Any other Christians in here interested in evolution? I mean genuinely wants to understand it.

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Heart2Soul

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No one uses literally really to mean anything than factual, or historical now days.

When someone says that they take genesis literally, they mean they take it as being historically and scientifically accurate and true. The movement is called “ biblical literalists”.

As far as presenting it in depth I already know this is not the place for it. If more responded because they legitimately wanted to know I could go really in-depth with it. My job involves imploring evolutionary ecology and habitat systems. But over the decade I’ve realized that what’s best is to use my time going in depth with those who can understand it and want to understand it. Or it’s with atheist. I’ve learned that most atheists who actually understand science are far more open to having a real dialogue about science and faith than the typical YECist. I mostly use these forums for very specific debates to try to eliminate all the weird rabbit holes they try to take me down and to lead those who are truly interested towards some places for more info.
Okay...so here is a question for you...dinosaurs, also called behemoths, did exist at one time...agree? Where or what or how did they evolve into dinosaurs? Is there any evidence to support their existence in any other form?
Second question....scientists agree that the earth is millions of years old...carbon dating and rock formation. So when did these dinosaurs roam the earth and what does carbon dating state as to how old they are/were.
 
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Grailhunter

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Okay...so here is a question for you...dinosaurs, also called behemoths, did exist at one time...agree? Where or what or how did they evolve into dinosaurs? Is there any evidence to support their existence in any other form?
Second question....scientists agree that the earth is millions of years old...carbon dating and rock formation. So when did these dinosaurs roam the earth and what does carbon dating state as to how old they are/were.

Now that is an interesting topic!
Can we define the spiritual mind or person?
Is it spiritually minded to believe that the world is flat?
Or is it a social / religious cliché? People profess things to be accepted in Christian groups but really do not believe it or apply it to their lives. There are a lot of Christians that believe in the saving Grace of Yeshua but do not believe the world is flat. Are we going to label them as carnal minded because they do not believe the world is flat and the sun and universe revolves around earth?
Do we have carnal Christians and spiritual Christians?
What is the difference? Where is the dividing line?
I have actually done quite a bit of travel and research on this because....I thought it was an interesting topic. Which was one of the reasons I started the thread "Types of Christians.....what type are you"
Types of Christians….what type are you?
And part of it was humor.

But before I got out of the defense department I took the opportunity to visit various churches and attend their Sunday schools up and down the eastern sea board and after I returned to Missouri I continued traveling around to various churches. I had a list of questions to ask them and see what their responses would be.
1. How can a Christian vote for a democrat?
2. Their opinion on science and the Bible?
3. Their beliefs on the various formulas on the Trinity?
4. Should we mix Judaism with Christianity?
5. What does the year 2000 mean to Christians? Back in the day.

Of course number 2 relates to this topic.
Some of the responses showed a negative view on education. To the point that they felt they had to do an intervention for their young adults that came out of college, to straighten them out. A few pointed out that Christ had warned about the "wisdom of men"
I tried to explain to them that He was talking about Greek philosophy and metaphysics that permeated the Greco-Roman culture.
It was so popular that some of it would eventually be adopted by Christianity, nearly from the beginning. John talks of the "Logos" which comes from Greek metaphysics, originating in the 6th century BC so that concept had been around a while. And when the converted Pagans....Gentiles took over the helm of the church, more of Greek thought was introduced.
So then the question is do some Christians believe that an educated Christian cannot be spiritual?

As far as the Bible and science? I got some interesting responses. Over all the people that consider themselves Fundamentalists - Bible only....denied what they could when science conflicted with the Bible....and that was the simple and definitive line of demarcation. They did not deny that microwave ovens and satellite TV's existed or worked because either someone could show them or they owned them. The line of denial was if they could see it or touch it. It takes a certain amount of education to understand science and as far as experience, the technology that makes up our everyday life might as well work on magic, but they accept it. At one time a lot of Christians denied that dinosaurs existed, but now they can go in a museum and see and touch them.

And as it turns out this negative view of science and education turns into a social / religious juggling act, talk about being conflicted? They are going to uphold the beliefs of the Old Testament and that science has it all wrong.....but it still comes down to see and touch....When the chips are down and they develop heart problems, they are not going to look for doctor that practices Old Testament medical procedures..... got any leeches handy? If they are having a heart attack they are not going to sit down and pray and read the Bible until they die. So all in all it is a juggling act. If their life is on the line they are going to use that witchy device to call the technology mobile, better known as the ambulance and go to the technology center, better known as the hospital!

