The Assyrian Anti-christ
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You are very mistaken to make these blanket statements about angels as you do with Satan. I assume you are refering to Gen. 18:2. That word for men in Gen. 18:2 is clearly mortal man. Angels can appear as mortal men but it doen't mean that they are! Angels can appear as whatever they want within God's Will.
1) man, mortal man, person, mankind
a) of an individual
B) men (collective)
c) man, mankind
http://www.bluelette...ongs=H582&t=KJV
There are a host of glitches on the reply options of the forum. Why can't I get rd of the smiley face?
You're very wrong when you say I don't cover the spiritual sense in God's Word.
All of God's Holy Writ is to be taken literally unless it is specifically giving an analogy or metaphor example in parable form. And even then, the meaning of the analogies, metaphors, and parables always... apply to literal Truth. When God gives a parable or analogy of symbolic metaphor, it's for the purpose of teaching us to make the Message easier to understand, not more difficult like mystic type interpretations do.
The problem with those who wrongly try to apply mysticism to God's Word is with their taking Scripture that's meant literally and applying some foreign mystical interpretation and then calling it spiritual. Because of doing that those often totally miss which parts of God's Word are meant as symbolic metaphor, and which parts are meant literally. That kind of mystical interpretation thing is a game by Satan's host to confuse many away from God's Truth in His Word. How we know doing that kind of thing is a game is by the many examples in God's Word that often tells us... a parable is being given, and then the literal explanation follows it.
Isaiah 14 is historically about the king of Babylon, AND ALSO METAPHORICALLY ABOUT SATAN. That's why God includes the sin that Satan first did in coveting God's Throne. No way to get around that.
It is ALSO a prophetic blueprint for the end times.
Isa 14:4-15
4 That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!
What's a "proverb"? It's a PARABLE. So right off the bat we were supposed to understand God is speaking a parable here, which contains greater meaning than just historical.
5 The LORD hath broken the staff of the wicked, and the sceptre of the rulers.
God indeed did that to Jerusalem when He brought the king of Babylon (Nebuchadnezzar) upon them. But is this in the historical sense only? We'll know in a minute...
6 He who smote the people in wrath with a continual stroke, he that ruled the nations in anger, is persecuted, and none hindereth.
Now wait a minute; God is now talking about something else, because we know the king of Babylon wasn't persecuted yet, nor did God smite him with that continual stroke just yet. Must also be about someone else He's pointing metaphorically to...
7 The whole earth is at rest, and is quiet: they break forth into singing.
Now we definitely know this was not history. The whole earth being at rest and breaking forth into singing are Salvation symbols, the time of Christ's future Kingdom on earth that is still future to us even. God is moving way forward in time with that, and then with the previous 5-6 verses, we know those are meant for this same time when God will break the staff of the wicked, completely.
8 Yea, the fir trees rejoice at thee, and the cedars of Lebanon, saying, "Since thou art laid down, no feller is come up against us."
Uh, oh. God is doing this metaphor thing again with those symbols. What and where is He pointing to in His Word? One of the Scriptures He's pointing to is Ezekiel 31 with the parable He gave about Pharaoh and the Assyria, using the high cedar analogy which is symbolic of royalty. In Ezek.31, God eventually declares the one He spoke of there as once having been in His Garden of Eden. And we KNOW FOR SURE, no flesh Pharaoh or king of Assyria was EVER in God's Garden of Eden. It's just not... that difficult to figure out who our Heavenly Father is including in this "proverb" of Isaiah 14. It's Satan himself He's including in all this. So this 8th verse fits along with the previous verses so far, which are of a future time when Christ comes to subdue the wicked with de facto Kingdom and reign established upon this earth. And where is Satan going to be then during that "thousand years" per Rev.20? Wait a minute...
9 Hell from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming: it stirreth up the dead for thee, even all the chief ones of the earth; it hath raised up from their thrones all the kings of the nations.
10 All they shall speak and say unto thee, "Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us?"
11 Thy pomp is brought down to the grave, and the noise of thy viols: the worm is spread under thee, and the worms cover thee.
Hell is moved to meet him? The dead are stirred up for him? even all the chief ones of the earth? And those will even say to him in that time to meet him, "Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us?" Those verses are also of that future time of Christ's future Millennium reign. Those in the pit will look upon this one and say those things to him, wondering just how it is that he became as weak as them. Where do you think that will take place, and who's it really about? Wait a minute...
