"Stand You Ground" Laws

John S · Jul 17, 2013

In the U.S., more than 20 states have what is known as "Stand Your Ground" Laws. These state that if you feel threatened, you can pull out your gun and shoot the person who is "threatening" you.
About a year or so ago, in one of those states, Florida, a white man, George Zimmerman, felt threatened by a black teenager named Treyvon Martin. They, apparently, got into a fight, so he shot and killed him.
A few days ago, Mr. Zimmerman was found innocent because the jury also felt that he had been threatened and acted in self-defense.
When done properly, as Mr. Zimmerman appears to have been able to do, "Stand Your Ground" Laws legalize murder.

In the U.S. we have politicians who are extremely fearful of an organization that uses its vast money and influence to get these laws passed and to make sure that simple common sense laws are not passed.Their concern is NOT the welfare of the American people but with making tons and tons of money. This organization is known as the National Rifle Association (NRA).

When 20 first-graders were killed in Connecticut, the response of this despicable antichristian organization was to have EVERY teacher armed. If it were up to them, EVERY American would be armed in school, at work, at church, at the playground, in the movie theaters - EVERYWHERE.

Sadly, far too many American CHRISTIANS feel that it is their God-given right to own and use guns - even though Jesus Christ NEVER owned or used a weapon.

Slowly but surely, the American people are saying enough is enough. Hopefully, I will live to see the day when this horrible organization loses its power and influence over America's politicians.

lforrest · Jul 17, 2013

You have said quite a mouthful there, all of which appears to be very much in line with the liberal agenda. Rather than start another pointless debate about rights and laws, I suggest we look at the crux of the matter for those of us who are concerned with the will of God. When does God consider deadly force an option for self-defense?

Exodus 22:2-3
2 “If a thief is caught breaking in at night and is struck a fatal blow, the defender is not guilty of bloodshed; 3 but if it happens after sunrise, the defender is guilty of bloodshed.
"Anyone who steals must certainly make restitution, but if they have nothing, they must be sold to pay for their theft.

I can assume a reason for why the time of day matters in this biblical context. In the darkness of night you were not able to discern the intent of an invader. Under Mosaic Law killers were executed, so at night you were permitted to kill the thief because they could be a murderer. In the day you’re able to discern that the thief is only trying to steal property, and you didn’t have the right to defend your property with lethal force according to the law.

Consider that in the US you have grounds to use deadly force to defend yourself in the event of a home invasion regardless of the time of day. However there must also be a serious threat to your life. It seems our law depends slightly more heavily on the defender’s judgment as to what justifies deadly force. We can see that the spirit of the law is the same; you may only use deadly force when it is needed to protect your life.

States that do not have stand your ground laws require you to flee from a life threatening situation. States that do have “Stand your ground” laws permit you to remain where you are and defend yourself. I don’t think God would support “Stand your ground” laws, he would want to afford every opportunity to preserve life.

As an aside: “Stand your ground,” was not applicable to the current case because Zimmerman was ambushed and had no option to escape the confrontation. The case was not won based on the stand your ground law.

Angelina · Jul 17, 2013

An Observation: Despite these difficulties where your "stand your ground" laws apply. There seems to be an pervasive agenda of those in authority, who want to remove your right to defend yourself as your constitution allows. I believe that this pivotal piece of legislature, is the very thing that "restrains" the NWO regime. :huh:

Shalom!!!

Dan57 · Jul 18, 2013

John S said:
A few days ago, Mr. Zimmerman was found innocent because the jury also felt that he had been threatened and acted in self-defense.
When done properly, as Mr. Zimmerman appears to have been able to do, "Stand Your Ground" Laws legalize murder.

I agreed with the juries verdict... "Stand Your Ground' doesn't legalize murder, it simply gives a person like Zimmerman the right to use deadly force to defend themselves when their own life is in danger. . When Trayvon Martin was slamming Zimmerman's head onto a cement sidewalk, he used deadly force to prevent a murder, His Own! (Luke 22:36-38)

John S · Jul 18, 2013

I seem to have missed the verse where Jesus told us to shoot the person who punches us in the face - or to shoot the person who forces us to walk a mile - or to shoot the person who takes our "coat" - or to defend ourselves violently in any way.
As a Christian, the verses in the Old Testament mean absolutely nothing to me. ONLY the words of Jesus Christ matter and He would NOT want us to use guns.

