Why are Catholics so bad?
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But since you asked Jesus privatized unto Himself and the Father
its all in the post 280
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
I talk about my faith and I own many Bibles and I am a Catholic.....
I really do not think God believes I am a better Christian than Catholics or Protestants who do not.
One of the things I like most about my church is that Catholics never sit around in groups and try to determine if people are really Christians or not. Strange how members of a church that does not teach OSAS have such security in their faith and relationship with God.
I really do not think God believes I am a better Christian than Catholics or Protestants who do not.
One of the things I like most about my church is that Catholics never sit around in groups and try to determine if people are really Christians or not. Strange how members of a church that does not teach OSAS have such security in their faith and relationship with God.
Rex, your privatized form of Christianity doesn't cut it with the Word of God . Being that your man-made religion is based on the "Bible Alone " ,nowhere in the original Holy Bible were there any footnotes, nor is private interpretation taught in the bible, Further, before the words were written down , the revelation was handed on from one generation to another in spoken tradition. [ approx first 4 hundred years of Christianity ] . Hence the words of the Bible often need to be interpreted in light of what the original authors meant to say. Only a living tradition can give us such meanings being that there were no footnotes in the original bible ,so Christians always read the bible in light of the living tradition of the Church, guided by those that follow apostolic ordination.
2 Timothy 4
[sup]2 [/sup]Preach the word! Be ready in season and out of season. Convince, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching. [sup]3 [/sup]For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; [sup]4 [/sup]and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables. [sup]5 [/sup]But you be watchful in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.
Proverbs 20:21
Ezekiel 12:2
Matthew 11:15
Rex, the only way to be a teacher in the Catholic Church (and the Bible) is to be ordained by a higher authority. Priests are ordained by bishops, and bishops are ordained by numerous bishops. Always a higher authority. In your church, if you even have one, the minister (the higher authority) is hired by a board, (a lesser authority). Such a system is not biblical. 2 Tim 4:2 applies to Protestants, not to Catholics, because it is impossible to heap up for themselves teachers in the Catholic tradition.
2 Tim. 2:2 - this verse shows God's intention is to transfer authority to successors (here, Paul to Timothy to 3rd to 4th generation). It goes beyond the death of the apostles. But you deny succession too.
sad
2 Tim. 2:2 - this verse shows God's intention is to transfer authority to successors (here, Paul to Timothy to 3rd to 4th generation). It goes beyond the death of the apostles. But you deny succession too.
sad
Matthew 21:24-25
Isaiah 29:14
1 Cor
[sup]18 [/sup]For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. [sup]19 [/sup]For it is written:
“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise,
And bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.”[sup][a][/sup]
[sup]20 [/sup]Where is the wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the disputer of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? [sup]21 [/sup]For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe. [sup]22 [/sup]For Jews request a sign, and Greeks seek after wisdom; [sup]23 [/sup]but we preach Christ crucified, to the Jews a stumbling block and to the Greeks[sup][b][/sup] foolishness, [sup]24 [/sup]but to those who are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. [sup]25 [/sup]Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
This is a priceless piece of wisdom ...
The Church is a hierarchy; none of your verses prove otherwise. The three-fold Episcopate, bishop/priest/deacon is in the Bible. Your system doesn't even come close. You have don't even have bishops, but you think you possess greater authority. You don't. I don't.
Jesus Wants Us to Obey Apostolic Authority
Acts 5:13 - the people acknowledged the apostles' special authority and did not dare take it upon themselves.
Acts 15:6,24; 16:4 - the teaching authority is granted to the apostles and their successors. This teaching authority must be traced to the original apostles, or the authority is not sanctioned by Christ.
Rom. 15:16 – Paul says he is a minister of Christ Jesus to the Gentiles in the priestly service of the gospel of God, so that the offering of the Gentiles may be acceptable. This refers to the ministerial priesthood of the ordained which is distinguishable from the universal priesthood of the laity. Notice the Gentiles are the “sacrifice” and Paul does the “offering.”
