The Christian Resurrection vs. the Jew's Resurrection

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Timtofly

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Not one word in Revelation 20:1-6 are souls being resurrected into bodies upon this earth as you believe
Not even the camp of the saints on the earth? Those were humans rebelling in Paradise, after Satan was allowed into Paradise? Why did they march across the breadth of the earth to get to Paradise?
 

Curtis

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Did you know there is a difference between Christian Doctrine per The New Testament about the resurrection when Jesus returns, and the orthodox Jew's idea of the resurrection per The Old Testament?

Some Christian Churches wrongly preach the orthodox Jew's idea of resurrection, which is belief on the old dead flesh body being raised from the ground, and made anew. Just where would the orthodox Jews get such an idea?

Here's one place...

Ezek 37:1-12
37 The hand of the LORD was upon me, and carried me out in the spirit of the LORD, and set me down in the midst of the valley which was full of bones,
2 And caused me to pass by them round about: and, behold, there were very many in the open valley; and, lo, they were very dry.
3 And He said unto me, "Son of man, can these bones live?" And I answered, "O Lord GOD, thou knowest."
4 Again He said unto me, "Prophesy upon these bones, and say unto them, 'O ye dry bones, hear the word of the LORD.'
5 Thus saith the Lord GOD unto these bones; Behold, I will cause breath to enter into you, and ye shall live:
6 And I will lay sinews upon you, and will bring up flesh upon you, and cover you with skin, and put breath in you, and ye shall live; and ye shall know that I am the LORD."
7 So I prophesied as I was commanded: and as I prophesied, there was a noise, and behold a shaking, and the bones came together, bone to his bone.
8 And when I beheld, lo, the sinews and the flesh came up upon them, and the skin covered them above: but there was no breath in them.
9 Then said He unto me, "Prophesy unto the wind, prophesy, son of man, and say to the wind, 'Thus saith the Lord GOD; Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe upon these slain, that they may live."
10 So I prophesied as He commanded me, and the breath came into them, and they lived, and stood up upon their feet, an exceeding great army.
11 Then He said unto me, "Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel: behold, they say, 'Our bones are dried, and our hope is lost: we are cut off for our parts.'
12 Therefore prophesy and say unto them, 'Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, O My people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel."
KJV


Wow! What would someone who stays ONLY in The Old Testament Scriptures think about the future resurrection at Christ's future coming? They would definitely believe that God is going to refurbish old dead bodies buried in the ground, wouldn't they? But didn't anyone in Ezekiel's day ever think that God was giving that prophecy through Ezekiel as an allegory?

Here's why I ask that, for the following is about the resurrection per New Testament doctrine...

1 Cor 15:49-55
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, 'Death is swallowed up in victory.'
55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?
KJV


As we have borne the "image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly"? What is Paul talking about with that?

Well, what is the "image of the earthy"? It's our flesh body, right? Yes! So what's that "image of the heavenly" we will also bear? That's the image of the angels, because Lord Jesus said in Matthew 22:30 that those of the resurrection are "as the angels of God in heaven".

That brings up an important question. If the resurrection is "as the angels" in Heaven, then just what kind... of body do the angels have? We well know through enough revelations in God's Word that the angels are not born through woman's womb, so they do not... have flesh bodies. They have angelic bodies of that other realm, the realm of Spirit.

Is the resurrection then to an angelic heavenly type body, and not about a literal flesh body? YES! Apostle Paul confirms this in the above, and in the following...

1 Cor 15:42-50
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

That idea of the first man Adam being made a living soul is important to distinguish from the resurrection that our Lord Jesus shows. Paul tells us there that "the last Adam was made a quickening spirit"!


I don't know about you, but a "quickening spirit" does NOT mean a flesh body.

Do you remember that even in John 3 Lord Jesus made a distinction between that which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of The Spirit is spirit? Flesh and spirit are two totally distinctly different realms and operations. The "natural body" is a body of flesh we have today. The "spiritual body" is the body type of the future resurrection. It is the "quickening spirit" type of the future with Jesus. Thus even our Lord Jesus' flesh body was transfigured to "a quickening spirit".


