God changed Seventh Day Sabbath Worship to First Day of the Week

JunChosen said:

God said in Exodus 31:13
"... Verily my sabbaths you shall keep: for it is a sign [a shadow] between me and you throughout your generations..."

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Exodus 31:13 "sign", Hebrew H226, "אות" ('oth), and it does not ever, in all of scripture, mean "shadow" (see below):

The Law of God, including the 4th Commandment, is always "light":

Total KJB Occurrences: 79

sign, 33
Exo_4:8 (3), Exo_8:23, Exo_13:9, Exo_31:13, Exo_31:17, Num_16:38, Deu_6:8, Deu_11:18, Deu_13:1-2 (2), Deu_28:46, Jos_4:6, Jdg_6:17, 1Sa_2:34, 1Sa_14:10, 2Ki_19:29, 2Ki_20:8-9 (2), Isa_7:11, Isa_7:14, Isa_19:20, Isa_20:3, Isa_37:30, Isa_38:7, Isa_38:22, Isa_55:13, Isa_66:19, Jer_44:29, Eze_4:3, Eze_14:8, Eze_20:12, Eze_20:20

signs, 27
Gen_1:14, Exo_4:9, Exo_4:17, Exo_4:28, Exo_4:30, Exo_7:3, Exo_10:1-2 (2), Num_14:11, Deu_4:34, Deu_6:22, Deu_7:19, Deu_26:8, Deu_29:3, Deu_34:11, Jos_24:17, 1Sa_10:7, 1Sa_10:9, Neh_9:10, Psa_74:4, Psa_74:9, Psa_78:43, Psa_105:27, Isa_8:18, Jer_10:2, Jer_32:20-21 (2)

token, 10
Gen_9:12-13 (2), Gen_9:17, Exo_12:11-13 (3), Exo_13:16, Num_17:10, Jos_2:12, Psa_86:17

tokens, 4
Job_21:29, Psa_135:8-9 (2), Isa_44:25

miracles, 2
Num_14:22, Deu_11:3

ensign, 1
Num_2:2

ensigns, 1
Psa_74:4

mark, 1
Gen_4:15

The very word "Sabbath" contains the word 'oth along with "abba", as the sign of the Father's, and all the children who bear His sign, are His.

charity said:

Hello @ReChoired, ...

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I have read Romans 11, numerous times. I have read the OT prophets numerous times. It's why I am Seventh-day Adventist, and no longer Roman Catholic.

The theology you presently espouse is Jesuit theology. Go read their material. You'll see.

I understand your reluctance to read the evidence I provided. It would show your error, quite plainly, and you do not want that. Easier for you to ignore it. I get it, really. When truth comes to us, we have two choices. Right now, you are making the choice Pilate took. You don't have to make that choice, but you are making it none the less.

Romans 11:

Rom 11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.
Rom 11:2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel, saying,
Rom 11:3 Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life.
Rom 11:4 But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.
Rom 11:5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.
Rom 11:6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
Rom 11:7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded
Rom 11:8 (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear unto this day.
Rom 11:9 And David saith, Let their table be made a snare, and a trap, and a stumblingblock, and a recompence unto them:
Rom 11:10 Let their eyes be darkened, that they may not see, and bow down their back alway.
Rom 11:11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.
Rom 11:12 Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?
Rom 11:13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:
Rom 11:14 If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them.
Rom 11:15 For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?
Rom 11:16 For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches.
Rom 11:17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;
Rom 11:18 Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.
Rom 11:19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in.
Rom 11:20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
Rom 11:21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Rom 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
Rom 11:23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.
Rom 11:24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?

Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Rom 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
Rom 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
Rom 11:30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
Rom 11:31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
Rom 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
Rom 11:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!
Rom 11:34 For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?
Rom 11:35 Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again?
Rom 11:36 For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.

The individuals are called to come into Christ Jesus through faith. If they do not, they are forever lost.