1 Cor. 5:3-5; 16:22; 1 Tim. 1:20; Gal 1:8; Matt 18:17 – these verses show the authority of the elders to excommunicate / anathemize ("deliver to satan").
2 Cor. 2:17 - Paul says the elders are not just random peddlers of God's word. They are actually commissioned by God. It is not self-appointed authority.
2 Cor. 3:6 – Paul says that certain men have been qualified by God to be ministers of a New Covenant. This refers to the ministerial priesthood of Christ handed down the ages through sacramental ordination.
2 Cor. 5:20 - Paul says we are "ambassadors" for Christ. This means that the apostles and their successors share an actual participation in Christ's mission, which includes healing, forgiving sins, and confecting the sacraments.
2 Cor. 10:6 – in reference to the ordained, Paul says that they are ready to punish every disobedience. The Church has the authority excommunicate those who disobey her.
2 Cor. 10:8 - Paul acknowledges his authority over God's people which the Lord gave to build up the Church.
1 Thess. 5:12-13 - Paul charges the members of the Church to respect those who have authority over them.
2 Thess. 3:14 - Paul says if a person does not obey what he has provided in his letter, have nothing to do with him.
1 Tim. 5:17 - Paul charges the members of the Church to honor the appointed elders (“priests”) of the Church.
Titus 2:15 - Paul charges Timothy to exhort and reprove with all authority, which he received by the laying on of hands.
Heb. 12:9 – in the context of spiritual discipline, the author says we have had earthly fathers (referring to the ordained leaders) to discipline us and we respected them.
Heb. 13:7,17 - Paul charges the members of the Church to remember and obey their leaders who have authority over their souls.
1 Peter 2:18 - Peter charges the servants to be submissive to their masters whether kind and gentle or overbearing.
1 Peter 5:5; Jude 8 - Peter and Jude charge the members of the Church to be subject to their elders.
2 Peter 2:10 - Peter warns the faithful about despising authority. He is referring to the apostolic authority granted to them by Christ.
3 John 9 - John points out that Diotrephes does not acknowledge John's apostolic authority and declares that this is evil.
Deut. 17:10-13 - the Lord commands His faithful Israel to obey the priests that He puts in charge, and do to all that they direct and instruct. The Lord warns that those who do not obey His priests shall die.
Num. 16:1-35 - Korah incited a "protestant" rebellion against God's chosen Moses in an effort to confuse the distinction between the ministerial and universal offices of priesthood, and Korah and his followers perished. (This effort to blind the distinctions between the priests and the laity is still pursued by dissidents today.)
Sirach 7:29-30 - with all your soul fear the Lord and honor His priests, love your Maker and do not forsake His ministers. God is not threatened by the authority He gives His children! God, as our Loving Father, invites us to participate in His plan of salvation with His Son Jesus. Without authority in the Church, there is error, chaos and confusion.
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Choir Loft
Why do protestants wail on Catholics so much? I defy anyone to approach a nun and tell her to her face, after spending a lifetime in the service of Christ, that she isn't going to heaven.
Take the log out of your own eyes before you accuse a brother of a speck in his.
but that's just me, hollering from the choir loft....
Take the log out of your own eyes before you accuse a brother of a speck in his.
but that's just me, hollering from the choir loft....
I agree.
I don't know a Catholic who doesn't own a Bible, personally. It's innuendo like that which destroys the legitimate debate and disagreement that we do have. I have been a part of Protestant churches where over 90% of the congregation did not carry a Bible to services; so we have our own problems in that arena.
I don't know a Catholic who doesn't own a Bible, personally. It's innuendo like that which destroys the legitimate debate and disagreement that we do have. I have been a part of Protestant churches where over 90% of the congregation did not carry a Bible to services; so we have our own problems in that arena.
It's nice to see your involvement HammerStone. I hear you. I will do all I can to be a peace maker
You do notice I haven't bothered to reply.
