after he has laid the foundation

Luke 14:28-30 For which of you, intending to build a tower, sits not down first, and counts the cost, whether he have sufficient to finish it? [29] Lest haply, after he has laid the foundation, and is not able to finish it, all that behold it begin to mock him, [30] Saying, This man began to build, and was not able to finish.


1 Corinthians 3:11
For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

John 2:18-21 Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign show You unto us, seeing that You do these things? [19] Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up. [20] Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and will You rear it up in three days? [21] But he spake of the temple of his body.

What do you see regarding after he has laid the foundation …
whether he have sufficient to finish it?

What do you see regarding after he has laid the foundation …
whether he have sufficient to finish it?

What I see in this that encourages.
I think of 1 Corinthians 3:9-11 For we are laborers together with God: you are God's husbandry, you are God's building. [10] According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another builds thereon. But let every man take heed how he builds thereupon. [11] For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

And regarding the foundation where the religious leaders mocked the foundation of God.
Mark 15:28-31 And the scripture was fulfilled, which said, And he was numbered with the transgressors. [29] And they that passed by railed on him, wagging their heads, and saying, Ah, you that destroy the temple, and build it in three days, [30] Save yourself, and come down from the cross. [31] Likewise also the chief priests mocking said among themselves with the scribes, He saved others; himself he cannot save.

….after he has laid the foundation …
whether he have sufficient to finish it?
What makes …after he has laid the foundation speak…
And whether he has sufficient to finish it speak…
Is
2 Corinthians 3:4-6 Such is the confidence that we have through Christ toward God. [5] Not that we are sufficient in ourselves to claim anything as coming from us, but our sufficiency is from God, [6] who has made us sufficient to be ministers of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit. For the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

Because isn’t this what we tell others yea?
How the foundation of God stands? Where if the Work is of God nothing can overthrow it? 2 Timothy 2:19 But God's firm foundation stands, bearing this seal: "The Lord knows those who are his," and, "Let everyone who names the name of the Lord depart from iniquity."

Luke 14:30
Saying, This man began to build, and was not able to finish.

After comes
Luke 14:34 Salt is good: but if the salt have lost his savor(taste), wherewith will it be seasoned?

I’m not sure what salt is.
Forgetting for a moment trying to define salt…
When I think of taste …
And hope of when something has lost its savor…
I think of what life reveals which is depression often…
I’ve asked these questions also: what is the point of this life?
What is there to be hopeful for? Why get up everyday and continue?
If everything is so bad or evil or pointless then there is no hope…
When I think of savor or taste when you have loss the zest of life, or others do not see anything in you that speaks of Psalm 34:8
O taste and see that the LORD is good:
blessed is the man that trusts in him.

Where will his savor lost come from? Remember Paul spoke of losing all things to be found in Christ. I take that to mean Paul lost the admiration of men in what men held as admiration. Losing his taste as men no longer drooled after what Paul pointed to as Christlike “we will be weak, that you be made strong.” Consider seek first His kingdom, His Righteousness and all these things (exceeding great promises) will be added unto you 2 Peter 1:4-8
(Notice it comes from ‘Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these you might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. [5] And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; [6] And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; [7] And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity. [8] For if these things be (added)in you, and abound, they make you (not having your own righteousness but the Righteousness of God) that you will neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Jay Ross said:

There are a series of one verse parables in Luke 14 which tells us that we do not have the means to build a "temple" i.e. called a watch tower in Luke 14:28, and that we will fail in any attempt to do so, but if Israel Seeks out the condition that the King has, who will come to defeat the nations in sight of Israel, and complies with those requirements, then their salvation will be assured. However, if their saltiness is lacking, then they too will be discarded.

Click to expand...

Agree Luke 14 tells us that we do not have the means to build a temple…and that we will fail in any attempt to do so. Similar to another passage in the New Testament concerning: leave these mean alone for if it’s a work of men it come to nothing. But if it’s a Work of God nothing can overthrow it.

rvmb said:

""1 Corinthians 3:11
For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.""
That's part of 1 Cor 3:10-15, 2 Cor 5:10 << The Judgement Seat of Christ judgement for believers SAVED by the 1 Cor 15:1-4, Eph 1:13 Gospel that applies 'today'

Click to expand...

What do you think of
…after he has laid the foundation..?
I ask because I see two where:
…after man has laid the foundation…
…After God has laid the foundation …
Two different endings…? What happens after man has laid the foundation? What happens After God has laid the foundation

quietthinker said:

some even grows but doesn't reach maturity

Click to expand...

What is not reaching maturity?

rvmb said:

The verse is part of the Judgement Seat of Christ that ONLY Paul taught that applies to believers saved by the 1 Cor 15:1-4, Eph 1:13 Gospel that was taught ONLY to Paul (Gal 1:11-12) by Christ.
Why are you trying to apply it elsewhere ?

