The Word For Today

Ephesians 1

[sup]1[/sup] Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God,
To God’s holy people in Ephesus, the faithful in Christ Jesus:
[sup]2[/sup] Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Praise for Spiritual Blessings in Christ

[sup]3[/sup] Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ. [sup]4[/sup] For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love [sup]5[/sup] he predestined us for adoption to sonship through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will— [sup]6[/sup] to the praise of his glorious grace, which he has freely given us in the One he loves. [sup]7[/sup] In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, in accordance with the riches of God’s grace [sup]8[/sup] that he lavished on us. With all wisdom and understanding, [sup]9[/sup] he made known to us the mystery of his will according to his good pleasure, which he purposed in Christ, [sup]10[/sup] to be put into effect when the times reach their fulfillment—to bring unity to all things in heaven and on earth under Christ.
[sup]11[/sup] In him we were also chosen, having been predestined according to the plan of him who works out everything in conformity with the purpose of his will, [sup]12[/sup] in order that we, who were the first to put our hope in Christ, might be for the praise of his glory. [sup]13[/sup] And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, [sup]14[/sup] who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.

Thanksgiving and Prayer

[sup]15[/sup] For this reason, ever since I heard about your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all God’s people, [sup]16[/sup] I have not stopped giving thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers. [sup]17[/sup] I keep asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father, may give you the Spirit of wisdom and revelation, so that you may know him better. [sup]18[/sup] I pray that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in his holy people, [sup]19[/sup] and his incomparably great power for us who believe. That power is the same as the mighty strength [sup]20[/sup] he exerted when he raised Christ from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms, [sup]21[/sup] far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every name that is invoked, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. [sup]22[/sup] And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church, [sup]23[/sup] which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way

Galatians 3

Justification by Faith

[sup]1[/sup] O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you that you should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed among you as crucified? [sup]2[/sup] This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? [sup]3[/sup] Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh? [sup]4[/sup] Have you suffered so many things in vain—if indeed it was in vain?
[sup]5[/sup] Therefore He who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you, does He do it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?— [sup]6[/sup] just as Abraham “believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” [sup]7[/sup] Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham. [sup]8[/sup] And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” [sup]9[/sup] So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham.

The Law Brings a Curse

[sup]10[/sup] For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.” [sup]11[/sup] But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for “the just shall live by faith.” [sup]12[/sup] Yet the law is not of faith, but “the man who does them shall live by them.”
[sup]13[/sup] Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree” ), [sup]14[/sup] that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

The Changeless Promise

[sup]15[/sup] Brethren, I speak in the manner of men: Though it is only a man’s covenant, yet if it is confirmed, no one annuls or adds to it. [sup]16[/sup] Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, “And to seeds,” as of many, but as of one, “And to your Seed,”[sup][[/sup][sup]i[/sup][sup]][/sup]who is Christ. [sup]17[/sup] And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. [sup]18[/sup] For if the inheritance is of the law, it is no longer of promise; but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

Purpose of the Law

[sup]19[/sup] What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. [sup]20[/sup] Now a mediator does not mediate for one only, but God is one.
[sup]21[/sup] Is the law then against the promises of God? Certainly not! For if there had been a law given which could have given life, truly righteousness would have been by the law. [sup]22[/sup] But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. [sup]23[/sup] But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. [sup]24[/sup] Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. [sup]25[/sup] But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

Sons and Heirs

[sup]26[/sup] For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. [sup]27[/sup] For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. [sup]28[/sup] There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. [sup]29[/sup] And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Hi Prentis!

Thanks so much for posting this here... I am glad that you are willing to have a discussion on this subject. Bless you!

Only the scriptures also say many other things. Things like this 'to he who overcomes', 'he who endures to the end shall be saved', 'Children, I tell you this so that you would not sin, IF you sin...', 'if you walk by the Spirit, you will NOT fulfill the deeds of the flesh', 'I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me'. 'If you wish to be perfect, … follow me'.

