"Romans 13"

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sdcougar

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Mar 17, 2010
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South Dakota
"Romans13"

I am trying to write on some various Bible texts to bring attention to their context. This is one text which has been misleading to many. I would appreciate any feedback as to whether it is clearly explained. What needs more explanation? Do you find it helpful?


"Romans13" in Context


First, Paulwrote a letter. It had no chapter divisions. These numbers wereadded in the second millennium.


Remember that after Antiochus IV intervened in a Jewish civil war [168 B.C.]and desecrated the Temple, that the autonomy won by the Maccabees only lasted a few decades. Following Pompey's capture of Jerusalem [60 B.C.] they were subject to the Romans. The Senate conferred the title “King of the Jews” on Herod in 40 B.C.. And for four decades he bore the sword under which many Jews chafed.


Following Herod's death in 4 B.C., revolts again broke out. When the rule ofhis son, Archelaus, ended in A.D. 6, Judas the Galilean [mentioned in Acts 5] led a revolt. Varus with three legions who bore the sword, crushed it and 2,000 Jews were crucified around Jerusalem [Josephus,Ant. 17:295].


From this period until the outbreak of the Jewish War in AD 66, Zealots and assassins would continue to foment rebellion and violent outbreaks against the Roman rule and taxes. During the insurrections from A.D. 46 to 48, two sons of Judas the Galilean were executed by Rome. After that, probably in A.D. 49, Claudius issued an edict expelling the Jews from Rome because of disturbances [Acts 18:2]. When he died in A.D. 54, Jews began returning to Rome.


In A.D. 57, Paul wrote to the Christians in Rome:


...Iappeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect…

Bless those who persecute you; bless and do not curse. Rejoice with thosewho rejoice; mourn with those who mourn....

Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Be careful to do what is right in the eyes of everybody. If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone. Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay,"says the Lord. On the contrary:

"If your enemy is hungry, feed him;

if he is thirsty, give him something to drink.

In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head."

Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. Consequently, he who rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and he will commend you. For he is God's servant to do you good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword for nothing. He is God's servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also because of conscience. This is also why you pay taxes, for theauthorities are God's servants, who give their full time to governing. Give everyone what you owe him: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.
 

Alethos

New Member
Mar 8, 2011
685
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0
Melbourne Australia
"Romans13"

I am trying to write on some various Bible texts to bring attention to their context. This is one text which has been misleading to many. I would appreciate any feedback as to whether it is clearly explained. What needs more explanation? Do you find it helpful?


"Romans13" in Context


First, Paulwrote a letter. It had no chapter divisions. These numbers wereadded in the second millennium.


Remember that after Antiochus IV intervened in a Jewish civil war [168 B.C.]and desecrated the Temple, that the autonomy won by the Maccabees only lasted a few decades. Following Pompey's capture of Jerusalem [60 B.C.] they were subject to the Romans. The Senate conferred the title “King of the Jews” on Herod in 40 B.C.. And for four decades he bore the sword under which many Jews chafed.


Following Herod's death in 4 B.C., revolts again broke out. When the rule ofhis son, Archelaus, ended in A.D. 6, Judas the Galilean [mentioned in Acts 5] led a revolt. Varus with three legions who bore the sword, crushed it and 2,000 Jews were crucified around Jerusalem [Josephus,Ant. 17:295].


From this period until the outbreak of the Jewish War in AD 66, Zealots and assassins would continue to foment rebellion and violent outbreaks against the Roman rule and taxes. During the insurrections from A.D. 46 to 48, two sons of Judas the Galilean were executed by Rome. After that, probably in A.D. 49, Claudius issued an edict expelling the Jews from Rome because of disturbances [Acts 18:2]. When he died in A.D. 54, Jews began returning to Rome.


In A.D. 57, Paul wrote to the Christians in Rome:


...Iappeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect…

Bless those who persecute you; bless and do not curse. Rejoice with thosewho rejoice; mourn with those who mourn....

Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Be careful to do what is right in the eyes of everybody. If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone. Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay,"says the Lord. On the contrary:

"If your enemy is hungry, feed him;

if he is thirsty, give him something to drink.

In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head."

Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. Consequently, he who rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and he will commend you. For he is God's servant to do you good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword for nothing. He is God's servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also because of conscience. This is also why you pay taxes, for theauthorities are God's servants, who give their full time to governing. Give everyone what you owe him: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.

Sdcougar,

Last year I was given the opportunity to create a PowerPoint presentation on AD66 - AD 70. I also have a series of studies in the Olivet Prophecy that speaks to the same time period. I am more than happy to email them if desired.

Alethos

 

veteran

New Member
Aug 6, 2010
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Southeast USA
"Romans13"

I am trying to write on some various Bible texts to bring attention to their context. This is one text which has been misleading to many. I would appreciate any feedback as to whether it is clearly explained. What needs more explanation? Do you find it helpful?


"Romans13" in Context

....




The point you appear to be drawing is how some of the zealous Jews sufferred greatly to gain essentially nothing except a fleeing emotion of thinking to have gained something.

Paul's message is pretty simple. Don't go rebelling against the authorities that God has placed in control, for it's only like kicking against the pricks like Saul (Paul) once did, and won't accomplish anything except an early grave.