And there is no way to explain it to them because it is complicated enough that you have to be educated on it, and they do not like education. All the technological products we have today started out in laboratories as theories and they work and we use them. Most people do not understand the science behind them or how they work, just that they work and they can touch them and see them and use them, so they believe in that science. But when you get into Quantum mechanics and Astro Physics and things like evolution and cosmology it is not something they can understand or can see or touch. So they deny it and it is more socially acceptable within Christian groups to deny science....even if they were to fly into the church parking lot with a jet pack.

So what does it matter? Beliefs, Truths, Facts, beliefs can be anything and they have the right to believe what they want. But it matters when they imply that Christians that are educated and understand science are less of a Christian than them. My profession and education and hobbies are all about science as well as biblical studies, theology, and Christian history, and I have had enough real Divine visitations to know that God knows that I am spiritual. I am a person of science and know what to be confident in, but on the other hand I know that one way or another God is behind everything and science is mostly about finding out how it all happened, or how it is, or how it works and how they can use that knowledge to make our lives better....look around your house....and imagine living without all those things that science has produced.
 
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BeyondET

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Now that is an interesting topic!
Can we define the spiritual mind or person?
Is it spiritually minded to believe that the world is flat?
Or is it a social / religious cliché? People profess things to be accepted in Christian groups but really do not believe it or apply it to their lives. There are a lot of Christians that believe in the saving Grace of Yeshua but do not believe the world is flat. Are we going to label them as carnal minded because they do not believe the world is flat and the sun and universe revolves around earth?
Do we have carnal Christians and spiritual Christians?
What is the difference? Where is the dividing line?
I have actually done quite a bit of travel and research on this because....I thought it was an interesting topic. Which was one of reasons I started the thread "Types of Christians.....what type are you"
Types of Christians….what type are you?
And part of it was humor.

But before I got out of the defense department I took the opportunity to visit various churches and attend their Sunday schools up and down the eastern sea board and after I returned to Missouri I continued traveling around to various churches. I had a list of questions to ask them and see what their responses would be.
1. How can a Christian vote for a democrat?
2. Their opinion on science and the Bible?
3. Their beliefs on the various formulas on the Trinity?
4. Should we mix Judaism with Christianity?
5. What does the year 2000 mean to Christians? Back in the day.

Of course number 2 relates to this topic.
Some of the responses showed a negative view on education. To the point that they felt they had to do an intervention for their young adults that came out of college, to straighten them out. A few pointed out that Christ had warned about the "wisdom of men"
I tried to explain to them that He was talking about Greek philosophy and metaphysics that permeated the Greco-Roman culture.
It was so popular that some of it would eventually be adopted by Christianity, nearly from the beginning. John talks of the "Logos" which comes from Greek metaphysics, originating in the 6th century BC so that concept had been around a while. And when the converted Pagans....Gentiles took over the helm of the church, more of Greek thought was introduced.
So then the question is do some Christians believe that an educated Christian cannot be spiritual?

As far as the Bible and science? I got some interesting responses. Over all the people that consider themselves Fundamentalists - Bible only....denied what they could when science conflicted with the Bible....and that was the simple and definitive line of demarcation. They did not deny that microwave ovens and satellite TV's existed or worked because either someone could show them or they owned them. The line of denial was if they could see it or touch it. It takes a certain amount of education to understand science and as far as experience, the technology that makes up our everyday life might as well work on magic, but they accept it. At one time a lot of Christians denied that dinosaurs existed, but now they can go in a museum and see and touch them.

And as it turns out this negative view of science and education turns into a social / religious juggling act. They are going to uphold the beliefs of the Old Testament and that science has it all wrong.....but it still comes down to see and touch....When the chips are down and they develop heart problems, they are not going to look for doctor that practices Old Testament medical procedures..... got any leeches handy? If they are having a heart attack they are not going to sit down and pray and read the Bible until they die. So all in all it is a juggling act. If their life is on the line they are going to use that witchy device to call the technology mobile, better known as the ambulance.

