Pilate asked Jesus, What Is Truth?

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Truther

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That was certainly NOT what I was saying to you.

I do not see Acts 2:38 nor any other part of the Bible as childish. Rather, I see it as a guidebook to growth as we are led by the Holy Ghost. There should be no stopping point in our growth as long as we have time left to us. To stop growing is stagnate and die.

Remember the words of John the Baptist here:

"I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:" Matt 3:11

And here:

"He must increase, but I must decrease." John 3:30

And the words of Jesus here:

"For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say, He hath a devil.
The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children." Matt 11:18-19

And then again, what did Jesus do?

"And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man." Luke 2:52
I did not infer you thought Acts 2:38 was childish, but I inferred that you were saying we need to put away "childish" things or, "less mature" things as per Acts 2:38.

Am I correct?
 

amadeus

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I did not infer you thought Acts 2:38 was childish, but I inferred that you were saying we need to put away "childish" things or, "less mature" things as per Acts 2:38.

Am I correct?
No! Each one of us needs to be growing. God does not change, but as we grow, are we not changing? What about us is changing?
 

Truther

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No! Each one of us needs to be growing. God does not change, but as we grow, are we not changing? What about us is changing?
What does that have to do with baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of our sins(Acts 2:38)?
 

amadeus

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What does that have to do with baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of our sins(Acts 2:38)?
Try to answer the questions I asked as well as to understand some of the verses I quoted. When you can, you may understand the connection. If you believe the UPC essentials then I may know what you believe. I received the Holy Ghost in a UPC, and they taught me those things.

Where to from there?

How does a person continue to grow toward God? What is the limit for a man in his growth toward God?

"Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.
And this will we do, if God permit." Heb 6:1-3
 

Truther

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Try to answer the questions I asked as well as to understand some of the verses I quoted. When you can, you may understand the connection. If you believe the UPC essentials then I may know what you believe. I received the Holy Ghost in a UPC, and they taught me those things.

Where to from there?

How does a person continue to grow toward God? What is the limit for a man in his growth toward God?

"Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.
And this will we do, if God permit." Heb 6:1-3
Shall I leave Acts 2:38 behind and stop insisting sinners and misinformed believers adhere to it?

Or, was that a "saint to saint" passage that was comprised of folks whom already obeyed Acts 2:38?
 

JohnPaul

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Pilate asked Jesus this all important question about 2,000 years ago in St. John 18:38. Many are still asking this question today. With so many different denominations and religious crusaders, many of whom clash, disagree, and even dispute with one another, it is no small wonder why many people may be asking this question today.

Scriptures that have been taken out of their original context are pretty easy to detect. However, this strategy is used by many who wish to just find a scripture to support their particular point of view. In Exodus 20:13 we find God's commandment, "Thou shalt not kill," but in Acts 10:13 we find Peter being told by a voice from Heaven to "kill and eat," and in Matthew 5:21-22 Jesus said that being angry with our brother without a cause is like killing. No one in their right mind would attempt to use these scriptures to say that God contradicted Himself. While all of the scriptures are true, they are used in totally different contexts. 1 Corinthians 14:33 tells us that God is not the author of confusion, but confusion runs rampant in our world today. And there are many divisions among people who all claim to be going to the same place, many of whom use the same Bible.

The terms "Christian" and "Born Again" are so loosely used and applied today by so many that they have become bywords which have little or no meaning to a lot of people.

The Plan of Salvation was presented by Peter, under the inspiration of the Spirit of God, on the Day of Pentecost in Acts Chapter 2, following Jesus' death, burial, resurrection and ascension. Upon being specifically asked what sinners must do, here's what God inspired Peter to say, as recorded in Acts 2:38: "Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

Peter didn’t stop there. In the very next verse (verse 39) he said, "For the promise is to you, your children, to those that are afar off, even as many as the Lord OUR GOD shall call". So, my question is, "Has God stopped calling?" ABSOLUTELY NOT!

Step 1. Repentance of sins

Jesus said in Luke 13:3 "... except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish." And He COMMANDED in Luke 24:47 that REPENTANCE AND REMISSION OF SINS should be preached in HIS NAME among ALL nations, BEGINNING at Jerusalem.

Step 2. Water Baptism in the precious name of Jesus

Jesus told Nicodemus in John 3:1-8 that unless a person is "born again" of water AND of the Spirit, they cannot enter into the Kingdom of God. And, He said in Mark 16:16 "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned." The Greek word that was translated into English as "baptize" means to fully wet, immerse, submerge, plunge into, dip or bury. Baptism in by immersion (not sprinkling).

Romans 6:3-4 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

When we are baptized, our sins are washed away...

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

When we stand in the waters of baptism calling upon the name of the Lord -- then here comes the blood...

Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Step 3. Receiving the Holy Spirit (the Bible way)

Jesus told Nicodemus this in John Chapter 3...

Verse 3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Verse 5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Verse 8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.


According to Jesus, Himself, although you cannot see the wind, or know where it came from or where it is going, there is a "sound" heard when it is present, likewise, there is a "sound" heard when everyone is born of the Spirit. So, my question is "What is the sound to which Jesus referred?"...

1) the 120 in the upper room in Acts 2:1-4, .... they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

2) the household of Cornelius in Acts 10:44-48, ... While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God.

3) the 12 disciples of John in Acts 19:1-6, ... And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

"Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed?" (Acts 19:2)
I believe it is true as Pilate did not want the blood of Christ on his hands, it's why he washed his hands of the conviction of Christ, and left it up to the Jews to decide.

Pontious Pilate did not kill Jesus as many think but the Jews did.
 

