Would the Real Elijah Please Come Forth!

101G said:

John the baptist is Elijah in spirit and power, (authority). but not in body, and soul. as for John 1:21 "And they asked him, What then? Art thou Elias? And he saith, I am not. Art thou that prophet? And he answered, No".

Click to expand...

Congratulations and welcome to the forum, Well done, you have just answered half the riddle Angelina is asking about.

Angelina said:

Q.1. What do believer's look for when determining who this Elijah is and do we really have to? :huh:

Click to expand...

We know that IF it be the spirit of Elijah that is to come, he will not announce himself. Bad news for terry, but I like him anyway.
Anyone else care to claim the mantel of Elijah?

thanks Angelina,

Is it not Jesus himself who is speaking to John in Revelation? If it is Jesus than he says that he will appoint his two witnesses and they shall prophecy 1,260 days.

that which John saw, happen already. revelation is a revealing. just as chapter 12 reveals Jesus Christ birth. yes, Jesus and only Jesus was speaking to John. the book of revelation is a three fold book, past, present, (then), and future. just because an event was shown in heaven dose not mean it didn't happen on earth. so John is getting a FULL revelation of Jesus.

P.S. the 1,260 days is the three 3 1/2 years of our Lord Jesus ministry.

101G

And Rev 12 past, present, (then), and future as well we agree again, I'm looking forward to watching your post

Angelina said:

I understand that. Are you saying then that the two witness scenario has already happened?
Blessings!

Click to expand...

I'm not and I'll let you two finish your conversation.

Angelina, thanks

Are you saying then that the two witness scenario has already happened? What I was saying was that Jesus was telling John in Revelation that he would send his two witnesses. If that has not happened [and I believe that it has not] then why did he call them his witnesses that he sends, if he were one of the witnesses coming with Elijah?

have not Elijah come?, and have not Christ come?. scripture, Matthew 17:11 "And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things.12 But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them. 13 Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist".

here in this one scripture the two witness are revealed. John and Jesus. one do believe the scriptures I hope.

P.S. as for Jesus witness. John 5:36 "But I have greater witness than that of John: (again both witness). for the works which the Father hath given me to finish, the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me". is Jesus the faithful witness. Revelation 1:5 "And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood.

the witness is on going, is not Jesus manifested in Spirit, (the Holy Spirit), and in Preaching?. scripture, Titus 1:1 "Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness; 2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began; 3 But hath in due times manifested his word through preaching, which is committed unto me according to the commandment of God our Saviour"

101G

Rex said:

Congratulations and welcome to the forum, Well done, you have just answered half the riddle Angelina is asking about.


We know that IF it be the spirit of Elijah that is to come, he will not announce himself. Bad news for terry, but I like him anyway.
Anyone else care to claim the mantel of Elijah?

Click to expand...

I have a son called Elijah, does that count? LOL

I think there is a propensity to equate Elijah with the two witnesses. They are not connected scripturally, except by the power gifts. I think it suffice for them to wait & see, & when this incredible unprecedented power display begins, there will be no doubt. When they die, for 3/1/2 days...many Nations will party sending gifts to one another..which proves that the entire world knows who they are..& it appears that they will have a major role in protecting the Remnant Bride. They will be instrumental in defeating the anti-Christ with their deaths...proving that indeed he is not God, but a fraud in their resurrection, & will be the main instruments in the salvation of all of Israel......when the VOICE thunders..."COME UP HERE!"...& they float to Heaven on a cloud....very publicly....though it is possible that one of them is Elijah.......

There is no telling if the true Church would receive them at all....until they are desperate enough to need them....& even then some will refuse to,,,,it goes against their theology.

2 Angelina, greeting in the name of the Lord Jesus.

of course I believe in scripture. That is why I am asking this ^_^ You are saying that Elijah has already come ...then why is he sent again before the great and dreadful "Day of the Lord" It seems based on scripture that Elijah comes again...and so does Jesus Hebrews 9:26.

Elijah is sent only once, and it is before the great and dreadful "Day of the Lord".
the question that needs to be asked is this. "WHAT IS THE GREAT AND DREADFUL DAY OF THE LORD"?. answer, Isaiah 34:8 "For it is the day of the LORD'S vengeance, and the year of recompences for the controversy of Zion". vengeance on who or what?, answer, SIN. and the question when did the LORD come, answer, Isaiah 35:4 "Say to them that are of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come with vengeance, even God with a recompence; he will come and save you". question Angelina, who came and saved us from our sin?.answer Jesus the Christ. supportive scripture, John 1:29 "The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world". again, question, who came before Jesus?. John the Baptist, in the spirit and the power of Elijah. scripture, Luke 1:13 "But the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: for thy prayer is heard; and thy wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John. 14 And thou shalt have joy and gladness; and many shall rejoice at his birth. Luke 1:58; 15 For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb. 16 And many of the children of Israel shall he turn to the Lord their God. 17 And he shall go before him in the spirit and power of Elias, to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just; to make ready a people prepared for the Lord".