And there is no way to explain it to them because it is complicated enough that you have to be educated on it, and they do not like education. All the technological products we have today started out in laboratories as theories and they work and we use them. Most people do not understand the science behind them or how they work, just that they work and they can touch them and see them and use them, so they believe in that science. But when you get into Quantum mechanics and Astro Physics and things like evolution and cosmology it is not something they can understand or can see or touch. So they deny it and it is more socially acceptable within Christian groups to deny science....even if they were to fly into the church parking lot with a jet pack.

So what does it matter? Beliefs, Truths, Facts, beliefs can be anything and they have the right to believe what they want. But it matters when they imply that Christians that are educated and understand science are less of a Christian than them. My profession and education and hobbies are all about science as well as biblical studies, theology, and Christian history, and I have had enough real Divine visitations to know that God know that I am spiritual. I am a person of science and know what to be confident in, but on the other hand I know that one way or another God is behind everything and science is mostly about finding out how it all happened, or how it is, or how it works and how they can use that knowledge to make our lives better....look around your house....and imagine living without all those things that science has produced.
I've read quite alot of technology is inspired by natural things, design n blueprints basically
 

Grailhunter

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I've read quite alot of technology is inspired by natural things, design n blueprints basically

There is some truth to that. Leonardo da Vinci and Albert Einstein were known as Geneses of observation and of the mind. Einstein developed his theories of relativity while at his desk or asleep. He had to learn physics and Quantum math to explain it to the other scientists.
 
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BeyondET

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There is some truth to that. Leonardo da Vinci and Albert Einstein were known as Geneses of observation and of the mind. Einstein developed his theories of relativity while at his desk or asleep. He had to learn physics and Quantum math to explain it to the other scientists.
Yes people having been using designs of nature quite some time, there's a ton of info on subject, nuclear plants is like the sun in a box. Here's a short video I've seen before just a example but there's alot of designs inspired by nature no doubt.

 

Heart2Soul

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Now that is an interesting topic!
Can we define the spiritual mind or person?
Is it spiritually minded to believe that the world is flat?
Or is it a social / religious cliché? People profess things to be accepted in Christian groups but really do not believe it or apply it to their lives. There are a lot of Christians that believe in the saving Grace of Yeshua but do not believe the world is flat. Are we going to label them as carnal minded because they do not believe the world is flat and the sun and universe revolves around earth?
Do we have carnal Christians and spiritual Christians?
What is the difference? Where is the dividing line?
I have actually done quite a bit of travel and research on this because....I thought it was an interesting topic. Which was one of the reasons I started the thread "Types of Christians.....what type are you"
Types of Christians….what type are you?
And part of it was humor.

But before I got out of the defense department I took the opportunity to visit various churches and attend their Sunday schools up and down the eastern sea board and after I returned to Missouri I continued traveling around to various churches. I had a list of questions to ask them and see what their responses would be.
1. How can a Christian vote for a democrat?
2. Their opinion on science and the Bible?
3. Their beliefs on the various formulas on the Trinity?
4. Should we mix Judaism with Christianity?
5. What does the year 2000 mean to Christians? Back in the day.

Of course number 2 relates to this topic.
Some of the responses showed a negative view on education. To the point that they felt they had to do an intervention for their young adults that came out of college, to straighten them out. A few pointed out that Christ had warned about the "wisdom of men"
I tried to explain to them that He was talking about Greek philosophy and metaphysics that permeated the Greco-Roman culture.
It was so popular that some of it would eventually be adopted by Christianity, nearly from the beginning. John talks of the "Logos" which comes from Greek metaphysics, originating in the 6th century BC so that concept had been around a while. And when the converted Pagans....Gentiles took over the helm of the church, more of Greek thought was introduced.
So then the question is do some Christians believe that an educated Christian cannot be spiritual?

As far as the Bible and science? I got some interesting responses. Over all the people that consider themselves Fundamentalists - Bible only....denied what they could when science conflicted with the Bible....and that was the simple and definitive line of demarcation. They did not deny that microwave ovens and satellite TV's existed or worked because either someone could show them or they owned them. The line of denial was if they could see it or touch it. It takes a certain amount of education to understand science and as far as experience, the technology that makes up our everyday life might as well work on magic, but they accept it. At one time a lot of Christians denied that dinosaurs existed, but now they can go in a museum and see and touch them.

