When did the devil first rebel against God?
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Why does this matter?
What positive would anyone gain from this discussion?
Maybe if you shared what you hoped to learn and the benefit of learning it....
.
What positive would anyone gain from this discussion?
Maybe if you shared what you hoped to learn and the benefit of learning it....
.
Yes it is a silly topic, made even more ridiculous as a Poll as the actual answer isn't even included in the selection lol. So I'll just provide it here... the originall rebellion and sin is;
(Gen 3:6) And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
(Rom 5:12) Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
(Rom 6:23) For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
(Rom 5:15) But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.
Sin and death came from Adam.
But what Christian doesn't know that?
Peace,
Whitestone
(Gen 3:6) And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
(Rom 5:12) Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
(Rom 6:23) For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
(Rom 5:15) But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.
Sin and death came from Adam.
But what Christian doesn't know that?
Peace,
Whitestone
I think it is pretty obvious by the Ezekiel account that iniquity was found in Satan in the Angelic realm.
It was probably after that when he tempted Eve in genesis.
Because before he tempted Eve he was described as a crafty serpent who did not tell the truth.
It was probably after that when he tempted Eve in genesis.
Because before he tempted Eve he was described as a crafty serpent who did not tell the truth.
Quite a non-scriptural reply. Nothing in Ezekiel about a supernatural demon in the angelic realm though. Good sci-fi material though.
It know that some folk use Ezek 28 to try to prove their point, but they never read it before saying so, because the person is identified as a "Man"...
(Eze 28:2)
Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thine heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, I am a God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas; yet thou art a man, and not God, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God:
I know many think so but not all accept it - it is not the one universally accepted Christian doctrine, eh?
I think we need to rethink "as by one man sin entered into the world," as we know that the serpent was sinning in the garden and Eve sinned before Adam sinned. So th eonly way he could have brought sin into the world isif he was a sinner when he got there before the toher two.
[Suggesting he was a federal head is convenient but unsatisfactory as it begs the question: why does GOD need to create us sinful, sickly and dying to be able to have a perfect realationship with us?]
With one man sin entered the world is to the pre-conception existence thinking that Adam, coming to earth into his body, as a sinner already, brought his sin with him (as Eve brought hers and satan brought his) and rides on the doctrine that GOD created us good, not sinful and dead, and that we were all created as ingenuous innocents able to make a true free will choice by which some of HIS elect chose to become evil in HIS sight.
And Satan is described as crafty alright but atually it is "more crafty" than the other animals wich says something about sin, no? Like, just how crafty were they? And these supposed perfect animals without sin are judged in the flood with man, Gen 6:7 So the Lord said, “I will wipe mankind, whom I have created, from the face of the earth—men and animals, and creatures that move along the ground, and birds of the air—for I am grieved that I have made them.”
Let's consider also that before HE told Adam that HE had a small bad thing (in a completely perfect world) to fix by getting him married, HE ordered him not to eat of the tree. So what are Adam's options right here? If he accepts GOD in whatever form he saw HIM as GOD, then to obey makes him righteous, right?
Well, it does unless he is already a sinner then this work of obedience does not make him righteous at all. So let's look for signs whether he was righteous or sinful after the command.
So what does Adam do next? He tries to find his wife among the animals. (Giving the animals names is just a red herring to get us off the question, "What the heck was Adam doing looking among the animals for his wife? Do we think that GOD wanted him to do that? Do we think he was following GOD when he did that? Not very likely at all when put like that, eh?
Ok, ok, I hear you...GOD's creation was called good and very good by then, right? So there could be no sin?
Gen. 1:31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.
1.
This verse:
2 Peter 2:4 - For if GOD spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell (literally: Tartarus) and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgement.
is in this “everything,” since it is common knowledge that Satan and the angles fell before the garden as proven by the snake arriving in a fallen state before Adam and Eve (supposedly) sinned in the garden.