I hope that answered your question.

101G


2 Angelina, GINOLJC.

I see you only accept the part of the two witness, I think there is a propensity to equate Elijah with the two witnesses. They are not connected scripturally, except by the power gifts. I think it suffice for them to wait & see

Ok, while some are waiting lets make some scriptual connections. I believe that we had the two witness as Elijah and Moses (as to description only) on point. but are we still correct?. I say yes, if we can connect John the Baptist to Elijah. and Jesus the Christ to Moses.

Revelation 11:3 "And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth"
there are two words in this scripture that I have bolded and underline, that can or could help us to connect both Prophets of the new testament, (John and Jesus). to the two prophets of the old testament, (Elijah and Moses)

First of Two witness. (John), Scripture: John 1:6 "There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. 7 The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe"
Second of two witness: (Jesus), Scripture: John 18:37 "Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice

Now Power: to understand this we need to go to the book of Zechariah chapter 4. the Power is the Holy Spirit. read again all of chapter 4. now lets look at these verses 11-14 "Then answered I, and said unto him, What are these two olive trees upon the right side of the candlestick and upon the left side ther".eof? 12 And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves? 13 And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord. 14 Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.
Anointed ones: who are they?. what do anointed means. W.E. vines Dictionary:
anointing,1. Verb,G218, aleipho The material used was either oil, or ointment. as in Luke 7:38, Luke 7:46.
anointing,2. Verb,G5548, chrio is more limited in its use than No. 1; it is confined to "sacred and symbolical anointings;" of Christ as the "Anointed" of God, Luke 4:18; Acts 4:27; Acts 10:38, and Heb 1:9, where it is used metaphorically in connection with "the oil of gladness." The title Christ signifies "The Anointed One," The word (Christos) is rendered "(His) Anointed" in Acts 4:26, RV. Once it is said of believers, 2Cor 1:21. Chrio is very frequent in the Sept., and is used of kings, 1Sam 10:1, and priests, Exod 28:41, and prophets, 1Kgs 19:16. Among the Greeks it was used in other senses than the ceremonial, but in the Scriptures it is not found in connection with secular matters.
so the connection is the "oil" and the oil represent the Holy Spirit. so the two witness is endowed with the Holy Spirit. Remember Revelation is symbolic.
First the Anointing of (John), Scripture: Luke 1:11 "And there appeared unto him an angel of the Lord standing on the right side of the altar of incense. 12 And when Zacharias saw him, he was troubled, and fear fell upon him. 13 But the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: for thy prayer is heard; and thy wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John. 14 And thou shalt have joy and gladness; and many shall rejoice at his birth. 15 For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb. 16 And many of the children of Israel shall he turn to the Lord their God. 17 And he shall go before him in the spirit and power of Elias, to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just; to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.
so here in this scripture, not only do we have the Anointing of John with the Holy Spirit, but also the connection with the spirit of Elijah.
and as Zechariah said "that stand by the Lord of the whole earth", Luke states, "For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord". Connection #1.is made.
now the Anointing of (Jesus) at his birth same as John, and at his baptism also. and his connection to Moses. Scripture: Luke 1:35 "And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God. Matthews 3:16 "And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him 17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Lastly, Luke 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised.
now the connection to Moses.
Deuteronomy 18:14 "The LORD thy God will raise up unto thee a Prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren, like unto me; unto him ye shall hearken".
also some more connections. both was laws givers, both had a water connection, just as John and Elijah had water connections. Moses and the children of Israel was baptized in water, thru the red sea. Jesus and his Children are baptize in water also thru (the Holy Spirit, the well of Water in us). Mose turned water into blood. Jesus turned water into wine (red like blood). both are leaders, both are always before GOD. we can get the better picture of this connection at Jesus transfiguration. Matthews 17:2 "And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light. 3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.
so now the connection is made with Jesus and Moses.
I'll stop here and let you digest this, but there is much more.

Love and Peace
101G


2 Angelina, GINOLJC.

Matthew 3:7 "But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?", also see Luke 3:7 this should certify the great and dreadful "Day of the Lord".

Now the last part of this scriptures. "they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days". a thousand two hundred and threescore days = 1260 divided by 365 = 3 years and one half. the exact years of Jesus public ministry. and also John's public ministry, approx 3 or 3 and a half years.

