Should we pray to God or Jesus or both?

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Thomas-

New Member
Mar 24, 2011
7
0
0
This is a topic I have been debating for quite some time now. When I pray I often start the prayer "Dear God and Jesus...". As I read the bible Jesus is always talking about praying to the father,asking the father for strength,honoring the father,etc. Even the lords prayer is directed at God and Jesus told us this is the way we should pray. Yet in church we rarely if ever pray to God. It always ends with "In Jesus name" or starts with "Our lord Jesus Christ". I do understand the meaning of the father,son,and holy ghost and realize they are 3 separate entities in one body. Yet I am often confused if we should pray to just Jesus or should we pray to just God or should we pray to both of them at different times.
 

Templar81

New Member
Apr 14, 2010
854
17
0
UK
Since jesus is God then we can direct our prayers to him, but when we direct our prayers to God the father, we are doing so through Jesus. "No-one comes to the father except through me." By virtue of being Christians we are praying through the Son tot he Father.

There are also prayers to the Holy spirit; like Veni Creator Spiritus (come Holy Spirit)

Then we have the Trinitarian forumla; In the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirir. (In nomine Patris et Filli et Spiritus Sancti.

Baptisms in some chruches is in the name fo the Trinity and in others it is simply done in Jesus name. either way it makes no difference since Jesus is God and you certainly don't have to be a unitarian to only pray in jesus name. The scriptures say we can use both so I would call it a matter of preferance.
 

Butch5

Butch5
Oct 24, 2009
1,146
32
48
62
Homer Ga.
This is a topic I have been debating for quite some time now. When I pray I often start the prayer "Dear God and Jesus...". As I read the bible Jesus is always talking about praying to the father,asking the father for strength,honoring the father,etc. Even the lords prayer is directed at God and Jesus told us this is the way we should pray. Yet in church we rarely if ever pray to God. It always ends with "In Jesus name" or starts with "Our lord Jesus Christ". I do understand the meaning of the father,son,and holy ghost and realize they are 3 separate entities in one body. Yet I am often confused if we should pray to just Jesus or should we pray to just God or should we pray to both of them at different times.

We are to pray to the Father. There is nothing in Scripture that tells us to pray to Jesus, Jesus Himself prayed to the Father. When we say "In Jesus name" we are saying that we are addressing the Father having been given this authority as follower of Jesus, in other words, we are addressing the Father with the authority to do so because we are Jesus' disciples.
 

bigape

New Member
May 22, 2008
235
14
0
68
What is there to debate about.

Jesus made it clear, who we should pray to.........
Matthew 6:6
“But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee \openly.”

Luke 11:2
“And he said unto them, When ye pray, say, Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done, as in heaven, so in earth.”

John 16:23
“And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give [it] you.”
 

Templar81

New Member
Apr 14, 2010
854
17
0
UK
That is what I was trying to say, Butch, though don't foregt that jesus is actually God himself.

Here's an example:

Almighty God
to whom all hearts are open
all esires known
and from whom no secrets are hidden.
Clense the thoughts of our hearts
by the inspiration of your holy spirit
that we may perfectly love you
and worthily magify your holy name.
Through Chrsit our Lord.
Amen.

Quite clearly this is to the Father, through the Son
 

Butch5

Butch5
Oct 24, 2009
1,146
32
48
62
Homer Ga.
That is what I was trying to say, Butch, though don't foregt that jesus is actually God himself.

Here's an example:

Almighty God
to whom all hearts are open
all esires known
and from whom no secrets are hidden.
Clense the thoughts of our hearts
by the inspiration of your holy spirit
that we may perfectly love you
and worthily magify your holy name.
Through Chrsit our Lord.
Amen.

Quite clearly this is to the Father, through the Son

I agree that Jesus is God but He is not the Father.
 

Guestman

Active Member
Nov 11, 2009
618
72
28
70
Texas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
This is a topic I have been debating for quite some time now. When I pray I often start the prayer "Dear God and Jesus...". As I read the bible Jesus is always talking about praying to the father,asking the father for strength,honoring the father,etc. Even the lords prayer is directed at God and Jesus told us this is the way we should pray. Yet in church we rarely if ever pray to God. It always ends with "In Jesus name" or starts with "Our lord Jesus Christ". I do understand the meaning of the father,son,and holy ghost and realize they are 3 separate entities in one body. Yet I am often confused if we should pray to just Jesus or should we pray to just God or should we pray to both of them at different times.

