Peace, Peace....There is No Peace!

whirlwind · Dec 13, 2013

Peace, peace...there is no Peace !

Jeremiah prophesied and warned God's children in Jerusalem about the desolations that were about to begin but...they didn't listen. This is our example of today's prophets and watchmen warning today's children of God (which is His spiritual Jerusalem). Do we listen today?

Jeremiah said....

Jeremiah 6:10 To whom shall I speak, and give warning, that they may hear? behold, their ear is uncircumcised, and they cannot hearken: behold, the word of the LORD is unto them a reproach; they have no delight in it.

They love the Lord but they don't hear the words of the Lord...they listen to man...man's ideas, theories, doctrines, man's translations....man's words.

Amos 8:11 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the LORD:

2 Timothy 4:3-4For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

6:13-15 For from the least of them even unto the greatest of them every one is given to covetousness; and from the prophet even unto the priest every one dealeth falsely. They have healed also the hurt of the daughter of my people slightly, saying, Peace, peace; when there is no peace. Were they ashamed when they had committed abomination? nay, they were not at all ashamed, neither could they blush: therefore they shall fall among them that fall: at the time that I visit them they shall be cast down, saith the LORD.

The days are now come...the false prophets and priests abound that dealeth falsely, paving the way for THE day when Satan himself stands before us pretending to be our Savior and he will deceive many! They promise peace and safety saying....we'll be raptured away....don't worry.

Please consider that when they say "peace, peace when there is no peace," means....Christ has not arrived at that time. They will say He is there but...there is no Peace/no Christ.....

Ephesians 2:14 For He is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

1 Thessalonians 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

6:16-17 Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they said, We will not walk therein. Also I set watchmen over you, saying, Hearken to the sound of the trumpet. But they said, We will not hearken.

Hearken to the sound of the trumpet...wait for the seventh trumpet, knowing that is when the true Saviour arrives. Don't fall into apostasy.

He is our Peace and He is our Rest. Only with Him will we find that promised land. The watchmen warn...but how many harken to truth or prefer to believe they'll be raptured? Remember, they'll say....

Peace, peace...where there is no Peace! It will be Satan, not our Savior.

guysmith · Dec 14, 2013

whirlwind said:
The days are now come...the false prophets and priests abound that dealeth falsely, paving the way for THE day when Satan himself stands before us pretending to be our Savior and he will deceive many! They promise peace and safety saying....we'll be raptured away....don't worry.

Shalom whirlwind,

As I recall your position was pre-trib. Do you still hold that position?

In Yehoshua,
Guy Smith

whirlwind · Dec 14, 2013

guysmith said:
Shalom whirlwind,

As I recall your position was pre-trib. Do you still hold that position?

In Yehoshua,
Guy Smith

Hi Guy, I just answered you in a PM but will say here too....the false prophets are those pushing pre-trib. It is a false peace they teach.

Rocky Wiley · Dec 14, 2013

whirlwind said:
Hi Guy, I just answered you in a PM but will say here too....the false prophets are those pushing pre-trib. It is a false peace they teach.

The tribulation came first, then the destruction of the temple (in Jerusalem) then the resurrection of the dead.

ENOCH2010 · Dec 14, 2013

Tribulation has happened, the temple has been destroyed. Both of these can be proven in the Scripture. The resurrection of the dead happening at that time can not be proven, in fact it isn't even hinted at in the Scripture, so your words of the resurrection happening in 70 ad is nothing but lie.

Scripture isn't wrong men are

Rocky Wiley · Dec 14, 2013

ENOCH2010 said:
Tribulation has happened, the temple has been destroyed. Both of these can be proven in the Scripture. The resurrection of the dead happening at that time can not be proven, in fact it isn't even hinted at in the Scripture, so your words of the resurrection happening in 70 ad is nothing but lie.

