What happens to the SINNING : Christian

Michiah-Imla · Aug 6, 2022

Behold said:
And here is my LIST, of Self Saving, Legalism, Christ rejecting Requirements.

1. Water Baptism
2. Enduring to the end
3. Abiding
4. Holding unto my faith
5. confessing all my daily sinning
6. Commandment and Law keeping
7.) AND = Whatever else i can think of that I HAVE TO DO to TRY TO STAY SAVED.

You teach against biblical teachings; this is ANARCHISM and Bible rejection your are promoting.

What a sham!

Just to point out one of his errors:

@Behold says that “enduring to the end” is to reject Christ!

THOSE ARE CHRIST’S VERY WORDS!

So to obey Christ = Rejection of Christ in @Behold ’s mind. Try and wrap your head around that crazy statement.

This absolutely insane that ANYONE listens to you over the Bible.

Behold · Aug 6, 2022

Michiah-Imla said:
You teach against biblical teachings; this is ANARCHISM and Bible rejection your are promoting.
.

You dont see it yet.
You dont realize what im showing you = is Paul's Gospel that he teaches as "My Gospel".
See that?
That is the Gospel of Grace. And that Gospel precludes all works of any kinds that you can do.. to try to be accepted by God.

So my LIST.... you read it, but you dont understand what im showing you, regarding that list, and that is because you are trying to keep that list so that you don't go to hell.
And why are you doing that?
Its because you DO NO TRUST IN CHRIST to Keep you saved., and THAT is the mind of the person who has "fallen from Grace", if they are actually born again.
And, its the absolute mind of a religious but lost FAKIR, who is water baptized, but not born again.

Listen....All legalist's, have a SELF SAVING list of : "i must do this, and I must not do that'....that they follow and regard as their means of trying to be saved or stay saved.
That is why my list is your Faith, Michiah Imla.

Michiah-Imla · Aug 6, 2022

Behold said:
you are trying to keep that list so that you don't go to hell.

No, I’m doing it to stop sinning! An alien concept to you!

“Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness? But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.” (Romans 6:16-17)

“See that?”

Behold said:
And why are you doing that?
Its because you DO NO TRUST IN CHRIST to Keep you saved., and THAT is the mind of the person who has "fallen from Grace"

You are biblically deficient.

You guys frequently use the “fallen from grace” scripture erroneously.

Here’s the CONTEXT in which Paul used the term:

“Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.” (Galatians 4:10)

“Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.” (Galatians 5:2)

I don’t see any of your items biblically associated with being fallen from grace.

1. Water Baptism
2. Enduring to the end
3. Abiding
4. Holding unto my faith
5. confessing all my daily sinning
6. Commandment and Law keeping

And ironically:

1. Observing Days
2. Observing Months
3. Observing Times
4. Observing Years
5. Circumcision

Which are biblically associated with falling from grace Weren’t on your heretical list.

Behold · Aug 6, 2022

Michiah-Imla said:
No, I’m doing it to stop sinning! .

Yes, you are still trying to stop sinning.
When is the last time you confessed?
I don't expect you to admit it....... but my point is, you haven't stopped.
Why?
Because you are not obeying the "simplicity that is in Christ" that is to understand the Grace of God.
This is why you are full of works to try to BECOME< only what God can cause you to remain.

Salvation, takes care of Eternal life, and all sin.....but to exist in what Paul refers to as "as many as be perfect", you have to not do everything that you are trying to do, as all that self effort, causes you to fail at your discipleship, because its not based on right understanding.

Michiah-Imla · Aug 6, 2022

Behold said:
Yes, you are still trying to stop sinning.
When is the last time you confessed?

You have to obey righteousness to stop sinning. Just like the scripture I quoted to you says:

“Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness? But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.” (Romans 6:16-17)

Behold said:
my point is, you haven't stopped.
Why?

I have stopped.

This is why:

“Whosoever is born of God does not commit sin” (1 John 3:9)

If you want to keep dismissing my points and continue to change the conversation particulars, no problem. I can keep up.

But It just shows you have no biblical answers to my rebuttals other than your long winded opinions.

ScottA · Aug 6, 2022

Michiah-Imla said:
You teach against biblical teachings; this is ANARCHISM and Bible rejection your are promoting.

What a sham!

Just to point out one of his errors:

@Behold says that “enduring to the end” is to reject Christ!

THOSE ARE CHRIST’S VERY WORDS!

So to obey Christ = Rejection of Christ in @Behold ’s mind. Try and wrap your head around that crazy statement.

