Nation born in a day in 1948?

Ronald David Bruno · Oct 9, 2021

dad said:
Their only real beginning will be when they repent and all Israel is saved. Only the saved Israel will be gathered back to that land by God, and protected, and made rulers etc. The current nation according to prophesy is slated for invasion, defeat, and, great death and sorrow. The Israel that will be born in a day was not that secular doomed one.

Of course being born again would be the beginning of eternity for them but all the steps and actions that have transpired in the last 70 years were setting the stage for the final battle. Israel had to become a nation, they had to prosper and grow, to become wealthy enough, a nuclear power. They generate and fuel hate by their prosperity, their unity, their pride and religion (We are the chosen nation ... by God) and so the hatred grows until the only way to defeat them is to become a nuclear power. But all their enemies will be defeated. Iran is about there. Still Israel has probably hundreds of nukes. It only takes a couple, an EMP. In one hour many missiles will fly and many will die in a nuclear war.
This berse desceibes the effects of a neutron bomb. It dissolves/melts away your flesh while you are standing in your feet. I would imagine any nuclear bomb would.
And this shall be the plague with which the Lord will strike all the people who fought against Jerusalem: Their flesh shall dissolve while they stand on their feet, Their eyes shall dissolve in their sockets, And their tongues shall dissolve in their mouths. Zech. 14:12 The word "dissolve" can also be translated, consume away, rot, decay.
Will Christ use nukes to destroy them or just fire from heaven, He speaks the wirda and they are toast? That reminds me of that scene in Raiders of the Lost Ark, at the end.
Rev. 8:7 describes 1/3 of the earth on fire. That most likely is the Middle East.
The rider in the pale horse brings death (from wars, pestilence and famine) to 1/4 of the planet. That's almost 2 billion. Later in in the GT another 1/3 dies. That will cause people to repent. But they will have to before the last trumpet is blown, after which time the wrath of God in the Seven Bowls is released and no one repents after that, they curse God. The Restrainer, Holy Spirit, is taken out of the way and all hell breaks loose. So the question is, when will this remnant Jewish/Israel be enlightened? Where and when do the two witnesses who evangelize them arrive? Prior to Christ's return or after. It would appear prior since seeing Jesus descending from heaven would be enough and they wouldn't be needed.
Exciting and confusing times aye. Hold onto to your faith. We will have to go through some of that.

Ronald Nolette · Oct 9, 2021

dad said:
True they decided to set up a secular nation and came from many nations, that is not God bringing them, sorry.

Well I would like to see you prove this return was not diveinly originated. Do you have a hot line with god?

Ezekiel 20:34 - "I will bring you from the nations and gather you from the countries where you have been scattered -- with a mighty hand and an outstretched arm and with outpoured wrath."

Isaiah 11:11-12 NIV - "In that day the Lord will reach out his hand a second time to reclaim the remnant that is left of his people from Assyria, from Lower Egypt, from Upper Egypt, from Cush, from Elam, from Babylonia, from Hamath and from the islands of the sea. He will raise a banner for the nations and gather the exiles of Israel; he will assemble the scattered people of Judah from the four quarters of the earth."

(the first time was the return from Egypt)
Teh regathering is in Gods anger to judge them- not play nice with them)

Israel, a nation that had not really existed as a separate nation for nearly 2,500 years, was declared a new sovereign state by an act of the United Nations on May 14, 1948. The nation was born in a day.

Isaiah 66:8 NIV - "Who has ever heard of such a thing? Who has ever seen such things? Can a country be born in a day or a nation be brought forth in a moment? Yet no sooner is Zion in labour than she gives birth to her children."

Remember prior to May 14, 1948 the land hade known as the Roman renamed "palestine". after teh final disapoera in 135 A.D.

Isaiah 43:5-6,21 - "Do not be afraid, for I am with you; I will bring your children from the east and gather you from the west. I will say to the north, `Give them up!' and to the south, `Do not hold them back.' Bring my sons from afar and my daughters from the ends of the earth..."

"... the people I formed for myself that they may proclaim my praise."

Psalm 107:2-3 NIV - "Let the redeemed of the LORD say this -- those he redeemed from the hand of the foe, those he gathered from the lands, from east and west, from north and south.

This occurred in this order as major movements of Jews back to Israel.

Sign #6: A pure language

With the return of the nation, the ancient Hebrew language has been revived and become the official language of the state. Prior to this happening, the Jews spoke an impure form of the language called Yiddish. The return to a pure common language was again predicted by the prophets.

Zephaniah 3:8-10 KJV - "For then will I turn to the people a pure language, that they may all call upon the name of the LORD, to serve him with one consent. From beyond the rivers of Ethiopia my suppliants, [even] the daughter of my dispersed, shall bring mine offering".

Sign #7: The shekel

After nearly 2,000 years the shekel has been reinstated as the common monetary unit in Israel, again, just as predicted.

