A View Of The Name Of Yehovah

PS95 · Friday at 3:27 PM

Grailhunter said:
I find no meaning for lefus.
This is what I find.....
Latin is Iesus in formal contexts, derived from the Greek Iēsous (Ἰησοῦς),
But what I am saying is that the word Jesus is not used before the 17th century.
And like I said it is not going to hurt my feeling if you can prove me wrong.

Oh come on GH- look here at chapter 3 verse 6- zoom in on His name. What I said stands. They used the Latin version of His name!

The Geneva Bible 1560 : God : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

A full scan of the original Geneva Bible.

archive.org

Grailhunter · Friday at 3:34 PM

PS95 said:
Oh come on GH- look here at chapter 3 verse 6- zoom in on His name. What I said stands. They used the Latin version of His name!

The Geneva Bible 1560 : God : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

A full scan of the original Geneva Bible.

archive.org

Christ’s Name in the Geneva Bible

In the Geneva Bible (1560/1587 editions), the name of Christ is rendered as Iesvs in the first-person genealogy (Matthew 1:1–17) and as Iesus in the narrative account of his birth (Matthew 1:18–25) Bible Hub+1.

The Geneva Bible, unlike the Latin Vulgate or the later King James Version, follows the Greek spelling rather than the Latin Iesus, which was common in the KJV.

For example:

In the genealogy, the text reads: “the book of the generation of Iesvs Christ the sonne of Dauid” Bible Hub.
In the birth narrative, the angel tells Joseph: “And she shall bring forth a sonne, and thou shalt call his name Iesvs: for hee shall saue his people from their sinnes” Bible Hub.

Later editions of the Geneva Bible (post-1587) sometimes use Jesus in place of Iesvs or Iesus, but the original 1560/1587 texts consistently use the Greek transliteration form www.textusreceptusbibles.com.

Summary:

Geneva Bible (1560/1587): Iesvs (genealogy) and Iesus (birth narrative)
Reason: Follows the Greek New Testament spelling of Iēsous
Difference from KJV: KJV uses Iesus throughout, while Geneva’s early form is Iesvs in the genealogy and Iesus in the narrative The Gospel

TrevorHL · Friday at 3:38 PM

The following is one example of where the two different forms of the Yahweh Name are used:

Isaiah 50:4-10 (KJV): 4The Lord GOD hath given me the tongue of the learned, that I should know how to speak a word in season to him that is weary: he wakeneth morning by morning, he wakeneth mine ear to hear as the learned. 5The Lord GOD hath opened mine ear, and I was not rebellious, neither turned away back. 6I gave my back to the smiters, and my cheeks to them that plucked off the hair: I hid not my face from shame and spitting. 7For the Lord GOD will help me; therefore shall I not be confounded: therefore have I set my face like a flint, and I know that I shall not be ashamed. 8He is near that justifieth me; who will contend with me? let us stand together: who is mine adversary? let him come near to me. 9Behold, the Lord GOD will help me; who is he that shall condemn me? lo, they all shall wax old as a garment; the moth shall eat them up. 10Who is among you that feareth the LORD, that obeyeth the voice of his servant, that walketh in darkness, and hath no light? let him trust in the name of the LORD, and stay upon his God.

The four occurrences spelt GOD in the KJV is the Strongs' #3069 and these have the vowel points of Elohim to warn the Jewish reader to read Elohim, while the other two are #3068 to warn the reader to read Adonai. The reason for the difference is that the first four have Adonai immediately before the occurrence of Yahweh and this change avoids reading Adonai Adonai.

The erroneous form Jehovah or in this thread Yehovah is based on a misreading of YHWH and integrating the vowel points of Adonai.

Kind regards
Trevor

PS95 · Friday at 4:00 PM

Grailhunter said:
Christ’s Name in the Geneva Bible
In the Geneva Bible (1560/1587 editions), the name of Christ is rendered as Iesvs in the first-person genealogy (Matthew 1:1–17) and as Iesus in the narrative account of his birth (Matthew 1:18–25) Bible Hub+1.