On the night before his death, Jesus told his eleven faithful apostles: "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."(John 14:6) Over three years earlier, Jesus said: "You must pray, then, this way:Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified."(Matt 6:9) On another occasion, one of Jesus disciples had asked: "Lord, teach us how to pray, just as John also taught his disciples." Jesus replied: "Whenever you pray, say, Father, let your name be sanctified." (Luke 11:1, 2) Thus, Jesus established that it only to the Father, Jehovah God, that prayer is to be made and no one else.

Jesus was well aware of David's words at Psalms 65:1, 2 that says: "For you there is praise, O God....O Hearer of prayer, even to you people of all flesh will come." He fully understood David's words again at Psalms 145:18, that says: "Jehovah is near to all those calling upon him." At another time, David wrote: "To my sayings do give ear, O Jehovah....O my King and my God because to you I pray."(Ps 5:1, 2)

Jesus himself prayed to Jehovah God, for the apostle Paul wrote that Jesus "offered up supplications and also petitions to the One (Jehovah God) who was able to save him out of death."(Heb 5:7) On the night before his death, Luke says of Jesus: "But getting into agony he continued praying more earnestly."(Luke 22:42) The account in Matthew says that Jesus "fell upon his face, praying and saying: "My Father, if it possible, let this cup pass away from me. Yet, not as I will, but as you will."(Matt 26:39)

Thus, all prayer is to be directed only to the "one true God" and not to Jesus Christ.(John 17:3) Any who are to be a Christian must follow in exactly in Jesus footsteps and pray only to the Father, Jehovah God.(1 Pet 2:21) All prayers must made through Jesus Christ, for he said that "no one comes to the Father except through me."(John 14:6)
 

aspen

“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
Apr 25, 2012
14,111
4,778
113
52
West Coast
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
There is equality within the Trinity - all three are God all three are one. Jesus humbled Himself - His own choice - to be an example for us, but He is know in His rightful place and deserves all praise and honor from us.

Deciding who deserves more praise, adoration, or worship is to rank the personages. This is one of the main controversies between Orthodox and Roman Catholics. All personages are equal despite what the first draft of the Nicene Creed seems to indicate.
 

Amazing Grace

New Member
Mar 21, 2011
110
6
0
Often we see in the Bible that people prayed to the Lord. Both God and Jesus are the Lord.

REV 5:6 Then I saw a Lamb, looking as if it had been slain, standing in the center of the throne, encircled by the four living creatures and the elders. He had seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven spirits of God sent out into all the earth. 7 He came and took the scroll from the right hand of him who sat on the throne. 8 And when he had taken it, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb. Each one had a harp and they were holding golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints.



REV 8:2 And I saw the seven angels who stand before God, and to them were given seven trumpets.

REV 8:3 Another angel, who had a golden censer, came and stood at the altar. He was given much incense to offer, with the prayers of all the saints, on the golden altar before the throne. 4 The smoke of the incense, together with the prayers of the saints, went up before God from the angel's hand. 5 Then the angel took the censer, filled it with fire from the altar, and hurled it on the earth; and there came peals of thunder, rumblings, flashes of lightning and an earthquake.

The prayers of the Saints are offered to both to The Lamb and to God. So both receive them in Heaven.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Amazing Grace

Guestman

Active Member
Nov 11, 2009
618
72
28
70
Texas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Often we see in the Bible that people prayed to the Lord. Both God and Jesus are the Lord.



The prayers of the Saints are offered to both to The Lamb and to God. So both receive them in Heaven.

Revelation 5:6 does not say that Jesus is to be prayed to, for Jesus had already fully established prayer to his Father as the only way.(John 14:6) Rather, there was concern in finding one who was worthy of opening the "scroll written within and on the reverse the side, sealed tight with seven seals."(Rev 5:1) Thus, at verse 6, "a lamb" was the only one worthy to open the seal, and after taking it "out of the right hand of the One seated on the throne" (verse 7), then the "four living creatures and twenty four elders fell down before the Lamb".(Rev 5:8) However, there is nothing said about these praying to the "Lamb", but instead that "the incense means the prayers of the holy ones."(Rev 5:8)

If you had closely looked a little deeper, at Revelation 8:4, it says concerning the "incense": "And the smoke of the incense ascended from the hand of the angel with the prayers of the holy ones before God", not Jesus Christ or the "Lamb". It is because of distorting and twisting the Bible, that the "tradition" of prayer to Jesus (and even to Mary and the "saints") has been accepted without regard for what Jesus had said.