So sometimes everything does not mean everything. Perhaps it does not include some things outside of the area being talked about OR perhaps something (someone) is bad but since it was used by God to further God's purpose then this situation with a bad thing being used for the good of His purpose could be summed up as good.
So the fact that Adam and Eve are not mentioned as sinning in the garden yet, and are included in being very good, does not prove their moral goodness, only that their creation and the creation of the earth and the garden serves God's purpose.
All of the arguments that they had to be morally good in the garden as God cannot create evil depends upon their bodies being created for them in the Garden as descriptive of their first and original creation, which causes the theological difficulties of some of these verses.
[Of course such argument ignores our (supposedly) being created under the sin of Adam, ie not good, sick and sinful unto death).
If it is accepted that their original creation was as spirits in the spirit world (Sheol) where they may have sinned before the creation of the physical universe, then there is no need to ascribe them perfection of moral purpose in the garden.
Adam looking for his mate among the animals was a foolishness born of sin, a sin he brought with him from sheol and which would cause him to learn the hard way that a helpmeet as sinful as himself was no helper at all and that the snake did not make a good teacher, garden neighbour or friend.
Peace, Ted
Nice try. read eze 28:11 - 16
Furthermore .... Satan was described as a crafty serpent and liar before he tempted Eve.
I stand by what I said in attempting to answer the question in the OP.
Some ask why is it important to understand this matter from God's Word.
Ans: cannot fully understand the end without first understanding the beginning. That applies to what Satan did also.
Ans: cannot fully understand the end without first understanding the beginning. That applies to what Satan did also.
This thread is based on misunderstandings of scripture. The term "the devil" means "the evil". "Evil is rebellion against God". The serpent in the garden rebelled against God by calling God a liar and tempting the woman to sin against God. Eve and Adam rebelled against God by believing the Lies of the serpent.
200 of the Holy messengers rebelled against God by leaving their posts and mating with woman in the days of Noah and God buried them alive in the desert in the middle east awaiting their judgement at the end.
Men, Woman and children are the ones who spread the infection of rebellion through the spreading of Lies to this very day. Not to worry, The plan of God is right on schedule and will not be delayed. Everything and everyone is about to be put in their proper place real soon. Which brings us to the importance of asking God for His Spirit .
Satan is a Hebrew word that means nothing more than "The adversary of God". There are many adversaries everywhere. Even Peter was playing the part of the adversary in this following Scripture where Christ called him satan "The adversary of God.
Matthew 16
23 But He turned and said to Peter, "Get behind Me, Satan! You are an offense to Me, for you are not mindful of the things of God, but the things of men."
In this case the adversary was a man who was mindfull of the things of man.
200 of the Holy messengers rebelled against God by leaving their posts and mating with woman in the days of Noah and God buried them alive in the desert in the middle east awaiting their judgement at the end.
Men, Woman and children are the ones who spread the infection of rebellion through the spreading of Lies to this very day. Not to worry, The plan of God is right on schedule and will not be delayed. Everything and everyone is about to be put in their proper place real soon. Which brings us to the importance of asking God for His Spirit .
Satan is a Hebrew word that means nothing more than "The adversary of God". There are many adversaries everywhere. Even Peter was playing the part of the adversary in this following Scripture where Christ called him satan "The adversary of God.
Matthew 16
23 But He turned and said to Peter, "Get behind Me, Satan! You are an offense to Me, for you are not mindful of the things of God, but the things of men."
In this case the adversary was a man who was mindfull of the things of man.
Father of all lies...
We know that thefirst lie is told to Eve that we are made aware about.This is in Genesis chapter 3.
[sup]4 [/sup]And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
[sup]5 [/sup]For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
Being God is not about knowing good and evil. Even the Angels know good and evil.
Misleading and a lie as well as the lie he said about them being gods. They would gain no power and knowing good and evil does not make you gods.
I believe these are the first lies. Why? Because the angels and Satan already knew right from wrong and the angels could not be lied to.They knew what Adam and Eve didn't.
Satan was very much a being. Too often people confuse the word used for adversary as being a mindset rather than a person.