And as it turns out this negative view of science and education turns into a social / religious juggling act, talk about being conflicted? They are going to uphold the beliefs of the Old Testament and that science has it all wrong.....but it still comes down to see and touch....When the chips are down and they develop heart problems, they are not going to look for doctor that practices Old Testament medical procedures..... got any leeches handy? If they are having a heart attack they are not going to sit down and pray and read the Bible until they die. So all in all it is a juggling act. If their life is on the line they are going to use that witchy device to call the technology mobile, better known as the ambulance and go to the technology center, better known as the hospital!

And there is no way to explain it to them because it is complicated enough that you have to be educated on it, and they do not like education. All the technological products we have today started out in laboratories as theories and they work and we use them. Most people do not understand the science behind them or how they work, just that they work and they can touch them and see them and use them, so they believe in that science. But when you get into Quantum mechanics and Astro Physics and things like evolution and cosmology it is not something they can understand or can see or touch. So they deny it and it is more socially acceptable within Christian groups to deny science....even if they were to fly into the church parking lot with a jet pack.

So what does it matter? Beliefs, Truths, Facts, beliefs can be anything and they have the right to believe what they want. But it matters when they imply that Christians that are educated and understand science are less of a Christian than them. My profession and education and hobbies are all about science as well as biblical studies, theology, and Christian history, and I have had enough real Divine visitations to know that God knows that I am spiritual. I am a person of science and know what to be confident in, but on the other hand I know that one way or another God is behind everything and science is mostly about finding out how it all happened, or how it is, or how it works and how they can use that knowledge to make our lives better....look around your house....and imagine living without all those things that science has produced.
I think you meant this to be a response to my previous post...because there wasn't anything that connected to this post....lol

Now let me say this LOUD AND CLEAR!!! Lol...I absolutely love science....it fascinates me even more on the genetic side... I love learning, studying and searching beyond my limited knowledge of everything.

What I don't like is theories of evolution, the big bang theory, and pretty much any theory that tries to eliminate God in the equation.

I love that science has finally accepted creation by design and purpose from a Supreme being....
 
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Grailhunter

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I think you meant this to be a response to my previous post...because there wasn't anything that connected to this post....lol

Now let me say this LOUD AND CLEAR!!! Lol...I absolutely love science....it fascinates me even more on the genetic side... I love learning, studying and searching beyond my limited knowledge of everything.

What I don't like is theories of evolution, the big bang theory, and pretty much any theory that tries to eliminate God in the equation.

I love that science has finally accepted creation by design and purpose from a Supreme being....

I think I addresses what you and others do not like. What you cannot see and touch.
And I have explained this misconception before....I have sat in their labs and offices and cubicles and discussed this with real scientists, not to mention drinks and Christmas dinners and they are not all atheists. But the methodology has to be more or less atheist because if it were not they would just say, God did it all, and we would not have anything that we have to today and disease and plagues would run rampant. Christians that understand science are not trying to eliminate God....they know God is driving everything....they are just agree with the effort to understand how it happened and how it works.

The Old Testament is what it is and it could not be any other way. It is not about whether it is right or wrong. God could not explain Quantum science or Astrophysics to a primitive people, for one they could not have faith is something that was not understandable. And what we like or what we do not like really does not matter and that applies to religion and science.

And you say....I love that science has finally accepted creation by design and purpose from a Supreme being. You said a mouthful. At one time science thought it had all the answers but as time went on, and they discovered more and more they realized the more you know, the more you don't know. It is not a static understanding and that is what it is all about. They cannot build a model of cosmology because the more you learn the model changes and that is the way it should be.

And the rest I explained in the previous post. God love ya and I do too.
 
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Skovand1075

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Okay...so here is a question for you...dinosaurs, also called behemoths, did exist at one time...agree? Where or what or how did they evolve into dinosaurs? Is there any evidence to support their existence in any other form?
Second question....scientists agree that the earth is millions of years old...carbon dating and rock formation. So when did these dinosaurs roam the earth and what does carbon dating state as to how old they are/were.
There is tons of evidence for several species of dinosaurs.