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You are picking scripture out randomly dear brother without reading them in context...
"he who overcomes" Revelation 2:7, 11, 17, 26. Revelation 3:5, 12, 21. Speaks of the seven Churches, their good points and what needs to change, then it goes on to say that each Church will be blessed in a certain way if they overcome the situation at hand...

Revelation 21
[sup]7[/sup] He who overcomes shall inherit all things, and I will be his God and he shall be My son. [sup]8[/sup] But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”

This scripture is about enduring and persevering during tribulations that we Christians, may each face individually or in a corporate sense.

"he who endures to the end" [speaks of the twelve disciples who were sent out by Jesus to the lost sheep of Israel Matthew 10:1-23]

I could go through each scripture you have posted but I know that you understand what I am saying... :huh:

The disciples followed Jesus, and even after 3 years there were many things they did not understand. But because they were faithful with what they had, they were clean before God. But if they stopped following, would it of been so? There is only one way in which I have seen all those scriptures be true. It is that first; yes, we receive the free gift of 'salvation', we are saved from the corruption of this world and given new life. We are forgiven our past sins and Christ makes us alive in him. Only having received this, we must now persevere to the end of our lives. One promise we receive is that by him we are made free from the POWER (not only condemnation) of sin in this life, and it is said that by faith we take the promises. The scriptures all work together if indeed we must 'work out our salvation with fear and trembling'. Our heart and soul has been renewed, yes, but James says, speaking to brothers, 'persevere unto the saving (future) of the soul'. We must continue also in the renewing of the mind. Yes, if we are humble, God is faithful to erase our failures. But we must strive and use that gift we are given to the best of the ability that God gives us, seeking to understand how we may please him and do the works he prepared in advance. We all receive of the same seed, and by that we receive new life, but that same seed we must bring to fruitfulness. It only requires that we will be faithful with what we have. But it does require that. Paul says he does not even judge himself, though he knows of no sin against himself, but not considering to have attained, he presses on. To the disciples Jesus often said 'you little of faith' because they did not believe in his provision, but despaired. They were still disciples, and they followed him, there was no condemnation on them. But there was a purpose to their following him, that they would learn and become like him. We must bear fruit, otherwise, we will be cut off.

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My plea is that there is such a thing as being cut off for the Christian, the believer, and that we must indeed fear God, and work out our salvation in fear and trembling. As Paul admonishes us...

Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off.

With love and full of hope, in our Lord Jesus Christ,

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The fruit God speaks of in Galatians 5 are character fruit. This fruit is not built in us overnight because we have lived and practiced a certain lifestyle for a very long time and it takes practice to undo or unpractice it all with the help of the Holy Spirit. This is the process of sanctification...

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19[/sup] The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; [sup]20[/sup] idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions [sup]21[/sup] and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

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[sup]22[/sup] But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, [sup]23[/sup] gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. [sup]24[/sup] Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. [sup]25[/sup] Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. [sup]26[/sup] Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.

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Honey, you are talking about a process. This process has nothing to do with salvation...salvation is freely given. After we receive that free gift, we begin our journey with God with the help of the Holy Spirit which is another free gift God has given us through Jesus, our redeemer.

Whether you believe that we need to hold on to our salvation through endurance, striving or pressing through or whether you do not believe...does not change that fact that you are saved....and that is the most important thing.

It just means that those who feel that they need to keep their salvation are making it harder for themselves when all they need to do is believe... that's all

Much love and blessings to you dear brother!

Hi Prentis,

My apologies for not getting back to you straight away...I have been babysitting a liitle man while his mom has been unwell for the past week. I have to be diligent and keep an eye out otherwise my house could be turned up side down in minutes...lol! ^_^
Thank you for pursuing this particular subject...as someone has said already, because this is a salvation issue, it must be addressed correctly.

Thank you also for not just accepting what others say...and challenging their positions on this...we grow and learn by testing what others believe which in turn puts our own theories into the spot-light.