The evidence is in the bible. God cannot lie and his word shows Satan is a being.
[sup]6 [/sup]Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.
[sup]7 [/sup]And the Lord said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
[sup]8 [/sup]And the Lord said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?
[sup]9 [/sup]Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, Doth Job fear God for nought?
He is the accuser and he is the adversary of man. Satan told a lie and he is clearly a being rather than a mind set.
The Jews believed many other things like the story of Abraham and his Father who was said to be an idol maker.
Abraham had the argument with him that they were idols of stone and wood and could do nothing.
One night Abraham made a point by smashing all the other idols up and leaving only one idol with the implement he used.
The next morning Abrahams Father came in to find all his idols smashed and the implement used next to the one idol left.
He was angry and asked who could have possibly done all this. Abraham told him. There is one idol/god left so he must have done it using the implement next to him. Angry and annoyed Abrahams Father replied. " Don't be stupid it can't move or do anything. At that point Abraham admitted he had done it and his Father conceded that they were just wood and plaster.
There are many things the Jews believed that Christians and others do not get to know about.
Other books not in our bible which the Jews believed. But for man Satan got involved and lies started the fall in Genesis.
He is definitely a being.
Satan the adversary of God has always been mixed in with the sons of God. It is the parable of the wheat and the tares.
Satan "the adversary of God" is passed from human to human by the medium of the air. The only being he has is human and human perversion.
The scriptures does not support the above. I am always willing to be corrected if I am in error but there are two things which I am sure about.
1. God cannot and does not lie.
2. He never misleads by writing or allowing anything untrue in his word.
The Old Testament was not written in latin it was written in ancient Hebrew and when translated they had to use words which were the nearest in meaning by the Jewish Scholars.
In the history of Judaism we find that Satan somehow sneaked into the garden in the guise of a serpent.
In the New Testament we see something very important...
John 13:2 & 27
[sup]2 [/sup]And supper being ended, the devil having now put into the heart of Judas Iscariot, Simon's son, to betray him;
King James Version (KJV)
[sup]27 [/sup]And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.
Who put what in his heart? Why would Satan need to enter him and how can he put something in his heart if it is already there?
As Christ had taught...
[sup]15 [/sup]There is nothing from without a man, that entering into him can defile him: but the things which come out of him, those are they that defile the man.
[sup]16 [/sup]If any man have ears to hear, let him hear.
So how did Satan enter him and why was it necessary if he had already put it in his heart to betray Christ?
How can Satan stand before God as the accuser of men if he does not exist?
Revelation 12.
[sup]7 [/sup]And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
[sup]8 [/sup]And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
[sup]9 [/sup]And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
[sup]10 [/sup]And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.
[sup]11 [/sup]And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.
We need to check what we believe. We need to remember that what we believe can affect what is said in the book of Revelations and elsewhere.
[sup]7 [/sup]And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
[sup]8 [/sup]And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
If not a person why refer to him as a him why not a her or a it?
I see nothing in scripture that does not suggest that Satan is a being.
Lot of wonderings on this Biblical matter here, obviously. But what Satan, the dragon, "that old serpent", and called the Devil, did with tempting Eve was not his original rebellion against God.
Afterall, you'll notice his tempting Eve had nothing to do with drawing a third of the stars with him in rebellion like Rev.12:3-4 reveals to us. Nor did his tempting Eve in God's Garden have anything to do with the ten horned, seven headed, seven crowned beast system declared along with that time of his first rebellion per Rev.12:3-4.
Rev 12:3-4
3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
(KJV)
The symbolic "woman" of Rev.12 clothed with the sun, the moon under her feet, and a crown of 12 stars on her head was revealed by Joseph's dream as Israel (Gen.37). Her Child that was to be born is a symbol for the Seed of the woman, Christ Jesus Who was to be born of the "woman". That is pointing back to Satan's rebellion prior to Eve, and then to his tempting Eve later in God's Garden preparing to devour her Seed (see Gen.3:15).