There are more important things than swinging a sword. But when a battle erupts I'm not going to be like David and say at home, that's exactly where he was when he first seen Bathsheba.
It's a miracle the same sword that brings death also brings life. Lets just say the day is near when my sword will become the plow.
Most times in the NT when Jesus to took up the sword, it was against those that denied His salvation.
That is all I ask of Catholics
You do notice I haven't bothered to reply.
There are more important things than swinging a sword. But when a battle erupts I'm not going to be like David and say at home, that's exactly where he was when he first seen Bathsheba.
It's a miracle the same sword that brings death also brings life. Lets just say the day is near when my sword will become the plow.
Most times in the NT when Jesus to took up the sword, it was against those that denied His salvation.
That is all I ask of Catholics
Kepha is right, there is a hierarchy in the church, our Lords church, God, Jesus, HolySpirit, You.
Everything else is men. mens opinions, mens hierarchy, mens wisdom, mens works, mens... well the list goes on.
In all His Love
Everything else is men. mens opinions, mens hierarchy, mens wisdom, mens works, mens... well the list goes on.
In all His Love
Catholics bad? No, I'd just say that my other family members (the human family) are deceived. And they're deceived by their leaders, whom I'm hoping are just as deceived as well, and not deliberatly leading the flock, my family, away.
A reason I have a problem with Catholocism, is because of their rejection of Sola Scriptura. The Bible is to be the final decision, upon every doctrine is made. The term sola scriptura did not exist beforehand, but the concept existed. I can make mention of the Waldenses, as that is the only one that comes to my memory at this point. They rejected the Catholic Faith. They were Protestants, before the Word Protestant came into play.
When a Roman Catholic is sometimes brought into the narrow path, that scriptures advocate, the rejection of Sola Scriptura is put forth. This is nothing but a sheer defense mechanism when they are shown to be in error. For example, when stating the Bible says that it is demonic to forbid people to marry, it is made to believe that it is actually not demonic to them, by the reasoning of men. This is vain Philosophy. The philosophy of the Church one where it tries to workaround the various blatant statements. For example, thou shalt not make any graven image, nor bow thyself down before them, nor serve them. However the church teaches that it is okay for their flock to bow, so long as they do not worship. This is an error, as God said "do not bow" before the images. Worse yet, sometimes the cheribuim issue is brought up, to sanction what they are doing. Again, this is vain philosophy. The Bible says DO NOT DO THIS, but it is continually explained away by the Church.
My family members, who are part of the Roman Church - do not be deceived. If your boss tells you, do not do something while you are at work, are you going to find a way to do it, and then use his own words to back up what your boss specifically said NOT to do?
A reason I have a problem with Catholocism, is because of their rejection of Sola Scriptura. The Bible is to be the final decision, upon every doctrine is made. The term sola scriptura did not exist beforehand, but the concept existed. I can make mention of the Waldenses, as that is the only one that comes to my memory at this point. They rejected the Catholic Faith. They were Protestants, before the Word Protestant came into play.
When a Roman Catholic is sometimes brought into the narrow path, that scriptures advocate, the rejection of Sola Scriptura is put forth. This is nothing but a sheer defense mechanism when they are shown to be in error. For example, when stating the Bible says that it is demonic to forbid people to marry, it is made to believe that it is actually not demonic to them, by the reasoning of men. This is vain Philosophy. The philosophy of the Church one where it tries to workaround the various blatant statements. For example, thou shalt not make any graven image, nor bow thyself down before them, nor serve them. However the church teaches that it is okay for their flock to bow, so long as they do not worship. This is an error, as God said "do not bow" before the images. Worse yet, sometimes the cheribuim issue is brought up, to sanction what they are doing. Again, this is vain philosophy. The Bible says DO NOT DO THIS, but it is continually explained away by the Church.
My family members, who are part of the Roman Church - do not be deceived. If your boss tells you, do not do something while you are at work, are you going to find a way to do it, and then use his own words to back up what your boss specifically said NOT to do?