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
There is NO doubt God is speaking this specifically about the cherub named Satan that rebelled against Him in coveting His Throne in the beginning. Even without the word "Lucifer", there's plenty enough given in that verse that can ONLY point to Satan himself! No flesh king had ever "fallen from heaven", nor has that "son of the morning" title, or the 'morning star' (Hebrew heylel) title ever apply to any flesh king, but to Satan ONLY in his attempt to usurp God's Throne and Place.
Now listen to what God tells us that cherub Satan once said against Him...
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, "I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High."
That's God telling us what Satan said he would do. That's specifically what caused Satan's original fall from heaven. He coveted God's Throne and sides of the north for himself, and even said he would be... "like the most High"!
And how does our Heavenly Father respond to what Satan said?
15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
(KJV)
Now we know just how God meant those previous Isaiah 14 verses covered above; it's about hell and the chief ones in it meeting him when he is locked in the pit at Christ's second coming! That's when Satan is going to be locked in chains in that pit during Christ's future Millennium reign.
Because YOU have totally missed all this, it shows your determination to listen to the doctrines of men about this instead.
Since the meaning of the Archangel Gabriel's name is... 'man'... of God, what kind of likeness image do you think he has?
No, the image of the angels is not one that does some kind of shape-shifting mystic Indian idea. Their image is the image of man just as ours is. That's why God's Word reveals they appeared on earth to His servants with that image of man.
Mark 16:5-6
5 And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they were affrighted.
6 And he saith unto them, "Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of Nazareth, Which was crucified: He is risen; He is not here: behold the place where they laid Him."
(KJV)
Only I do not see in any way that this scripture is applied to the US.
The USA, looking at the way it is, is not righteous. Nations are corrupt, they work by power. The US is no exception.
God bless you
You don't see the Romans 13 Scripture by Paul as applied to the U.S.?
Might want to get into all... of God's Word to get understanding, instead of just the few parts that you dwell upon. The LORD is still... in control, and He already told us His Plan for things to happen in this world.
Nothing wrong with wanting to dwell on the blessed hope that our Lord Jesus Christ has promised us in His Kingdom to come. But those promises involve especially the world to come, and not this present world.
I used to think like you before I came to Christ Jesus. I couldn't understand why the peoples of the world wouldn't want to seek peace and brotherhood together, and that we could actually make this present world more conformed to our Lord Jesus' example if we only tried.
Then I got into all of God's Word and reality hit. Our Heavenly Father and His Son have NO... intentions of allowing this present world to become a replacement for His coming Kingdom and Reign. Yet He is allowing the peoples and nations who refuse Him to think... that they CAN do Salvation without Him. Not only that, because the world refused Him, He's going to send them a 'saviour' they will believe on instead of Him, and that saviour will be one to cause them to be snared, fall backward, and be taken.
God has much to say in His Word pointing to the Christian West today. The nation of Canada is included in that, under authority of Ephraim. When Israel during the OT times fell away from Him, He punished the nation, but not all peoples in it. He preserved a faithful remnant then, just as He has today, and will also in the future trials. And God Himself is Who has established the nations of today. So if you go too far in trying to separate today's purpose of the nations in His Plan, you actually separate your understanding from those parts of His Word where He declared these things.
You don't have a reliable or sensible hermeneutic. I know your going to bounce around trying to debunk the Assyrian anti-christ. I'm ready for the challenge.
You said,
I don't like that you're accusing me of applying mysticism to God's Word. And I don't like you saying that I'm playing Satans game!
You're going to tee me off and end up on ignore if you keep it up. You're not a punk so don't act like one!
You are not applying common sense in interpreting God's Word. i.e. a good hermeneutic. Do you know what a hermeneutic is???
You're becoming like Popeye and the Scribbler. When you're theory is debunked and you're backed into a corner that's when the unappropiate comments come out so just stop it!
Isaiah 28:9 ¶Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breast.
10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:
11 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.
12 To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear.
13 But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken.
Veteran said,
About what king of Babylon???
God included Satan's sin of pride and his fall to compare it to the Assyrian anti-christ who is also called the "king of Babylon." You're trying to get around that. The center of attention in chapter 14 isn't Satan. It is The Assyrian and his fall otherwise known as the king of Babylon, Israel, and the Millennium. The Assyrian is simply compared to Satan.
You also quote,
Gesenius says that a proverb "consist in the ingenious comparison of two things or opinions."
Read about it here...
http://www.bluelette...ngs=H4912&t=KJV
This "proverb' compares the pride and fall of the Assyrian anti-christ to the pride and fall of Satan. Your fabrications are failing!