This absolutely insane that ANYONE listens to you over the Bible.

That is not going against the Bible, all those things are just misunderstood.

For instance: "enduring to the end." Who is [biblically] the End? ...By name it is Christ. But only the Spirit reveals what is in plain sight, but missed by those who do not have eyes to see.

Thus, when one comes to Christ and Christ comes into them, they have endured to the End...and "It is finished", just as He said. All of which is indeed biblical.

Behold · Aug 6, 2022

Michiah-Imla said:
You have to obey righteousness to stop sinning.
“Whosoever is born of God does not commit sin” (1 John 3:9)

The born again Spirit has BECOME, "made righteous".... so, there is no sin found there, as this is to be "in Christ", "One with God".

Also..

"Born of God"..

See that?
That is not your mind or your body, """as your body is DEAD because of Sin"", and the "Old man is Crucified with Christ".

So what is "born of GOD"? ?????

= Your SPIRIT., and this Birth of your Spirit is to be BORN>......AGAIN. as a 'New Creation in Christ".

Where does the Born Again Spirit exit, as Born again?

A.) Translated from DARKNESS TO LIGHT.... (Kingdom of God)

B.) Seated in Heavenly Places in Christ

C.) ONE with God.

See that?
There is no sin found There, and that is where the Born again Exist.....as a SON of God.....Body of Christ.... Bride of Christ.

Jim B · Aug 6, 2022

Michiah-Imla said:
You have to obey righteousness to stop sinning. Just like the scripture I quoted to you says:

“Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness? But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.” (Romans 6:16-17)

I have stopped.

This is why:

“Whosoever is born of God does not commit sin” (1 John 3:9)

If you want to keep dismissing my points and continue to change the conversation particulars, no problem. I can keep up.

But It just shows you have no biblical answers to my rebuttals other than your long winded opinions.

So according to you, no Christian sins? Very interesting!

James, Jesus' brother, wrote "So confess your sins to one another and pray for one another so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great effectiveness." James 5:16 According to you, he didn't know the truth.

How about John? He wrote in 1 John 1:8-0, "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us." So, the apostle who was closest to Jesus didn't understand sin?

Here is your verse in context: 1 John 3:4-10, " Everyone who makes a practice of sinning also practices lawlessness; sin is lawlessness. You know that he appeared in order to take away sins, and in him there is no sin. No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him. Little children, let no one deceive you. Whoever practices righteousness is righteous, as he is righteous. Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil. No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God's seed abides in him; and he cannot keep on sinning, because he has been born of God. By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother."

(Quotes from the ESV).

1 John 3:9, "No one who has been born of God practices sin, because His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin continually, because he has been born of God." NASB

"No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God." NIV

It's time for you to buy a new Bible and learn the truth!

amigo de christo · Aug 6, 2022

Behold said:
The born again Spirit has BECOME, "made righteous".... so, there is no sin found there, as this is to be "in Christ", "One with God".

Also..

"Born of God"..

See that?
That is not your mind or your body, """as your body is DEAD because of Sin"", and the "Old man is Crucified with Christ".

So what is "born of GOD"? ?????

= Your SPIRIT., and this Birth of your Spirit is to be BORN>......AGAIN. as a 'New Creation in Christ".

Where does the Born Again Spirit exit, as Born again?

A.) Translated from DARKNESS TO LIGHT.... (Kingdom of God)

B.) Seated in Heavenly Places in Christ

C.) ONE with God.

See that?
There is no sin found There, and that is where the Born again Exist.....as a SON of God.....Body of Christ.... Bride of Christ.

and dont forget to remind the church what paul wrote . About who we serve is whose we are . THE PROOF of whose we are
is not seen in lip alone but by confession of Christ and our love of Him , aka OBEY HIM .
GOD wont be mocked . IF folks live as i once did and lip the name of JESUS yet live for themselves and their sins . THEY HAVE DECIEVED
themselves . I WAS DECIEVED , THEY ARE TOO . WHO we BELONG TOO is who we follow . WHO we love and what we love IS what we obey .
ITS SEEN by our fruits . And IF GOD is at work in a person , THEN what HE IS DOING , WELL HE has us doing the things that are pleasing to HIM . SIN AINT . GOD has never been nor ever will be an acceptor or a lover of mens sins . THUS IN CHRIST WE NOW
have the true way to worship GOD as HE has always desired . IN SPIRIT and in truth , NOT IN FLESH and LIVING IT UP IN SINS
cause that is THA OLD MAN . That ol feller got to be crucified . WE HAVE ALL WE NEED IN CHRIST . THUS FOLLOW HIM
HEED THE SPIRIT and NOT the FLESH .