You left something out. See post #228 that lists 2 dozen+ scriptures (that you ignored) that show that Jesus wants us to obey Apostolic Authority that your community, whatever it is, doesn't have.
Why don't you come out and say it? You mean the Catholic Church, don't you? I feel sorry for you to be lost in such confusion. This is what your bible cult has taught you so you accept their opinions as infallible. Or you like many other lost souls in here are your own pope in a church of one. Or are you a Seventh Day Adventist?
The Church is an organized visible fellowship. Because it is divine institution and dynamism, the Holy Spirit dwells in it, keeping it alive, keeping it true, and making it grow. The Spirit is the source of the life of the Church, but that life is the life of a body.
The body is made up of many members who are distinguished one from the other by functions for which they have a fixed structure. In the Body, the bishops have the function of teaching and guiding, and this task they perform through the power of the Spirit who transfuses the whole Body, making each member effective in his function.
The Body is one, and so the episcopate is one, and the unity of the episcopate is achieved through solidarity with the prime source of Episcopal power, the Bishop of Rome. In the Catholic vision the pope teaches in the name of the episcopate and the episcopate teaches in the name of the Church and the Church teaches in the name of Christ, and Christ teaches in the name of God.
Matt. 16:18; 18:18 - Jesus uses the word "ecclesia" only twice in the New Testament Scriptures, which demonstrates that Jesus intended a visible, unified, hierarchical, and authoritative Church.
Acts 20:17,28 - Paul refers to both the elders or priests ("presbyteroi") and the bishops ("episkopoi") of the Church. Both are ordained leaders within the hierarchical structure of the Church.
1 Cor. 12:28 - God Himself appoints the various positions of authority within the Church. As a loving Father, God gives His children the freedom and authority to act with charity and justice to bring about His work of salvation.
Eph. 4:11 - the Church is hierarchical and includes apostles, prophets, pastors, and teachers, all charged to build up the Church. The Church is not an invisible entity with an invisible foundation.
Phil. 1:1 - Paul addresses the bishops and deacons of the Church. They can all trace their unbroken lineage back to the apostles.
1 Tim. 3:1; Titus 1:7 - Christ's Church has bishops ("episkopoi") who are direct successors of the apostles. The bishops can trace the authority conferred upon them back to the apostles.
1 Tim. 5:17; Titus 1:5; James 5:14 - Christ's Church also has elders or priests ("presbyteroi") who serve the bishops.
1 Tim. 3:8 - Christ's Church also has deacons ("diakonoi"). Thus, Jesus Christ's Church has a hierarchy of authority - bishops, priests and deacons, who can all trace their lineage back to Peter and the apostles.
Exodus 28:1 and 19:6 – shows the three offices of the Old Testament priesthood:
(1). high priest – Aaron (Ex. 28:1);
(2). Ministerial priests – Aaron’s sons (Ex. 19:6; 28:1); and
(3). Universal priests – Israel (Ex. 19:6).
The New Testament priesthood also has three offices:
(1) High Priest – Jesus Christ (Heb. 3:1);
(2) Ministerial priests – the ordained bishops and priests (Rom. 15:16; 1 Tim. 3:1,8; 5:17; Titus 1:7); and
(3) Universal priests - all the baptized (1 Pet. 2:5,9; Rev. 1:6).
You insult the Church Jesus founded, ignore dozens of scriptures, preach evangelical Manachaenism that denies the divine/human characteristic of the Church, claim the Holy Spirit for yourself, and you do this "In all His Love"
The title of the thread is "Why are Catholics so bad?" That title alone makes it a magnet for Catholic bashers who don't have a clue about Catholic teaching. You, Forthwrite, axehead, mjrhealth, and Raeneske have all jumped on the anti-Catholic bandwagon in this page alone. I have lots of good things to share. You can find them on the other threads. You can click on the you tube links I post. I will give it a rest when the last anti-Catholic gets the last word and makes an utter fool of themselves.