Click to expand...

Because I’m interested in understanding the nature of God. What nature…that He is Able. When I think of a man who after he laid the foundation and started to build…he didn’t have the sufficiency to finish what he started. I can’t read that and not think of the foundation God laid which is Jesus Christ. One speaks of failure. One speaks of able to finish what has been Laid. I’m familiar with not having sufficiency to finish. What amazes me is After God laid the foundation He is sufficient to finish.

rvmb said:

JSoC- Rom 14:10, 1 Cor 3:10-15, 2 Cor 5:10 is the teaching of Paul
1 Cr 3:11 Christ laid the foundation
1 Cr 3:12 any build on that - the 'works' of a believer saved by 1 Cor 15:1-4, Eph 1:13
1 Cr 3:13 those 'works' are tested by fire
1 Cr 3:14-14 good 'works' = reward, others = loss
1 Cr 3:15 reward or loss, believer remains saved

Click to expand...

Okay thanks. I’m not disputing 1 Corinthians 3:11-15.

quietthinker said:

See Mathew 13 ViJ

Click to expand...

I read it a few times this morning. I’m curious what you glean from it in regards to maturity? I’m trying to understand what the bring forth fruit sown on good ground means to you. We never know when someone quotes or points at a passage why it answers …in this case what maturity is.

quietthinker said:

The parable of the sower tells us that the seeds who 'never made it,' so to speak, didn't/ couldn't produce that which is required to replicate themselves, ie never matured.
How does this apply? Maturing is a process of having access to nutrients....annnnnd, ingesting them.

The disciples, as an example, were limited/ stunted in their understanding when they first encountered Jesus. Awed by his miracles, riveted by his words but understanding their intent and meaning was slim. Firstly, none of them believed he was going to die even while he made it very clear with his words many times, (it was totally outside their paradigm) then they refused to believe he was resurrected.....even at the testimony of an eye witness (Mary). Yes, they had access to the 'nutrients' in their 3.5 year sojourn with Jesus but what they ingested had lots of reservations (doubts and misinterpretation).
Maturity powered ahead when they 'joined the dots' (understood) after the resurrection in the 40 days with Jesus before he ascended.
The new openness to information/ experience/ relationship opened the door to absorb the 'nutrients'.

Now, to your question, how/ what does maturity look like? It understands/ joins the dots by seeing/ understanding through the lens of Jesus.
We need to ask, how does the lens of Jesus see/ understand?....Ahhhhhh, the very core and matter for which the Devil does back flips to conceal from us. So we pray, Father, open our eyes and ears, teach us your ways so that your Kingdom informs all that we think and do.

Here is a dialog between Ian, Sasha and Warren. Please take the time to watch it ViJ. I pray it sheds light.

241 Who Killed Jesus according to Isaiah 53?

In this episode of Rediscovering God we take a close look at Isaiah 53 which many use to support the idea that God needed the death of His son to enable Him to forgive sinners. However a close look at this chapter reveals a much different outcome and attributes the killing of Jesus to the people...

www.rediscoveringgod.ca

Click to expand...

It’s a lot to take in. This stood out to me : A loving person can voluntarily give up his place in the lifeboat for another who does not have a place.

I can see this in when the Corinthians asked for proof Christ speaks in Paul. The proof of Christ speaking I think is “we will be weak, that you be made strong.” I don’t view that as someone who gives up their seat in a lifeboat to appear self sacrificing…but suffering the rejection and willing to be weak so they may see Christ. To me it’s not Paul but the Spirit of God in Paul doing the same as the cross “who rich become poor that we may be made rich”. It all speaks to how we view and through what perspective we look. Others won’t agree but when I read the parable you point to about the seed. If the only focus is our being the one who has the seat (or good ground) then we miss… when satan comes he steals what is planted in hearts. To me that tells me to not steal what is planted in others hearts. To me the parable is about that which lacks …but also how Christ is toward those who lack. I do agree it’s about maturity but what is maturity when it’s full gown? To me it’s upside-down from how we think and reason the parable teaches maturity. Especially when we are always the stronger one, not ever the weak. Imo especially if we never heed the warning —us in the role as the offender against brother —while claiming to be the one seed grows in, becoming Christ-like. “Weak that you be made strong.” How many have you met that will be weak that you be made strong? It’s like a unicorn? Is it real? Why is it so rare? When we all say or tell what it means. Oh we will say we are weak so another can be strong. Honestly I haven’t seen a unicorn …yet.

But I have seen or felt the constant trying to steal what has been planted. So much so I believe it’s real that Satan comes to steal what is sown not desiring it has time to root, not wanting it to grow up to reach maturity. I just hope I’m not the one stealing…