The "emnity" between Satan's servants on earth, and the Seed of the woman with Eve being tempted is what began sin specifically in the flesh. What Eve and Adam did by disobeying God then was not the very first sin ever though.
The very first sin ever was when Satan drew a third of the stars into rebellion with him against God.
In Ezekiel 28, God begins speaking about the king of Tyrus (rock), a pointer to the king of Tyre. But then He describes this certain one as an anointed covering cherub that was originally perfect in his ways serving God at His Altar, but then iniquity was found in him, i.e., he became evil. The idea of a cherub is a Heavenly order type being, not a flesh man. God says there this cherub was in His Eden, the Garden of God.
We know for certain no flesh king of Tyrus was ever in God's Eden, so by these descriptions it's easy to know God is only using the king of Tyrus as a title, or type, for Satan himself. Tyrus means 'rock', and that idea of a lower case "rock" is used about the opposite of God "our Rock" per Deuteronomy 32:31 in the Song of Moses.
Once that is understood how God is making a direct symbolic reference to Satan himself with the "king of Tyrus" title, and we read Ezekiel 28 again from the start, we find a specific sin God mentions the "prince of Tyrus" did, with God contrasting the "prince of Tyrus" with the "king of Tyrus" in the time sense...
Ezek 28:1-2
1 The word of the LORD came again unto me, saying,
2 Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thine heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, "I am a God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas"; yet thou art a man, and not God, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God:
(KJV)
Satan, the dragon, "that old serpent", called the Devil, sinned against God by wanting to be God in His Place, even saying, "I am God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas."
In Isaiah 14 we have this kind of symbolic reference to Satan's original rebellion once again. God begins by saying to take up a proverb for the king of Babylon. But then at Isaiah 14:12 He is addressing "Lucifer" ('O day starre' per original KJV) having fallen from Heaven. And God repeats Satan's sin of wanting to be The GOD, to sit in God's Place in the north, etc.
Isa 14:12-14
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, "I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High."
(KJV)
The flesh king of Babylon, Nebuchadnezzar, did not... fall from Heaven. God is talking about Satan, the dragon, that old serpent, called the Devil.
Why is all that important to understand for us as believers on The Father through His Son? Firstly, why did God put that information about Satan's original rebellion against Him in such proverbial or parable form? Why didn't He just reveal it outright, telling us directly without attaching any flesh role pagan kings to it used symbolically for Satan?
God did not give this to all to understand, apparently. But it's not really that difficult once one understands the descriptions in those Scriptures have things in them impossible to fit any flesh historical king or prince. An anointed covering cherub that was once in God's Garden of Eden serving Him at the stones of fire of His Altar in Heaven that later fallse from Heaven is not something applicable to a flesh king or man. It is very applicable to the heavenly cherub Satan though, who also has the image of a man.
One of the pagan doctrines of occultism is the idea that Satan is not a real entity, that he has no form or image, but merely serves as some negative force in the universe. That idea of pagan occultism couldn't be farther from God's Truth in His Word The Bible. Thus today Satan's servants have tried to plant that false idea among today's Churches, and some Churches have succumbed to that false doctrine that Satan is not a real entity with no image or form in the heavenly. It shouldn't be difficult to grasp how holding to that kind of doctrine will not allow understanding of what God showed us of what Satan first did against Him of old, when he first rebelled and fell from Heaven, and drew a third of the stars into rebellion with him.
Not understanding this matter per God's Word will also prevent understanding about a specific end time event that is coming, which will be the main function of the "great tribulation" which our Lord Jesus warned us of, as also His Apostles did like Paul and John. I speak of the final Antichrist that is coming. The act of someone setting themselves up as God, proclaiming themselves to be God, and exalt theirself above all that is even called God, or that is worshipped, is... the very first sin which Satan did against God to rebel against Him with. It was that specific sin which caused God to bring this present world time to see Who we would listen to and follow.