Well, Raeneske, here is your chance to prove it. This link takes you to Pope B16s 3 encyclicals. These are the latest official teachings of the Church. I know you won't read them, but somebody might. I'm betting you will scurry off like a scared rabbit and make no mention of what the Church actually teaches. You are much happier with the garbage bible cults claim the Catholic Church teaches. It's much more thrilling than the truth. So go ahead, Raeneske. Prove the deception, quote something with a bit of context.
No Protestant has been able to successfully prove this. The best you can do is prove material sufficiency, which Catholics accept. The concept of formal sufficiency did not exist until the 15th century when Martin Luther invented it. You haven't a shred of evidence to prove it existed before this.
Dissent from the Church isn't anything new. The Waldenses started off as extreme Catholics, taking vows of poverty to excess.
They already left the Church, THEN they joined the reformers. Neither Waldo nor his early disciples could have subscribed to any historic Baptist confession of faith, and those doctrines that are peculiarly baptistic would have been unacceptable to Waldenses in any period of their history. Although successionists have hailed them as Baptists, medieval Waldenses were quite similar to the Catholic Franciscans, those of the Reformation were akin to Presbyterians, and those of today have become Methodists.
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Really? Sola scriptura is not in the bible, is man made, is unworkable, illogical, and Protestants have failed to defend it.
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Your right. The Gnostics forbade marriage, not because they were following the teachings of Jesus and Paul on celibacy, but because they thought the flesh was evil. To say that Paul was condemning celibacy according to his own teaching is absolutely ludicrous.
Celibacy is NOT a doctrine. It is a discipline. There are married priests in the Catholic Church. Those who are celibate, freely choose to be so, they are not forced into the seminary. Unlike many Protestant churches, marriage is a sacrament in the CC. You are blowing forum flatulence with this one.
These same Gnostics that Paul wrote about are the same that John wrote about, who denied the Incarnation. These Gnostics forbade the eating of meat, which has nothing to do with fasting, but because they believed the meat itself was evil. These same Gnostics were also written about by Ignatius of Antioch, (who was trained by John the Apostle). These Gnostics denied the Real Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist, just like you.
This silly argument has been patiently explained to you at least 1000 times, yet still preach the same idiocy.
http://www.scripture...cramentals.html
http://www.catholic....worship-statues
It's not explained away, it's that you don't know your bible.
Deut. 5:9 - God's command, "you shall not bow down to them" means "do not worship them." But not all bowing is worship. Here God's command is connected to false worship.
Rev. 3:9 - Jesus said people would bow down before the faithful members of the church of Philadelphia. This bowing before the faithful is not worship, just as kissing a picture of a family member is not worship.
Gen. 19:1 - Lot bowed down to the ground in veneration before two angels in Sodom.
Gen. 24:52 - Abraham's servant bowed himself to the earth before the Lord.
Gen. 42:6 - Joseph's brothers bow before Joseph with the face to the ground.
Jos. 5:14 - Joshua fell to the ground prostrate in veneration before an angel.
1 Sam. 28:14 - Saul bows down before Samuel with his face to the ground in honor and veneration.
1 Kings 1:23 - the prophet Nathan bows down before King David.
2 Kings 2:15 - the sons of the prophets bow down to Elisha at Jericho.1 Chron. 21:21 - Ornan the Jebusite did obeisance to king David with his face to the ground.
1 Chron. 29:20 - Israelites bowed down to worship God and give honor to the king.
2 Chron. 29:29-30 - King Hezekiah and the assembly venerate the altar by bowing down in worship before the sin offerings.
Tobit 12:16 - Tobiah and Tobit fell down to the ground in veneration before the angel Raphael.
Judith 14:7 - Achior the Ammonite kneels before Judith venerating her and praising God.
Psalm 138:2 - David bows down before God's Holy Temple.
Dan. 2:46 - the king fell down on his face paying homage to Daniel and commands that an offering be made to him.
