Jesus Is Our Truth, Reward, And Faithfulness So We Can Lie, Steal, and Fornicate?

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CharismaticLady

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I know what they aren't: they aren't "the people left behind during the last 7 years of tribulation".

Again, John wrote Revelation, and he knows what the commandments are. Besides faith in Jesus Christ, they keep the royal law. James 2:8 They are eternal, as is the first part of the royal law.

Love God with all your heart, mind and strength, and love your neighbor as yourself. These are all kept by the Spirit, not by the letter.
 

CharismaticLady

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So the Spirit of the law does not make us go in the flesh to a building to worship? Is that correct?

But if I feel like going to church and worshipping in a building, is that OK or am I actually sinning?

The first church building was when Christianity became the state religion of Rome, and paganism was outlawed and left all these pagan temples standing empty. So they made them churches. Before that Christians met in homes and everyone was extended family.

Do you have any idea how lonely hundreds of people are that go to mega churches alone? And do you think the pastor who is suppose to be the shepherd even knows more than a handful of names? It is not the building anymore, it is the lack of accountability.
 

quietthinker

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Again, John wrote Revelation, and he knows what the commandments are. Besides faith in Jesus Christ, they keep the royal law. James 2:8 They are eternal, as is the first part of the royal law.

Love God with all your heart, mind and strength, and love your neighbor as yourself. These are all kept by the Spirit, not by the letter.
the thing is CL, If the Spirit of the Law is in ones heart so will the letter of the Law be but let's cut to the chase, its the Sabbath Commandment which you take offence at.....if you didn't you wouldn't argue against it.....and you would honour it.
 

CharismaticLady

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Sort of like keeping the spirit of the 6th commandment which allows you to be a serial killer? So long as you don't get angry, therefore you can ignore the letter of the law?

That wouldn't be the spirit of the law, but the opposite. And the writer is not meaning spirit like the essence of the law, but as lead by the Holy Spirit. Can you do that with the 4th commandment without being taught the rules? No. You know it is only by the letter of the law. But Jeremiah 31:31-34 shows us that no man needs to be taught. Why? Because it is the Royal laws that are written on our hearts, the la. James 2:8

As Phoneman says below...we are to rest on Sabbath as God did.

God can't get tired. That is not the Spirit of the law. It was the first thing that God created to later point to the Redeemer from before the foundation of the world. It then became a ceremonial law given only to the Jews, but the substance always pointed to Christ. There is no record of anyone before being taught to keep the Sabbath. Not even Abraham, Isaac or Jacob who both obeyed His voice as did Enoch and Noah. Only the Children of Israel was God's chosen nation predestined as His.

Where is the text that says God unblessed the Sabbath day? See 1 Chron. 17:27

1 Chron. 17:27 has to do with David's kingdom and his heir Jesus Christ. It has nothing to do with the Sabbath. It appears that your whole focus is on a Day, and mine is on the Substance.

b. Luke, in writing his gospel decades later says in Luke 23:56 "according to the commandment". How come they kept and observed the Sabbath according to the commandment if it was no longer a commandment?

"55 And the women who had come with Him from Galilee followed after, and they observed the tomb and how His body was laid. 56 Then they returned and prepared spices and fragrant oils. And they rested on the Sabbath according to the commandment."

Hebrews 9:16
For where there is a testament, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.

If you are mentioned in a will, when can you claim the money? Answer: when the will is read. It was read on the Day of Pentecost, not before, so the women were doing nothing wrong as they were still under the Old Covenant.

c. Why is it that none of the gospel writers, every one of whom penned their work decades after the resurrection, know less about the covenants and the law than you do seeing none of them spoke of any new day of worship or the abolition of the Sabbath day?

They were writing to people who were living the first century beliefs. You would think that if the Sabbath LAW was changed to Sunday as LAW it would be written about wouldn't you? But you don't understand that it was no longer a LAW to be kept by the letter so was not part of Christianity. Remember, In fact, they met DAILY.

Acts of the Apostles 2:46-47
46 So continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, they ate their food with gladness and simplicity of heart, 47 praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily those who were being saved.

d. If the old covenant law that needed to be replaced because it was faulty, are you saying the Tec Commandments which God Himself wrote on stone, was faulty?

Anything that God wrote is holy. But God wrote them to be kept by a faulty flesh like to kindergartners. But the flesh made them always fumble on the one law of the heart, the 10th. So they could never be as holy as the One who wrote them. That experience is in Romans 7:7-25.

They were fashioned after the Royal Law, but basically dumbed down because of our sin nature. That is why Paul wrote:

Romans 3:
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed, 26 to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

Now we can be holy as the Father is holy. Hebrews 12:14.