This king of Babylon is Nebuchadnezzar. But nebuchadnezzar was killed in Iraq ......... This Assyrian was destroyed in Israel and, "not by human hands"!!
Nebuchadnezzar died in Babylon. His age was somewhere between 68 and 84. He either died of old age or disease or at the hands of one of his wives Amystis. I'll explain later how Nebuchadnezzar, i.e. the Assyrian will die in Israel.
Now we know just how God meant those previous Isaiah 14 verses covered above; it's about hell and the chief ones in it meeting him when he is locked in the pit at Christ's second coming! That's when Satan is going to be locked in chains in that pit during Christ's future Millennium reign.
Doctrines of men???
I'm not missing anything. Your the one missing the context of the chapter. You refuse to see the Assyrian anti-christ. i.e. The king of Babylon, his comparison to Satan, the Millenium, and the "yoke that is removed from Israel,"
You refuse to see how the Assyrian is destroyed in Israel! NOT IN IRAQ where Nebuchadnezzar was destroyed!
Isaiah 14:24 ¶The LORD of hosts hath sworn, saying, Surely as I have thought, so shall it come to pass; and as I have purposed, so shall it stand:
25 That I will break the Assyrian in my land, and upon my mountains tread him under foot: then shall his yoke depart from off them, and his burden depart from off their shoulders.
26 This is the purpose that is purposed upon the whole earth: and this is the hand that is stretched out upon all the nations.
About what king of Babylon???
God included Satan's sin of pride and his fall to compare it to the Assyrian anti-christ who is also called the "king of Babylon." You're trying to get around that. The center of attention in chapter 14 isn't Satan. It is The Assyrian and his fall otherwise known as the king of Babylon, Israel, and the Millennium. The Assyrian is simply compared to Satan.
You also quote,
Gesenius says that a proverb "consist in the ingenious comparison of two things or opinions."
Read about it here...
http://www.bluelette...ngs=H4912&t=KJV
This "proverb' compares the pride and fall of the Assyrian anti-christ to the pride and fall of Satan. Your fabrications are failing!
This king of Babylon is Nebuchadnezzar. But nebuchadnezzar was killed in Iraq ......... This Assyrian was destroyed in Israel and, "not by human hands"!!
Nebuchadnezzar died in Babylon. His age was somewhere between 68 and 84. He either died of old age or disease or at the hands of one of his wives Amystis. I'll explain later how Nebuchadnezzar, i.e. the Assyrian will die in Israel.
Now we know just how God meant those previous Isaiah 14 verses covered above; it's about hell and the chief ones in it meeting him when he is locked in the pit at Christ's second coming! That's when Satan is going to be locked in chains in that pit during Christ's future Millennium reign.
Doctrines of men???
I'm not missing anything. Your the one missing the context of the chapter. You refuse to see the Assyrian anti-christ. i.e. The king of Babylon, his comparison to Satan, the Millenium, and the "yoke that is removed from Israel,"
You refuse to see how the Assyrian is destroyed in Israel! NOT IN IRAQ where Nebuchadnezzar was destroyed!
Isaiah 14:24 ¶The LORD of hosts hath sworn, saying, Surely as I have thought, so shall it come to pass; and as I have purposed, so shall it stand:
25 That I will break the Assyrian in my land, and upon my mountains tread him under foot: then shall his yoke depart from off them, and his burden depart from off their shoulders.
26 This is the purpose that is purposed upon the whole earth: and this is the hand that is stretched out upon all the nations.
With all the false doctrines of orthodox Jews that you have, and your false preaching about Saddam, all to try and point away.... from today's Jerusalem, it has to mean YOU are the one that's into 'replacement theology'! Just why else... would you continually keep trying to point AWAY... FROM JERUSALEM otherwise? It's because you believe in the GLOBALIST'S PLANS for today's Jerusalem as the HARLOT CITY.
Do you REALLY think your people can set up a fake copy of Christ's future Milennium Kingdom in Jerusalem today? Christ Jesus is going to strike it down, that's guaranteed!!!
(For others wondering about this term 'replacement theology', it's about some Christian doctrines of men that think that Christ's Church has 'replaced' God's nation of Israel, but in reality the Biblical view is that believers of the seed of Israel actually became Christ's Church per The New Covenant, with many believing Gentiles graffed in with them).
All I did is tell you some facts about Saddam and how he believed he was the re-incarnation of Nebuchadnezzar and similarities to him..
You have fallen for the false teachings of the big shot prophecy experts. A unified global religion, a global mark of thr beast, a global anti-christ dictator, etc.
About the only thing you have right is the rapture!