Scripture isn't wrong men are

enoch,
Most don't even believe that much. Here is an earlier post I made.
http://www.christianityboard.com/topic/19417-the-abomination-of-desolation-spoken-of-by-daniel-the-prophet/

whirlwind · Dec 14, 2013

Rocky Wiley said:
The tribulation came first, then the destruction of the temple (in Jerusalem) then the resurrection of the dead.

The tribulation hasn't yet happened.

The temple made with hands was destroyed while the true temple was raised and stands strong today.

The temple being destroyed in 70AD wasn't the tribulation and wasn't the fulfillment of Jesus' teaching on the mount of Olives for one stone still stands upon another.

I have been resurrected to life. I am spiritually alive.

Retrobyter · Dec 14, 2013

Shalom, everyone.

Guys, I'll just say it again: Don't make the mistake of thinking that the tribulation and the Seventieth Seven of Daniel are one and the same! They are NOT the same thing! I believe that the tribulation (Greek: thlipsis) began in the first century and continues through today. I also believe that it will continue until the Messiah Yeshua` returns. The purposes for the Seventieth Seven are not consistent with those for the tribulation.

I believe that Yeshua`s offer of the Kingdom, His "public ministry," lasted for 3.5 years, and that THIS was the first half of the Seventieth Seven. I also believe that Yeshua` BROKE that Seven in half when He left the Jews and their city Jerusalem "DESOLATE." When they have finally come to the point where they can welcome the Messiah back as Matthew 23:39 says they must do, then the tribulation will be over, the Messiah will return to rescue them physically from their enemies bent on their destruction, and He will begin the second half of the Seventieth Seven.

Thus, the two halves of the Seventieth Seven are like "bookends" to the tribulation, and the tribulation is in between. I further believe that the tribulation is also known as the Time of Jacob's Trouble.

Finally, when Yeshua` promised that, for the elect's sake, that time would be shortened, He was not talking about the overall length of the tribulation period but was talking about the length of the individual persecutions and individual trials they would face during the last two thousand years so far. He was allowing them to have periodic "time-outs" so they could re-populate and enjoy some semblance of blessing and God's provision from time to time, so that they would not be entirely wiped out.

veteran · Dec 18, 2013

whirlwind said:
The tribulation hasn't yet happened.

The temple made with hands was destroyed while the true temple was raised and stands strong today.

The temple being destroyed in 70AD wasn't the tribulation and wasn't the fulfillment of Jesus' teaching on the mount of Olives for one stone still stands upon another.

I have been resurrected to life. I am spiritually alive.

I totally agree with your discourse. You certainly have come a long way brother.

I don't know what happened, but your spiritual eyes have clearly been opened by The LORD. And I thought The LORD's final sealing of His in prep for the end time events might have been over already.

Retrobyter · Dec 25, 2013

Shalom, whirlwind.

whirlwind said:
The tribulation hasn't yet happened.

The temple made with hands was destroyed while the true temple was raised and stands strong today.

The temple being destroyed in 70AD wasn't the tribulation and wasn't the fulfillment of Jesus' teaching on the mount of Olives for one stone still stands upon another.

I have been resurrected to life. I am spiritually alive.

Show me one stone of the Temple still standing upon another! There are NONE left standing! If you're thinking about the Western Wall (the Wailing Wall), that's a portion of the RETENTION WALL for the level ground on the top of the hill! It's not a part of what was the Temple!

Also, no mere analogy takes the place of the original upon which the analogy is based!

Look, I'm truly glad that you're "spiritually alive," but that is in NO WAY the same as the Resurrection you SHALL receive when our Lord returns, if you physically die before He comes! Sorry to burst your bubble, but you have NOT YET been "resurrected to life!"

Eric E Stahl · Dec 25, 2013

whirlwind said:
Hi Guy, I just answered you in a PM but will say here too....the false prophets are those pushing pre-trib. It is a false peace they teach.