You didn't actually respond to any of the points I've been making, but simply regurgitating your own, so maybe you could answer the above with some semblance of Biblical relevance?

I hope I've been plain enough for you to finally understand and graduate to the New Covenant.
 

CharismaticLady

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the thing is CL, If the Spirit of the Law is in ones heart so will the letter of the Law be but let's cut to the chase, its the Sabbath Commandment which you take offence at.....if you didn't you wouldn't argue against it.....and you would honour it.

Hey, QT Haven't talked to you for a while. Missed you.

I love Seventh-day Adventists. But I know so much more now that I would have never known had I remained a SDA, or any of the other two denominations I was in before now. I can even hear God's voice. I want everyone to experience God the same way I do, and know the freedom from the desire to sin. That is the main subject I talk about on the forums, but most Adventists just want to talk about the Sabbath and I never see them in my posts on sin, or the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

I don't take "offense" at you worshiping on Saturday, anymore than I take offense at everyone else worshiping on Sunday. I do take offense at some of those Sunday keepers who call Sunday, the Sabbath, like the Amish to name just one. That's just ignorant and unauthorized. The fact is neither day is law in the New Covenant nor the only day of the week to worship God. We are to worship Him every moment of every day like Enoch and David did as a boy in the fields with his sheep writing songs to God when he was the apple of God's eye. At 74 and 44 years walking in the Spirit, that is how I am every moment of every day, especially as I believe Jesus is coming very, very soon. Even my dreams are pure and with Christian themes. LOL I'm not saying that to boast, just to show the wonder of what God has done in my life, and I want done in all those I speak to on here and other forum sites. I am not the one taking offense. There is one other that takes offense at me for not keeping it anymore and telling me I am out of God's will. Well 1 John 3:21-22 verifies he is wrong, because 100% of my prayers are answered, and I receive what I prayed for immediately. Why? Because I keep His commandments. And what are they? 1 John 3:23-24

46 So continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, they ate their food with gladness and simplicity of heart, 47 praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily those who were being saved.
 
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post

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Is that what you read off your Jesuit web pages? What is a bastardization of Scripture is OSAS, Jesuit Futurism, Dispensationalism, Antinomianism, etc. So glad Jesus is coming soon to sort out all who author and promulgate such nonsense.

Hmm OK so, endure in what, and how?
 

Brakelite

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You cannot kept the 7th day Sabbath from instinct, only by rules of the letter of the law, which I doubt you keep anyway.
But you can by simple obedience. It all friends upon who our what authority you choose to surrender to. If you observe Sunday, you observe and obey the Catholic Church. If you observe a "rest in Christ theme", which varies from church to church depending on your prospective, you are observing your own authority. They're is no justification for discarding the Commandment. Your excuses are simply made up according to your own imagination. You cannot biblically justify disobedience to the letter of the law. You can promote the indwelling Spirit who empowers you to obey, which you actually do elsewhere, but you reveal who your Lord in when discarding the 4th Commandment. Your going on about the covenant etc merely discloses your weak arguments, and your accusations that Sabbath keepers going understand the covenants reveals your own inhept research and scholarship. And your poor attention when attending Adventist churches. I could give you any number of brilliant links to articles, seminars, sermons, that teach sounds clear instruction and insight into the covenants... Without any reference to Ellen White... And without destroying biblical context and meaning. But because you are locked into your adopted position, I don't believe you'd be interested.
 

Brakelite

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And the writer is not meaning spirit like the essence of the law, but as lead by the Holy Spirit.
And you think the holy Spirit incapable of teaching one to obey by using what He wrote in scripture?
Can you do that with the 4th commandment without being taught the rules?
No. I need a "thus sayeth the Lord" . It's that okay with you?
You know it is only by the letter of the law
Which was written by the finger of God... Transgression of which is sin... As opposed to the ceremonial laws which if one transgressed was not sin. Shall we sin that grace may abound?
But Jeremiah 31:31-34 shows us that no man needs to be taught.
Right. That means that everyone can ditch the scriptures because they are all taught of the spirit right?
It was the first thing that God created to later point to the Redeemer from before the foundation of the world
Where in Genesis 1-3 is the Sabbath linked to redemption? And why would God establish the Sabbath as a type of redemption before the fall? The language in the Commandment itself stands as a rebuke to your idea.
It then became a ceremonial law given only to the Jews, but the substance always pointed to Christ.
Jesus' own words stand as a rebuke to this also. "The Sabbath was made for man". We were told by Jesus that the Sabbath was made for man, in which time there was no such thing as a Jew. Just because it was given to the Israelites as part of his covenant with them does not mean it did not exist before. We should expect God to share the blessings he gave to our first parents with the people he was trying to establish as his nation here on earth.