This present world time was never intended to be the time for God's Kingdom and Salvation to manifest on earth, it's the world to come under His Son that will be His Salvation manifested on earth, with Satan and the wicked destroyed. To not understand this difference is to lose focus in God's Word of what this present time is for, and why a final tempting through tribulation must come before our Lord Jesus will return to end it.
Afterall, you'll notice his tempting Eve had nothing to do with drawing a third of the stars with him in rebellion like Rev.12:3-4 reveals to us. Nor did his tempting Eve in God's Garden have anything to do with the ten horned, seven headed, seven crowned beast system declared along with that time of his first rebellion per Rev.12:3-4.
Rev 12:3-4
3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
(KJV)
The symbolic "woman" of Rev.12 clothed with the sun, the moon under her feet, and a crown of 12 stars on her head was revealed by Joseph's dream as Israel (Gen.37). Her Child that was to be born is a symbol for the Seed of the woman, Christ Jesus Who was to be born of the "woman". That is pointing back to Satan's rebellion prior to Eve, and then to his tempting Eve later in God's Garden preparing to devour her Seed (see Gen.3:15).
The "emnity" between Satan's servants on earth, and the Seed of the woman with Eve being tempted is what began sin specifically in the flesh. What Eve and Adam did by disobeying God then was not the very first sin ever though.
The very first sin ever was when Satan drew a third of the stars into rebellion with him against God.
In Ezekiel 28, God begins speaking about the king of Tyrus (rock), a pointer to the king of Tyre. But then He describes this certain one as an anointed covering cherub that was originally perfect in his ways serving God at His Altar, but then iniquity was found in him, i.e., he became evil. The idea of a cherub is a Heavenly order type being, not a flesh man. God says there this cherub was in His Eden, the Garden of God.
We know for certain no flesh king of Tyrus was ever in God's Eden, so by these descriptions it's easy to know God is only using the king of Tyrus as a title, or type, for Satan himself. Tyrus means 'rock', and that idea of a lower case "rock" is used about the opposite of God "our Rock" per Deuteronomy 32:31 in the Song of Moses.
Once that is understood how God is making a direct symbolic reference to Satan himself with the "king of Tyrus" title, and we read Ezekiel 28 again from the start, we find a specific sin God mentions the "prince of Tyrus" did, with God contrasting the "prince of Tyrus" with the "king of Tyrus" in the time sense...
Ezek 28:1-2
1 The word of the LORD came again unto me, saying,
2 Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thine heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, "I am a God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas"; yet thou art a man, and not God, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God:
(KJV)
Satan, the dragon, "that old serpent", called the Devil, sinned against God by wanting to be God in His Place, even saying, "I am God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas."
In Isaiah 14 we have this kind of symbolic reference to Satan's original rebellion once again. God begins by saying to take up a proverb for the king of Babylon. But then at Isaiah 14:12 He is addressing "Lucifer" ('O day starre' per original KJV) having fallen from Heaven. And God repeats Satan's sin of wanting to be The GOD, to sit in God's Place in the north, etc.
Isa 14:12-14
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, "I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High."
(KJV)
The flesh king of Babylon, Nebuchadnezzar, did not... fall from Heaven. God is talking about Satan, the dragon, that old serpent, called the Devil.
Why is all that important to understand for us as believers on The Father through His Son? Firstly, why did God put that information about Satan's original rebellion against Him in such proverbial or parable form? Why didn't He just reveal it outright, telling us directly without attaching any flesh role pagan kings to it used symbolically for Satan?
God did not give this to all to understand, apparently. But it's not really that difficult once one understands the descriptions in those Scriptures have things in them impossible to fit any flesh historical king or prince. An anointed covering cherub that was once in God's Garden of Eden serving Him at the stones of fire of His Altar in Heaven that later fallse from Heaven is not something applicable to a flesh king or man. It is very applicable to the heavenly cherub Satan though, who also has the image of a man.