Ezekiel 45:12-16 NIV - "The shekel is to consist of twenty gerahs. Twenty shekels plus twenty-five shekels plus fifteen shekels equal one mina.... All the people of the land will participate in this special gift for the use of the prince in Israel."

The shekel had to be restored. Israel has never had a prince, but Jesus will be the Prince of Peace to them.

Sign #8: Named cities of Israel

There are many cities in Israel that bear the ancient names of previous Jewish cities. Some of these that bear their Biblical identification include: Cana, Nazareth, Jericho, Nain, Bethany, Bethlehem, Hebron, Gaza, etc. Again, as the ancient nation was in the process of being destroyed, Ezekiel the prophet predicted that many of the ancient cities would, in fact, be re-inhabited and settled in the exact locations.

Ezekiel 36:11; 24 KJV - "And I will multiply upon you man and beast; and they shall increase and bring fruit: and I will settle you after your old estates, and will do better [unto you] than at your beginnings: and ye shall know that I [am] the LORD.... For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land."

This is happening before our eyes and you do not conisder this a movement by God? Why?

Sign #9: Cities excepted - never to be inhabited

Yeshua pronounced a curse on at least three cities within the land. These remain in ruins today.

Matthew 11:21-23 NIV - "Woe to you, Korazin! Woe to you, Bethsaida! If the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Tyre and Sidon, they would have repented long ago in sackcloth and ashes. And you, Capernaum, will you be lifted up to the skies? No, you will go down to the depths. If the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Sodom, it would have remained to this day."

Sign #10: From desolation to productivity

The restoration of the agriculture and of the trees and forests of Israel has been another remarkable miracle. Scarcely 75 years ago, the land was a desolate waste, full of malarial swamps and deserts. Today the replanted forests are flourishing and the Israeli agricultural production is one of the great wonders of the world. This tiny country exports quality produce around the world. Should we say, "Again, just as predicted!"

Isaiah 26:6 NIV - "In days to come Jacob will take root, Israel will bud and blossom and fill all the world with fruit."

Isaiah 35:1-2 NIV - "The desert and the parched land will be glad; the wilderness will rejoice and blossom. Like the crocus, it will burst into bloom; it will rejoice greatly and shout for joy....

All these are taking place just as prophesied!

dad · Oct 9, 2021

Davy said:
I don't know Hibbs either.

The prophecy involved is in Jeremiah 24.

In that prophecy God shows a vision to Jeremiah, and he sees two baskets of figs. One basket is of good figs, and the other basket is evil figs, so evil they cannot be eaten.

God then explains that like the good figs, He would acknowledge those of Judah carried away captive, and would bring them back to the land He promised them, and build them, and not pluck them up again (Jeremiah 24:5-6).

So Judah represents the good figs.

Therefore, when did God bring Judah back to the holy land and not remove them again?

We definitely know it was not in 70 A.D., because the Romans destroyed Jerusalem and scattered even that small remnant of the house of Judah at Jerusalem-Judea. Only in the centuries past 70 A.D. have the Jews been returning, and only in 1947-48 did Israel become a nation again since that time.

Thusly, IF... they are not removed again in the future from the land, then 1948 does represent this Jeremiah 24 prophecy having been fulfilled. And the fact that the Jeremiah 24 prophecy also points to the evil servants of the devil still dwelling among them, i.e., the evil basket of figs, it does show the prophecy is not for after Christ's future return, but for the last days.

Your main points are that God, sometime after the captivity, promises to return them to the land, not to be plucked up again, and that you think that a mention of bad figs means that this all has to be before the rule/return of Jesus.
To the first point, that is talking about when the people repent and turn to Him. That was not 1948.
Jeremiah 24:7
And I will give them an heart to know me, that I am the Lord : and they shall be my people, and I will be their God: for they shall return unto me with their whole heart.

To the second point, look who the bad figs are.
Jeremiah 24:8
And as the evil figs, which cannot be eaten, they are so evil; surely thus saith the Lord , So will I give Zedekiah the king of Judah, and his princes, and the residue of Jerusalem, that remain in this land, and them that dwell in the land of Egypt:
Jeremiah 24:9
And I will deliver them to be removed into all the kingdoms of the earth for their hurt, to be a reproach and a proverb, a taunt and a curse, in all places whither I shall drive them

The them here seems well defined. I do not see this meaning that it somehow points to 1948.

Ronald Nolette · Oct 9, 2021

dad said:
To the second point, look who the bad figs are.
Jeremiah 24:8
And as the evil figs, which cannot be eaten, they are so evil; surely thus saith the Lord , So will I give Zedekiah the king of Judah, and his princes, and the residue of Jerusalem, that remain in this land, and them that dwell in the land of Egypt:
Jeremiah 24:9
And I will deliver them to be removed into all the kingdoms of the earth for their hurt, to be a reproach and a proverb, a taunt and a curse, in all places whither I shall drive them

This is what took place from 70-135 AD.

dad said:
Jeremiah 24:7
And I will give them an heart to know me, that I am the Lord : and they shall be my people, and I will be their God: for they shall return unto me with their whole heart.