Read it - each verse. If you do not, you have chosen to remain as blind as they of old, and the prophecy of David and Isaiah are for you.

1 Corinthians 10 and 1 Corinthians 15:44-46:

Jesus is Israel (Matthew 2:13-15,19-21; Hosea 11:1; his children are his disciples (they overcome with Him (1 John 2:13-14; Revelation 3:12, 12:11)); Hebrews 2:13; Isaiah 8:16,18; John 13:33), the true "overcomer" (John 16:33; Revelation 3:21), the real "Prince" with God (Isaiah 9:6; Daniel 8:11,25, 9:25, 10:13,21, 11:22, 12:1; Acts 3:15, 5:31; Revelation 1:5), being Lord over His own house, whose house are we (Psalms 98:3; Hebrews 3:6; Jeremiah 31:33), who himself is the "elect" (Isaiah 42:1; Matthew 12:18; 1 Peter 2:6) of the Father, in whom all the promises of God find their realization (2 Corinthians 1:20). The promises made by God were all based upon condition (Exodus 19).

Mat 2:13-15,19-21; Hos 11:1; Jer 31:33; Rom 9:6-8; Heb 2:13; Isa 8:16,18; Jhn 13:33, 16:33, 17:12, 18:9, 21:5; 1 Cor 15:46; 2 Cor 1:20; Gal 6:16; Heb 3:6, 8:8,10; Rev 3:21

'Israel' after the flesh, as a 'nation', is left desolate (Matthew 23:38; Luke 13:35), to bear no more fruit ever again (Matthew 21:19), cursed, withered away (Mark 11:21), dried up from the roots (Mark 11:20), "twice dead" (Jude 1:12), and the axe already laid at their root (Matthew 3:10; Luke 3:9), cut down and to be thrown into the fire.

Rom_9:6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:

When Paul in Romans says "And so all Israel shall be saved", in the context it means that all those who are in Christ Jesus (the elect of God, the good Tree, the real Israel of God), shall be saved. Anyone knowingly choosing to remain outside of Him is lost.

JunChosen said:

It's true. All of God's promises to National Israel has been fulfilled. The last fulfillment was in 1948 when Israel became a nation once again among the nations of the world. Romans 11 is speaking about the "Israel" of God [Galatians 6:16].

To God Be The Glory

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'I say then, Hath God cast away His people? God forbid.
For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. '
(Rom 11:1)

'And as many as walk according to this rule,
peace be on them, and mercy,
and upon the Israel of God.'
(Gal 6:16)

Hello @JunChosen

'To God be the Glory' indeed: but that cannot be the case if we do not handle the word of God correctly. God has not cast away His People Israel: our Lord's kinsmen in the flesh; for they have a major part to play in His future purpose, and there is no Scriptural warrant for using the words, 'The Israel of God', as a general title for the church of God today.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Eternally Grateful said:

That’s funny

God instituted the 7th day as a day of rest.

i see no place where that was changed,

as for a day of worship, god told us to worship every day in spirit and truth, yes, the church did meet on the first day of the week, but that was not a sabbath day, that was a day of worship

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No it didn't as the first day of the week was a normal working day.

ReChoired said:

I have read Romans 11, numerous times. I have read the OT prophets numerous times. It's why I am Seventh-day Adventist, and no longer Roman Catholic.

The theology you presently espouse is Jesuit theology. Go read their material. You'll see.

I understand your reluctance to read the evidence I provided. It would show your error, quite plainly, and you do not want that. Easier for you to ignore it. I get it, really. When truth comes to us, we have two choices. Right now, you are making the choice Pilate took. You don't have to make that choice, but you are making it none the less.

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'I say then, Hath God cast away his people?
God forbid. For I also am an Israelite,
of the seed of Abraham,
of the tribe of Benjamin.'
(Rom 11:1)

Hello @ReChoired

My reluctance to read your posts is entirely based on the fact that you are obviously in error concerning God's People Israel, who have a major part to play in God's future purposes, and therefore I am reluctant to imbibe what else you have to say, for I do not expose myself to error if I can avoid it.