BloodBought 1953 · Aug 7, 2022

Behold said:
Yes.

Is is a great "falling away" from the Faith, in these end times.
Falling away from Faith in Christ, and falling into SELF SAVING = ""here is what I DO, so that I SAVE ME.... so that I TRY to keep myself saved".

And here is my LIST, of Self Saving, Legalism, Christ rejecting Requirements.

1.) Water Baptism saves me
2.) Enduring to the end saves me
3.) SELF Abiding saves me
4.) Holding unto my faith keeps me saves
5.) confessing all my daily sinning keeps me saved
6.) Commandment and Law keeping saves me
7.) AND = Whatever else i can think of that I HAVE TO DO to TRY TO STAY SAVED.

See all that?

THERE IS NO FAITH IN CHRIST FOUND IN THAT LIST.

Hey Behold !! Great list——- but I think that you may have left out the “ GRANDDADDY” of them all!!!

.8 “ Ya Gotta Repent Of All Of your Sins Before you die!” ....aka “ Lucky Repentance”.....

What am I talking about? It's like this.....

Somebody cuts you off in traffic and you spill very hot coffee in your lap and you almost wreck ! You let out a Terrible curse word and then you suddenly die Of a heart-attack.....you died before you had a chance to say a prayer of Repentance ......you are damned.......you did not have the time nor the “ luck” to repent......sorry, Charlie—- you are Toast....

Some other guy has the very same experience , except “ he” had the “ luck” to say a little prayer of Repentance before he died.....he died with his “Repentance Slate” Clean and therefore he got Saved.....There were NO sins left behind that he did get covered by his Repentance....

That is the World Of “ Lucky Repentance” —- A World Where Grace is Non- existent and having the Good Fortune to remember and to be sorry about ALL of your sins before you die is everything....

mailmandan · Aug 7, 2022

Jim B said:
So according to you, no Christian sins? Very interesting!

James, Jesus' brother, wrote "So confess your sins to one another and pray for one another so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great effectiveness." James 5:16 According to you, he didn't know the truth.

How about John? He wrote in 1 John 1:8-0, "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us." So, the apostle who was closest to Jesus didn't understand sin?

Here is your verse in context: 1 John 3:4-10, " Everyone who makes a practice of sinning also practices lawlessness; sin is lawlessness. You know that he appeared in order to take away sins, and in him there is no sin. No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him. Little children, let no one deceive you. Whoever practices righteousness is righteous, as he is righteous. Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil. No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God's seed abides in him; and he cannot keep on sinning, because he has been born of God. By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother."

(Quotes from the ESV).

1 John 3:9, "No one who has been born of God practices sin, because His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin continually, because he has been born of God." NASB

"No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God." NIV

It's time for you to buy a new Bible and learn the truth!

Amen and well said! :Thumbsup:

Eternally Grateful · Aug 7, 2022

Jim B said:
So according to you, no Christian sins? Very interesting!

James, Jesus' brother, wrote "So confess your sins to one another and pray for one another so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great effectiveness." James 5:16 According to you, he didn't know the truth.

How about John? He wrote in 1 John 1:8-0, "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us." So, the apostle who was closest to Jesus didn't understand sin?

Here is your verse in context: 1 John 3:4-10, " Everyone who makes a practice of sinning also practices lawlessness; sin is lawlessness. You know that he appeared in order to take away sins, and in him there is no sin. No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him. Little children, let no one deceive you. Whoever practices righteousness is righteous, as he is righteous. Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil. No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God's seed abides in him; and he cannot keep on sinning, because he has been born of God. By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother."

(Quotes from the ESV).

1 John 3:9, "No one who has been born of God practices sin, because His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin continually, because he has been born of God." NASB

"No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God." NIV

It's time for you to buy a new Bible and learn the truth!

Excellent post

Michiah-Imla · Aug 7, 2022

The sin enablers never tire.

Jim B said:
So according to you, no Christian sins? Very interesting!

No, according to the Bible! (Even this ESV translation):

“Since therefore Christ suffered in the flesh, arm yourselves with the same way of thinking, for whoever has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, so as to live for the rest of the time in the flesh no longer for human passions but for the will of God.” (1 Peter 4:1-2)

This is the problem with the new translations. They end up contradicting themselves by adding “practices sin” in other places! The KJV is consistent across the board; does NOT sin!