This will happen right before Jesus returns.

2 Cor. 3:
14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.

15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.

16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

Romans 11:
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.

29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

And that covenant is spelled out here:

Jer. 33:
Jeremiah 31:31-33
King James Version

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

So putting it all together:

1,. He returns the people in unbelief
2. Land will floueish again.
3. Ancient Hebrew becomes a spoken language again
4. The Jewish shekel resptred
5. The gathering is to judge th epeople.
6. The peopel are to return from all points of the compass.

These are all prophecies and all fulfilled.

dad · Oct 9, 2021

Ronald David Bruno said:
Of course being born again would be the beginning of eternity for them but all the steps and actions that have transpired in the last 70 years were setting the stage for the final battle. Israel had to become a nation, they had to prosper and grow, to become wealthy enough, a nuclear power. They generate and fuel hate by their prosperity, their unity, their pride and religion (We are the chosen nation ... by God) and so the hatred grows until the only way to defeat them is to become a nuclear power. But all their enemies will be defeated. Iran is about there. Still Israel has probably hundreds of nukes. It only takes a couple, an EMP. In one hour many missiles will fly and many will die in a nuclear war.

The utter defeat of every single enemy of His people has zero to do with any weapon they have. It has to do with one thing only. That is a true belief in Jesus, the Messiah, and crying out to Him. If they did that this afternoon, ant threat from Iran would only be a memory. God will deal with the enemies Personally. No weapons needed.

This berse desceibes the effects of a neutron bomb. It dissolves/melts away your flesh while you are standing in your feet. I would imagine any nuclear bomb would.
And this shall be the plague with which the Lord will strike all the people who fought against Jerusalem: Their flesh shall dissolve while they stand on their feet, Their eyes shall dissolve in their sockets, And their tongues shall dissolve in their mouths. Zech. 14:12 The word "dissolve" can also be translated, consume away, rot, decay.

The bomb has similar effects. All a bomb does is tweak atoms. God created atoms and everything else, and does not need a Manhattan Project to cause things to happen in a New York minute. Since we see that it is God striking here, I think we can rule out puny little weapons of man.

Will Christ use nukes to destroy them or just fire from heaven, He speaks the wirda and they are toast? That reminds me of that scene in Raiders of the Lost Ark, at the end.

His word dissolves the universe in a moment and created it also. Truly, it is the fool that says in his heart there is no God.

Rev. 8:7 describes 1/3 of the earth on fire. That most likely is the Middle East.

That is before the return of Jesus, so who knows what that could be. That might have to do with weapons man created, who knows?

The rider in the pale horse brings death (from wars, pestilence and famine) to 1/4 of the planet. That's almost 2 billion. Later in in the GT another 1/3 dies. That will cause people to repent. But they will have to before the last trumpet is blown, after which time the wrath of God in the Seven Bowls is released and no one repents after that, they curse God. The Restrainer, Holy Spirit, is taken out of the way and all hell breaks loose. So the question is, when will this remnant Jewish/Israel be enlightened? Where and when do the two witnesses who evangelize them arrive? Prior to Christ's return or after

.
The witnesses are still preaching and asking men to repent, so this is before the rule of Jesus.

dad · Oct 9, 2021

Ronald Nolette said:
This is what took place from 70-135 AD.

Zedekiah lived then?

This will happen right before Jesus returns.

Exactly, that is when they repent. (or when they see Him as another prophesy points out)

1,. He returns the people in unbelief
2. Land will floueish again.
3. Ancient Hebrew becomes a spoken language again
4. The Jewish shekel resptred
5. The gathering is to judge th epeople.
6. The peopel are to return from all points of the compass.

These are all prophecies and all fulfilled.

Israel has not turned to Jesus today. They did not in 1948 or any other time.

dad · Oct 9, 2021

Ronald Nolette said:
Well I would like to see you prove this return was not diveinly originated. Do you have a hot line with god?

Prove it was.

Ezekiel 20:34 - "I will bring you from the nations and gather you from the countries where you have been scattered -- with a mighty hand and an outstretched arm and with outpoured wrath."

Click to expand...

I posted commentary that places this chapter in history, so that would not be the end time.

Isaiah 11:11-12 NIV - "In that day the Lord will reach out his hand a second time to reclaim the remnant that is left of his people from Assyria, from Lower Egypt, from Upper Egypt, from Cush, from Elam, from Babylonia, from Hamath and from the islands of the sea. He will raise a banner for the nations and gather the exiles of Israel; he will assemble the scattered people of Judah from the four quarters of the earth."

That is after the verses showing the lamb will lay with the wolf etc. That is not any time in history. Yes God will gather them one day. That was not 1948. Show us a zoo where lions and sheep are together and children wander in?

Isaiah 66:8 NIV - "Who has ever heard of such a thing? Who has ever seen such things? Can a country be born in a day or a nation be brought forth in a moment? Yet no sooner is Zion in labour than she gives birth to her children."