Episode 101 – Sauropods

Episode 120 – Tyrannosaurs

Episode 42 – Spinosaurs

Episode 21 – Dinosaurs, an Introduction

This is an episode from them covering the geological time scale.
Episode 12 – The Geologic Time Scale

Though this entire podcast is dedicated to breaking down the geological record.

The Nick Zentner Geology Podcast — Nick Zentner

The earlier episodes go over different forms of dating. While all forms can essentially be used for all dating, because of half lives some are used to date older things VZ young things more commonly, though it’s almost always fact checked through another process as well.
 
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Skovand1075

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Also science is not religious or atheist. It’s science. It’s goal is to explain things. If I ask how does fire burn wood, I can’t just say “ god made fire to burn wood”. I have to go through the chemical processes , heat and so on.

if I ask how does a cloud form, and I mention evaporation, dust and ect… that’s not atheism. That’s science.

likewise, evolution has nothing to do with atheism. It has to do with biology, ecology and ect… so there is no such thing as atheistic or religious science. There is science. Different people with come to different conclusions on what the science means beyond its subject .

So for me, as someone who likes science , which means someone who accepts science like evolution, nothing in evolution makes me reject god. Nothing in evolution is atheistic for me. What it does make me reject is bad theology and pseudoscience such as those employees by YEC or OEC/ and ID.
 
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dhh712

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My bachelor's of Science degree was awarded by the State University of New York at Stony Brook in 1980. This was well before the human genome project was completed, but my degree was in biological sciences and I had quite a few courses that included the theory of evolution and taught from that perspective, including the basic biology classes bio 101 and 102, physics for biology, comparative anatomy, animal physiology, adaption and evolution, and genetics. My test score for the graduate record examination advanced test in biology was in the top 5% nationwide, so I absorbed a bit of the teaching. However, my conclusion was that evolutionary theory was inadequate to explain the origin of life. Some time after I graduated, I also read Robert Ardrey's books African Genesis, the Territorial Imperative, and the Social contract, all about his research into the anthropological studies trying to explain how man could've evolved in such a (relatively) short period of geological time.

Evolutionary theory is in part dependent upon the concept that anything, regardless of how unlikely, will occur given sufficient time for totally random processes to accidentally combine and work together in a functional way.

What's more, Charles Darwin based his foundational work, the origin of species, on mistaken observation. He believed that the various phenotypes of finches that he observed on the Galapagos Islands were different species. However we know now that those various phenotypes are just normal morphological variations in one species, just like the various ethnicities of mankind.

Then there's the flawed logic of the theory regarding the fossil record. The similarities in morphology between "divergent" species was the original "evidence" of lineal relationship between them. However, the comparison of placental mammal to marsupials and nonplacental mammals that thrived in geographically isolated regions like Australia, lead to the "understanding" that similar morphology could evolve independently to fit similar environmental niches. So, the primary evolutionary evidence upon which the theory is based, similar morphology, is by the admission of evolutionary scientists, not actually proof of lineal relationship.

Molecular biology and genetics is also used as evidentiary by examining genetic similarity, but huge anomalies persist in the "evidence". For example, some pig proteins are closer to their human counterparts than those in apes, but no one is proposing that we evolved from pigs.

One of the very first experiments to prove the spontaneous generation of life was an attempt to generate something living inside a sealed jar that contained nothing but dirt and air. The experiment generated worms in the soil, but was flawed because the soil wasn't sterilized and contained eggs. Yet that experiment was still taught as support for the spontaneous generation of life in the 1970s, but with the note that it was flawed for the stated reasons.

Newer devised experiments utilizing a mixture of gases that might have existed in the primordial Earth were able to produce some simple hydrocarbons, the building blocks of more complex organic compounds, but not life.
To this date, no one has been able to create even the simplest form of life spontaneously under experiment.

Some biologist have given themselves over the study of cellular mechanisms in bacterium, single celled organisms, some with extremely complicated biological machines for locomotion and transport. Some of these (non-Christian) scientists arrived at the concept of irreducible complexity, the notion that the most basic definition of life includes the requirement for multiple interdependent processes which couldn't themselves evolve independently. (Evolution only occurs (theoretically) when the organism is living and capable of reproduction). Their conclusion was that life demonstrates intelligent design. This conclusion is unacceptable to a concept of "pure science" that excludes any kind of creator, so the field was labeled pseudo science, and the scientists in those endeavors, "quacks" and frauds.