Regarding the Sabbath Day, if I were to keep it, I would do so on the day of God's choosing, on the seventh day of the week. However, I am not a Jew by birth therefore am not under the law of the Sabbath, so my stand must be that of Paul in Colossians 2:16-17.

'Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink,
or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.'
(Col 2:16-17)

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

mailmandan said:

Seventh-day Adventists teach that the near the end of time the "mark of the best" of Revelation 14 will be placed upon those who worship on Sunday instead of Saturday.

Mark of the Beast

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I find it not a little odd that so many anti Sabbatarians are willing to so readily decry and pour scorn on that concept, while in the very same breath are willing to admit that have no idea of who the beast actually is. I mean, if you don't have a clue to the identity of the beast, then how can you be in any position to judge what it's mark is?

charity said:

My reluctance to read your posts is entirely based on the fact that you are obviously in error ...

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That's a contradictory statement. You are reluctant to read, and yet say I am obviously in error without having read my responses in detail, with the given references. That places the cart before the horse, charity, but yet it is the standard response I normally receive. Moving on then.

charity said:

Regarding the Sabbath Day, if I were to keep it, I would do so on the day of God's choosing, on the seventh day of the week. However, I am not a Jew by birth ...

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Show me one place in scripture where the Sabbath belongs exclusively to the "Jews". From what I read, beginning in Genesis 2:1-3; Exodus 20:8-11, it is always "the seventh day the sabbath of the LORD thy God", made for "(the) man" (Mark 2:27), even Christ Jesus (Colossians 1:16).

Was Moses a Jew? Think carefully.

Was Zipporah (Moses' wife) a Jew? Think carefully.

Were the mixed multitude that came out of Egypt and were all present at Mt. Sinai, Jews? Think carefully.

Was Cornelius a Jew? Think carefully.

Was the whole city, Jews, in Acts 13:44? Think carefully.

You say "if" you were to "keep", and place yourself in the position of God, that is to say above the spiritual Law of God. You do realize that the Ten Commandments, so derided as "Jewish" (like so many today who mock Jesus Christ, the Jew), were all spoken by God from Heaven, to the peoples at the Mount? If that makes the Sabbath of the LORD thy God "Jewish" (for the Jews only), then, by that same horrendous and sinful theology, they are all only and ever for the Jews. The passages most give, citing the NT texts, never consider that those NT texts are simply citing OT verses, in regards the Ten Commandments (whom you say is for the Jews). Like Love God, Love neighbour (See Deuteronomy 6:5, in context of Deuteronomy 5, and see Leviticus 19:17-18, in context of sin and the Ten Commandments). Both of those are summations of the Ten Commandments (which you say is Jewish), therefore, by that horrendous theology, Love God, and love neighbour is only for the Jews. What about having no other Gods besides the LORD of the Sabbath (Jewish?), no idols (Jewish?), not taking the LORD's name (character) in vain (Jewish? after all Jesus became a Jew, and He is Jesus the Messiah, a Jew), honouring Father and Mother (Jewish?), killing/murder (Jewish?), adultery (Jewish?), stealing (Jewish?), bearing false witness (Jewish?), coveting (Jewish?). They are not the 9 commandments anywhere in scripture. They are a package deal. Ten. If one is Jewish, they are all Jewish, and all this 'rubbish' about the rest is just semantic nonsense.

Backlit said:

I find it not a little odd that so many anti Sabbatarians are willing to so readily decry and pour scorn on that concept, while in the very same breath are willing to admit that have no idea of who the beast actually is. I mean, if you don't have a clue to the identity of the beast, then how can you be in any position to judge what it's mark is?