I do not take on-board what others tell me if it is a new concept to me either, rather I test it out for myself through the word. I will also like you to check out what I say through the word, If you are in any doubt about what I say. If in the end, we find ourselves in a position of a stale-mate...we will agree to disagree on this matter...

Here's the thing though, it says of the unfaithful servant that he is bound hand and foot, and cast out. It says we can be cut off.

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This would have been so much easier dear brother if you had quoted where your scriptures are found so that I know what verses you are talking about..however, I believe that you may be referring to the parable of the talents here...

The Parable of the Talents

14 “For the kingdom of heaven is like a man traveling to a far country, who called his own servants and delivered his goods to them. 15 And to one he gave five talents, to another two, and to another one, to each according to his own ability; and immediately he went on a journey. 16 Then he who had received the five talents went and traded with them, and made another five talents. 17 And likewise he who had received two gained two more also. 18 But he who had received one went and dug in the ground, and hid his lord’s money. 19 After a long time the lord of those servants came and settled accounts with them.
20 “So he who had received five talents came and brought five other talents, saying, ‘Lord, you delivered to me five talents; look, I have gained five more talents besides them.’ 21 His lord said to him, ‘Well done, good and faithful servant; you were faithful over a few things, I will make you ruler over many things. Enter into the joy of your lord.’ 22 He also who had received two talents came and said, ‘Lord, you delivered to me two talents; look, I have gained two more talents besides them.’ 23 His lord said to him, ‘Well done, good and faithful servant; you have been faithful over a few things, I will make you ruler over many things. Enter into the joy of your lord.’
24 “Then he who had received the one talent came and said, ‘Lord, I knew you to be a hard man, reaping where you have not sown, and gathering where you have not scattered seed. 25 And I was afraid, and went and hid your talent in the ground. Look, there you have what is yours.’
26 “But his lord answered and said to him, ‘You wicked and lazy servant, you knew that I reap where I have not sown, and gather where I have not scattered seed. 27 So you ought to have deposited my money with the bankers, and at my coming I would have received back my own with interest. 28 So take the talent from him, and give it to him who has ten talents.
29 ‘For to everyone who has, more will be given, and he will have abundance; but from him who does not have, even what he has will be taken away. 30 And cast the unprofitable servant into the outer darkness. There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

Our original discussion is about salvation...note in the parable of the talents that each person was given a certain amount of talents and those talents were multiplied. The person with the least talent however, did not multipy his talent and was cast into the outer darkness.
When a man is saved...he is saved from the penalty of sin, which is death. Salvation is based on that man's confession and belief. All of this is by faith.

The parable of the talents is not talking about salvation because salvation is not given in measurements. The person either believes what Jesus has done for them on the cross and receives that free gift of salvation or they do not.

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That man might be saved from destruction, but he lives eternally in shame. It is not a thing to take lightly then. Why would Paul advise us to 'work out your salvation in fear and trembling'?

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No-one has taken salvation lightly my dear...Let's take a look at Philippians 2: The scripture that you have quoted here... :huh:

12 Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; 13 for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure.
14 Do all things without complaining and disputing, 15 that you may become blameless and harmless, children of God without fault in the midst of a crooked and perverse generation, among whom you shine as lights in the world, 16 holding fast the word of life, so that I may rejoice in the day of Christ that I have not run in vain or labored in vain.

Paul says "work out our own salvation"....but he does not say that we need to work to keep it...the bible says:

Acts 4:12
Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to mankind by which we must be saved.”

Ephesians 1
13 And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, 14 who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.

1 Thessalonians 5:8-10
8 But let us who are of the day be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love, and as a helmet the hope of salvation. 9 For God did not appoint us to wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, 10 who died for us, that whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with Him.

15 But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God’s grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, overflow to the many! 16 Nor can the gift of God be compared with the result of one man’s sin: The judgment followed one sin and brought condemnation, but the gift followed many trespasses and brought justification. 17 For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God’s abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ!

18 Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people, so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people. 19 For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.