The theory of evolution and the mechanisms that make it a possibility are easy to understand, but the end results are extremely improbable. However, the "scientific community " prefers a flawed theory, with flawed origin, built on flawed logic, with evidences as "proofs" that have alternative explanation, to the consideration of the supernatural, a God and Creator. This is why some evolutionary scientists turned to the newer hypothesis of "pangenesis", or that life originated "elsewhere" and somehow hitchhiked a ride to Earth. That allows them to rule out the problem of insufficient time for life to evolve here, and completely disregard its origin elsewhere.

Evolutionary science is a blind man trying to identify an elephant by its appendages.

This is what turns me off of evolution: it's extreme bias, often, of those in support of it. I do find it interesting and concur readily that it occurs at the macro level (I hope I'm not mixing up the terms; my brain often does that); macro-evolution (or it might be micro, I seem to get the two terms confused) was overwhelmingly proved by countless laboratory experiments.

Yet your so-called scientists jump to any sliver of a suggestion that evolution is the truth and that God is no where in the picture--the side-lining and denigration of those scientists who came to see by their studies evidence of intelligent design is an example of the underlying agenda of their experiments: They don't want to discover the truth, but rather whatever can be spun as an intelligent and persuasive sounding argument to deny the existence of God. As such, the majority of the population out there possessing a good level of intelligence but are not able to look into the research at the same level of depth as these people are doing are going to be persuaded by their arguments because they also are looking for seemingly sound arguments to deny God.

The end result is a belief in a theory that takes about the same amount of faith as a belief in God. And, because it has some articles of science attached to it (which are suspect if one would take the time to look into it, but the majority of people don't), what results is an attitude of "You don't believe in evolution? That's a backwards way of thinking that mostly dumb people adhere to."

So while it's somewhat interesting, the Satanic element of how it is generally undertaken by most as an agenda to disprove the action of God in creation has mostly just made me not really interested in looking into it that much.

I found it very sad, when I was doing genealogy research earlier, to find a story of a distant relation who was a minister of the word who proposed that Darwin's theory of evolution might be true (he was rightly fired by the church he was a minister in). An example of those who have been raised in the church doubting the word of God all due to intelligent-sounding worldly ideas. Reading the account of my family's story was like being an eye-witness to the seeds of worldliness (of that kind) that began to be sown in the church in the 1920s, when a large number of churches began to be infiltrated by the strong delusions of Satan (because they did not love the truth).
 
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Heart2Soul

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There is tons of evidence for several species of dinosaurs.

Episode 101 – Sauropods

Episode 120 – Tyrannosaurs

Episode 42 – Spinosaurs

Episode 21 – Dinosaurs, an Introduction

This is an episode from them covering the geological time scale.
Episode 12 – The Geologic Time Scale

Though this entire podcast is dedicated to breaking down the geological record.

The Nick Zentner Geology Podcast — Nick Zentner

The earlier episodes go over different forms of dating. While all forms can essentially be used for all dating, because of half lives some are used to date older things VZ young things more commonly, though it’s almost always fact checked through another process as well.
I went to do a web search about dinosaurs and how old they are.....can you believe they are 65 million years old?
That brings up a whole lot more questions..

Edit...I don't mean they were that old but that is when they were on earth....
And now the question...what about that day God created every living creature...it had to include dinosaurs...now the 7 day creation theory is looking more like eons instead of days.
 
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Grailhunter

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This is what turns me off of evolution: it's extreme bias, often, of those in support of it. I do find it interesting and concur readily that it occurs at the macro level (I hope I'm not mixing up the terms; my brain often does that); macro-evolution (or it might be micro, I seem to get the two terms confused) was overwhelmingly proved by countless laboratory experiments.

Yet your so-called scientists jump to any sliver of a suggestion that evolution is the truth and that God is no where in the picture--the side-lining and denigration of those scientists who came to see by their studies evidence of intelligent design is an example of the underlying agenda of their experiments: They don't want to discover the truth, but rather whatever can be spun as an intelligent and persuasive sounding argument to deny the existence of God. As such, the majority of the population out there possessing a good level of intelligence but are not able to look into the research at the same level of depth as these people are doing are going to be persuaded by their arguments because they also are looking for seemingly sound arguments to deny God.