Jim B said:
James, Jesus' brother, wrote "So confess your sins to one another and pray for one another so that you may be healed.

“Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.” (James 5:16)

Yes, if any haven’t been born again yet among you.

Because once you are healed you are born again and will not commit offenses anymore. Otherwise the effectual fervent prayer of the righteous man avails very little.

Jim B said:
How about John? He wrote in 1 John 1:8, "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Yes, if that man has not been cleansed by the blood of Christ:

“But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from ALL sin. If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” (1 John 1:7-9)

Jim B said:
It's time for you to buy a new Bible and learn the truth!

Here’s the English Standard Version (ESV) again:

“Since therefore Christ suffered in the flesh, arm yourselves with the same way of thinking, for whoever has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, so as to live for the rest of the time in the flesh no longer for human passions but for the will of God.” (1 Peter 4:1-2)

Jim B · Aug 7, 2022

Michiah-Imla said:
The sin enablers never tire. No, according to the Bible! (Even this ESV translation): “Since therefore Christ suffered in the flesh, arm yourselves with the same way of thinking, for whoever has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, so as to live for the rest of the time in the flesh no longer for human passions but for the will of God.” (1 Peter 4:1-2) This is the problem with the new translations. They end up contradicting themselves by adding “practices sin” in other places! The KJV is consistent across the board; does NOT sin! “Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.” (James 5:16) Yes, if any haven’t been born again yet among you. Because once you are healed you are born again and will not commit offenses anymore. Otherwise the effectual fervent prayer of the righteous man avails very little. Yes, if that man has not been cleansed by the blood of Christ:

“But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from ALL sin. If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” (1 John 1:7-9)
Here’s the English Standard Version (ESV) again: “Since therefore Christ suffered in the flesh, arm yourselves with the same way of thinking, for whoever has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, so as to live for the rest of the time in the flesh no longer for human passions but for the will of God.” (1 Peter 4:1-2)

1 John 1:8-10 KJV, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us."

So your writing that "The KJV is consistent across the board; does NOT sin!" is simply untrue!

You would like it to be true, but "Absolutely not! Let God be proven true, and every human being shown up as a liar, just as it is written: “so that you will be justified in your words and will prevail when you are judged.” Romans 3:4 or if you want it from the KJV, "God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged."

Sorry to break your delusion, but you are clearly and obviously wrong about sin!

And about your bias against other translations...

You wrote "This is the problem with the new translations. They end up contradicting themselves by adding “practices sin” in other places! The KJV is consistent across the board; does NOT sin!" This is clearly wrong, as I have shown above. Again, from the KJV, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."

You're wrong about sin and wrong about modern translations.

Michiah-Imla · Aug 7, 2022

@Jim B

How do you like turning John into a God mocking enabler?

“Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.” (Galatians 6:7-8)

Jim B · Aug 7, 2022

Michiah-Imla said:
@Jim B

How do you like turning John into a God mocking enabler?

“Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.” (Galatians 6:7-8)

So you lost the previous argument about sin, so now you change the subject and you expect me to respond? You're joking.

Michiah-Imla · Aug 7, 2022

Jim B said:
So you lost the previous argument about sin, so now you change the subject

You failed to address my rebuttal so I moved on.

So you see red mirages in scripture too I see:

“Be not deceived; God is ~~not~~ mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh ~~reap corruption~~ still reap life everlasting; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting as well.” (Galatians 6:7-8)

@Eternally Grateful @mailmandan
@Behold @BloodBought 1953 also see these red mirages too!

shortangel · Aug 7, 2022

great perspectives here, gives me alot to think about here

Ferris Bueller · Aug 10, 2022

Behold said:
Here is what happens to the Christian who lives in SIN.

That is a contradiction of terms.
The Bible says the person who lives in sin is not born again.
So there is no such thing as a Christian that lives in sin.
Only unsaved unbelievers live in sin. And they are going to the fiery place. That's what happens to them.

Behold · Aug 10, 2022

Ferris Bueller said:
That is a contradiction of terms.
The Bible says the person who lives in sin is not born again.
So there is no such thing as a Christian that lives in sin.
Only unsaved unbelievers live in sin. And they are going to the fiery place. That's what happens to them.

"the sinning Christian".......is what i said.

You said..>"a christian who lives in sin".......and i didnt say that.
You should be more accurate (honest) when you try to re-quote me to fit your self saving legalism.

Now let me show you again..

the "sinning Christian" is a person who sins and confesses.
That would be you., and that is different then someone who has backslidden into dead faith.

What happens to the SINNING : Christian

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