Just before this we see this

Isaiah 66:6
A voice of noise from the city, a voice from the temple, a voice of the Lord that rendereth recompence to his enemies.
When do you think that was, 1947!? Ha

Isaiah 43:5-6,21 - "Do not be afraid, for I am with you; I will bring your children from the east and gather you from the west. I will say to the north, `Give them up!' and to the south, `Do not hold them back.' Bring my sons from afar and my daughters from the ends of the earth..."

When He returns and is with them then He gathers..
Isaiah 43:5
Fear not: for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west
He will do a new thing, and gather them one day. That was not done yet.
Isaiah 43:19
Behold, I will do a new thing; now it shall spring forth; shall ye not know it? I will even make a way in the wilderness, and rivers in the desert.
Isaiah 43:20
The beast of the field shall honour me, the dragons and the owls: because I give waters in the wilderness, and rivers in the desert, to give drink to my people, my chosen.
His chosen are those who chose Him. That is who He gives drink to. I see no rivers in the desert there now?

Psalm 107:2-3 NIV - "Let the redeemed of the LORD say this -- those he redeemed from the hand of the foe, those he gathered from the lands, from east and west, from north and south.

Psalms 107:2
Let the redeemed of the Lord say so, whom he hath redeemed from the hand of the enemy;
Israel was anything but redeemed in 1948. Do you understand what you are posting? Neither were they saved from their enemies, look around.

Sign #6: A pure language

With the return of the nation, the ancient Hebrew language has been revived and become the official language of the state. Prior to this happening, the Jews spoke an impure form of the language called Yiddish. The return to a pure common language was again predicted by the prophets.

Zephaniah 3:8
Therefore wait ye upon me, saith the Lord , until the day that I rise up to the prey: for my determination is to gather the nations, that I may assemble the kingdoms, to pour upon them mine indignation, even all my fierce anger: for all the earth shall be devoured with the fire of my jealousy.
Zephaniah 3:9
For then will I turn to the people a pure language, that they may all call upon the name of the Lord , to serve him with one consent.
Do you understand what you post? You think God gathered all nations and poured out His wrath on them and sent a fire over the earth in 1948??

After nearly 2,000 years the shekel has been reinstated as the common monetary unit in Israel, again, just as predicted.

Ezekiel 45:12-16 NIV - "The shekel is to consist of twenty gerahs. Twenty shekels plus twenty-five shekels plus fifteen shekels equal one mina.... All the people of the land will participate in this special gift for the use of the prince in Israel."

Where in that chapter does it say this will be in the latter days exactly? Ha
(I addressed more than half of your long post here, you really have not a single valid point)

Desire Of All Nations · Oct 9, 2021

Verses 12-24 of that chapter places the fulfillment of verse 8 within the time span of the Millennium and beyond, so no one can legitimately argue that Isa. 66:8 was fulfilled in 1948 or any point before.

Davy · Oct 9, 2021

dad said:
Your main points are that God, sometime after the captivity, promises to return them to the land, not to be plucked up again, and that you think that a mention of bad figs means that this all has to be before the rule/return of Jesus.

Not really 'my' points, but the actual Jeremiah 24 Scripture.

To the first point, that is talking about when the people repent and turn to Him. That was not 1948.
Jeremiah 24:7
And I will give them an heart to know me, that I am the Lord : and they shall be my people, and I will be their God: for they shall return unto me with their whole heart.

To the second point, look who the bad figs are.
....

Well, I guess I'll have to cover it line upon line, since you skipped so much of the Jeremiah 24 Scripture. Then if you still choose not to believe it as written, then OK, your choice.

Jeremiah 24
1 The LORD shewed me, and, behold, two baskets of figs were set before the temple of the LORD, after that Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon had carried away captive Jeconiah the son of Jehoiakim king of Judah, and the princes of Judah, with the carpenters and smiths, from Jerusalem, and had brought them to Babylon.

None of that involved the majority of Israelites of the northern ten tribes. They had long before been removed from the holy land by the kings of Assyria. This takes place after the king of Babylon had removed the majority of the "house of Judah" at Jerusalem/Judea.

Jeremiah sees 2 baskets of figs.

2 One basket had very good figs, even like the figs that are first ripe: and the other basket had very naughty figs, which could not be eaten, they were so bad.

One basket was of good figs, first ripe. But the other basket had bad figs that couldn't be eaten.

3 Then said the LORD unto me, "What seest thou, Jeremiah?" And I said, "Figs; the good figs, very good; and the evil, very evil, that cannot be eaten, they are so evil."

Jeremiah then calls the bad basket of figs as 'evil' figs. We know real figs are not evil, not even those not fit to eat. This is the first indication that God is using the figs as a symbol for certain peoples.

4 Again the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
5 "Thus saith the LORD, the God of Israel; Like these good figs, so will I acknowledge them that are carried away captive of Judah, whom I have sent out of this place into the land of the Chaldeans for their good.

