The man needs to do nothing men say. He needs to keep trusting God. Put the promises in front of him. We will pray and he needs to read all the promises you put in front of him and simply believe them and where he finds he doesn’t, ask for help with his unbelief.
Church Bashing
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The man needs to do nothing men say. He needs to keep trusting God. Put the promises in front of him. We will pray and he needs to read all the promises you put in front of him and simply believe them and where he finds he doesn’t, ask for help with his unbelief.
Then it sounds like he hasn’t received the down payment of the Holy Spirit. Should we pray that for him?
Lambano
Well-Known Member
Do you receive the Holy Spirit before or after you trust Jesus to save you? First things first.
And since he struggles with a certain sin of his flesh, he thinks he will go to hell? That would make every single one of us go to hell…we aren’t perfected instantly upon receiving the Holy Spirit.
I honestly think he should stop worrying, stop trying to perfect himself, and start trusting.
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
Justification by Faith
What is justification by faith? It is the work of God in laying the glory of man in the dust, and doing for man that which it is not in his power to do for himself. When men see their own nothingness, they are prepared to be clothed with the righteousness of Christ.
As the penitent sinner, contrite before God, discerns Christ’s atonement in his behalf, and accepts this atonement as his only hope in this life and the future life, his sins are pardoned. This is justification by faith.
The grace of Christ is freely to justify the sinner without merit or claim on his part. Justification is a full, complete pardon of sin. The moment a sinner accepts Christ by faith, that moment he is pardoned. The righteousness of Christ is imputed to him, and he is no more to doubt God’s forgiving grace.
It is not God’s will that you should be distrustful, and torture your soul with the fear that God will not accept you because you are sinful and unworthy.
But, you say if I could only know that He is my Saviour! Well, what kind of evidence do you want? Do you want a special feeling or emotion to prove that Christ is yours? Is this more reliable than pure faith in God’s promises? . . .
There is not a friend in the world of whom you would require one-half the assurance that our heavenly Father has given you in His promises.
Those who accept Christ, and in their first confidence say, I am saved, are in danger of trusting to themselves. They lose sight of their own weakness and their constant need of divine strength. They are unprepared for Satan’s devices, and under temptation many, like Peter, fall into the very depths of sin. We are admonished, "Let him that thinketh he standeth, take heed lest he fall." 1 Corinthians 10:12. Our only safety is in constant distrust of self, and dependence on Christ.
In order that we may have the righteousness of Christ, we need daily to be transformed by the influence of the Spirit, to be a partaker of the divine nature. It is the work of the Holy Spirit to elevate the taste, to sanctify the heart, to ennoble the whole man.
In order for man to retain justification, there must be continual obedience, through active, living faith that works by love and purifies the soul.
It is by continual surrender of the will, by continual obedience, that the blessing of justification is retained.
What is justification by faith? It is the work of God in laying the glory of man in the dust, and doing for man that which it is not in his power to do for himself. When men see their own nothingness, they are prepared to be clothed with the righteousness of Christ.
As the penitent sinner, contrite before God, discerns Christ’s atonement in his behalf, and accepts this atonement as his only hope in this life and the future life, his sins are pardoned. This is justification by faith.
The grace of Christ is freely to justify the sinner without merit or claim on his part. Justification is a full, complete pardon of sin. The moment a sinner accepts Christ by faith, that moment he is pardoned. The righteousness of Christ is imputed to him, and he is no more to doubt God’s forgiving grace.
It is not God’s will that you should be distrustful, and torture your soul with the fear that God will not accept you because you are sinful and unworthy.
But, you say if I could only know that He is my Saviour! Well, what kind of evidence do you want? Do you want a special feeling or emotion to prove that Christ is yours? Is this more reliable than pure faith in God’s promises? . . .
There is not a friend in the world of whom you would require one-half the assurance that our heavenly Father has given you in His promises.
Those who accept Christ, and in their first confidence say, I am saved, are in danger of trusting to themselves. They lose sight of their own weakness and their constant need of divine strength. They are unprepared for Satan’s devices, and under temptation many, like Peter, fall into the very depths of sin. We are admonished, "Let him that thinketh he standeth, take heed lest he fall." 1 Corinthians 10:12. Our only safety is in constant distrust of self, and dependence on Christ.
In order that we may have the righteousness of Christ, we need daily to be transformed by the influence of the Spirit, to be a partaker of the divine nature. It is the work of the Holy Spirit to elevate the taste, to sanctify the heart, to ennoble the whole man.
In order for man to retain justification, there must be continual obedience, through active, living faith that works by love and purifies the soul.