46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV


There are more Old Testament Scripture examples that can make one think the future resurrection will be a refurbished flesh body out of the ground, such as Isaiah 26:19; Hosea 13:14; Daniel 12:2, Psalms 71:20.

Even with the Genesis 2:7 description that when God breathed the breath of life into Adam and he became a 'living soul', the orthodox Jews are led to believe that the soul... is even part of our flesh. It is not, as Lord Jesus showed in the Matthew 10:28 Scripture to not fear those who can kill our flesh, but not our soul.

Flesh and blood cannot go to heaven, but Jesus’ resurrected with a flesh and bone body, not flesh and blood, and Paul said when we are resurrected we shall be like Him.

Luk 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

1Jn 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

We, like Him, will have immortal resurrected bodies of flesh and bone.

Jesus was talking about us not being married in heaven, and in that context, He meant that we shall be like the angels in the sense that, like the angels, we won’t marry in heaven. He didn’t say we’d be spirits only just like angels.

At the resurrection the dead in Christ’s bodies are resurrected and made immortal, He’s certainly not resurrecting only souls, because souls don’t sleep in the dirt, and souls are seen in heaven by John, and in 1 Thessalonians 4 it states Jesus brings those souls WITH HIM from heaven at the resurrection, obviously to be reunited with their immortal resurrected bodies of flesh and bone.

1Th 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

1Th 4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

 

Davy

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Who is this mysterious "some"? Honestly, I'm not sure what distinction you are making here for it seems a bit esoteric to me.

Years ago my baby daughter asked me for another cookie. I had given her a cracker. Rather than tell her she used the wrong word, I gave her what I knew she wanted.

Don't know if there is truly a doctrinal difference or just the language being used. For instance, many Christians think we become disembodied spirits rather than a physical resurrection. I've personally witnessed devote saints in Bible study for decades think this. You know, I just love them anyway.

Attend enough funerals, and listen to preachers at them, and you'll begin to understand what I said. One preacher kept pointing to my aunt's ashes in an urn going to be raised from the dead (she chose cremation). Sorry, my aunt was no longer in that urn. She was in heaven with The Lord, like Apostle Paul showed in 2 Corinthians 5.

Some backward preachers on the false 'dead in the ground' theory actually preach that the idea of 'spirits' always means a demon or familiar spirits. The "spirits in prison" event in 1 Peter 3, they preach those were demons Lord Jesus preached The Gospel to, like a victory in your face speech. Crazy.

That 'dead in the ground' kind of thinking comes from influence of the Jew's doctrine per Old Testament beliefs. The Jew's religion treats our soul as if it were part of our material earthly body, thus our soul to them is only living with an alive flesh body.
 

Davy

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Flesh and blood cannot go to heaven, but Jesus’ resurrected with a flesh and bone body, not flesh and blood, and Paul said when we are resurrected we shall be like Him.

Luk 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

1Jn 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

We, like Him, will have immortal resurrected bodies of flesh and bone.

I know what Lord Jesus said there. He also agreed with the false Jews in John 8 when they claimed to be offspring from Abraham. They also claimed they had never been in bondage (slavery; yet the real children of Israel had been in slavery in Egypt). Lord Jesus called those false Jews sons of the devil and of Cain.

My point is, in that single Luke 24 example, Lord Jesus did not give us the further detail of what the resurrection body is. Yet Apostle Paul in 1 Corinthians 15 did...

1 Cor 15:44-50
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV

How do we then reconcile Luke 24 with what Apostle Paul showed there about Jesus' flesh body being made "a quickening spirit"? Simple -- Lord Jesus' flesh body was transfigured to "a quickening spirit". Why? To keep the marks of His crucifixion forevermore, as a remembrance of His Sacrifice for sin. Did we do that? No, so there is no need for our flesh body to be transfigured like His. But there is... a need for us also to put on that quickening spirit type body which Apostle Paul calls there a "spiritual body". Reason is because that... is the type body of the future world to come after the destruction of this present world.

Matt 22:30
30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

KJV

Some forget that Lord Jesus said the above too.
 
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Truth7t7

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Attend enough funerals, and listen to preachers at them, and you'll begin to understand what I said. One preacher kept pointing to my aunt's ashes in an urn going to be raised from the dead (she chose cremation). Sorry, my aunt was no longer in that urn. She was in heaven with The Lord, like Apostle Paul showed in 2 Corinthians 5.