God compares the basket of good figs with Judah that was carried away captive to Babylon ("land of the Chaldeans").

6 For I will set Mine eyes upon them for good, and I will bring them again to this land: and I will build them, and not pull them down; and I will plant them, and not pluck them up.

That is the heart of this prophecy, and one must stop and think about it, and know some history about Judah and Jerusalem. God promised there to bring Judah back to the land, and build them again. He promised He would not pull them down, nor pluck them up again.

So just when... would that fit in Jerusalem per the history of Judah there?

If we say it happened when God brought back a small remnant of the "house of Judah" back to Jerusalem after the 70 years Babylon captivity by Nebuchadnezzar, then we run into a problem, because later in 70 A.D. the Romans literally destroyed Jerusalem and scattered Judah (called the Diaspora). And actually most of Judah never did return to Jerusalem after the 70 years Babylon captivity, but chose to stay in Babylon, and from there were further scattered in the countries like the ten tribes were.

ONLY... in 1948 did Israel become a nation again, and many of Judah returned to accomplish that, but it took approval of the United Nations Charter vote to seal it. Yet it was still by God's hand per His Promise to them. And I do not see God removing them again from that land in the middle east, nor is it written in The Bible that they will be removed again for any endtime scenario. So the 1948 forming is pretty darn solid that God fulfilled this Jeremiah prophecy.

7 And I will give them an heart to know Me, that I am the LORD: and they shall be My people, and I will be their God: for they shall return unto Me with their whole heart.

How can we in Christ Jesus deny how the majority of Judah there in the nation of Israel has turned to The LORD. It's not their time to understand The Gospel of Jesus Christ, so of course they still have God's blindness He put upon them per Romans 11. But their 'heart' is most certainly towards our Heavenly Father, the faithful ones there anyway.

Yet that above event certainly is not... about the time when Lord Jesus returns. Why? Because when Jesus returns there, and the unbelieving Jews who do love The Father, will appear in shame, wishing for the hills and mountains to fall upon them (see what Jesus said to them in Luke 23:27-31, and what the end of Zechariah 12 shows how they will mourn for Him on that day. In other words, they will be in mourning there when Jesus comes.)

In Romans 11, Apostle Paul told us to not be conceited about the unbelieving Jews, because God blinded them away from The Gospel so The Gospel could go to the Gentiles. And that blindness would not be removed until the fullness of the Gentiles. Paul said that God's calling and election was without repentance, meaning He will not go back on what He promised their fathers. He still loves them. The majority of them are simply still blinded today for His Purpose.

8 And as the evil figs, which cannot be eaten, they are so evil; surely thus saith the LORD, So will I give Zedekiah the king of Judah, and his princes, and the residue of Jerusalem, that remain in this land, and them that dwell in the land of Egypt:

God said there He would leave some of the evil basket of figs there at Jerusalem among the "residue of Jerusalem", which means among Judah there, and also among the Jews in Egypt.

9 And I will deliver them to be removed into all the kingdoms of the earth for their hurt, to be a reproach and a proverb, a taunt and a curse, in all places whither I shall drive them.

That is still about the basket of evil figs. The evil figs would also be scattered through the countries with the majority of Judah. So this is definitely an indicator for the last days, and not for when Jesus returns.

10 And I will send the sword, the famine, and the pestilence, among them, till they be consumed from off the land that I gave unto them and to their fathers.
KJV

Those are actually some of the last days Signs that Jesus warned about for the "great tribulation". So there again, that shows this definitely is not for the time when Jesus returns, nor for after the return.

Davy · Oct 9, 2021

Understanding just who it was that returned to the holy land to form the modern nation of Israel in 1948...

It's important to study The Old Testament Books too, because one will not properly understand many prophetic timelines in God's Word that are still yet to be accomplished, nor when previous prophecies were fulfilled.

The authentic Jews that have been returning to the holy land is mainly about the "house of Judah", and not the ten lost tribes of Israel.

Per the 1 Kings 11 through 2 Kings 17 histories, God removed the ten northern tribes of Israel, the majority of Israelites, and scattered them to Assyria and the lands of the Medes, never to return to the holy lands. They lost their heritage as Israel, which fulfilled prophecy in the Book of Hosea. They don't know who they are today. So they do not practice the Jew's religion, and even the Jews don't know who or where the ten tribes are today.

The "house of Judah" became made up of only the tribes of Judah, Benjamin, and Levi, and a small remnant of the northern ten tribes that refused Jeroboam's gold calf idol worship in the northern lands, right after God split Israel into two separate kingdoms in the day of Rehoboam, the son of Solomon.

The ten northern tribe "kingdom of Israel", made up of ten northern tribes, were removed out of the land first. Only the "kingdom of Judah" remained in the south at Jerusalem-Judea. Then about 120 years later, God sent the king of Babylon, Nebuchadnezzar, upon the "house of Judah" at Judea, destroyed Jerusalem and took Judah, Benjamin, and Levi and the strangers with them, captive to Babylon for 70 years.