A comparison of Daniel's day with the seventy years Babylon captivity of Judah might be in order with that Romans 13 Message. The Jews were well taken care of during their captivity to Babylon, as God had promised they would be. They had it so good as a matter of fact, that the majority of Jews chose to stay in Babylon instead of returning back to Jerusalem.


At the same time, Paul's Message in Romans 13 does not mean Christians are to just roll over to the wicked at a drop of the hat. If that were so Jesus would not have told His disciples in Luke 22 to go buy a sword for those who didn't have one.


 

Alethos

New Member
Mar 8, 2011
685
4
0
Melbourne Australia

The point you appear to be drawing is how some of the zealous Jews sufferred greatly to gain essentially nothing except a fleeing emotion of thinking to have gained something.

Paul's message is pretty simple. Don't go rebelling against the authorities that God has placed in control, for it's only like kicking against the pricks like Saul (Paul) once did, and won't accomplish anything except an early grave.

A comparison of Daniel's day with the seventy years Babylon captivity of Judah might be in order with that Romans 13 Message. The Jews were well taken care of during their captivity to Babylon, as God had promised they would be. They had it so good as a matter of fact, that the majority of Jews chose to stay in Babylon instead of returning back to Jerusalem.

At the same time, Paul's Message in Romans 13 does not mean Christians are to just roll over to the wicked at a drop of the hat. If that were so Jesus would not have told His disciples in Luke 22 to go buy a sword for those who didn't have one.[/size]


Veteran & Sdcougar,

I would like to gain your thoughts on the matter of voting and politics, which I believe keeping within the topic of this thread? The reason I ask it appears a great deal of attention in wider Christian circles has been given to these obligations. For instance here in Australia the Baptist's are very active in politics, while other denominations prefer to abstain from voting etc..

Rom 13:1-7: Is clearly about Christian’s obligations to their government within the confines of the Word. This subject matter can be a very sensitive area of thought amongst many Christians. The forbidding of a believer in taking vengeance is one aspect , by allowing God to exercise His authority is the subject matter, see Rom 12:19,20,21, Do we think that God allows evildoers to have their own way in this world? Certainly NOT, Paul states God is governing the authorities and even as I type this short note He is bringing wrath against the evildoers (see Tit 3:1 & 1 Pe 2:13-17 and Jer 27:17, 29:7 also...Mat 22:21, John 18:3,6, Acts 4:19,20 & 1 Ti 2:1,2).

"The Most High rules the kingdom of men, and gives it to whom he will, and sets over it the lowliest of men" (Dan 4:17).

I am curious how you both view the application of this verse (Dan 4:17) in relation to voting, jury service and many other government type roles and responsibilities?

Alethos
 

tomwebster

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Dec 11, 2006
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...
"The Most High rules the kingdom of men, and gives it to whom he will, and sets over it the lowliest of men" (Dan 4:17).

I am curious how you both view the application of this verse (Dan 4:17) in relation to voting, jury service and many other government type roles and responsibilities?

Alethos


Why do you insist on taking Scripture out of context? Dan 4:17 does not stand by itself; it is a part of a context.


 

Alethos

New Member
Mar 8, 2011
685
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Melbourne Australia

Why do you insist on taking Scripture out of context? Dan 4:17 does not stand by itself; it is a part of a context.

Tom

what are you saying about Dan 4:17? in relation to Rom 13?

Do you have a view or an understanding you would like to share with us? or are you still wanting to cast stones from behind closed doors?
dry.gif


This is not my thread and it would appear rude to hijack this thread for the sake of casting stones.

Maybe refrain from doing so here; more than willing for you to PM anytime.

Back on topic Dan 4:17 in relation to Rom 13 on topic of voting and politics?

Do you have a view?

Alethos

 

tomwebster

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Dec 11, 2006
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Tom

what are you saying about Dan 4:17? in relation to Rom 13?

Do you have a view or an understanding you would like to share with us? or are you still wanting to cast stones from behind closed doors?
dry.gif


This is not my thread and it would appear rude to hijack this thread for the sake of casting stones.

Maybe refrain from doing so here; more than willing for you to PM anytime.

Back on topic Dan 4:17 in relation to Rom 13 on topic of voting and politics?

Do you have a view?

Alethos



There is no relationship because you are taking Dan 4:17 out of it context.


 

Duckybill

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Feb 12, 2010
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please dont go out into darkness.
Such irony!

Matthew 8:12 (ESV)
[sup]12 [/sup]while the sons of the kingdom will be thrown into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.”

 

Alethos

New Member
Mar 8, 2011
685
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Melbourne Australia

What makes you think 'truth' is "old"?


Ducky, again as I was saying to you earlier you consistently pull down people and their beliefs but add no value or substance yourself.

Ducky, I am going to monitor your responses to see if this trend continues, in some way I wil make you accountable for your posts, to help you with making them more positive and uplifting rather than negative and condemning.

This ought to be done via a moderator....if you are listening?

Alethos

 

Duckybill

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Feb 12, 2010
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Ducky, again as I was saying to you earlier you consistently pull down people and their beliefs but add no value or substance yourself.

Ducky, I am going to monitor your responses to see if this trend continues, in some way I wil make you accountable for your posts, to help you with making them more positive and uplifting rather than negative and condemning.

This ought to be done via a moderator....if you are listening?
You just do that. Every time I see you imply that Jesus was sinful I will speak up.