God help you come out of denial!
In the end we will see who had the most false teaching.
My advice to you, and I'm serious, is to quit listening to Jewish teaching about end time prophecy. That's something they are very... confused about today, and blinded to. And it's probably because of their long-awaited hope for Jerusalem. Well, a little longer wait is needed, because the world globalists DO EXIST today, and they DO have PLANS for TODAY'S JERUSALEM. Christ's Revelation CONFIRMS it too!!!
Here you go TELLING ME what I'm doing. I'm not listening to any Jewish teaching about the end. Your presumptions are wrong. All of my beliefs come from my own personnal study and nothing else. I have more study books than you probably have hair! I can tell that you have yet to put as much time into study as I do. What you're talking about is people enabling self fulfilled prophecy!
My advice to you is to accept God's word for what it is. You make these blanket statements like you do about Satan in Isaiah 14 and say the entire chapter is about Satan.
When you tried to tell me Isaiah 14 is a 'parable' about Satan, you probably didn't even know that a proverb is a comparisson of two things. Isaiah 14 compares Satans pride and fall with the Assyrian pride and fall. He is also called the king of Babylon.
You think the word all always means all, and the word place always means place. If that were true.
There wouldn't be about 130 words for all and about 200 for place! http://www.eliyah.co...n&isindex=place
http://www.eliyah.co...n&isindex=place
Stop assuming where I get my information from. You're becoming like Popeye and the Scribbler.
Probably right about the hair, I don't have much left.
Never said all the Isaiah 14 chapter was only about Satan. That's you're take, and as a matter of fact, you're the one who said it had nothing to do with Satan if I recall right.
Look up that KJV word "proverb" in that section of Isa.14, same word as "parable" in Num.23. Anyway, what do you think a parable is, if not a comparison of two things? Need more sleep maybe?
You can bet that word "all" in the Rev.13:7-8 verses does mean... all, the whole...
Rev 13:7-8
7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
(KJV)
That power over ALL kindreds, and tongues, and nations, is about the coming "one world government" beast system you don't see being setup over all the earth today.
Doesn't matter HOW you got your denial of those Rev.13:7-8 verses meaning ALL, or your denial that world globalists are at work today to setup the 1st beast kingdom system over all the earth which Christ warned us of. The unbelieving Jews who still refuse Christ Jesus don't believe it either, which is why they plan to build another temple and start up the old sacrifices again in prep for false messiah's coming.
In our near future, orthodox Jews in Jerusalem and Islam are going to be working together for the false messiah. What will you do then with still wanting to point to the geographical city of Babylon, when the real Babylon harlot is going to be setup at Jerusalem?
Only I do not see in any way that this scripture is applied to the US.
The USA, looking at the way it is, is not righteous. Nations are corrupt, they work by power. The US is no exception.
God bless you
Hey Prentis,
Just because you may not know laminar airflow characteristics, it doesn't man the aircraft can't fly.
The fact remains, that GOD does not hold the U.S. in the same disrepute that you apparently do. (Please be aware the GOD certainly would not be happy with all the sin in this nation, and he indicates our decline in Revelation 17.) But to maintain a fully perspective, one must be cognizant of ~all~ contributors.
BibleScribe
Prentis
New Member
Americans are NOT God's people 
That would require to throw out the whole new covenant which is according to the Spirit, not the flesh.
That would require to throw out the whole new covenant which is according to the Spirit, not the flesh.
Americans are NOT God's people
...
Hi Prentis,
If what you assert is true, then GOD would not have spent an entire Chapter on the virtues of this nation, and also directly cited that nation in four other Chapters. -- Did you think that GOD was some distant entity too distracted and too removed from the affairs of HIS creation?
BibleScribe
Hey Prentis,
One other consideration, -- if all Christians were under the same envelope of Christ's covering, then the U.S. wouldn't have religious freedom and muslim nations would have Christian persecution, -- we'd all be the same. But each of us live in our own respective nation and have our own peculiar circumstances.
So if one were Jewish, they might be well advised to prepare to evacuate their homes and communities within the next 12-18 months. If one were Russian, they might be well advised to prepare for internal dissent in the next one to three years. And the others might be well advised to prepare for global thermonuclear war within the next six to seven years.
But to simply suggest that because you are one of GOD's children that you are independent of international circumstances would be naive.
BibleScribe
One other consideration, -- if all Christians were under the same envelope of Christ's covering, then the U.S. wouldn't have religious freedom and muslim nations would have Christian persecution, -- we'd all be the same. But each of us live in our own respective nation and have our own peculiar circumstances.