Dan. 8:17 - Daniel fell down prostrate in veneration before the angel Gabriel.
I'll bet that in a week or a month from now you will come up with the same false charges because you are unteachable. Your ‘magisterium’ has fed you a pack of lies and you hold them to be infallible. That is why you are so confused. In your pride and blindness you will run to the nearest “Bible-Christian” hate site for another list of anti-Catholic falsehoods. May God have mercy on your soul.
Thank you for providing a list of Biblical references of people bowing. I’m going to address a couple, and then show you something.
Psalm 138:2; Israel was to face towards the temple when they worshipped God. They were not bowing “To the temple”. It was just the direction they were to face, when worshipping. They were to face the temple, because the sun would be at their backs. We can see in blatant apostasy however, that Israel actually turned their backs to the Temple of God, and worshipped facing the sun (Ezekiel 8:16).
2 Chronicles 29:29-30; Does not show them venerating any alter. In verse 27, it shows they burnt offerings upon the alter, and sang songs to the Lord. In verse 31 it shows they have consecrated themselves to the Lord. When they were bowing in worship, they were not worshipping a dumb alter. They were worshipping the Lord.
Deuteronomy 5:8-9 - Thou shalt not make thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the waters beneath the earth: Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me,
Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them, nor serve them. Kepha, you have no provided me Biblical Evidence, that God commanded people to bow down before idols. You have showed me, where people have bowed before people – This I have seen. But where is the evidence, that God commanded them to bow down before statues? Did God tell them to do this? No, He did not. Scriptures have been very plain on that point. God said no. Please provide me with where in the Bible God told them to bow down reverencing a statue. God has rejected every hint of idolatry.
In Daniel chapter 3, we see Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego refusing to bow before the idol. If they could have bowed before the idol, without actually “worshipping” it, don’t you think they would have done so? These three however knew how very plain God was about this. Do you honestly think every person there that day was actually worshipping that dumb golden statue King Nebuchadnezzar had? They were threatened with being burned to death in a fiery furnace. Some were obviously bowing out of fear, not to worship. But God is plain, thou shalt not bow before any graven image. – Period. There were no if, ands, and buts about that statement.
You should not even appear to bow down before idols because, 1 Thessalonians 5:22 - Abstain from all appearance of evil. With all that being said, there is no Biblical foundation at all, to support bowing down in front of statues. All of it is evil, end of story. So no, my Bible does not tell me that bowing down before statues is Okay.
There are married priests – those who were married before becoming priests. I have talked with many Catholics on this point. Paul advocated being single, it is good for a man not to touch a woman. I do not disagree with this. However, what did Paul say? If they cannot contain themselves, let them marry. Paul advocated being single, but he did not require it. Yes, I am aware; many Catholics say this is not something that is set in stone about the Catholic Church. That doesn’t make it any less evil. If I decided to tell my family to take the Lord’s name in vain, is it any less of evil, simply because I say “It’s not written in stone, it can change”? Of course, people have the choice to choose whether they want to marry or not. But you cannot forbid them to marry. They are in fact being forbidden to marry is what makes this evil. That is a doctrine of devils, you cannot do that. You can advocate celibacy – fine. You cannot however, forbid them to marry. End of story. To do that, is demonic.
No Protestant has sufficiently proven it? I honestly doubt that, but I’ll give it a go.
Isaiah 8:20 says - To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
Okay, so first hint, is that if someone does not speak according to this word, it is because there is no light in them. Kepha, if a church comes along claiming that they have all the Biblical knowledge, and that no other church is right, and that their church is completely infallible, yet, they contradict the Bible, whose right? Is the church right, or the Word of God? Let’s say it’s not the Catholic Church in this instance. Let’s say its Pentecostals. (Sorry if anyone is one, not making fun, just using an example). If the Pentecostal church claims that someone they’re church was started by Jesus, and that only they can interpret the Word, and that they only hold the truth, and yet they contradict the Bible on many points of their doctrine, who’s right? Whom do you believe? Do you believe what the Bible says, or what the Pentecostal Church says? Let’s say the Pentecostal Church claims they put the Bible together, and they only hold the right interpretation. But let’s say, now they also teach that you should commit adultery every 3[sup]rd[/sup] Wednesday of the month to be saved; Are you going to believe this church, and that only they are right? Or are you going to believe what the Bible says, wherein it shows you that they are in error?
