proposed returning to them a third time, and if so, he would be forced to deal ruthlessly with those who ignored him and continued in their evil ways, just as he did on his second visit (v.2) Some had obviously said that his reluctance to use his Apostolic powers in judgment meant that in reality he was no Apostle! :-

'Since you seek a proof of Christ speaking in me
.. (who is not weak toward you, but is powerful in you;
.... for even if He was crucified out of weakness,
...... yet He lives by the power of God.
........ For indeed even we are weak in Him,
.......... but we shall live with Him by the power of God toward you),

(2 Cor. 13:3-4)

* They demanded proof of his apostleship. To which he responded with the words of verse 6:-

Examine yourselves, whether you are in the faith, prove your own selves.
Do you not know your own selves, that Jesus Christ is in you, - unless you are reprobates(or 'counterfeit')?'
(2 Corinthians 13:5)

* Paul then said, 'But I trust that ye shall know that we are not reprobates.' He hopes that the Corinthian believers will realise that he is no 'counterfeit' (or reprobate). For earlier in this epistle, he had said to them, 'You are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read by all men,' (2 Cor. 3:2) . Yes, if they sought proof of his Apostleship, they need look no further than their own selves, for they had been saved through the ministry of the risen Christ by him. They were in His heart and he loved them as a Father loves his children because they were born from above by means of his ministry.

I hope I have answered in a manner appropriate to your own post.
With love in Christ Jesus
Chris


 
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VictoryinJesus

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Interesting thought process. thank you. I think you are right, Paul was not concerned about his own reputation in the eyes of his critics, he was concerned about the Corinthian's growth in Christ Jesus.

Reminds me of Hebrews 12:10-11 For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness. [11] Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.
 
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soul man

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For this thing I besought the Lord thrice,
that it might depart from me.
And He said unto me, "My grace is sufficient for thee:
for My strength is made perfect in weakness."
(2 Corinthians 12: 8)

Hello again, @soul man,

Yes, Paul asked the Lord on three occasions that this 'infirmity' might 'depart' from him: but the Lord did not do so, did He? Why? We do not know why affliction comes our way, in whatever form, or why sometimes it has to be endured for a while, before it goes away; or even stays with us for the rest of our lives.

In Paul's case, in verse 10, he ways that he
'takes pleasure' in infirmity, in reproach in necessity, in persecution, and in distress. Why? 'For Christ's sake'. ( For when he is weak then he is strong). For the power that enabled him to endure and to continue with the ministry that God had given him, in the face of such things, was so very obviously of God and not of Himself, therefore it resounded to the glory of God. Which was his purpose, and His goal. Praise God!

With Paul, whether he lived or died, as long as it was 'gain' for Christ, that was what mattered. What a mindset! May it be ours too: for Paul said,
'Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ' (1Cor 11:1)

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris



Yes the mystery of these bodies (not much of a mystery really they are just flesh and blood given to sickness at times). I chalk it up as part of the schoolhouse because I see the training; as everything in the natural working toward that purpose.
 
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VictoryinJesus

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Interesting thought process. thank you. I think you are right, Paul was not concerned about his own reputation in the eyes of his critics, he was concerned about the Corinthian's growth in Christ Jesus.

still considering where Paul tells them to examine themselves. Then his mention of “testing” and how he trust they will know he (we) do not fail …as you said: is not “a counterfeit”. Is the test not within the text itself? They are accusing their brother and he is modeling Christ Romans 12:14-16 Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not. [15] Rejoice with them that do rejoice, and weep with them that weep. [16] Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.

but condescend to men of low estate. And is not Paul saying he will be of low estate…although possessing all things in Christ. To me there is a promise there in what is being shown. That Paul’s trusting they will know he is not a reprobate, nor a counterfeit in trusting in God who raises the dead into Life. He who hates and despises his brother remains in darkness still. Paul urges them: enduring all things, believing all things, bearing all things, and hoping all things …not that he appears approved but that they be made perfect in love for the power of God resting upon him who is weak( God’s strength and perfection in loving us while we were yet dead in our sin and trespasses) . He is asking them to examine whether or not they are in the Faith of Christ while persecuting their brother in Christ. Which brother fails not the test…he who blesses His brethren, or he who curses his brethren?

* These are final warnings being given by Paul to the Corinthians assembly, aren't they? For he proposed returning to them a third time, and if so, he would be forced to deal ruthlessly with those who ignored him and continued in their evil ways, just as he did on his second visit (v.2) Some had obviously said that his reluctance to use his Apostolic powers in judgment meant that in reality he was no Apostle! :-


2 Corinthians 13:9-10 For we are glad, when we are weak, and ye are strong: and this also we wish, even your perfection. [10] Therefore I write these things being absent, lest being present I should use sharpness, according to the power which the Lord hath given me to edification, and not to destruction. (There is another verse some where also but can’t find it now …where he didn’t want to pluck up, or tear down but instead according to the power which the Lord had given him UNTO edification.)
 
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