Some backward preachers on the false 'dead in the ground' theory actually preach that the idea of 'spirits' always means a demon or familiar spirits. The "spirits in prison" event in 1 Peter 3, they preach those were demons Lord Jesus preached The Gospel to, like a victory in your face speech. Crazy.

That 'dead in the ground' kind of thinking comes from influence of the Jew's doctrine per Old Testament beliefs. The Jew's religion treats our soul as if it were part of our material earthly body, thus our soul to them is only living with an alive flesh body.
Davy you deny the "Bodily" resurrection of the believer, a foundation in the christian faith

1 Corinthians 15:12-18KJV
12 Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?
13 But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen:
14 And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.
15 Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.
16 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:
17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.
18 Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.
 
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Keraz

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Davy you deny the "Bodily" resurrection of the believer, a foundation in the christian faith
No-one denies that.
But it is the false teaching that we receive resurrection before the GWT Judgment, which is error.
Only the martyrs killed by the 'beast', will be resurrected when Jesus Returns. Revelation 20:4
 

Truth7t7

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No-one denies that.
But it is the false teaching that we receive resurrection before the GWT Judgment, which is error.
Only the martyrs killed by the 'beast', will be resurrected when Jesus Returns. Revelation 20:4
There is one time of resurrection for all, this takes place on the (Last Day) at the Second Coming of Jesus Christ

There are (Two) resurrections on this (Last Day) the righteous are blessed to be in the (First Resurrection) to eternal life, on such the (Second) death resurrection has no power.

1.) (First) Resurrection To Life
2.) (Second) Resurrection To Damnation, The Second Death

Revelation 20:6KJV
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

The (Last Day) Resurrection Of All Below

John 5:28-29KJV
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 And shall come forth;
they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.


John 6:39-40KJV
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

1 Corinthians 15:21-24KJV
21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end,
when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

The (Last Day) Judgement

John 12:48KJV
48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
 

post

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wow what in the world is wrong with you people and your blasphemous JW heresies???
Christ died in the flesh and rose in the flesh and ascended in the flesh!!



Jesus Himself stood in the midst of them, and said unto them,
Peace be to you.
But they were abashed and afraid, supposing that they had seen a spirit. Then He said unto them,
AWhy are ye troubled? and wherefore do doubts arise in your hearts?
Behold! Mine hands and My feet! For it is I Myself: handle Me, and see: for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see Me have!

And when He had thus spoken, He showed them His hands and feet. And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, He said unto them,
Have ye here any meat?
And they gave Him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb, and He took it, and did eat before them.
And He said unto them,

These are the words, which I spake unto you while I was yet with you, that all must be fulfilled which are written of Me in the Law of Moses, and in the Prophets, and in the Psalms!
Then opened He their understanding, that they might understand the Scriptures,
And said unto them,

Thus is it written, and thus it behooved Christ to suffer, and to rise again from the dead the third day, and that repentance, and remission of sins should be preached in His Name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. Now ye are witnesses of these things!!
(Luke 24:36-48 GNV)
 
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Truth7t7

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the entire JW community that this forum welcomed into its household denies it..
read the OP for example!
I fully agree, there are several that deny the bodily resurrection of flesh and bone as Jesus maintained
 
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Davy

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The idea that the resurrection means decayed dead flesh in the casket being raised is an Old Testament JEW doctrine. The New Testament does not teach that.

Crept in unawares of the JEWS that sneaked into positions as Christian teachers have been pushing that false Old Testament idea among some Christian congregations.


Apostle Paul made it clear in 1 Corinthians 15 that Lord Jesus' flesh body was transfigured to a heavenly type body, Paul saying Jesus was made "a quickening spirit".

Paul also showed that the resurrection is NOT to another flesh body, what he called the "natural body", but to a "spiritual body", what Paul called the "image of the heavenly", which is a body LIKE the angels have.

Even Lord Jesus in Matthew 22:30 revealed that those of the resurrection are "as the angels of God in heaven".

1 Cor 15:42-50
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:

44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.


46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.