Truther

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I believe it is true as Pilate did not want the blood of Christ on his hands, it's why he washed his hands of the conviction of Christ, and left it up to the Jews to decide.

Pontious Pilate did not kill Jesus as many think but the Jews did.
It was a combo.

The Romans were the actual executioners but the Jews were the prosecutors, judge and jury.

They all had their hands in it.
 

JohnPaul

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It was a combo.

The Romans were the actual executioners but the Jews were the prosecutors, judge and jury.

They all had their hands in it.
I don’t believe so, the Jews were fully responsible.
 

amadeus

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Shall I leave Acts 2:38 behind and stop insisting sinners and misinformed believers adhere to it?

Or, was that a "saint to saint" passage that was comprised of folks whom already obeyed Acts 2:38?
You do not really leave anything behind. You simply go to the lowest room and abandon yourself to God. [see Luke 14:7-11]

We do not grow ourselves. We simply surrender to God and keep on surrendering from moment to moment and from day to day. Will God not increase us? What is the limit to our growth? It certainly is not in an unlimited God, is it?

As to what we share with others from what God has given us...? When we are being led by the Holy Ghost should we not know what to share and when... or when to remain silent?
 

Truther

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I don’t believe so, the Jews were fully responsible.
Like Rome is not responsible for the Christian persecutions either, beginning with Peter in the prison?

Were the Jews commanding Rome what to do per the crucifixion?

Or, was it a political thing for Pilate to avoid a confrontation??
 

Truther

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You do not really leave anything behind. You simply go to the lowest room and abandon yourself to God. [see Luke 14:7-11]

We do not grow ourselves. We simply surrender to God and keep on surrendering from moment to moment and from day to day. Will God not increase us? What is the limit to our growth? It certainly is not in an unlimited God, is it?

As to what we share with others from what God has given us...? When we are being led by the Holy Ghost should we not know what to share and when... or when to remain silent?
I appreciate your insight, but do you preach Acts 2:38 to sinners still?
 

amadeus

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I appreciate your insight, but do you preach Acts 2:38 to sinners still?
I have always tried to 'preach' what God has put in my mouth in and for the moment. If Acts 2:38 were included, what else could I do?
 
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JohnPaul

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Like Rome is not responsible for the Christian persecutions either, beginning with Peter in the prison?

Were the Jews commanding Rome what to do per the crucifixion?

Or, was it a political thing for Pilate to avoid a confrontation??
Pontious Pilate knew Christ was a holy man, and wanted no part of it, that's why he left it to the Jews to choose, not for political reasons, he didn't want the son of God's blood on his hands.
 

Truther

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I have always tried to 'preach' what God has put in my mouth in and for the moment. If Acts 2:38 were included, what else could I do?
My suggestion is to preach to sinners exactly what Peter preached to sinners.

That is being led of the Holy Ghost.

I had a sinner couple talking to me about being under spiritual attack yesterday, but instead of going to see them and appeasing them in their situation, I told them they must first be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of their sins, lest we are spinning our wheels by rebuking devils. The blood must first be applied to their lives.
 

Truther

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Pontious Pilate knew Christ was a holy man, and wanted no part of it, that's why he left it to the Jews to choose, not for political reasons, he didn't want the son of God's blood on his hands.
So, the Jews ordered the Roman government to crucify Jesus?

They ordered the Roman soldiers, or were these Jewish soldiers that took over?
 

amadeus

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My suggestion is to preach to sinners exactly what Peter preached to sinners.

That is being led of the Holy Ghost...
And the preaching of other inspired writers of the scripture?

And whatever else God may speak to our heart?
Are we all the same part of the Body of Christ each having exactly the same function?

1co 12:4 Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.
1co 12:5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.
1co 12:6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
1co 12:7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
1co 12:8 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
1co 12:9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
1co 12:10 To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
1co 12:11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.
 

Truther

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And the preaching of other inspired writers of the scripture?

And whatever else God may speak to our heart?
Are we all the same part of the Body of Christ each having exactly the same function?

1co 12:4 Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.
1co 12:5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.
1co 12:6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
1co 12:7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
1co 12:8 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
1co 12:9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
1co 12:10 To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
1co 12:11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.
I don't preach the gifts of the Spirit to sinners.

I teach it to saints that have the Holy Ghost and remission of sins via Acts 2:38.
 
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amadeus

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I don't preach the gifts of the Spirit to sinners.
Should we not teach or preach whatever God gives us to teach or preach? When I came to the Lord in 1976, they did teach me from and about Acts 2:38, but they also taught me to read the entirety of the Bible and to talk to and listen to God all of the time.

When a sheep hears God's voice, what should he do with what he hears?

Acts 2:38 may become one's "sugar stick", but our Director is the Holy Ghost...or not!


"O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem. 10:23
 

Truther

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Should we not teach or preach whatever God gives us to teach or preach? When I came to the Lord in 1976, they did teach me from and about Acts 2:38, but they also taught me to read the entirety of the Bible and to talk to and listen to God all of the time.

When a sheep hears God's voice, what should he do with what he hears?

Acts 2:38 may become one's "sugar stick", but our Director is the Holy Ghost...or not!


"O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem. 10:23
Should we not teach or preach whatever God gives us to teach or preach? When I came to the Lord in 1976, they did teach me from and about Acts 2:38, but they also taught me to read the entirety of the Bible and to talk to and listen to God all of the time.

When a sheep hears God's voice, what should he do with what he hears?

Acts 2:38 may become one's "sugar stick", but our Director is the Holy Ghost...or not!


"O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem. 10:23
Acts 2:38 is a "sugar stick"?

Was that Peter's "sugar stick" at Pentecost?

Can't you see what ALL INCLUSIVE, the anti-Acts 2:38 crowd has done to you?