After the 70 years, only a small remnant of the "house of Judah" returned to Jerusalem-Judea. Because God said He would take care of them in their Babylon captivity, they had gotten fat and happy, so the majority of them chose to stay in Babylon after the 70 years. Then those, the actual majority of the tribes of Judah, Benjamin, Levi, would be further scattered through the countries like the ten tribes were. This... is how the majority of Jews wound up in scattered in the nations.

In 70 A.D., God sent the Romans upon Jerusalem and literally destroyed the city, the 2nd temple, and wall. The Romans then scattered captive the small remnant of Jews that had returned from the previous Babylon captivity.

Over the centuries since then, the Jews have been returning back to the holy lands. They, along with the Muslims, and even small remnants of Christians, all lived together in peace in the region. Only when the Jews started gaining ground in their goal of forming the nation of Israel again, did that peace begin to end in that area.

The majority of Israelites returning to the holy lands today are orthodox unbelieving Jews. They still reject Lord Jesus Christ. Many of them no longer believe the ten tribes exist. So if you're not a Jew, you might find it difficult to be accepted to live in the state of Israel. That should let those in Christ know very well that God's Kingdom definitely has NOT yet come there in the holy land. Some of those orthodox Jews want us Christians to think so, but the prophecies in God's Word certainly reveal it's not yet that time for the return of the Ezekiel 37 Kingdom promises to Israel.

dad · Oct 9, 2021

Davy said:
God compares the basket of good figs with Judah that was carried away captive to Babylon ("land of the Chaldeans").

6 For I will set Mine eyes upon them for good, and I will bring them again to this land: and I will build them, and not pull them down; and I will plant them, and not pluck them up.

That is the heart of this prophecy, and one must stop and think about it, and know some history about Judah and Jerusalem. God promised there to bring Judah back to the land, and build them again. He promised He would not pull them down, nor pluck them up again.

Not before He returned or they repented. That is the heart of the matter. They did not repent in 1948. When God brings them, we know from other prophesies that this is after they repent, and the remnant is saved.

So just when... would that fit in Jerusalem per the history of Judah there?

Never. They never repented yet and God did not return yet etc. It only fits when He returns, slaughters their enemies, and restores the repented remnant.

If we say it happened when God brought back a small remnant of the "house of Judah" back to Jerusalem after the 70 years Babylon captivity by Nebuchadnezzar, then we run into a problem, because later in 70 A.D. the Romans literally destroyed Jerusalem and scattered Judah (called the Diaspora). And actually most of Judah never did return to Jerusalem after the 70 years Babylon captivity, but chose to stay in Babylon, and from there were further scattered in the countries like the ten tribes were.

ONLY... in 1948 did Israel become a nation again, and many of Judah returned to accomplish that, but it took approval of the United Nations Charter vote to seal it. Yet it was still by God's hand per His Promise to them. And I do not see God removing them again from that land in the middle east, nor is it written in The Bible that they will be removed again for any endtime scenario. So the 1948 forming is pretty darn solid that God fulfilled this Jeremiah prophecy.

No, it is totally impossible and cannot fit. God needs to bring them back, and that is way after they bring themselves back. When He brings them back all will know. I will know, you will know, the world will know.

7 And I will give them an heart to know Me, that I am the LORD: and they shall be My people, and I will be their God: for they shall return unto Me with their whole heart.

How can we in Christ Jesus deny how the majority of Judah there in the nation of Israel has turned to The LORD.

Say what?? No idea what you are saying, it could not possibly be that Israel already repented and accepted the Messiah. (or could it?)

It's not their time to understand The Gospel of Jesus Christ, so of course they still have God's blindness He put upon them per Romans 11. But their 'heart' is most certainly towards our Heavenly Father, the faithful ones there anyway.

The nation does not accept God at all now. Jesus is God, in case that is news. Those few make up the actual Israel. The secular one is doomed. It cannot enter the kingdom or eternity. ONLY when all Israel accepts Him whom they pierced and mourns as for an only son for their wickedness in killing Him can they be saved. Most are prophesied to die, and only the few left will be saved. Those are the ones that are Israel, and whom all prophesies are about as far as being restored and protected etc. NOT 1948 by any stretch.

Yet that above event certainly is not... about the time when Lord Jesus returns. Why? Because when Jesus returns there, and the unbelieving Jews who do love The Father, will appear in shame, wishing for the hills and mountains to fall upon them (see what Jesus said to them in Luke 23:27-31, and what the end of Zechariah 12 shows how they will mourn for Him on that day. In other words, they will be in mourning there when Jesus comes.)

No. That is the sorrow of true repentance. Not 'unbelieving' Jews who somehow happen to be alive. You should realize the vast majority of the nation there is prophesied to die. Only the remnant alive who accept Jesus are saved.