20 The law was brought in so that the trespass might increase. But where sin increased, grace increased all the more, 21 so that, just as sin reigned in death, so also grace might reign through righteousness to bring eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Romans 11

[sup]29[/sup] For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.

We know that we have been saved by grace through faith Ephesians 2:8...so what is Paul actually talking about here....

Hebrews 9
24 For Christ did not enter a sanctuary made with human hands that was only a copy of the true one; he entered heaven itself, now to appear for us in God’s presence. 25 Nor did he enter heaven to offer himself again and again, the way the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood that is not his own. 26 Otherwise Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But he has appeared once for all at the culmination of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself. 27 Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, 28 so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.

Salvation is the beginning of our walk with Jesus by faith. The book of Hebrews, says that he will come again to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him. I believe that Paul is speaking with the end of our hope in Jesus, in mind..."Eternal Life"
When Jesus comes again, whether we are alive or sleep [1 Thessalonians 5:8-10].

Salvation is the beginning and it is free. It is neither earned nor can we keep it through striving...we keep it by believing and recieving by faith...but this is not the end of our hope here on this earth...it continues on-ward until Jesus comes again. The next part of the salvation process is getting your life right with God. We do this with the help of the Holy Spirit. This part of our salvation is the sanctification part where we are helped by the HS. The last part of our salvation is when Jesus comes again "to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him" as Hebrews 9 states...

Paul says in Philippians 3: 12 Not that I have already attained, or am already perfected; but I press on, that I may lay hold of that for which Christ Jesus has also laid hold of me. 13 Brethren, I do not count myself to have apprehended; but one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind and reaching forward to those things which are ahead, 14 I press toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.
15 Therefore let us, as many as are mature, have this mind; and if in anything you think otherwise, God will reveal even this to you. 16 Nevertheless, to the degree that we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us be of the same mind.

He speaks again of not attaining perfection quite yet, but presses on toward the upward call in Jesus...the end result of our hope...which is salvation in it's fullness [Hebrews 9:28]

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I find it baffling that all those scriptures are simply taken and downplayed as though it really wasn't that bad or important. The new testament is so full of warnings, that we must bear fruit... That we must abide... That we must run the race... And that if we do not, we will be cut off and cast out!

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The fruit the bible is speaking of here, is again "Character Fruit" personal character changes in our lives that reflect the changes in our heart. From that of the world, to that of Christ Jesus the great shepherd of the sheep.

Luke 3:8
Produce fruit in keeping with repentance. And do not begin to say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ For I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham.

Colossians 1:9-11
9 For this reason, since the day we heard about you, we have not stopped praying for you. We continually ask God to fill you with the knowledge of his will through all the wisdom and understanding that the Spirit gives 10 so that you may live a life worthy of the Lord and please him in every way: bearing fruit in every good work, growing in the knowledge of God, 11 being strengthened with all power according to his glorious might so that you may have great endurance and patience,

Matthew 7
15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. 16 You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? 17 Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them.

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The doctrine of which says we will share in God's glory eternally whether unfaithful or faithful with what he has given us is not in scripture. Scripture always warns us with 'if'. 'If you continue in his goodness'.

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The bible says that without faith it is impossible to please God. [Hebrews 11:6]

He also says that when we are faithless, he remains faithful because he cannot deny himself. [2 Timothy 2:13]

unfaithfulness is not the same as being faithless.... But you are again referring to the "Parable of the Talents" which has nothing to do with salvation as I have explained above.

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re you believe these things with no ill intentions, of what I have seen of you, you are most loving, gentle and patient, an example to others and myself. Only doctrinally speaking, I find this to be a doctrine propagated by 'schools of theology' and church institutions, which sadly, are run by money, rather than freedom in Christ.

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I believe that salvation is a free gift of God and that all we need to do is believe and recieve this free gift by faith. I also believe that this is only the beginning and God takes us through a process whereby we are molded and conformed into Christs image by the aide of the Holy Spirit. This belief comes from reading the bible and revelation from the Holy Spirit. I do not take on-board, any teaching unless I have tested it by the word of God and got revelation of it myself from the Holy Spirit.