Dodo_David · Jul 18, 2013

John S said:
In the U.S., more than 20 states have what is known as "Stand Your Ground" Laws. These state that if you feel threatened, you can pull out your gun and shoot the person who is "threatening" you.
About a year or so ago, in one of those states, Florida, a white man, George Zimmerman, felt threatened by a black teenager named Treyvon Martin. They, apparently, got into a fight, so he shot and killed him.
A few days ago, Mr. Zimmerman was found innocent because the jury also felt that he had been threatened and acted in self-defense.
When done properly, as Mr. Zimmerman appears to have been able to do, "Stand Your Ground" Laws legalize murder.

In the U.S. we have politicians who are extremely fearful of an organization that uses its vast money and influence to get these laws passed and to make sure that simple common sense laws are not passed.Their concern is NOT the welfare of the American people but with making tons and tons of money. This organization is known as the National Rifle Association (NRA).

When 20 first-graders were killed in Connecticut, the response of this despicable antichristian organization was to have EVERY teacher armed. If it were up to them, EVERY American would be armed in school, at work, at church, at the playground, in the movie theaters - EVERYWHERE.

Sadly, far too many American CHRISTIANS feel that it is their God-given right to own and use guns - even though Jesus Christ NEVER owned or used a weapon.

Slowly but surely, the American people are saying enough is enough. Hopefully, I will live to see the day when this horrible organization loses its power and influence over America's politicians.

Stand Your Ground was not the defense used during the Zimmerman murder trial. So, Stand Your Ground and Zimmerman are separate subjects.

Stand Your Ground is applied to people defending themselves while they are on their own property, such as a resident of a home shooting an armed intruder who breaks into the resident's home.

lforrest · Jul 18, 2013

Dodo_David said:
Stand Your Ground was not the defense used during the Zimmerman murder trial. So, Stand Your Ground and Zimmerman are separate subjects.

Stand Your Ground is applied to people defending themselves while they are on their own property, such as a resident of a home shooting an armed intruder who breaks into the resident's home.

What you refer to here is known as the Castle doctrine. You have the right to defend yourself in your home and do not have to flee it.

Stand your Ground is an extension of the castle doctrine and permits you to defend yourself anywhere your allowed to be, and not just on your own property.

John S said:
I seem to have missed the verse where Jesus told us to shoot the person who punches us in the face - or to shoot the person who forces us to walk a mile - or to shoot the person who takes our "coat" - or to defend ourselves violently in any way.
As a Christian, the verses in the Old Testament mean absolutely nothing to me. ONLY the words of Jesus Christ matter and He would NOT want us to use guns.

Jesus Christ and the author of the Old Testament are one and the same. This doesn't mean we should go about following the OT laws, but the will of God can be discerned from its pages.

Dodo_David · Jul 18, 2013

lforrest said:
What you refer to here is known as the Castle doctrine. You have the right to defend yourself in your home and do not have to flee it.

Stand your Ground is an extension of the castle doctrine and permits you to defend yourself anywhere your allowed to be, and not just on your own property.

Jesus Christ and the author of the Old Testament are one and the same. This doesn't mean we should go about following the OT laws, but the will of God can be discerned from its pages.

Again, Stand Your Ground was not the defense used in the Zimmerman murder trial.

This Vale Of Tears · Jul 18, 2013

The OP lost me when he called George Zimmerman a "white man" (he's actually Hispanic) and Treyvon Martin a "black teenager." It seems that the Left can only see skin deep. They don't see people, they see races, genders, and even sexual orientations. Yes, the entire OP was a litany of over-rehearsed left wing talking points with a strong anti-gun thrust. This is truly sad.

John S · Jul 19, 2013

YES - I'm anti-gun because Jesus Christ would be anti-gun.
What is "truly sad" is that Christians think that guns is a "Christian" thing to have - when it isn't.

aspen · Jul 19, 2013

all weapons are concrete examples of a lack of faith.

Dan57 · Jul 19, 2013

John S said:
YES - I'm anti-gun because Jesus Christ would be anti-gun.
What is "truly sad" is that Christians think that guns is a "Christian" thing to have - when it isn't.

aspen2 said:
all weapons are concrete examples of a lack of faith.

Can I surmise that neither of you feel that David had any right to have a sling-shot? Self-defense is not non-Christian, there is nothing in the bible that forbids it. Jesus asked his disciples to get a couple swords, and what David did with a weapon was an act of faith, not a lack of faith.