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So you believe that ludicrous doctrine? Are you a Seventh Day Adventist? I’ve been in multiple discussions with SDA’s on a different Christian forum and they come across to me as crafty lawyers who twist the scriptures in order to accommodate their perverted sabbath gospel and the end result is “salvation by grace plus law, faith plus works.” (Galatians 1:6-9)

mailmandan said:

So you believe that ludicrous doctrine? Are you a Seventh Day Adventist? I’ve been in multiple discussions with SDA’s on a different Christian forum and they come across to me as crafty lawyers who twist the scriptures in order to accommodate their perverted sabbath gospel and the end result is “salvation by grace plus law, faith plus works.” (Galatians 1:6-9)

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Why don't you ask the beast what his mark is?

Backlit said:

Why don't you ask the beast what his mark is?

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I already read about his mark in Revelation chapter 13.

mailmandan said:

I already read about his mark in Revelation chapter 13.

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Of course. And your conclusion?
A micro chip?
The covid vaccine?
Computer bars tattooed on the forehead?
And so like everyone else, you pick a "mark" out of a hat and then apply it to some imaginary future "beast"/ Antichrist/Jewish-dictator and claim, I know what the mark of the beast is!
And you say Sunday sacredness as the mark of ecclesiastical authority in the Catholic Church by her own admission, is ludicrous?
No-one so deceived as those who run with the eyes shut but believe they are open.

JunChosen said:

It is a sign in the sense that Exodus 31:13 points to a reality of a very spiritual significance.
Note in verse 14 God declares that the Sabbath is holy and every one found to defile it by doing work therein shall be put to death.
Do you know the spiritual meaning? And do you know why the punishment of doing work on the Sabbath is so severe as to be put to death?

To God Be The Glory

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I answered that already here by the following material:

COVENANTS

..."

Hello @JunChosen,

Thank you for responding.

In Romans 9:27, concerning Israel it is said, 'a remnant shall be saved'. This was so at the time of the writing of Paul's epistle, for only a remnant had believed the gospel during the ministry of Christ Himself, and of 'those who heard Him' (the Apostles), yet Paul assures his countrymen, fellow believers like himself, that the day would come when 'all Israel shall be saved' (Romans 11:26). God will pour out 'the spirit of grace and of supplications' upon them; and they shall look upon Him Whom they have pierced; and shall mourn for Him (Zechariah 12:10). God will cleanse them from all their iniquity, whereby they have sinned against Him, and will pardon all their iniquities. (Jeremiah 33:38).
* Look again at what is actually said in Galatians 6:15-16:-

'For in Christ Jesus
.. neither circumcision availeth any thing,
.... nor uncircumcision,
...... but a new creature.
And as many as walk according to this rule,
.. peace be on them, and mercy,
.... and upon the Israel of God.'
(Gal 6:15-16)

* 'The Israel of God' is the opposite of 'Israel after the flesh' that Paul refers to in 1 Corinthians 10:18, but still of the nation of Israel.
* Redeemed Israel shall be a kingdom of Priests unto God among the nations, as God appointed in Exodus 19:5-6; Jeremiah 31:31-37;

* The blindness of Israel will continue until 'the fulness of the Gentiles be come in'.

'For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery,
lest ye should be wise in your own conceits;
that blindness in part is happened to Israel,
until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
And so all Israel shall be saved:
as it is written,
.. There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer,
.... and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
...... For this is My covenant unto them,
........ when I shall take away their sins.'
As concerning the gospel,
.. they are enemies for your sakes:
.... but as touching the election,
...... they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.'
(Rom 11:25-29)

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

ReChoired said:

That's a contradictory statement. You are reluctant to read, and yet say I am obviously in error without having read my responses in detail, with the given references. That places the cart before the horse, charity, but yet it is the standard response I normally receive. Moving on then.

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Hello @ReChoired,

If that is the response you 'normally receive', perhaps you should ask yourself why. Or do you believe that it is only yourself and those of like mind as yourself who have the TRUTH.