It is by continual surrender of the will, by continual obedience, that the blessing of justification is retained.
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
Sanctification by Faith
Our only ground of hope is in the righteousness of Christ imputed to us, and in that wrought by His Spirit working in and through us.
The righteousness by which we are justified is imputed; the righteousness by which we are sanctified is imparted. The first is our title to heaven, the second is our fitness for heaven.
Both our title to heaven and our fitness for it are found in the righteousness of Christ.
When through repentance and faith we accept Christ as our Saviour, the Lord pardons our sins, and remits the penalty prescribed for the transgression of the law. The sinner then stands before God as a just person; he is taken into favor with Heaven, and through the Spirit has fellowship with the Father and the Son. Then there is yet another work to be accomplished, and this is of a progressive nature. The soul is to be sanctified through the truth. And this also is accomplished through faith. For it is only by the grace of Christ, which we receive through faith, that the character can be transformed.
Those who would be saints in heaven, must first be saints upon the earth; for when we leave this earth, we shall take our character with us, and this will be simply taking with us some of the elements of heaven imparted to us through the righteousness of Christ.
The newly converted soul often has fierce conflicts with established habits or with some special form of temptation, and, being overcome by some master passion or tendency, he is guilty of indiscretion or actual wrong. . . .We must expect to meet with great imperfections in those who are young and inexperienced.
We have a correct record of the religious experiences of marked characters in Bible history. Men whom God favored, and to whom He entrusted great responsibilities, were sometimes overcome by temptation and committed sins, even as we of the present day strive, waver, and frequently fall into error. But it is encouraging to our desponding hearts to know that through God’s grace they could gain fresh vigor to again rise above their evil natures; and, remembering this, we are ready to renew the conflict ourselves.
Our only ground of hope is in the righteousness of Christ imputed to us, and in that wrought by His Spirit working in and through us.
The righteousness by which we are justified is imputed; the righteousness by which we are sanctified is imparted. The first is our title to heaven, the second is our fitness for heaven.
Both our title to heaven and our fitness for it are found in the righteousness of Christ.
When through repentance and faith we accept Christ as our Saviour, the Lord pardons our sins, and remits the penalty prescribed for the transgression of the law. The sinner then stands before God as a just person; he is taken into favor with Heaven, and through the Spirit has fellowship with the Father and the Son. Then there is yet another work to be accomplished, and this is of a progressive nature. The soul is to be sanctified through the truth. And this also is accomplished through faith. For it is only by the grace of Christ, which we receive through faith, that the character can be transformed.
Those who would be saints in heaven, must first be saints upon the earth; for when we leave this earth, we shall take our character with us, and this will be simply taking with us some of the elements of heaven imparted to us through the righteousness of Christ.
The newly converted soul often has fierce conflicts with established habits or with some special form of temptation, and, being overcome by some master passion or tendency, he is guilty of indiscretion or actual wrong. . . .We must expect to meet with great imperfections in those who are young and inexperienced.
We have a correct record of the religious experiences of marked characters in Bible history. Men whom God favored, and to whom He entrusted great responsibilities, were sometimes overcome by temptation and committed sins, even as we of the present day strive, waver, and frequently fall into error. But it is encouraging to our desponding hearts to know that through God’s grace they could gain fresh vigor to again rise above their evil natures; and, remembering this, we are ready to renew the conflict ourselves.
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
Sanctification’s Goal: A Christ-like Character
True sanctification is nothing more or less than to love God with all the heart, to walk in His commandments and ordinances blameless. Sanctification is not an emotion, but a heaven-born principle that brings all the passions and desires under the control of the Spirit of God; and this work is done through our Lord and Saviour.
When self is merged in Christ, love springs forth spontaneously. The completeness of Christian character is attained when the impulse to help and bless others springs constantly from within.
When we submit ourselves to Christ, the heart is united with His heart, the will is merged in His will, the mind becomes one with His mind, the thoughts are brought into captivity to Him; we live His life. This is what it means to be clothed with the garment of His righteousness.
Total Victory a Reality
We can overcome. Yes; fully, entirely. Jesus died to make a way of escape for us, that we might overcome every evil temper, every sin, every temptation, and sit down at last with Him.
If you will stand under the bloodstained banner of Prince Emmanuel, faithfully doing His service, you need never yield to temptation; for One stands by your side who is able to keep you from falling.
The strongest temptation is no excuse for sin. However great the pressure brought to bear upon the soul, transgression is our own act. It is not in the power of earth or hell to compel anyone to sin. The will must consent, the heart must yield, or passion can not overbear reason, nor iniquity triumph over righteousness.