48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

KJV
 

Davy

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So when someone says something like, "decayed flesh in the casket being raised from the dead has been a mainstay doctrine from Christianity from the beginning", you know they are only trying to support their TRADITION OF MAN by hot air, because The New Testament Scripture does not show that, especially Scripture by Apostle Paul...

2 Cor 5:1-9
5 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.


2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:


3 If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked.

4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life.

5 Now He That hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, Who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit.

6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:


7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:)

8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.
KJV


You have TWO bodies brothers and sisters, one is a flesh body of this present world, which gets old, sick, and dies, and was never created to be eternal.

Then you have ANOTHER BODY inside... your flesh body that is incorruptible, of the heavenly, and when your flesh dies, that spirit body is released back to God, and that is what Paul meant above with, "... whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord".

And what is actually amazing, is that those on the false 'dead in the ground' theory of OT Jews, they believe even our 'soul' is of material matter, and think it ONLY can manifest with FLESH! How sick is that idea???

For if that were true, then it would mean all those Scriptures in The New Testament, like Matthew 10:28 that man cannot kill the soul, or Jesus revealing to the malefactor crucified with Him that he would be with Him in Paradise that day, or the story of what happens after flesh death per Jesus in Luke 16 about Lazarus and the rich man, etc., ALL THAT would mean nothing but myths! It would even be calling Apostle Paul a liar in 2 Corinthians 5 and 1 Corinthians 15 where Paul showed 'exactly' what kind of body the resurrection is, i.e., "a spiritual body"!!!

The 'dead in the ground' theory of men, if it were true, also would mean when our flesh body dies, WE STOP EXISTING! That's right, they believe your SOUL IS DEAD WITH YOUR FLESH, UNTIL GOD RAISING YOUR FLESH AGAIN!!! That truly is sick and a doctrine of devils! and it goes directly OPPOSITE OF BIBLE SCRIPTURE in THE NEW TESTAMENT!
 
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Davy

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Here is the SOURCE of the Old Testament Jew's IDEA that our soul is of material matter like our flesh body...

Gen 2:7
7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

KJV

That is about the first formation of the man Adam by God in His Garden of Eden.

By that idea, the Old Testament Jews hold to their tradition that the "living soul" ONLY means a flesh body being animated, i.e., made alive.

In other words, in THEIR ignorant view, there is NO REAL PERSON involved, since they believe FLESH is required for that "living soul" to exist!

And that's exactly what their false tradition amounts to, because our flesh body is simply material matter from the earth. You can SCRAP any belief in a Heavenly dimension with their false belief, because in their view the soul cannot manifest without that fleshy material matter!!!

That is WHY they hold so strongly to the false 'dead in the ground' with flesh from the casket being raised at the resurrection, along with the idea of Christ's flesh body being raised. In The Old Testament, God didn't reveal everything about the resurrection type body. But through Jesus He did through His Apostles in The New Testament, particularly Apostle Paul.

There is only ONE Scripture they try to use against what Apostle Paul taught about the resurrection being to a spiritual body. It is about what Jesus said to His disciples when they doubted He had been raised from the dead, per Luke 24:39. They will quote that verse all... day... long... like an all-day-sucker, while DISREGARDING Apostle Paul in 1 Corinthians 15:45-47 about Jesus being made "a quickening spirit", pointing to resurrection as a heavenly dimension type body, a spiritual body.

And did you know brethren, THIS was one of the subjects that Lord Jesus was trying to show Nicodemus in John 3. Nicodemus kept pointing to the idea of how can one enter his mother's womb again to be "born again"? Nicodemus, a Pharisee, no doubt tried to understand, but he showed he had succumbed to the Old Testament JEWS teaching about dead flesh being what the future resurrection is about. He simply could not understand THE HEAVENLY DIMENSION OF SPIRIT that Lord Jesus pointed out to him...

John 3:3-8
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

4 Nicodemus saith unto Him, "How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?"

5 Jesus answered, "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Just WHAT PART OF US is born of the Spirit?? Is it our flesh? NO! but that's what the Old Testament Jews think, even Nicodemus here shows he couldn't get his brain wrapped about this idea Lord Jesus was revealing to him.


6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.