Much love and blessings to you my dear brother in Jesus!

Btw: you are the first person, I have ever encountered that believes the way you do regarding salvation, in the thirty odd years as a born-again believer...

Bless you!

I understand what you are telling me. Only I see that scriptures always provides an 'if', 'if you endure', 'if you overcome', 'if you continue in faithfulness'. And commands 'you ought to walk as he walked', etc.

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You are correct...the "ifs" in salvation are this "If you confess" and "believe" but you are saying that we have to strive to keep it... but salvation is received by faith..."Believing and receiving. Nothing more...

Man receives grace when he first come to Christ, and I do believe that at any genuine conversion, a mans sins are washed away, because he begins a new life in Christ Jesus. But what he does with taht grace and that new life matters. 'If you deny me before men (this could be in deed or in word), I will deny you before the Father'. We must live worthy (there are also many scriptures on this), we must be fruitful.

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Again you are not referring to the initial free gift but to our walk with Jesus...they are two separate things but are part of our salvation walk...and fruitfulness or the "Fruit of the Spirit" are fruit that we bare in our own lives [character fruit] as we are transformed daily from the image of those who live in the world [the life we use to live], into the image of our heavenly Father..

If indeed whoever receives much, much is expected of him, then more is expected of the Christian than the one who has never received grace, the Spirit, and new life in Christ. We have a run to race that is set before us... I believe that if the servant is slack, he will be rejected. Otherwise God is choosing favorites, doing a lottery of 'pardons'.

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If I, for instance have been given a gift of discernment and know that a brother or sister is walking in a way that will cause them or others to fall...then I have a responsibility to either pray or speak to that person according to the leading of the Holy Spirit. This is also part of receiving much...I do not believe that it has to do with unbelievers but rather believers...as God has given various gifts to believers...some may have the gift of helps or guidance while others, healing and miracles. God is not a respecter of persons but he does know the plans he has for each believer and imparts his gifts accordingly..

Believing without works does nothing, because if one truly believes, he will obey.

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When I first became a believer...I believed the word about Jesus [faith] then I received that word by faith [action/works]
I could not just believe and leave it at that...the bible says that even the demons believe that God is one and they tremble [James 2:19] If demons believe things about the God's word then faith [in this sense] must be accompanied then by action, which is receiving that word of truth into your heart by faith...that is how I see it... ^_^
Believing and receiving is faith and action [works]. I believed, therefore I acted upon my belief by receiving [that word which brings salvation] by faith.

But I already know the answer, I think we are just repeating the same things to each other. Also, I do not in any way believe that 'having these beliefs' is a matter of salvation. Man is not saved by some mere knowledge, that would be gnosticism, but man is saved because he obeys God, and does what is right before him. Only if we wish to advance in Christ, I do believe this matter is primordial.

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I do not know what gnosticism is honey...I just read the word of God and get revelation of the word through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit... :huh:

Only if we wish to advance in Christ, I do believe this matter is primordial.

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Bless you dear brother .. I have been a Sunday School teacher and a Bible in Schools teacher. I have preached in my own country and overseas. I have had the privilege of being a part of a healing ministry, Counseling and Deliverance Ministry, Street Evangelism Ministry, Youth Ministry and have led Worship and Prayer Teams and much more...

I have also had the privilege of leading over 800 people to the cross of Jesus in my walk with him [that I officially know of]
I host my own Christian Radio program at the moment along with a whole lot of other things...and I give "All Praise and Glory to God"

All of these doors have opened for me because I believe his word and walk in it. I am not perfect but I press onward, not trying to hold on to what I have been freely given but to bless those who have nothing by giving what I do have...which is words of the hope I have in Jesus [the salvation message] and eternal life.

I believe I have been advancing the Kingdom in Jesus according to his will and perfect plan for my life

Bless you my dear brother...and much love...stale-mate it is...