2 Timothy 3:16-17 - All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.
All scripture is given by inspiration of God. And just to be clear, we’re talking about the Word of God here, in verse 15 it’s addressed about these Holy Scriptures, which Timothy has known from His youth. Verse 15 says the Bible is able to make you wise unto salvation. The Bible, is profitable for doctrine, reproof, correction, and instruction in righteousness – And don’t miss this please – that the man of God may be perfect – Not mediocre, not barely living, not Okay, not simply alright – but perfect. Are you starting to see why we believe in Sola Scriptura? With all the false churches out there, where is your guide? Your guide is the Bible, it is a lamp. It will light the way, always. I don’t care, and you shouldn’t care, dear Kepha, if your church says they’re infallible. You shouldn’t care, if your church says they’re the ones who put together the Bible, or if they claim Jesus established their church. As far as any child of God should be concerned, if they are not speaking according to the Word of God, there is no light in that church, plain and simple.
Catholic Bashers, who don’t have a clue about Catholic teaching. No, we just expose the Catholic Church for what it’s doing. When you try to expose a Protestant Church, are you “Protestant Bashing”? Do you have every idea, clue, and inkling about every teaching within the Protestant Church? No? So then, why can I not as a Protestant, accuse you of “Protestant Bashing”? Are you jumping on the “Anti-Protestant bandwagon” with the rest of the Catholics? Enough with the name calling. We are Christians, not first graders. “Tattle-tale!” Why? Because someone told the teacher you stole 20 boxes of crayons? No, more like doing what is right. So, when we try to expose the Catholic Teachings, it is no different, than when you try to expose Protestant teachings.
… Wow, those are long. I was not expecting that, so it doesn’t surprise me that someone wouldn’t actually read it. I don’t know if you’ve ever seen comments before like “TL;DR”. If you haven’t it means too long, didn’t read. That would probably come from people upon seeing a list like that. Tell you what though, I’ll honestly look at it – I am not saying I will read it all – and you respond to this post thus far.P.S. Would like you maybe a book on what Ellen White wrote? I can link you to a book, that way maybe you could also learn what some Protestants believe.
All I had to demonstrate is that not all bowing is worship, something you failed to grasp. Using bold font didn't help.
No one is forbidden to marry in the Catholic Church, with exceptions such as to family members, coercion, living in common law, etc. Priests cannot marry because they choose not to, and have made solemn vows to God to remain single for the sake of the kingdom. You need to read the story of the rich young man.
If an atheist university professor chooses to remain single so he can dedicate his life to his work, the world admires his dedication. But if a Christian chooses to dedicate his entire life, including his sexuality to God, suddenly its demonic. Yea, I hear you.
Isaiah 8:20 "To the law and to the testimony" means the written word is equal with the spoken word, something you deny. This verse backfires on you. You also deny the importance of oral tradition in Judaism, because your man made cult is more removed from Judaism than is Protestantism.
2 Timothy 3:12-17
[12] Indeed all who desire to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted,
[13] while evil men and impostors will go on from bad to worse, deceivers and deceived.
[14] But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have firmly believed, (Tradition) knowing from whom you learned it (Magisterium)
[15] and how from childhood you have been acquainted with the sacred writings which are able to instruct you for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. (Scriptures)
[16] All scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,
[17] that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work.
Note verse 14. It admonishes Timothy to do three things:
1) Remember what you have learned and firmly believed (Tradition)
2) Know from whom you learned it (Magisterium)
3) Know you have the Scriptures
The Bible on St. Paul's list comes in third, not first. He actually gives here the traditional Catholic teaching on the three sources of sound teaching.