I have the word of God as you have, and it alone is my teacher in the hand of the Holy Spirit.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

ReChoired said:

Show me one place in scripture where the Sabbath belongs exclusively to the "Jews". From what I read, beginning in Genesis 2:1-3; Exodus 20:8-11, it is always "the seventh day the sabbath of the LORD thy God", made for "(the) man" (Mark 2:27), even Christ Jesus (Colossians 1:16).

Was Moses a Jew? Think carefully.

Was Zipporah (Moses' wife) a Jew? Think carefully.

Were the mixed multitude that came out of Egypt and were all present at Mt. Sinai, Jews? Think carefully.

Was Cornelius a Jew? Think carefully.

Was the whole city, Jews, in Acts 13:44? Think carefully.

You say "if" you were to "keep", and place yourself in the position of God, that is to say above the spiritual Law of God. You do realize that the Ten Commandments, so derided as "Jewish" (like so many today who mock Jesus Christ, the Jew), were all spoken by God from Heaven, to the peoples at the Mount? If that makes the Sabbath of the LORD thy God "Jewish" (for the Jews only), then, by that same horrendous and sinful theology, they are all only and ever for the Jews. The passages most give, citing the NT texts, never consider that those NT texts are simply citing OT verses, in regards the Ten Commandments (whom you say is for the Jews). Like Love God, Love neighbour (See Deuteronomy 6:5, in context of Deuteronomy 5, and see Leviticus 19:17-18, in context of sin and the Ten Commandments). Both of those are summations of the Ten Commandments (which you say is Jewish), therefore, by that horrendous theology, Love God, and love neighbour is only for the Jews. What about having no other Gods besides the LORD of the Sabbath (Jewish?), no idols (Jewish?), not taking the LORD's name (character) in vain (Jewish? after all Jesus became a Jew, and He is Jesus the Messiah, a Jew), honouring Father and Mother (Jewish?), killing/murder (Jewish?), adultery (Jewish?), stealing (Jewish?), bearing false witness (Jewish?), coveting (Jewish?). They are not the 9 commandments anywhere in scripture. They are a package deal. Ten. If one is Jewish, they are all Jewish, and all this 'rubbish' about the rest is just semantic nonsense.

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Hello @ReChoired

I have no desire to pursue this line of enquiry with you. I have given you my response to this in a former post, and see no reason for further discussion on it.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Curtis said:

So is the fact that Paul said that law was not meant for the righteous but for ungodly sinners and murderers, and that Christians are no longer under that law, but have died to it, for before faith came, we were imprisoned by the law, until Jesus and faith came along.

So if you want to quote the NT, quote all it says about the law, like how Christians are dead to the law, and now are married to Jesus instead of the law, and have been DELIVERED FROM the law:


Rom 7:4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.


Rom 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not inthe oldness of the letter.


Or quote that the law doesn’t apply to Christians, just to the unconverted, because the law is NOT MEANT for a RIGHTEOUS MAN, but for the UNGODLY and for MURDERERS:


1Ti 1:9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderersof fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,


1Ti 1:10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;


Christians are the righteousness of God in Christ, thus the law, which is not meant for a righteous man, but for the ungodly is null and void for us.


Php 3:9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:


And this agrees:


Rom 3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested,being witnessed by the law and the prophets;


Thus it hasn’t passed away, it just doesn’t apply to those born again, since it’s only meant for the ungodly and murderers, etc. 1 Tim 1:9 above.


And don’t forget it says that BEFORE faith came, we were imprisoned by the law, locked up by it until the coming of Christ, and now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian:


Gal 3:23 Now before faith came, we were held captive under the law,imprisoned until the coming faith would be revealed.


Gal 3:24 So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith.



Gal 3:25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian,

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Amen! And AMEN!! Seems to me this whole discussion about The LAW
that NO LONGER applies To The Body Of CHRIST, is Pointless! Because,
According To The Scriptures:

The law IS FULFILLED "In ONE WORD: LOVE!" (Gal 5:14; Rom 13:8-10 KJB!)

Thus, I REST In, and worship HIM, 24/7!

Be Blessed!