So if one were Jewish, they might be well advised to prepare to evacuate their homes and communities within the next 12-18 months. If one were Russian, they might be well advised to prepare for internal dissent in the next one to three years. And the others might be well advised to prepare for global thermonuclear war within the next six to seven years.
But to simply suggest that because you are one of GOD's children that you are independent of international circumstances would be naive.
BibleScribe
Prentis
New Member
:blink:
It would take a great misunderstanding of the new testament to somehow consider God's plan was to make another fleshly nation for himself. It would also take a great misunderstanding of history to somehow think America was founded according to Christ's ways. In his name? Sure. His name on the lips and a sword in the hand, with chains ready for the captives.
Christ has made all those who would be in Him to be a 'peculiar people, a nation of priests'.
The devil rules over all the kingdoms of the earth, and God rules over the kingdom of heaven. America is the antithesis of Christianity; mighty in the flesh, self-serving...
Now you're going to say I hate America.
I don't. Earthly power corrupts, as it is all in the faithless ways of the devil, according to Mammon (money), Lording it over others, etc. No nation or earthly organization is exempt from this. That includes the 'church' when she seeks to be recognized as an earthly organization.
God works according to the Spirit, and his kingdom is not of this world. These are of the most basic truths, and I am stunned you would not know this.
It would take a great misunderstanding of the new testament to somehow consider God's plan was to make another fleshly nation for himself. It would also take a great misunderstanding of history to somehow think America was founded according to Christ's ways. In his name? Sure. His name on the lips and a sword in the hand, with chains ready for the captives.
Christ has made all those who would be in Him to be a 'peculiar people, a nation of priests'.
The devil rules over all the kingdoms of the earth, and God rules over the kingdom of heaven. America is the antithesis of Christianity; mighty in the flesh, self-serving...
Now you're going to say I hate America.
I don't. Earthly power corrupts, as it is all in the faithless ways of the devil, according to Mammon (money), Lording it over others, etc. No nation or earthly organization is exempt from this. That includes the 'church' when she seeks to be recognized as an earthly organization.
God works according to the Spirit, and his kingdom is not of this world. These are of the most basic truths, and I am stunned you would not know this.
The word all in Rev 13:8 means individually. If all, whole, or completely was to be meant, John would have used 'holos' and not 'pas.' I see that I'm going to have to give you examples how the word 'pas' is used compared to the word 'holos.' There are hundreds of examples of this but doubt you'll accept it.
Matthew 2:3 When Herod the king had heard these things, he was troubled, and all (pas 'individually') Jerusalem with him.
I seriously doubt that all the people of Jerusalem were troubled.
Matthew 3:5 Then went out to him Jerusalem, and all Judaea, and all the region round about Jordan,
6 And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins.
Here both words are 'pas.' All people from Jerusalem, Judea and the region around Jordan did not get baptized by John.
Matthew 4:24 And his fame went throughout all (holos) Syria: and they brought unto him all (pas) sick people that were taken with divers diseases and torments, and those which were possessed with devils, and those which were lunatick, and those that had the palsy; and he healed them.
Famine did go throughout Syria. That's the word 'holos' the one that is not used in Revelation 13:7-8
The second word all (pas) in the verse referencing to sick people is the one used in Rev. 13:7-8 That's because not all the sick people from Syria were brought unto Christ.
Matthew 8:16 When the even was come, they brought unto him many that were possessed with devils: and he cast out the spirits with his word, and healed all that were sick: The way the word all (pas) is used here is very similar to Rev. 13-7-8. It's not all the people of the world that were healed, only the ones that were brought to Christ!
In Rev 13 not all the "kindreds, and tongues, and nations" of the world will worship him. Only those that he had power given him over! NOT THE ENTIRE WORLD!
If the word 'holos' was used then I would agree with you. But it is not!
Matthew 12:23 And all the people were amazed, and said, Is not this the son of David?
All the people of the world were not amazed.
Matthew 14:35 And when the men of that place had knowledge of him, they sent out into all (holos) that country round about, and brought unto him all (pas) that were diseased; Same thing here. The were sent out into the entire country but I seriously doubt that all the diseased people were brought to Christ. I'm sure they didn't find them all or that all of them wanted to go or believed that they could be healed!
Matthew 21:10 And when he was come into Jerusalem, all the city was moved, saying, Who is this?
I doubt that every person in the city was moved!
I really doubt that you will ever change your mind about this because it debunks your globalist theory!
I said,
You said,
This is what you are quoted as saying,
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