The end result is a belief in a theory that takes about the same amount of faith as a belief in God. And, because it has some articles of science attached to it (which are suspect if one would take the time to look into it, but the majority of people don't), what results is an attitude of "You don't believe in evolution? That's a backwards way of thinking that mostly dumb people adhere to."

So while it's somewhat interesting, the Satanic element of how it is generally undertaken by most as an agenda to disprove the action of God in creation has mostly just made me not really interested in looking into it that much.

I found it very sad, when I was doing genealogy research earlier, to find a story of a distant relation who was a minister of the word who proposed that Darwin's theory of evolution might be true (he was rightly fired by the church he was a minister in). An example of those who have been raised in the church doubting the word of God all due to intelligent-sounding worldly ideas. Reading the account of my family's story was like being an eye-witness to the seeds of worldliness (of that kind) that began to be sown in the church in the 1920s, when a large number of churches began to be infiltrated by the strong delusions of Satan (because they did not love the truth).

A lot of this is just false and has been addressed in this thread.
 

Skovand1075

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I went to do a web search about dinosaurs and how old they are.....can you believe they are 65 million years old?
That brings up a whole lot more questions..

Edit...I don't mean they were that old but that is when they were on earth....
And now the question...what about that day God created every living creature...it had to include dinosaurs...now the 7 day creation theory is looking more like eons instead of days.
I think the days in genesis 1 refers to 24 hour days. They can’t refer to eons because it says birds were around before land animals but birds evolved after dinosaurs.

The only way to really interpret genesis in a way that honors the Bible, science and reality is that it’s not meant to be read literally but fictionally.
 

Heart2Soul

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I think the days in genesis 1 refers to 24 hour days. They can’t refer to eons because it says birds were around before land animals but birds evolved after dinosaurs.

The only way to really interpret genesis in a way that honors the Bible, science and reality is that it’s not meant to be read literally but fictionally.
Well the content was given to Moses. He wrote the 1st 5 books of the KJV...
Also the events are not in order as to when it took place.
If you read Genesis 1 you see on the 4th day that God created lights....but wait a minute...He did that on the 1st day.
So did God create light, and then create lights (plural).
They are not the same light...
So until the 4th day there was no measurement of time such as 24 hrs. Days, or weeks or months or years.
God existed and still exists outside of time.
So I believe the 1st 3 days is actually eons so that when he created animals, humans and plant life everything they need to grow and stay alive would be ready.
 
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Grailhunter

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Well the content was given to Moses. He wrote the 1st 5 books of the KJV...
Also the events are not in order as to when it took place.
If you read Genesis 1 you see on the 4th day that God created lights....but wait a minute...He did that on the 1st day.
So did God create light, and then create lights (plural).
They are not the same light...
So until the 4th day there was no measurement of time such as 24 hrs. Days, or weeks or months or years.
God existed and still exists outside of time.
So I believe the 1st 3 days is actually eons so that when he created animals, humans and plant life everything they need to grow and stay alive would be ready.

The history of Genesis is that there were three well known stories about Creation and Adam and Eve....and Moses included them in Genesis. They are not one continuous story but separate accounts.
They have different wordings and different orders of creation.
The first of course starts at Genesis 1:1 with the wording....In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth....
The second story starts at Genesis 2:4 with the wording....This is the account of the heavens and earth when they were created....
The third start at 5:1 with the wording....This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day when God create man....
There is no reason to try to harmonize these stories or have concerns that they are different.
 

dhh712

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A lot of this is just false and has been addressed in this thread.
It's actually quite true that worldly people do not believe in God. That was the basis of the post (they're going to either consciously or subconsciously look for ways to deny the existence of God). Not sure how that could be a false statement, really. Maybe you believe most scientists go into experiments completely free of bias (which is impossible); not sure if that's what you were thinking was false.

But, it doesn't matter as long as I know I speak the truth (based on God's word) and am not falsifying information, that is all that concerns me (not going to take the time to read through the thread. I have more important things to do. Just wanted to share my view on evolution; it is based on the Bible. It strikes me as a bit disrespectful also to to say that someone is saying something is false and then not point out to the person where he or she believes he or she is wrong. I just wouldn't find it proper to reply to a thread, "You're saying a bunch of lies here" and then not give an explanation for it. But, to each his own. Apparently not everyone see it the same way I'm sure).
 