If we consent, He will so identify Himself with our thoughts and aims, so blend our hearts and minds into conformity to His will, that when obeying Him we shall be but carrying out our own impulses.
Not even by a thought did He yield to temptation. So it may be with us.
Those only who through faith in Christ obey all of God’s commandments will reach the condition of sinlessness in which Adam lived before his transgression. They testify to their love of Christ by obeying all His precepts.
In every phase of your character-building you are to please God. This you may do; for Enoch pleased Him, though living in a degenerate age. And there are Enoch’s in this our day.
When the character of Christ shall be perfectly reproduced in His people, then He will come to claim them as His own.
True sanctification is nothing more or less than to love God with all the heart, to walk in His commandments and ordinances blameless. Sanctification is not an emotion, but a heaven-born principle that brings all the passions and desires under the control of the Spirit of God; and this work is done through our Lord and Saviour.
When self is merged in Christ, love springs forth spontaneously. The completeness of Christian character is attained when the impulse to help and bless others springs constantly from within.
When we submit ourselves to Christ, the heart is united with His heart, the will is merged in His will, the mind becomes one with His mind, the thoughts are brought into captivity to Him; we live His life. This is what it means to be clothed with the garment of His righteousness.
Total Victory a Reality
We can overcome. Yes; fully, entirely. Jesus died to make a way of escape for us, that we might overcome every evil temper, every sin, every temptation, and sit down at last with Him.
If you will stand under the bloodstained banner of Prince Emmanuel, faithfully doing His service, you need never yield to temptation; for One stands by your side who is able to keep you from falling.
The strongest temptation is no excuse for sin. However great the pressure brought to bear upon the soul, transgression is our own act. It is not in the power of earth or hell to compel anyone to sin. The will must consent, the heart must yield, or passion can not overbear reason, nor iniquity triumph over righteousness.
If we consent, He will so identify Himself with our thoughts and aims, so blend our hearts and minds into conformity to His will, that when obeying Him we shall be but carrying out our own impulses.
Not even by a thought did He yield to temptation. So it may be with us.
Those only who through faith in Christ obey all of God’s commandments will reach the condition of sinlessness in which Adam lived before his transgression. They testify to their love of Christ by obeying all His precepts.
In every phase of your character-building you are to please God. This you may do; for Enoch pleased Him, though living in a degenerate age. And there are Enoch’s in this our day.
When the character of Christ shall be perfectly reproduced in His people, then He will come to claim them as His own.
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
We Need Not See All Points Alike
Many commit the error of trying to define minutely the fine points of distinction between justification and sanctification. Into the definitions of these two terms they often bring their own ideas and speculations. Why try to be more minute than is Inspiration on the vital question of righteousness by faith? Why try to work out every minute point, as if the salvation of the soul depended upon all having exactly your understanding of this matter? All cannot see in the same line of vision.
It is not essential for you to know and tell others all the whys and wherefores as to what constitutes the new heart, or as to the position they can and must reach so as never to sin. You have no such work to do. All are not constituted alike. Conversions are not all alike.
A Perfect Heart Is More Essential Than a Perfect Theology
There is to be no dread of anyone being borne down even in a widespread apostasy, who has a living experience in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. If Jesus be formed within, the hope of glory, the illiterate as well as the educated can bear the testimony of our faith, saying, "I know in whom I have believed." Some will not, in argument, be able to show wherein their adversary is wrong, having never had any advantages that others have had, yet these are not overborne by the apostasy because they have the evidence in their own heart that they have the truth, and the most subtle reasoning and assaults of Satan cannot move them from their knowledge of the truth and they have not a doubt or fear that they are themselves in error.
"I want," says one, "to reason out this matter." Well, reason it out if you can. "The wind bloweth where it listeth," and you hear the sound thereof, but you cannot explain it. And no more can you explain the things of God upon the human heart. You cannot explain this faith that lays right hold upon the merits of the blood of a crucified and risen Saviour to bring Christ’s righteousness into your life. Clothed with the righteousness of Christ and not your own righteousness, you will not depend upon what you can do or what you will do.
He saves us because He said He would. Are we going to go into all the explanations as to how He can save us? Do we have the goodness in ourselves that will make us better and cleanse us from the spots and stains of sin, enabling us then to come to God? We simply cannot do it.
Christ crucified, Christ risen, Christ ascended into the heavens, Christ coming again, should so soften, gladden, and fill the mind of the minister that he will present these truths to the people in love and deep earnestness.