Some Bible translations, in an attempt to promote this, has added words to the Bible, as at Acts 7:59, in which the King James Bible reads: "And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit." Barnes’ Notes on the New Testament makes this honest admission: “The word God is not in the original, and should not have been in the translation. It is in none of the ancient [manuscripts] or versions.” How did the word “God” come to be inserted into that verse? Scholar Abiel Abbot Livermore called this “an instance of the sectarian biases of the translators.” Most modern translations, therefore, eliminate this spurious reference to God. Thus, in order to foster the belief in the trinity, these translators have dishonestly added the word "God" to Acts 7:59.

Many do not read the Bible with an eye toward what is accurate, but with bias and prejudice. It is no different than the religious leaders of Jesus day, whereby Jesus told them that they had made "the word of God invalid because of your tradition."(Matt 15:6) He further told them: "You are searching the Scriptures, because you think that by means of them you will have everlasting life; and these are the very ones that bear witness about me."(John 5:39) These did not examine the Bible with "a clean heart"(1 Tim 1:5), but to distort such provisions as the sabbath under the Mosaic Law, even condemning God's Son.(Matt 12:1-7)

Hence, nowhere in the Bible is any loyal servant of God praying to anyone else but God. For example, King Solomon, after the completion of the temple in Jerusalem and standing before the altar, spread his palms out to the heavens and said: "O Jehovah the God of Israel, there is no God like you in the heavens above or on the earth beneath." (1 Kings 8:22, 23) He thus prayed to Jehovah God, even saying that "there is no God like you."

Every prayer is a form of worship. The World Book Encyclopedia confirms this, stating: “Prayer is a form of worship in which a person may offer devotion, thanks, confession, or supplication to God.” On one occasion Jesus said: “It is written, ‘It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service.’” (Luke 4:8) Jesus adhered to the fundamental truth that worship—hence also prayers—is to be addressed only to his Father, Jehovah God. At Luke 6:12, it says of Jesus before selecting his twelve apostles, that "in the progress of these days he went out into the mountain to pray, and he continued the whole night in prayer to God."
 

Butch5

Butch5
Oct 24, 2009
1,146
32
48
62
Homer Ga.
There is equality within the Trinity - all three are God all three are one. Jesus humbled Himself - His own choice - to be an example for us, but He is know in His rightful place and deserves all praise and honor from us.

Deciding who deserves more praise, adoration, or worship is to rank the personages. This is one of the main controversies between Orthodox and Roman Catholics. All personages are equal despite what the first draft of the Nicene Creed seems to indicate.

It depends on what aspect you are speaking of. They are equal in nature, not order.
 

Foreigner

New Member
Apr 14, 2010
2,583
123
0
So they are all the same person, the same God...but you should only pray to one-third of that person?
 

bigape

New Member
May 22, 2008
235
14
0
68
So they are all the same person, the same God...but you should only pray to one-third of that person?


No.

We should just follow the Lord’s instructions...........
John 16:23
“And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you,
Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give [it] you.”
 

aspen

“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
Apr 25, 2012
14,111
4,778
113
52
West Coast
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
It depends on what aspect you are speaking of. They are equal in nature, not order.


What does that mean?

Since God chose to reveal Himself in a specific order, we are supposed to view them in that order? I think God is a bit more dynamic then that.....

It is as if we could simply call them by their rank......number !, number 2.....

 

Duckybill

New Member
Feb 12, 2010
3,416
44
0
There is equality within the Trinity - all three are God all three are one. Jesus humbled Himself - His own choice - to be an example for us, but He is know in His rightful place and deserves all praise and honor from us.
Very well put! IMO.

 

Amazing Grace

New Member
Mar 21, 2011
110
6
0
Guestman

Hence you should never pray any other prayer than the Lord's prayer.

MT 6:9 "This, then, is how you should pray:

" `Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name,

MT 6:10 your kingdom come,
your will be done
on earth as it is in heaven.

MT 6:11 Give us today our daily bread.

MT 6:12 Forgive us our debts,
as we also have forgiven our debtors.

MT 6:13 And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from the evil one. '

MT 6:14 For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15 But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.