If a rapist broke into your house, standing by and doing nothing while he raped your wife or daughter would be a sin. God did not put a target on Christians backs nor did He write "Victim" across our foreheads. JMO.

Dodo_David · Jul 19, 2013

[SIZE=16.363636016845703px]In Luke 22:35-38, we read the following:[/SIZE]

[SIZE=.75em]35 [/SIZE]Then Jesus asked them, “When I sent you without purse, bag or sandals, did you lack anything?”

“Nothing,” they answered.

[SIZE=.75em]36 [/SIZE]He said to them, “But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. [SIZE=.75em]37 [/SIZE]It is written: ‘And he was numbered with the transgressors’; and I tell you that this must be fulfilled in me. Yes, what is written about me is reaching its fulfillment.”

[SIZE=.75em]38 [/SIZE]The disciples said, “See, Lord, here are two swords.”

“That’s enough!” he replied.

Although He did not require that every one of his disciples carry a sword, Jesus did instruct the His disciples as a group to be armed with swords.

The last time that I checked, a sword is a lethal weapon.

John S · Jul 19, 2013

Aspen - Exactly.

Dan - Unfortunately, law enforcement and the military still need weapons - and David was in the military - sort of.
As I stated in an earlier post, maybe you can show us the verses where Jesus told us to shoot the person who punches us in the face - or makes us walk a mile - or takes our "coat" - or whatever. Show us the verses where He preached violence even in our defense.
Jesus NEVER owned or used a weapon. I TRY to follow His words and examples - and so should all of His other followers.THAT is the definition of Christianity.

David - ...and what did Jesus do when Peter used his sword? Did He praise him?
Did the Apostles carry weapons after they got the Gift of Tongues? - I doubt it.

BTW - It doesn't matter if George Zimmerman is white, black, brown, yellow, red, or blue, he got away with murder.
The "Stand Your Ground" law may not have been "used" in that trial but at least one juror believed that Mr. Zimmerman had the right to defend himself in a situation that may or may not have been actually threatening.

James Forthwright · Jul 20, 2013

John S said:
As a Christian, the verses in the Old Testament mean absolutely nothing to me.

This is one of the most inane statements I’ve read in very long time. The New Testament is filled with quotes of the Old Testament and is largely a commentary of the writings of the Old Testament laws, prophets and psalmists. The Holy Bible (God’s Word to mankind) consists of BOTH testaments and there is much wisdom to be gleaned from studying the sacred texts of the men of God that preceded the advent of Christ Jesus.

John S said:
ONLY the words of Jesus Christ matter and He would NOT want us to use guns.

How about the words of Peter, James, John, Mark, Matthew, Luke and the epistles of Paul? Do you only read the letters printed in RED?

You claim that Jesus Christ does not want us to use guns but offer no explanation as to why He told his disciples to “sell their cloaks and buy a sword” right before his crucifixion. You don’t use a sword to cut communion loaves!

John S said:
Jesus NEVER owned or used a weapon. I TRY to follow His words and examples - and so should all of His other followers. THAT is the definition of Christianity.

Do you honor the Sabbath as Jesus did? Do you revere God’s Law as Jesus did? (Matt. 5:17-18)

Jesus knew the OT well, why don’t you follow His example?

And BTW, you are dead wrong. Not only did Jesus use a weapon but in a fit of rage Christ made an improvised weapon to drive the money changers from the temple. (John 2:15)

John S said:
David - ...and what did Jesus do when Peter used his sword? Did He praise him?

Christ neither praised nor condemned Peter’s actions. He merely told him to sheath his weapon for the time being, for it was His sole purpose to be arrested, tried and put to death. Again, it makes no sense for Jesus to tell His disciples to buy a sword but then not EVER enable His followers to use it!

John S said:
Did the Apostles carry weapons after they got the Gift of Tongues? - I doubt it.

Pure speculation on your part. You haven’t the faintest idea and you errantly and arrogantly believe that all Christians should have the same exact views on Gun Control as you theorize all good Christians should behave.

John S said:
BTW - It doesn't matter if George Zimmerman is white, black, brown, yellow, red, or blue, he got away with murder.

No one “gets away” with anything. Eventually we all must stand before our Maker and make an account of our words and actions. All that matters for now is that Mr. Zimmerman was fully acquitted by a lawful jury of his peers and is a free man.

John S said:
The "Stand Your Ground" law may not have been "used" in that trial but at least one juror believed that Mr. Zimmerman had the right to defend himself in a situation that may or may not have been actually threatening.