I love Him! I love Him! I see in Jesus matchless charms. I see in Him everything to be desired by the children of men. Let us come to the "Lamb of God, which taketh away the sins of the world." Let us, through His merits and righteousness, obtain a fitting up for heaven.
Many commit the error of trying to define minutely the fine points of distinction between justification and sanctification. Into the definitions of these two terms they often bring their own ideas and speculations. Why try to be more minute than is Inspiration on the vital question of righteousness by faith? Why try to work out every minute point, as if the salvation of the soul depended upon all having exactly your understanding of this matter? All cannot see in the same line of vision.
It is not essential for you to know and tell others all the whys and wherefores as to what constitutes the new heart, or as to the position they can and must reach so as never to sin. You have no such work to do. All are not constituted alike. Conversions are not all alike.
A Perfect Heart Is More Essential Than a Perfect Theology
There is to be no dread of anyone being borne down even in a widespread apostasy, who has a living experience in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. If Jesus be formed within, the hope of glory, the illiterate as well as the educated can bear the testimony of our faith, saying, "I know in whom I have believed." Some will not, in argument, be able to show wherein their adversary is wrong, having never had any advantages that others have had, yet these are not overborne by the apostasy because they have the evidence in their own heart that they have the truth, and the most subtle reasoning and assaults of Satan cannot move them from their knowledge of the truth and they have not a doubt or fear that they are themselves in error.
"I want," says one, "to reason out this matter." Well, reason it out if you can. "The wind bloweth where it listeth," and you hear the sound thereof, but you cannot explain it. And no more can you explain the things of God upon the human heart. You cannot explain this faith that lays right hold upon the merits of the blood of a crucified and risen Saviour to bring Christ’s righteousness into your life. Clothed with the righteousness of Christ and not your own righteousness, you will not depend upon what you can do or what you will do.
He saves us because He said He would. Are we going to go into all the explanations as to how He can save us? Do we have the goodness in ourselves that will make us better and cleanse us from the spots and stains of sin, enabling us then to come to God? We simply cannot do it.
Christ crucified, Christ risen, Christ ascended into the heavens, Christ coming again, should so soften, gladden, and fill the mind of the minister that he will present these truths to the people in love and deep earnestness.
I love Him! I love Him! I see in Jesus matchless charms. I see in Him everything to be desired by the children of men. Let us come to the "Lamb of God, which taketh away the sins of the world." Let us, through His merits and righteousness, obtain a fitting up for heaven.
Yikes…I almost want to say who cares, as long as you receive your Baptism!
If you want to talk theology, I would say, God first heals your blindness and deafness so you can see He exists. Then you are so sorry you didn’t see and ignored Him. Then, you begin to call out to Him and He gives the Holy Spirit sometime soon after.
This man, have you tried to determine if he has received the Spirit Baptism yet?
Did you point blank ask him - did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
How could this be done? There are people who have enough inherent willpower to feign an excellent character. Just asking.
Lambano
Well-Known Member
robert derrick
Well-Known Member
True.
I would define smug self-righteousness as putting out some unscriptural doctrine in the name of 'love', and daring anyone to object.
Good job.
It's simply the wording Hebrews uses. You used to approach God through the temple service, now you approach God through Jesus Christ. Hardly awkward at all!
Much love!
Lambano
Well-Known Member
Trust IS the issue.
And I want you to think about what you just said about not being perfected instantly. I've been arguing that we're not perfected until Jesus returns.
How could this be done? There are people who have enough inherent willpower to feign an excellent character. Just asking.
Somehow, from the sound of it, I don’t think this man would feign anything.
robert derrick
Well-Known Member
Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
Divisions caused by false doctrine are the destructive dividers to avoid, by dividing ourselves from them.
Unity for unity's sake without truth is the unity forced down the throats of the righteous.
Nimrod was the first great unifier of the church at Babel.
How in the world do you know what my church is like?
If you are an example of it, I'll pass on visiting it.
you would have to give me the verses that led you to believe why - but if you want to be perfect, sell all you have and follow Me - is not for now.
Lambano
Well-Known Member
Barny, the referenced post advises the reader to "Rest in Him", trust, etc. Could we flesh out a bit how a young man undergoing strong temptation can apply "Rest in Him"? For example, does it mean, you can give in to the temptation and trust in God's forgiveness? True, but depending on the temptation, somebody could get hurt. Does it mean trust God to give you the strength to resist the temptation? That's certainly what he's asking us to pray for, but I don't know if that's tells him anything he doesn't already know.Tell him this.
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