Skovand1075

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Well the content was given to Moses. He wrote the 1st 5 books of the KJV...
Also the events are not in order as to when it took place.
If you read Genesis 1 you see on the 4th day that God created lights....but wait a minute...He did that on the 1st day.
So did God create light, and then create lights (plural).
They are not the same light...
So until the 4th day there was no measurement of time such as 24 hrs. Days, or weeks or months or years.
God existed and still exists outside of time.
So I believe the 1st 3 days is actually eons so that when he created animals, humans and plant life everything they need to grow and stay alive would be ready.
Well the Tohu wabohu ( the cosmic watery darkness ) is symbolic of chaos. Before the first day of creation the universe according to the Bible and ancient Jewish people was a place of dark deep water and darkness. When darkness was separated it’s not a reference to the sun. The darkness there is not symbolic of the night. That’s sun, moon and stars.

it’s why in revelation it says there will be no sun.


Revelation 21:23
New American Standard Bible

23 And the city has no need of the sun or of the moon to shine on it, for the glory of God has illuminated it, and its lamp is the Lamb.

it’s also why it says there will be no sea.

so when it says the darkness was separated creating the light is about gods order overcoming chaos.

same as when Yahweh allowed darkness to swallow everywhere but Goshen.

Exodus 10:21
New American Standard Bible
Darkness over the Land

21 Then the Lord said to Moses, “Reach out with your hand toward the sky, so that there may be darkness over the land of Egypt, even a darkness which may be felt.”

it was a darkness they could even feel. It was the cosmic chaos that existed before Yahweh conquered it. It’s the abyss the demons fear.
 

Grailhunter

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It's actually quite true that worldly people do not believe in God. That was the basis of the post (they're going to either consciously or subconsciously look for ways to deny the existence of God). Not sure how that could be a false statement, really. Maybe you believe most scientists go into experiments completely free of bias (which is impossible); not sure if that's what you were thinking was false.

Not true, people have a tendency to believe in a God. You can go to an island out in the middle of the Ocean and odds are they believe in a god. Different religions but most people believe in a god of one form or another.

Bias is the wrong word and it has been covered in this thread. I have covered the atheist methodology of science. It has to be that way in function because if they went to work and wrote down in their logs that God did it and went home....you and I would not be talking to each other on this forum...and would still use candles in our homes.
 
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Skovand1075

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It's actually quite true that worldly people do not believe in God. That was the basis of the post (they're going to either consciously or subconsciously look for ways to deny the existence of God). Not sure how that could be a false statement, really. Maybe you believe most scientists go into experiments completely free of bias (which is impossible); not sure if that's what you were thinking was false.

But, it doesn't matter as long as I know I speak the truth (based on God's word) and am not falsifying information, that is all that concerns me (not going to take the time to read through the thread. I have more important things to do. Just wanted to share my view on evolution; it is based on the Bible. It strikes me as a bit disrespectful also to to say that someone is saying something is false and then not point out to the person where he or she believes he or she is wrong. I just wouldn't find it proper to reply to a thread, "You're saying a bunch of lies here" and then not give an explanation for it. But, to each his own. Apparently not everyone see it the same way I'm sure).

so I base all of my religious and theological views off of the Bible as well.

this is the difference. Some see genesis 1 as a historical story for of scientifically verifiable facts. So when they say they are basing it off of the Bible, what they mean is that they basing their worldview off of their interpretation of the Bible.

likewise, I’m doing the same. My interpretation of genesis 1 is based off of the Bible. I call it a myth because that’s the genre the holy spirit decided to use to convey that story to mankind. If God used a historical story I would have a different worldview. But he did not. He used a myth full of symbolism. Since it’s fiction that god decided to use, I know that no matter what science teaches it’s not a contradiction.

the bible says Yahweh makes it rain on the good and bad. That implies god is who makes it rain. So someone could take that and mean they reject the scientific literature about meteorology , humidity, and so on. Or they could not make those statements anything other than what they are and that’s symbolism.