That statement by Lord Jesus is so... profound, many just pass right by it! By that Lord Jesus revealed TWO DIFFERENT DIMENSIONS OF EXISTENCE, this earthly flesh one, and the heavenly one of Spirit. He showed our flesh is a separate creation from our spirit. WOW! That is what Apostle Paul taught also in the 1 Corinthians 15 Chapter, saying just as we have borne the "image of the earthy", we shall also bear the "image of the heavenly"! And Paul showed the resurrection type body is "a spiritual body"!

So which one do you think He was pointing that is "born again"?


7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
KJV


Does our flesh body have that kind of attribute like the wind? Of course not. But our spirit with soul INSIDE our flesh body when it is loosed from our flesh at flesh death does... have that kind of wind attribute! When we view someone who dies, we can easily tell while they are still alive in their flesh body manifesting their personality. But when their flesh dies, their person no longer manifests in their flesh, so we KNOW something left at that time of death! It just ain't that hard to figure out.

Likewise, when we believe on Jesus and are baptized in His name, we are then "born again", by The Spirit. What then? does that mean our flesh body becomes superhuman by that? NO! of course not! It means our spirit with soul INSIDE our flesh is reborn through Faith on The Blood of Jesus Christ! So even with what Lord Jesus showed in John 3, He was showing a distinction between our flesh and our spirit with soul inside our flesh, as two SEPARATE THINGS and operations.
 

Davy

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Don't know if there is truly a doctrinal difference or just the language being used. For instance, many Christians think we become disembodied spirits rather than a physical resurrection. I've personally witnessed devote saints in Bible study for decades think this. You know, I just love them anyway.

No, Christianity does not teach that the resurrection is about disembodied spirits, but nor does it in reality teach that the resurrection is about the dead flesh in the ground being raised either, as that is just an OT expression used for those who can't understand the resurrection. The New Testament scriptures reveals that the resurrection is to a body type like the angels, even Lord Jesus saying that. All true Christians realize this from New Testament scripture like Matthew 22:30. Only someone not familiar with the New Testament would argue against Christ about that.
 

nenagana

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The Christian Resurrection vs. the Jew's Resurrection
(HOW DOES GOD DE-VALUE FORNICATION IN THE NEW TESTAMENT)

ISAIAH 3:12 [As for] my people, children [are] their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause [thee] to err, and destroy the way of thy paths.

(God has called a women or a child, a lesser prophet................)

(in the old testament this is biblical fact, not my opinion in parenthesis)
(the jewish people would not accept a prophet, or a theologian, if that person was not with a wife or with a women..............in some instances, they jewish people would just be silent, and a generation later, the writings of a prophet will be included in the bible, as god wrestled with them, only for a short while with the written word, before they had not more value)

(when you see the "book of revelation" and its emphasis on a "women"..............its not a continuation of the old testament jewish law............where a women is required for a judgment)

(God gives priority to the prophecy of Daniel, where "women" or a "manchild" (or isaiah's statement 3:12, is not important.............God calls the Abomination of Desolation, this human dirth charge, and God gives preference to the rotting of the body, that means pandemic, not a sign or a vision..............) (that means ezekiel's statements about "dry bones" is not about the taking of a wife, since ezekiel's temple is the lord's body, where all the tribes are mentioned, not the body of a women like in ezra's temple)

(a sign or a vision is the result of removing this human dirth charge, think about noah, or think about jesus claim that the last generation would be compared to noah...................that must come first, a controversy with a women is not a biblical right, its not a continuation of the jewish law, or anything, its a snare for the wicked, God does not have to acknowledge the language of REVELATION/JUDE/JAMES/HEBREWS............that gives a women's body value like the lord jesus, that is not accurate)
 
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charity

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'Jesus answered and said unto them,
Ye do err,
not knowing the scriptures,
nor the power of God.
For in the resurrection
they neither marry,
nor are given in marriage,
but are as the angels of God in heaven.'
(Mat 22:29-30)

Hello @Davy,

The words of the Lord here in Matthew 22:30, that you refer to frequently, is in response to a question regarding marriage, and the response given is also in reference to marriage. It tells us that 'in the resurrection', marriage will not exist, for in that regard man will be like the angels in heaven who neither marry nor are given in marriage. It does not imply that we will be like angelic beings in any other way.