Cloths in sackcloth, meaning preaching repentance. sackcloth means penitence.
(John) Scripture, Matthews 3:1 "In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea, 2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. 3 For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight. Now what was John's Baptism?. a Baptism of REPENTANCE. Matthew 3:11 "I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire".
(Jesus) Scripture, Matthews 4:16 "From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand".

Love and Peace
101G

2 Angelina, GINOLJC
verse 28 goes on to state that he will appear a second time, apart from sin - meaning not for the purpose of sacrificing himself for sin again, but for salvation. We are still humans living on earth and are not yet redeemed.

are you saying that you're not redeemed?, I mean of the spirit. 1 Peter 1:18 "Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers; 19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot". have you not been bought with a price?. what you think the blood was for?.

Angelina, question, have you not been translated into the kingdom?, are you not seated with Christ?.
2 Corinthians 5:21 "For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him".
Galatians 2:17 "But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid. 18 For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor. 19 For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God. 20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me".

Oh well, but to stay on topic, Verse 5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed". do you understand the symbolism here?.

Fire: is a refiner. Jeremiah 5:14 "Wherefore thus saith the LORD God of hosts, Because ye speak this word, behold, I will make my words in thy mouth fire, and this people wood, and it shall devour them". and Jeremiah 23:29 "Is not my word like as a fire? saith the LORD; and like a hammer that breaketh the rock in pieces?". so the word of God is for the repentance heart.

Love and Peace
101G

2 Angelina, GINOLJC

The Holy Spirit is a guarantee of that redemption, yes, of our spirit, not the body. it must be changed, either resurrected or quicken at his coming if alive. but your spirit is redeemed. Romans 8:23 "And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

Love and Peace
101G

Shalom, 101G.

101G said:

2 Angelina, GINOLJC

The Holy Spirit is a guarantee of that redemption, yes, of our spirit, not the body. it must be changed, either resurrected or quicken at his coming if alive. but your spirit is redeemed. Romans 8:23 "And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

Love and Peace
101G

Click to expand...

Please don't sell Angelina short. She is correct, based on the Scriptures:

Romans 8:16-23
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.
19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.
20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
KJV

These verses (as well as others) support the concept that there IS a future redemption (the noun form of "redeem") when we are resurrected, the redemption of each one of our bodies. It is to this time of redemption, I believe, that Angelina is referring. (She can correct me, if I am wrong.) Don't kick against the body we shall receive being a physical body! As I've been trying to tell others, a "spiritual body" does NOT mean a "non-physical body!" "Spiritual" means "a greater, supernatural body," one patterned after our Lord's body "of flesh and bones" that could be handled and overcame death! It does NOT mean a "ghostly body" or an "other-worldly or other-dimensional body!" See it big, keep it simple.

Our bodies were "fearfully and wonderfully made," patterned after our ultimate grandfather, Adam, and we were created for this earth and the earth created for us. Why would a perfect God change something He called "very good?" HaSatan (The Enemy) doesn't win in ANY sense, and He will NOT take the earth down with him! God will re-create this planet's surface and improve it, just as He will our bodies! This is assured in Scripture time and time again!

2 Retrobyter GINOLJC

the bible is clear on this. I believe I stated that, re-read my post. for our spirits are redeemed, not our bodies as yet, only until he returns. as good as these bodies are made they must undergo change, because sin was condemned in the flesh. these bodies must be swallowed up in victory by the Spirit. 1 Corinthians 15:35-58. "But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come? 36 Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die: 37 And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, (THAT'S THE ANSWER), but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain: 38 But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body".

death must be overcome, 54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. 55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory? 56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law. 57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ". question, why in Christ Jesus, "for the kingdom of God is within us". question, what's within us?. "spirit" the real you.

so the bodies we have now is NOT THE BODY THAT SHALL BE. the whole chapter of 1 Corinthians 15 is worthy of the read, as well as the whole book.

now, you gave the right scripture Romans 8:16-23.
16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God. WITH OUR "spirits", which is a diversity of the true Eternal Spirit.
but we're redeemed spiritually, until the redemption of the body. scripture, Romans 8:22 "For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now. 23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body. (THERE IT IS). 24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for? 25 But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it". so we wait on the redemption of OUR BODIES.

but have we not been translated spiritually?. Colossians 1:12 "Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light". HOLD IT, hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance. HATH MADE US, hath is a past tense designation, meaning it have already happen. we're already made partakers of the inheritance. are we not seated with Christ?. lets continue, 13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son". again HATH is a past tense designation, this is done already. we only wait. if one have not been translated, as our brother John said, 1 John 1:7 "But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin". if one is not walking in the Light then one is still in their sins. for this is the message, 1 John 1:5 "This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. 6 If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth". if one do not believe, then I question your salvation that you suppose to walk in.

Love and peace
101G

Angelina, good morn ing,
sure get some sleep, and may god bless you.