[SIZE=18pt]Five Phases of the First Resurrection [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt]The Five Phases of the First Resurrection [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt](1) Jesus took the Old Testament saints to Heaven at His ascension. Psalms 68:18[/SIZE]KJV, Ephesians 4:8KJV

[SIZE=10pt](2) The Holy Spirit and the church age saints are caught up to heaven before the antichrist is given power in the Christian nations. 2 Thessalonians 2:6-12KJV, and 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17[/SIZE]KJV also see John16:7-8KJV the Comforter in the church will reprove sin.

[SIZE=10pt](3) The mid tribulation catching up will include the two witnesses Revelation11:3, 7-14KJV, the 144,000 sealed Jews from Revelation chapter 7KJV who where redeemed from the earth. See Revelation 14:1-4[/SIZE]KJV, and the redeemed dead saints from the first half of the Tribulation. See Revelation 15:1-4KJV

[SIZE=10pt](4) The dead saints from the last half of the tribulation are redeemed from the earth after the tribulation. Revelation 20:4[/SIZE]KJV

[SIZE=10pt](5) The dead saints from the Kingdom age will be judged at the great white throne judgment along with the second resurrection sinners. Revelation 20:11-15[/SIZE]KJV

veteran · Dec 25, 2013

Retrobyter said:
Shalom, whirlwind.

Show me one stone of the Temple still standing upon another! There are NONE left standing! If you're thinking about the Western Wall (the Wailing Wall), that's a portion of the RETENTION WALL for the level ground on the top of the hill! It's not a part of what was the Temple!

Also, no mere analogy takes the place of the original upon which the analogy is based!

Look, I'm truly glad that you're "spiritually alive," but that is in NO WAY the same as the Resurrection you SHALL receive when our Lord returns, if you physically die before He comes! Sorry to burst your bubble, but you have NOT YET been "resurrected to life!"

When Jesus pointed to the area of the temple mount, He wasn't just pointing to one building like the 2nd temple. Literally, not one stone standing on top of another will be left standing there in that area, and it's for the time of His second coming. Thus the planned 3rd temple today's orthodox Jews in Jerusalem will build is going to be destroyed, and His true Milennium Temple will stand in place of it when He returns. As written, The LORD will build the Temple, not man.

ENOCH2010 · Dec 25, 2013

Eric E Stahl said:
[SIZE=18pt]Five Phases of the First Resurrection [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt]The Five Phases of the First Resurrection [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt](1) Jesus took the Old Testament saints to Heaven at His ascension. Psalms 68:18[/SIZE]KJV, Ephesians 4:8KJV

[SIZE=10pt](2) The Holy Spirit and the church age saints are caught up to heaven before the antichrist is given power in the Christian nations. 2 Thessalonians 2:6-12KJV, and 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17[/SIZE]KJV also see John16:7-8KJV the Comforter in the church will reprove sin.

[SIZE=10pt](3) The mid tribulation catching up will include the two witnesses Revelation11:3, 7-14KJV, the 144,000 sealed Jews from Revelation chapter 7KJV who where redeemed from the earth. See Revelation 14:1-4[/SIZE]KJV, and the redeemed dead saints from the first half of the Tribulation. See Revelation 15:1-4KJV

[SIZE=10pt](4) The dead saints from the last half of the tribulation are redeemed from the earth after the tribulation. Revelation 20:4[/SIZE]KJV

[SIZE=10pt](5) The dead saints from the Kingdom age will be judged at the great white throne judgment along with the second resurrection sinners. Revelation 20:11-15[/SIZE]KJV

more pre-trib lies !!!! The Bible only talks about 1 first resurrection (NOT 5) in Rev: 20 People will be held accountable for the lies they try to teach.

Eric E Stahl · Dec 26, 2013

ENOCH2010 said:
more pre-trib lies !!!! The Bible only talks about 1 first resurrection (NOT 5) in Rev: 20 People will be held accountable for the lies they try to teach.

Enoch2010,

You should read the bible passages in the King James and you may understand it better.

Example Revelation 10:1-4 describes the 144,000 in heaven at the middle of the tribulation.

The only saints resurrected at the end of the tribulation are the ones that didn't take the mark.