Context is vital. :)

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
 

Davy

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'Jesus answered and said unto them,
Ye do err,
not knowing the scriptures,
nor the power of God.
For in the resurrection
they neither marry,
nor are given in marriage,
but are as the angels of God in heaven.'
(Mat 22:29-30)

Hello @Davy,

The words of the Lord here in Matthew 22:30, that you refer to frequently, is in response to a question regarding marriage, and the response given is also in reference to marriage. It tells us that 'in the resurrection', marriage will not exist, for in that regard man will be like the angels in heaven who neither marry nor are given in marriage. It does not imply that we will be like angelic beings in any other way.

Context is vital. :)

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

So the fact... that Jesus emphatically pointed to the resurrection being like the state of the angels of God in heaven means nothing? YOU ARE WRONG AND HAVE NOT COMPARED WHAT HE SAID WITH WHAT PAUL SAID...

1 Cor 15:49-50
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.


50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV
 

nenagana

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(jewish people believed, a prophet had to have a wife or a women, to be reproved by that prophet from the lord................in the new testament, or rather, there is a lot of language about a "marriage in a jewish temple", between a prophet an a women, in order to be accepted by the jews as a reproof of the lord)

(so they added that tagline of "marriage"...............you know what the gospel says, "if a women is caught in fornication, and that women is separated from her husband"-----------"that women is not allowed back into that marriage")

(so you can understand, that after the jewish people fornicated with babylon in prostituting the temple and in taking babylon slaves back to jerusalem for pleasure, god really cut their ties to them as a people or their church, and with the written word...........................and they were GUILTY OF THAT, not being used by god, and not carrying the written word, and removed from the book of life....................and BEING GUILTY...............they though that a "marriage" represented to them that they were being included back into the lord's temple)

(but listen to this, you don't dictate god's behavior, when God stops using a people or removes their names from the book of life)

(we will say this clearly....................mankind is a sin offering and there is no hope for it, there is only a few years from now until 2061 when humanity is dead.............as a "sin offering for god".................its not really important if mankind correctly understands or acts on the gospel, or sees a sign or a vision............this is about prayer only, and the law is not a lynching mechanism for the faithful, just for all of humanity)
 
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Davy

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'For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved,
we have a building of God, an house not made with hands,
eternal in the heavens.
For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon
with our house which is from heaven:
If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked.
For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened:
not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon,
that mortality might be swallowed up of life.
Now He that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God,
Who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit.
Therefore we are always confident,
knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:
( For we walk by faith, not by sight )

We are confident, I say, and willing rather
to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent,
we may be accepted of Him.pi
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ;
that every one may receive the things done in his body,
according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.'

(2 Corinthians 5:1-10)

I made plain Paul's subject in that above 2 Corinthians 5 scripture about 2 different bodies we have. That is what Paul was talking about with that building of God we also have. That aligns with 1 Corinthians 15 where he taught that 'there is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body', meaning at present, not future only when Jesus returns.

Now if you choose to not believe Paul, and want to lie and say that wasn't Paul's subject there, then YOU have a problem, because you are trying to wrongly make the written scripture fit what you learned from men's Jewish traditions.
 

charity

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I made plain Paul's subject in that above 2 Corinthians 5 scripture about 2 different bodies we have. That is what Paul was talking about with that building of God we also have. That aligns with 1 Corinthians 15 where he taught that 'there is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body', meaning at present, not future only when Jesus returns.

Now if you choose to not believe Paul, and want to lie and say that wasn't Paul's subject there, then YOU have a problem, because you are trying to wrongly make the written scripture fit what you learned from men's Jewish traditions.
'For our conversation is in heaven;
from whence also we look for the Saviour,
the Lord Jesus Christ:
Who shall change our vile body,
that it may be fashioned like unto His glorious body,
according to the working
whereby He is able
even to subdue all things
unto himself.'

(Php 3:20-21)

Hello @Davy,

There is no need for an aggressive stance, Davy :): for I believe what Paul says, that at the resurrection, the believer will receive a spiritual body, like unto Christ's own spiritual body, which comprises flesh and bone.

Within the love of Christ our Saviour
Chris
 
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