You never answered the question of what YOU would do if a rapist broke into your home and threatened your wife and daughter? Would you be justified in taking the rapist’s life? Or would you calmly read him the Sermon on the Mount?

Judging from the photographs of Zimmerman’s broken nose and multiple lacerations to the back of his skull, the jury unanimously agreed that he had every right to defend himself from further serious injury or possible death. That’s also what the police officers at the scene initially decided as well.

Rex · Jul 20, 2013

The Other side of the coin

Zimmerman went looking for trouble where trouble didn't exsist, he found it, more than he could chew, so instead of filling an assult charge the court found him justified in killing.

The court system isn't set up to see or use common sense,

The court system is designed to accept testimony from those that wear the color of authority, in an equal decision the court will always protect those that by force enforce its legislation. Zimmerman was a rent a cop, he has the right to question, and the 911 operators are not under the color of authority, if they were Zimmerman would have been in violation of disobeying an officer, and would have certainly been found guilty.

The long and short of the story< our system doesn't always work.

James Forthwright · Jul 20, 2013

Rex said:
The Other side of the coin

Zimmerman went looking for trouble where trouble didn't exsist, he found it, more than he could chew, so instead of filling an assult charge the court found him justified in killing.

The court system isn't set up to see or use common sense,

"Looking for trouble" is precisely what a Neighborhood Watchman is SUPPOSED to do. Zimmerman saw an apparently intoxicated individual acting strangely and he immediately called 911. He then ignored instructions from the dispatcher to stay in his vehicle because he wanted to keep track of where this stranger was going (too many culprits like this get away). If Traygone had any actual fears of Zimmerman all he had to do was call the police on his own phone and tell them someone was stalking him. Instead, he talked to his girlfriend, describing GZ as a "creepy ass white cracker" and took matters into his own hands by attacking Zimmerman. That was a fatal mistake.

The Florida jury composed of six women (one of whom BTW was black) IMO used a large measure of "common sense" in deciding their unanimous Not Guilty verdict.

Rex · Jul 20, 2013

Zimmerman should have followed the 911 operators instructions
Even a police officer knows to wait for back-up, stupid rent a cops not so much

Martin shouldn't have assaulted even a security guard

The police were on the way, he chose to confront someone who was not in violation of any law alone, resulting in having to shoot someone.
Now that's just being a dumb ass, at the expense of someones life.

even someone that uses white cracker as an expression.

James Forthwright · Jul 20, 2013

Rex said:
Zimmerman should have followed the 911 operators instructions
Even a police officer knows to wait for back-up, stupid rent a cops not so much

Martin shouldn't have assaulted even a security guard

The police were on the way, he chose to confront someone who was not in violation of any law alone, resulting in having to shoot someone.
Now that's just a being dumb ass

There is no law that I'm aware of against "being a dumb ass". Do you know how long it takes sometimes for police to respond? Traygone's daddy's crib was only a few hundred feet away. All he had to do was walk home before the police arrived.

Again, Neighborhood Watchmen are expected "to confront" strangers in their housing complex. That's their job! All Traygone had to do was tell Zimmerman that his daddy lives 'right over there' and walk away. He apparently did not want GZ to know where he lived.

Do you know what the ingredients of the common narcotic gangsta drink "Lean" aka Syzzurp are? Ans. Arizona Watermelon Iced Tea + (ground) Skittles + Robitusson cough syrup (containing codeine). I'd be willing to wager that neither the Arizona Iced Tea nor bag of Skittles was opened and that his gangsta daddy had a prescription for Robitusson in the medicine cabinet.

There just happened to be a discarded 'slim jim' burglary tool found by the police in the nearby bushes. And there had been a series of recent break-ins in the neighborhood. St. Skittles was apparently "casing" the neighborhood on his way back home from da sto. Trayvon was currently suspended from skool (sic) for breaking into lockers, possessing marijuana and had women's jewelry in his backpack (that "he found in the woods"). He was also implicated in an attack against a school bus driver. His mother couldn't handle him so she sent him to his father's house.

The jury made THE RIGHT DECISION!

Rex · Jul 20, 2013

Slice it how ever you like two wrongs never = a right

The court, = the wisdom of the world

As for your insinuation I have never experienced the streets you're sorely mistaken.
But have a nice day John I simply wanted to make a comment, this topic is hardly going to change a thing, it's simply another example of mens wisdom used to expose the hearts and minds of men.

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