In Romans 11, Apostle Paul told us to not be conceited about the unbelieving Jews, because God blinded them away from The Gospel so The Gospel could go to the Gentiles. And that blindness would not be removed until the fullness of the Gentiles. Paul said that God's calling and election was without repentance, meaning He will not go back on what He promised their fathers. He still loves them. The majority of them are simply still blinded today for His Purpose.

So in that last time many will see and repent. Until then He does not protect them as a nation, restore them, etc.

9 And I will deliver them to be removed into all the kingdoms of the earth for their hurt, to be a reproach and a proverb, a taunt and a curse, in all places whither I shall drive them.

That is still about the basket of evil figs. The evil figs would also be scattered through the countries with the majority of Judah. So this is definitely an indicator for the last days, and not for when Jesus returns.

10 And I will send the sword, the famine, and the pestilence, among them, till they be consumed from off the land that I gave unto them and to their fathers.

So the bad apples had trouble. That is news?

Those are actually some of the last days Signs that Jesus warned about for the "great tribulation". So there again, that shows this definitely is not for the time when Jesus returns, nor for after the return.

No. That is not unique to one time in history. Ask Hitler.

Ronald David Bruno · Oct 10, 2021

dad said:
The utter defeat of every single enemy of His people has zero to do with any weapon they have. It has to do with one thing only. That is a true belief in Jesus, the Messiah, and crying out to Him. If they did that this afternoon, ant threat from Iran would only be a memory. God will deal with the enemies Personally. No weapons needed.

Then I guess He shouldn't have prophesied wars and rumors wars?

dad said:
Since we see that it is God striking here, I think we can rule out puny little weapons of man.

We were a Nation under God, a Christian natiin when Japan attacked Pearl Harbor. Those puny little atom bombs worked for us.
God has ordained who wins or loses all thoughout history. Whether man had only swords or nukes, his plan is certain. He also uses natural disasters, pestilence and wild beasts also as described in the GT.
Sure He can speak a word and reign down fire from heaven, but he wants man to be responsible for some of it.

Davy · Oct 10, 2021

dad said:
Not before He returned or they repented. That is the heart of the matter. They did not repent in 1948. When God brings them, we know from other prophesies that this is after they repent, and the remnant is saved.

The Jeremiah 24 Scripture isn't about the Jews repenting to Christ. It's about their leaving the pagan things God brought the king of Babylon upon them for, and their hearts turning back to The Father. They did that when they started returning to Jerusalem after being scattered by the Romans in 70 A.D.

Never. They never repented yet and God did not return yet etc. It only fits when He returns, slaughters their enemies, and restores the repented remnant.

I'm starting to see you have a problem with the Jews, and think they are lost. They are not. And Apostle Paul showed that in Romans 11 about them, how God blinded them away from The Gospel until the fullness of the Gentiles comes in, which won't be complete until Lord Jesus returns in our near future.

So you really should get rid of that conceit against the Jews, if you want to understand how the 1948 return fit prophecy in God's Word.

dad · Oct 10, 2021

Ronald David Bruno said:
Then I guess He shouldn't have prophesied wars and rumors wars?

Sinful mankind will always have wars, especially in the most wicked time in history. Zero to do with God coming down and wiping out His enemies one day in righteous judgment.

We were a Nation under God, a Christian natiin when Japan attacked Pearl Harbor. Those puny little atom bombs worked for us.

You thought God liked that?? Seriously?

God has ordained who wins or loses all thoughout history. Whether man had only swords or nukes, his plan is certain. He also uses natural disasters, pestilence and wild beasts also as described in the GT.
Sure He can speak a word and reign down fire from heaven, but he wants man to be responsible for some of it.

Man will have no say in the matter. When God arises to take over this world, nothing man says or does matters at all.

dad · Oct 10, 2021

Davy said:
The Jeremiah 24 Scripture isn't about the Jews repenting to Christ.

Right, and that is one way we know it is before the repentance of Israel and return of Christ.

It's about their leaving the pagan things God brought the king of Babylon upon them for, and their hearts turning back to The Father. They did that when they started returning to Jerusalem after being scattered by the Romans in 70 A.D.

Great, nothing to do with a supposed God ordained and directed return in 1948.

I'm starting to see you have a problem with the Jews, and think they are lost.

False. I would like the lost people of Israel to be saved. Anyone that thinks they are not in rebellion is completely wrong.

They are not. And Apostle Paul showed that in Romans 11 about them, how God blinded them away from The Gospel until the fullness of the Gentiles comes in, which won't be complete until Lord Jesus returns in our near future.

Not sure what you think that means. But to be clear, they are blind until they see Jesus is the only way and the Messiah. That ends (as a nation) when they cry out to God in the very end.
You really should try to be honest and not try to pretend that people who accept the bible somehow hate Jews. Realizing, as God does that they must repent is not hating, on the contrary. All must accept Jesus, and that includes Israel. There is no other way.

Ronald David Bruno · Oct 10, 2021

dad said:
Zero to do with God coming down and wiping out His enemies one day in righteous judgment

1 day? I thought the Gteat Tribulation period was 1260 days (or 42 months, time, times and half a time - mentioned in several areas).
If it was just one day, Revelation would only be 6 chapters long.

dad said:
You thought God liked that?? Seriously?