Revelation 11:14 is the middle of the tribulation.

Dodo_David · Dec 26, 2013

Eric E Stahl said:
Enoch2010,

You should read the bible passages in the King James and you may understand it better.

Here is an excerpt from this website's Bible Version Statement:

Christianity Board uses the New International Version (NIV) Bible as the default translation for the entire website and community...

... We frequently use and considered the following versions, so we feel quite safe recommending them (they are listed in no particular order): Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB or CSB), New King James Version (NKJV), English Standard Version (ESV), New Revised Standard Version (NRSV), New American Standard Bible (NASB or NASV), King James Version (KJV) and the New Living Translation (NLT). These Bibles all provide slightly different English perspective on the truth of Holy Scripture, even though they all have varying strengths and weaknesses. In fact, we recommend owning at least three of them (or using internet resources) to consult a variety of renderings on a certain text.

Do not mistake the abundance of translations for errors or disagreement on major Christian beliefs. In fact, we confidently assert (along with many, many others) that all of the above versions offer no major deviation on essential Christian doctrines. The misunderstanding comes in how we read and apply verses, but that is topic for another day.

In short, one doesn't have to use the KJV in order to understand what the Bible teaches.

The Old Testament writers wrote in ancient Hebrew. The New Testament writers wrote in Koiné Greek.
The ancient Bible manuscripts in their original languages are the standard for comparison, not any English version.
Indeed, the men who wrote the books of the Bible didn't write any of the English versions, not even the KJV.

ENOCH2010 · Dec 26, 2013

Eric E Stahl said:
Enoch2010,

You should read the bible passages in the King James and you may understand it better.

Example Revelation 10:1-4 describes the 144,000 in heaven at the middle of the tribulation.

The only saints resurrected at the end of the tribulation are the ones that didn't take the mark.

Revelation 11:14 is the middle of the tribulation.

The first resurrection is described in Rev:20 as happening at the Lords second coming, that my friend is the only first resurrection. All the rest of your post about 5 phases of the first resurrection, is only in your imagination, read the Word for what it says, not for what you want it to say.

Apocalypticist · Dec 26, 2013

whirlwind said:
Peace, peace...there is no Peace !

Jeremiah prophesied and warned God's children in Jerusalem about the desolations that were about to begin but...they didn't listen. This is our example of today's prophets and watchmen warning today's children of God (which is His spiritual Jerusalem). Do we listen today?

Jeremiah said....

Jeremiah 6:10 To whom shall I speak, and give warning, that they may hear? behold, their ear is uncircumcised, and they cannot hearken: behold, the word of the LORD is unto them a reproach; they have no delight in it.
They love the Lord but they don't hear the words of the Lord...they listen to man...man's ideas, theories, doctrines, man's translations....man's words.

Amos 8:11 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the LORD:

2 Timothy 4:3-4For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

6:13-15 For from the least of them even unto the greatest of them every one is given to covetousness; and from the prophet even unto the priest every one dealeth falsely. They have healed also the hurt of the daughter of my people slightly, saying, Peace, peace; when there is no peace. Were they ashamed when they had committed abomination? nay, they were not at all ashamed, neither could they blush: therefore they shall fall among them that fall: at the time that I visit them they shall be cast down, saith the LORD.
The days are now come...the false prophets and priests abound that dealeth falsely, paving the way for THE day when Satan himself stands before us pretending to be our Savior and he will deceive many! They promise peace and safety saying....we'll be raptured away....don't worry.

Amos 8 has already been fulfilled. You said, The days are come now. That's fine if you apply it to everyhting else you cited but Amos 8 was fulfilled over 2000 years ago. It was called the silent period. Do you know what happened?

The Israelites continued to rebel against the prophets, killing them, shedding their blood, all the way down to Zechariah, son of Berechiah. So do you know what happened? The prophets died, God sent no more, there was a drought of His word. The Jews went into a very dark period.