There is no record of anyone before being taught to keep the Sabbath.
Jesus said the Sabbath was made for man, which at that time was Adam and Eve. Are we to suppose the Adam then ignored it, and told his progeny to ignore it? Or perhaps Adam said to his children, and his grandchildren, remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy?
 

Phoneman777

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The Word of the Father wrote them. John 15:10
Let's get something straight about Jesus:

"ALL THINGS were made by Him (including the Ten Commandments) and without Him nothing was made that was made." -- John 1:3 KJV

So, to which commandments did He refer when He said, "If ye love Me, keep My commandments"? His Ten Commandments. Betimes, Jesus spoke as a man and also as God, so let's not make those times He spoke as a man negate the truths which pertain to Him as God.
 

Phoneman777

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Hey, if you want to believe that Moses wrote the second tables,

And the LORD said unto Moses, Write thou these words: for after the tenor of these words I have made a covenant with thee and with Israel. And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments. (Ex 34)

This is the set hewed by Moses put into the ark. The 1st set written by the finger of God was broken up by Moses.
WRONG. Moses did all his writing in a BOOK (Deuteronomy 31:24 KJV) and God wrote the Ten Commandments the second time in STONE (Exodus 34:1 KJV).

The pronoun "he" in your "proof text" can apply to either Moses or the Lord, so an honest scholar like myself will appeal to other texts for clarification, while a stubborn, ignorant teacher of false doctrine like yourself will deny these other texts of Scripture in order to establish his error. Repent of this foolishness.
overwhelming evidence which puts a difference between the Moral and Mosaic Laws All from your minds, none from Scripture, as well as Scripture refuting your minds. And you minds also persist into the depths of irrationality to tray and make it so. The same as the created-christ pushers.
Did you even bother to read the texts I presented with prove the difference between the Mosaic Law and the Moral Law? Probably not, because ignorance is bliss. For instance, the Mosaic Law of ceremonies and sacrifices is clearly said to have been nailed to the Cross (Colossians 2:14-16 KJV) while the Ten Commandments are said to "stand fast forever and ever" (Psalms 111:7-8 KJV). Deliberately ignoring the evidence of the Biblical distinction between the Moral Law and the Mosaic Law so you can sleep at night is not going to prevent the rude awakening that is sure to come upon you in the end, pal.
I ain't mad at ya.

That doesn't matter. But you are glad we won't be messing up your personal Sabbath heaven, even as you don't let anyone mess up your personal Sabbath on earth by having any fellowship with them that Sabbath not. Which again, doesn't matter to me. You people have thoroughly exposed yourselves as elitist separatists, who have thoroughly blinded your minds from Scripture of truth and the things of the Spirit by your absolute obedience to your 1st Commandment of Sabbath. Keeping this carnal commandment has made you carnal in all your ways, even as the physical seed that abides in unbelief. You don't have all the vail of Moses upon your hearts as they, but you certainly do have the vail of a carnal Sabbath.
And you have deliberately blinded yourself to the truth that Saints who refuse to keep God's commandments show their love has turned away from God and back to sin, and they will NOT enter the kingdom of God (Revelation 22:14 KJV). Please - stop teaching the lie of OSAS and start teaching the Bible, lest the latter end of you be worse than the beginning (2 Peter 2:20 KJV).
 
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Phoneman777

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Questions:
a. Where is the text that says God unblessed the Sabbath day? See 1 Chron. 17:27
b. Luke, in writing his gospel decades later says in Luke 23:56 "according to the commandment". How come they kept and observed the Sabbath according to the commandment if it was no longer a commandment?
c. Why is it that none of the gospel writers, every one of whom penned their work decades after the resurrection, know less about the covenants and the law than you do seeing none of them spoke of any new day of worship or the abolition of the Sabbath day?
d. If the old covenant law that needed to be replaced because it was faulty, are you saying the Tec Commandments which God Himself wrote on stone, was faulty?
You didn't actually respond to any of the points I've been making, but simply regurgitating your own, so maybe you could answer the above with some semblance of Biblical relevance?
The only way to establish Antinomianist doctrine is to read the Scriptures as one would survey a buffet table, selecting that which is appealing and snubbing the nose to that which is not. That is why the challenge your questions present goes unmet by those who "draw nigh unto Me with their mouths and do honor Me with their lips, but their hearts are far from Me" because their "fear of the Lord is taught by the precepts of men". (Matthew 15:7-9 KJV; Isaiah 29:13 KJV).
 