He was high fiving all the angels, and the 24 elders.
No, seriously, God grieves. Apparently it took something severe to stop the war.
He is sovereign --- in control. He allows evil for a purpose.
He grieved when He destroyed the earth with the flood that killed proobably 50 times more than the bombs did.

dad said:
Man will have no say in the matter. When God arises to take over this world, nothing man says or does matters at all.

Of judgment is His, it is perfect amd without flaw. It is amazing how He factors our lives throughout history into His plans whether blessings or judgments. We cooperate with Him.
The Body of Christ is important. Once we are gone, then His wrath pours out and as you say His enemies will be completely hopeless and powerless. That will probably be towards the end of the GT, maybe the last 40 days. Something severe happens in one hour though, possibly a worldwide earthquake that levels everything.

Davy · Oct 10, 2021

dad said:
Right, and that is one way we know it is before the repentance of Israel and return of Christ.

Great, nothing to do with a supposed God ordained and directed return in 1948.

I see you're still trying to force your false conclusions into God's Word where it's not written. It's not difficult at all to look at today's nation of Israel (that still rejects Jesus Christ in majority), but how God has still blessed that nation and people today. Among them are many devout Jews who love The Father, and still try to keep His laws. So THERE IS A REPENTANCE THERE AMONG THEM with the result of God having set them up there again!!! Thus the Jeremiah 24 Scripture is shown having been fulfilled.

Davy · Oct 10, 2021

Ronald David Bruno said:
1 day? I thought the Gteat Tribulation period was 1260 days (or 42 months, time, times and half a time - mentioned in several areas).
If it was just one day, Revelation would only be 6 chapters long.

He was high fiving all the angels, and the 24 elders.
No, seriously, God grieves. Apparently it took something severe to stop the war.
He is sovereign --- in control. He allows evil for a purpose.
He grieved when He destroyed the earth with the flood that killed proobably 50 times more than the bombs did.

Of judgment is His, it is perfect amd without flaw. It is amazing how He factors our lives throughout history into His plans whether blessings or judgments. We cooperate with Him.
The Body of Christ is important. Once we are gone, then His wrath pours out and as you say His enemies will be completely hopeless and powerless. That will probably be towards the end of the GT, maybe the last 40 days. Something severe happens in one hour though, possibly a worldwide earthquake that levels everything.

I don't see anything wrong with retaliation against Christ's enemies. They have a choice to follow the devil, or GOD. If it's the devil, then destruction is the order, even by GOD.

And in final, with the future "lake of fire" when the wicked perish in it because they still... reject The Father and His Son Jesus Christ, their destruction will be a GOOD THING, for only by that destruction of the wicked will ETERNAL PEACE come upon this earth.

dad · Oct 10, 2021

Ronald David Bruno said:
1 day? I thought the Gteat Tribulation period was 1260 days (or 42 months, time, times and half a time - mentioned in several areas).
If it was just one day, Revelation would only be 6 chapters long.

The trib is the time many of His people are getting wiped out by the final regime. Then, when He comes one day, He wipes them out. Let me know if you need that broken down more for your comprehension.

He was high fiving all the angels, and the 24 elders.
No, seriously, God grieves. Apparently it took something severe to stop the war.
He is sovereign --- in control. He allows evil for a purpose.
He grieved when He destroyed the earth with the flood that killed proobably 50 times more than the bombs did.

Well, when He sees the nations actually gather together to try and fight Him, He laughs actually. It is ridiculous that they get so deceived as to imagine they had any chance whatsoever.

Of judgment is His, it is perfect amd without flaw. It is amazing how He factors our lives throughout history into His plans whether blessings or judgments. We cooperate with Him.
The Body of Christ is important. Once we are gone, then His wrath pours out and as you say His enemies will be completely hopeless and powerless. That will probably be towards the end of the GT, maybe the last 40 days. Something severe happens in one hour though, possibly a worldwide earthquake that levels everything.

That is all fine and it brings down the world governments. The time when He slays His enemies Personally is when He comes back, and saves Israel (who now have repented). He kills them dead.

dad · Oct 10, 2021

Davy said:
I see you're still trying to force your false conclusions into God's Word where it's not written. It's not difficult at all to look at today's nation of Israel (that still rejects Jesus Christ in majority), but how God has still blessed that nation and people today. Among them are many devout Jews who love The Father, and still try to keep His laws. So THERE IS A REPENTANCE THERE AMONG THEM with the result of God having set them up there again!!! Thus the Jeremiah 24 Scripture is shown having been fulfilled.

Nope. Your forced conclusions are wrong. That nation is slated for great great judgments and sorrow and death. That is not a Christian nation and not any nation eligible for the blessing of God. Not yet, until they repent. The opposite is true now. When they all get saved and believe in Jesus, THEN they get blessed.

Nation born in a day in 1948?

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