You said,
"Couldn't we just look at more of what scripture says".
You should be telling that to Axehead.
What in the world has that got to do with Jesus dying Spiritually, And being made alive again Spiritually??.
[1]Jesus was talking to the Pharisees in Jn 7: 34 & Jn 8: 21.
And in Jn 13: 33, Jesus never said His disciples wouldn't go to heaven, He said he told the Pharisees that they wouldn't go.
Then He said to His disciples, "Now I say say to YOU, A new commandment I give unto you".
And as I said to them same to you...
Joh 13:33 Little children, yet a little while I am with you. Ye shall seek me: and as I said unto the Jews, Whither I go, ye cannot come;
so now I say to you.
So now I say to you, where I go, you cannot come.
The Diaglott has it...
John 13:33 O little children, yet a little with you I am. You will seek me; and as I said to the Jews:
That where I go, you not are able to come; even to you I say now.
We do not go there, He comes back here.
What Jesus said was, You will seek Me but not find Me because I'm going to heaven, And I told the pharisees that they can't come.
The Bible proves that Christians will go to heaven.
And show me the scripures please.
You quoted one scripture yourself, Or I should say, "YOU MISQUOTED SCRIPTURE"".
Actually, I C&Ped 'em. Pretty straightforward.
In Jn 14, Jesus tells us He is going to heaven to prepare a place for us, And He will come back again to take us to the place He has prepared for us, Wher did Jesus go?? TO HEAVEN, Where is the place that He prepared for us??. HEAVEN.
Where is He going to take us to??. HEAVEN.
This is talking about the pre-tribulation rapture.
Act 1:11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.
Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.
We are here for the Millenium and then the Father Himself comes to the earth bringing the temple with Him. If you are in heaven at this time, you are going to be very lonely.
Paul, [Who got the revelation from Jesus] Said we will go to heaven, 2 Cor 5: 1--8. Phil 1: 23.
Also see Rev 6: 9-10. Rev 7: 1-17. Rev 14: 2-5. all these say people go to heaven when they die.
2 Cor 5:1-8 says that it is prepared for us in heaven, same as John 14:2 says. Then John 14:3 says...
Joh 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
[2]We [Christians] are born again,NOW. Jn 1: 12--13. Jn 3: 3--8. James 1: 18. 1 Pet 1: 22--23. 1 Jn 5: 1--4.
John 1:12-13 No mention of going to heaven.
John 3:3-8 No mention of going to heaven although you might read John 3:13.
James 1:18 No mention of going to heaven.
1 Pet 1:22-23 No mention of going to heaven.
1 John 5:1-4 No mention of going to heaven.
Now as far as begotten verses born...
Joh 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
Joh 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
When does this occur? At the resurrection...
1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
1Co 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits;
afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
Else you render the scriptures invalid. Christ is the firstfruits.
Rom 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
and so on.
Joh 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
Are you invisible?
Jas 1:18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.
At the resurrection, again, 1 Cor 15:23
1Pe 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:
1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
When do we become incorruptible...
1Co 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
1Co 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
1Co 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
When? At the last trump, the return of Christ...
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
The dead rise first, then those alive and remaining are changed. When? At the return of Christ.
1Co 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
1Co 15:43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
1Co 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
1Co 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
1Co 15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
1Co 15:47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
1Co 15:48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
1Co 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
1Co 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
If you have flesh on your bones and blood coursing through your veins, you cannot inherit the Kingdom of God. You must be born as spirit in the resurrection to inherit the Kingdom. We are begotten now...
1Pe 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
1Jn 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.
1Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
Can we, in the flesh, sin? Yes...
1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
When we are born by a resurrection from the dead, we will not sin. We will then be spirit.
How come Jesus was made alive in His Spirit, if He never died Spiritually,
Jesus said He died Spiritually, And He ought to know, He was there.
For the truth, See my post on the subject.
Ah, the real question. Jesus Christ was stone cold dead for three days and three nights and lay in His tomb until His resurrection from the dead. At that time, He became the Firstborn among many brethren. We will be born at our resurrection at His coming.