One of the pagan doctrines of occultism is the idea that Satan is not a real entity, that he has no form or image, but merely serves as some negative force in the universe. That idea of pagan occultism couldn't be farther from God's Truth in His Word The Bible. Thus today Satan's servants have tried to plant that false idea among today's Churches, and some Churches have succumbed to that false doctrine that Satan is not a real entity with no image or form in the heavenly. It shouldn't be difficult to grasp how holding to that kind of doctrine will not allow understanding of what God showed us of what Satan first did against Him of old, when he first rebelled and fell from Heaven, and drew a third of the stars into rebellion with him.
Not understanding this matter per God's Word will also prevent understanding about a specific end time event that is coming, which will be the main function of the "great tribulation" which our Lord Jesus warned us of, as also His Apostles did like Paul and John. I speak of the final Antichrist that is coming. The act of someone setting themselves up as God, proclaiming themselves to be God, and exalt theirself above all that is even called God, or that is worshipped, is... the very first sin which Satan did against God to rebel against Him with. It was that specific sin which caused God to bring this present world time to see Who we would listen to and follow.
This present world time was never intended to be the time for God's Kingdom and Salvation to manifest on earth, it's the world to come under His Son that will be His Salvation manifested on earth, with Satan and the wicked destroyed. To not understand this difference is to lose focus in God's Word of what this present time is for, and why a final tempting through tribulation must come before our Lord Jesus will return to end it.
You really need to treat the Word of God with some respect Arnie.
Ezek 28 the entire chapter is all about the King of Tyrus in his God appointed position of authority over Israel and how he took advantage againt the Israelites.
"THE MAN" THE KING OF TYRUS. CHERUB THAT COVERED ISRAEL. WHO BECAME LIFTED UP. SHEESH CAN'T ANYONE READ???
The flowery wording the writer uses to describe this sure throws you into a frenzie of silly superstition though doesn't it!
Listen... no one is saying that whoever the 'satan' (adversary) was in the garden, was not a liar. Of course satan was telling a lie.
BUT>>> ONLY ADAM WAS IN COVENANT LAW RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD.
NO OTHER PERSON WAS IN A LAW RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD. ONLY ADAM.
WHOEVER THE 'SATAN' WAS WAS NOT UNDER LAW FROM GOD AND COULD LIE WITHOUT SIN. UNDERSTAND THIS BASIC BIBLE TEACHING...
THERE WAS NO SIN WHERE NO LAW WAS TRANSGRESSED.
You really need to repent of your doctrine of devils you attempt to push, you are a false teacher in doing so.
(Rom 4:15)
Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.
(Rom 5:13)
(For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
. .................................................................................
I think you well know per Ezekiel 28 that no literal flesh king of history ever was the "anointed cherub that covereth", nor ever in God's Garden of Eden serving God at the "stones of fire".
Ezek 28:14
14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
(KJV)
So the next question is, just what line of religious thought are you coming from whitestone? Why would you like to hide this "anointed cherub that covereth" idea God declares in Ezekiel 28 about the "king of Tyrus"?
Who do you really... represent, for anyone claiming to be following God's Word cannot deny this Ezek.28 Scripture point? A "cherub" is not a flesh being.
You simply speak lies as your father does.
Ezek 28 calls the King of Tyrus an Anointed cherub that covereth.
NEVER is there one reason for you to suggest he was otherwise than flesh, except that only because you love a lie.
The stones of fire were the Israelites!
Just like we are the living stones in the true Temple, purified by fire as described by Peter. You know what I mean or do I need to show you the scriptures?
You need to understand the mind and language of God. Otherwise you'll be sidetracked into silliness like this at ever turn.
Seek JESUS! Ask for His Holy Spirit of knowledge wisdom and understanding and He will open your eyes! It is true!
Peace
You put your foot in it again whitestone .....
eze 28:1 is describing the ruler of Tyre
eze 28:12 is concerning the king of Tyre
Lol, whatever you say arnie.
Ezek 28 the entire chapter is all about the King of Tyrus in his God appointed position of authority over Israel and how he took advantage against the Israelites.
And that is the Word of God and will never change regardless how much you kick against the facts.
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