In verse 15 he goes into an excursus on the Bible. This brief excursus emphasizes the value of the Bible and recommends a fourfold method of exegesis. This verse was used in the pre-Deformation Church as a proof text for the Quadriga which was the standard Catholic approach to the Bible. The Quadriga method used the following four categories:
Literal/Literary (teaching) - the text as it is written
Analogical (reproof) - matters of faith
Anagogical (correction) - matters of hope/prophecy
Moral (training in righteousness) - matters of charity
The analogical, anagogical and moral senses of the Bible were known collectively as the spiritual senses.
The 'reformers' rejected the BIBLICAL fourfold method of exegesis in favor of a more literal approach, and ignored 2 Tim 3:12-17.
Catechism of the Catholic Church:
CCC115 According to an ancient tradition, one can distinguish between two senses of Scripture: the literal and the spiritual, the latter being subdivided into the allegorical, moral and anagogical senses. The profound concordance of the four senses guarantees all its richness to the living reading of Scripture in the Church.
116 The literal sense is the meaning conveyed by the words of Scripture and discovered by exegesis, following the rules of sound interpretation: "All other senses of Sacred Scripture are based on the literal." 83
117 The spiritual sense. Thanks to the unity of God's plan, not only the text of Scripture but also the realities and events about which it speaks can be signs.
(1) The allegorical sense. We can acquire a more profound understanding of events by recognizing their significance in Christ; thus the crossing of the Red Sea is a sign or type of Christ's victory and also of Christian Baptism. 84
(2) The moral sense. The events reported in Scripture ought to lead us to act justly. As St. Paul says, they were written "for our instruction". 85
(3) The anagogical sense (Greek: anagoge, "leading"). We can view realities and events in terms of their eternal significance, leading us toward our true homeland: thus the Church on earth is a sign of the heavenly Jerusalem. 86
118 A medieval couplet summarizes the significance of the four senses:
The Letter speaks of deeds; Allegory to faith; The Moral how to act; Anagogy our destiny. 87
You can't expose something you have pre-invented.
I have to speak in general terms when discussing reformist heresies. Being specific is hard to do with thousands of conflicitng Protestant denoms all having the Holy Spirit leading them. Few in here want to reveal what set of doctrines they follow. It's even worse when you have individual non-denominationalists each with their own set of doctrines, most of which don't make any sense. The "me, the Bible and the Holy Spirit" mentality. But I had you pegged as a SDA a long time ago. Besides, if I am guilty of Protestant bashing, quote me or knock off the slander.
P.S. Would like you maybe a book on what Ellen White wrote? I can link you to a book, that way maybe you could also learn what some Protestants believe.
Seventh-Day Adventism cannot change its views on the Catholic Church being the Whore of Babylon without admitting that it was wrong on Sunday worship. It cannot admit that Sunday worship is not the mark of the beast without changing its views on the Jewish Sabbath. Seventh-Day Adventism cannot cease to be anti-Catholic without ceasing to be Seventh-Day Adventism. SDA exposed. If you find something inaccurate, let me know.
Ellen White was an occultist who wrote by channeling, known by both Protestant and Catholic counsellors as demonic activity.
How about, They twist the scriptures, They twist the original Greek texts and their teachings aren't in the BIble.
exept the basic Christian teachings, As the devil puts some truth into every false religion in order to deceive people.
Christians aren't catholics, And catholics aren't Christians.
This isn't worth commenting on, because you haven't said anything of substance. No proof, no documentation, no argument,
just raw hate. I would really like to know the name of your bible cult, who founded it, and when, unless you are of the "me, bible and Holy Spirit" crowd as your own pope in a church of one. That would mean you founded your own church the minute you formulated an opinion. Or maybe you are a klansman. Do you feel the same way towards Jews and blacks as you do Catholics? You don't want to keep me guessing, do you?
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