Until suddenly, after four hundred years, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord. It was John, and the Israelites laughed and scorned quite similarly to the way they did in the past. "Ha, fool! Don't you know the word of the LORD dried up 400 hundred years ago! Off with you with your head now!" And then came the Messiah, and these two they killed.

Quite like it was when the prophets of old arrived.

Yet Christ says after his death, Behold, I send unto you prophets... And would you know that maybe 3% ever listened to them.

veteran · Dec 27, 2013

Apocalypticist said:
Amos 8 has already been fulfilled. You said, The days are come now. That's fine if you apply it to everyhting else you cited but Amos 8 was fulfilled over 2000 years ago. It was called the silent period. Do you know what happened?

Most of Amos truly was historical. But as with all the Books of the OT prophets, not everything in them has been fulfilled today.

Amos 8:9
9 And it shall come to pass in that day, saith the Lord GOD, that I will cause the sun to go down at noon, and I will darken the earth in the clear day:
(KJV)

That verse has a definite connection with the era of Day of The LORD events for the ending of this present world (Isaiah 13; Matt.24:29, Rev.6:12).

In Amos 8:14 we are told that "sin of Samaria" will never rise up again with pointing to that timing. That sin involves idol worship that the first king of Israel over the ten tribes setup (1 Kings 12:28). What specific sin mentioned at the end of Rev.13 involving idol worship is mentioned for the last days leading up to Christ's return? Thus that "sin of Samaria" idea is still... applicable all the way to the end of this world up to Christ's return, and that sin of idol worship will not be finished until Christ returns. Ezekiel 8 & 9 also make good studies on that matter for the end, because those Ezekiel chapters are not history yet either. Ezekiel 9 with God's judgment beginning with His followers is specifically where Apostle Peter was pulling from in 1 Peter 4:17.

Apocalypticist · Dec 27, 2013

veteran said:
Most of Amos truly was historical. But as with all the Books of the OT prophets, not everything in them has been fulfilled today.

Amos 8:9
9 And it shall come to pass in that day, saith the Lord GOD, that I will cause the sun to go down at noon, and I will darken the earth in the clear day:
(KJV)

That verse has a definite connection with the era of Day of The LORD events for the ending of this present world (Isaiah 13; Matt.24:29, Rev.6:12).

In Amos 8:14 we are told that "sin of Samaria" will never rise up again with pointing to that timing. That sin involves idol worship that the first king of Israel over the ten tribes setup (1 Kings 12:28). What specific sin mentioned at the end of Rev.13 involving idol worship is mentioned for the last days leading up to Christ's return? Thus that "sin of Samaria" idea is still... applicable all the way to the end of this world up to Christ's return, and that sin of idol worship will not be finished until Christ returns. Ezekiel 8 & 9 also make good studies on that matter for the end, because those Ezekiel chapters are not history yet either. Ezekiel 9 with God's judgment beginning with His followers is specifically where Apostle Peter was pulling from in 1 Peter 4:17.

I'm going to have to disagree with you. It's a huge stretch you're trying to make. But if you're as well versed on Revelation 13 as you think you are, can you explain the deadly wound? Because you're claiming insight on a chapter and I just want to verify that you are knowledgeable about it like you seem to claim.

veteran · Dec 27, 2013

Apocalypticist said:
I'm going to have to disagree with you. It's a huge stretch you're trying to make. But if you're as well versed on Revelation 13 as you think you are, can you explain the deadly wound? Because you're claiming insight on a chapter and I just want to verify that you are knowledgeable about it like you seem to claim.

Since it's you challenging, to be fair you should offer you're view of what the "deadly wound" of Rev.13 is, and then I will 'show' you from the Scripture how you might either be correct or wrong on the matter.

My reference to Rev.13 was in respect to the subject of the Amos 8 link of idol worship with the "image of the beast" in the latter part of Rev.13, not the "deadly wound", and... Amos 8:14 about the final fall of that practise and it never rising up again, which can only be at the very end of this present world.

Peace, Peace....There is No Peace!

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