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Phoneman777

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All of Leviticus 23 are ceremonial; the substance of all of them, including when the Creator rested, is fulfilled in Christ and His LOVE.
Yours is a religion of confusion and inconsistency and contradiction. The Ten Commandments existed LONG BEFORE Leviticus 23, because Cain knew better than to kill, Abraham knew better than to lie, Rachel knew better than to steal, Joseph knew better than to commit adultery, which he called "sin" -- and calling it "sin" proves the Ten Commandments existed back then because "sin is the transgression of the law".

Does the keeping the "Spirit of the Law" by turning our eyes away from "lust" mean we are at liberty to disregard the "Letter of the Law" and ejaculate in our neighbor's wife? Of course not. So, why does keeping the "Spirit" of rest in Jesus allow for us to disregard the "Letter" which says to rest on the seventh day Sabbath?
All of those is Leviticus 23 are kept by the letter. You cannot kept the 7th day Sabbath from instinct, only by rules of the letter of the law, which I doubt you keep anyway.
How about we limit the scope of our speculations to what is written in these forums, and not comment on things we no absolutely nothing about, OK?
 

Phoneman777

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If you love ME keep MY commandments. What did He teach?

1. Believe in Me.
2. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

1 John 3:23-24 verified that those are the New Covenant commandments. "If ye love Me, keep My commandments" was written by John, so he knew beyond doubt what Christ meant.
"ALL THINGS were created by Him and without Him nothing was made that was made." -- John 1:3 KJV

When Jesus says "His commandments", He's talking about the Ten Commandments which He created and which He spoke at Sinai.

So, the question isn't to which commandments does John 14:15 KJV refer, but why so many "Christians" refuse to obey them. I think the answer is perfectly clear and can be found just below the a bit to the left of the neck.
 

Phoneman777

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Again, John wrote Revelation, and he knows what the commandments are. Besides faith in Jesus Christ, they keep the royal law. James 2:8 They are eternal, as is the first part of the royal law.

Love God with all your heart, mind and strength, and love your neighbor as yourself. These are all kept by the Spirit, not by the letter.
Again, if we're keeping the Spirit, we will by default be keeping the letter!

Can a man keep the Spirit of "thou shalt not commit adultery" by shutting his eyes from seeing a naked woman while simultaneously breaking the Letter by ejaculating in her?

Can a man keep the Spirit of "thou shalt not kill" by smiling compassionately in another man's face while simultaneously breaking the Letter by twisting a knife through his heart?

But, you say a man can keep the Spirit of "Remember the Sabbath day" by resting in Jesus while at the same time breaking the Letter by telling Him, "Sorry, Jesus, I know You waited all week for this time together, but there's double time to be made and I gotta get while the gettin's good"...right?
 

Phoneman777

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Hmm OK so, endure in what, and how?
One of the things we have to endure is attacks on Jesus and His truth by people like you who will go so far to preserve the lie of OSAS that you claim the wicked can partake of agape love of God.....

.....so that the "many" of Matthew 24:12 KJV who are "Saints" (for only saints can partake of "agape") can be falsely taught to be "the wicked" so that it is "the wicked" who end up lost, in contrast to the Saints of verse 13 who do "endure to the end" and are "saved"(Matthew 24:13 KJV).

You read the plain texts in which Jesus is warning the church, NOT THE WICKED, of what is going to come upon it and what they'll have to endure, but when He gets to verse 12....well, then...that's talking about the wicked, right?
 

post

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One of the things we have to endure is attacks on Jesus and His truth by people like you who will go so far to preserve the lie of OSAS that you claim the wicked can partake of agape love of God.....

.....so that the "many" of Matthew 24:12 KJV who are "Saints" (for only saints can partake of "agape") can be falsely taught to be "the wicked" so that it is "the wicked" who end up lost, in contrast to the Saints of verse 13 who do "endure to the end" and are "saved"(Matthew 24:13 KJV).

You read the plain texts in which Jesus is warning the church, NOT THE WICKED, of what is going to come upon it and what they'll have to endure, but when He gets to verse 12....well, then...that's talking about the wicked, right?

Um, no, I'm asking what those who will be saved endure in, and how they manage to do so?
 

Phoneman777

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Um, no, I'm asking what those who will be saved endure in, and how they manage to do so?
I just named one of the things they have to endure. If you don't believe it, re-read Matthew 24.
 

Phoneman777

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the thing is CL, If the Spirit of the Law is in ones heart so will the letter of the Law be but let's cut to the chase, its the Sabbath Commandment which you take offence at.....if you didn't you wouldn't argue against it.....and you would honour it.
Truth is, Christians have ZERO problem with commandments against stealing, lying, adultery, killing, etc., because they don't want anyone robbing them, swindling them out of their retirement, seducing their spouse, taking their life --- there's just that one commandment that seems to get everyone's blood pressure up when ironically, if we observe it, it will have the opposite effect!