This really grabbed me today!
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Johann
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Lambano
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Johann
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Too many heteros answers, starting from Aristotle, what is a "name?"
Characteristics and nature, not so?
Oh…you were trying to negate the trinity because you think it will prove Jesus wasn’t God. I do at least understand that now! What Lambano said made me able to at least tenuously grasp it and I could probably now…ah, no, I still can’t, because while I believe Jesus grew in a womb and became a human, and took on a body of humility, I do not believe He had the fallen nature we do through inheritance, since our parents were made to bring forth of their own kind. So I already believe His nature was - oh, wait…you aren’t trying to prove Jesus had a fallen human nature, you’re trying to prove He didn’t have Gods nature but had His characteristics. But I don’t see a trinity anyways and… Ah, yeah, I still can’t understand what you were trying to say by your question and I can’t spend any more time on it. I CAN, with effort, still make my mind work as it used to, I just don’t WANT to. It’s like the difference between an old crank handle can opener and an electric one. I CAN still use the crank one, but I don’t WANT to.
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Thank you for that. BTW, Christ is High priest and King and Intercessor and God. We have a detailed study on the investigative Judgement (Christ in the Sanctuary) and believe that the earthly model sanctuary was a type of the Heavenly One, with Christ having been the Sacrifice. Very interesting
Christ's Ministry in the Heavenly Sanctuary | White Throne Ministries
(I have no clue how you got EG WHite as high priestess.) There is only one Intercessor, Christ Jesus. Ellen White is dead.
Lambano
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Aristotle might be a good place to start, since the Nicene fathers expressed the doctrine of the Trinity as three όστασες (hupostases or persons), same ουσία (substance or essence), terms Aristotle would recognize. Though he might have used the terms synonymously, or nearly so, whereas we Christians have included μορφή (form) in our definition.
Brakelite
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I think there's a fairly good reason for form being included... Created I'm the image of God, and Christ bring the express image. I see no reason to assume shape or form would differ that much. Good does have a shape... Jesus said He knows it having been with the Father.
Johann
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You and I are resorting to circular reasoning Lambano, I think Origen said-In order to understand our bibles we are forced to turn to the Jews for answers-please check this out.
In conclusion, I would say Robertson and Vincent is a good resource to have in the library, and also the complete Jewish Encyclopedia.
Thanks for your time.
J.
Lambano
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I'm kinda agreeing with you that "form", being a "characteristic", should be considered in defining "nature". Then when we say "Christ has two nature", we mean He can only have one at a time. Is His "mind" part of His nature, or the same independent of His current form?
face2face
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Except that you have FALSIFIED what Peter said, since Jesus Christ is the Creator. The one true God is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
Johann
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Joh 10:30 I and my Father [WE ARE] are one.
Noticed the Plural?
Cross-reference this with the "Let us" accounts recorded in scripture in Genesis you have to stop and think carefully.
J.
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I looked up my translation. It says, 3 All praise to God, the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
God WAS His father when He took on a human body.
That doesn’t delete: and He WAS God.
That doesn’t delete: If you’ve seen Me, you HAVE seen the Father.
One verse does not cancel out another verse.
I looked up my translation. It says, 3 All praise to God, the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
God WAS His father when He took on a human body.
That doesn’t delete: and He WAS God.
That doesn’t delete: If you’ve seen Me, you HAVE seen the Father.
One verse does not cancel out another verse.
Johann
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1d) the sum of innate properties and powers by which one person differs from others, distinctive native peculiarities, natural characteristics: the natural strength, ferocity, and intractability of beasts.
J.
face2face
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The point being made Stunned is Jesus has a God - God doesn't have a God!
Again here:
Ephesians 1:3 Blessed is the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly realms in Christ.
Just aligning my faith with the Apostles and not creeds of men.
face2face
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You mean the Logos he became is the Creator. The messiah is a spiritual creation in himself (firstborn) like all those he represents.
Johann
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Johann
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You are veering further and further into a wrong derek, there is a way that seems right in the eyes of man...
What you typed here is pure nonsense.
J.
For God to make Himself nothing and take a human body, this is how this can be said that Jesus had a Father and a God. In His earthly life, He DID. It does not cancel out other verses. There’s a ditch on both sides of a road. To not fall into a ditch, you have to start with the sure premise that BOTH verses are true.
Surely you have seen it’s what happens that men argue scripture AGAINST other scripture.
Haven’t you seen men in both ditches, having gone overboard into one or the other?
I mean, pick an argument OTHER than this one. Surely you’ve seen it, right?
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