The Geneva Bible, unlike the Latin Vulgate or the later King James Version, follows the Greek spelling rather than the Latin Iesus, which was common in the KJV.

For example:

In the genealogy, the text reads: “the book of the generation of Iesvs Christ the sonne of Dauid” Bible Hub.

In the birth narrative, the angel tells Joseph: “And she shall bring forth a sonne, and thou shalt call his name Iesvs: for hee shall saue his people from their sinnes” Bible Hub.

Later editions of the Geneva Bible (post-1587) sometimes use Jesus in place of Iesvs or Iesus, but the original 1560/1587 texts consistently use the Greek transliteration form www.textusreceptusbibles.com.

Summary:

Geneva Bible (1560/1587): Iesvs (genealogy) and Iesus (birth narrative)

Reason: Follows the Greek New Testament spelling of Iēsous

Difference from KJV: KJV uses Iesus throughout, while Geneva’s early form is Iesvs in the genealogy and Iesus in the narrative The Gospel

Aramaic/Hebrew (later form): Yeshua → common name in post-exilic Judaism
Greek: Iesous → rendering of Yeshua in the Septuagint and New Testament
Latin: Iesus → standard in the early church and Western Christianity
English: Jesus → established in late medieval and early modern usage

I showed your directly in the geneva bible what it says! Did you even bother to look? If you still want to deny that was the Latin version- ok with me. People gonna do what they're gonna do! I think it's clear enough for all. good day GH.

Grailhunter · Friday at 4:14 PM

PS95 said:
Aramaic/Hebrew (later form): Yeshua → common name in post-exilic Judaism

Greek: Iesous → rendering of Yeshua in the Septuagint and New Testament

Latin: Iesus → standard in the early church and Western Christianity

English: Jesus → established in late medieval and early modern usage

I showed your directly in the geneva bible what it says! Did you even bother to look? If you still want to deny that was the Latin version- ok with me. People gonna do what they're gonna do! I think it's clear enough for all. good day GH.

It looks like you showed me in later revisions of the Geneva Bible that the word Jesus was used. Still that is after 1500. But I will check it out, thanks.
The rest of it is wrong.
For example....
In the Septuagint (LXX), the Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible, the name Yeshua (יֵשׁוּעַ) — a shortened form of Yehoshua (יְהוֹשֻׁעַ) — is rendered as Ἰησοῦς (Iēsous), the same Greek form used in the New Testament for the Messiah.

Christ's name Yeshua was a common name and appeared in the Hebrew Bible but not in Septuagint.
There is no way to translate from Ἰησοῦς (Iēsous) to Jesus. Again no J's in the scriptures. Did they not know Yeshua was His name for all that time? Could they not spell Yeshua? I don't know and no one really knows where the word Jesus came from.

Again Miriam would not give her Son a Greek word for a name and the scriptures say that only one name can be called upon for salvation......so I will stick with Yeshua.

WalterandDebbie · Friday at 4:37 PM

Grailhunter said:
It looks like you showed me in later revisions of the Geneva Bible that the word Jesus was used. Still that is after 1500. But I will check it out, thanks.
The rest of it is wrong.
For example....
In the Septuagint (LXX), the Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible, the name Yeshua (יֵשׁוּעַ) — a shortened form of Yehoshua (יְהוֹשֻׁעַ) — is rendered as Ἰησοῦς (Iēsous), the same Greek form used in the New Testament for the Messiah.

Christ's name Yeshua was a common name and appeared in the Hebrew Bible but not in Septuagint.
There is no way to translate from Ἰησοῦς (Iēsous) to Jesus. Again no J's in the scriptures. Did they not know Yeshua was His name for all that time? Could they not spell Yeshua? I don't know and no one really knows where the word Jesus came from.

Again Miriam would not give her Son a Greek word for a name and the scriptures say that only one name can be called upon for salvation......so I will stick with Yeshua.

Hello Grailhunter, I have been following this thread,

Latin is Iesus: What is the origin of the words “Jesus” and “Christ”? | Time of Reckoning Ministry

What is the origin of the words “Jesus” and “Christ”?

Posted by Navah on Nov 22, 2018

Question: What is the origin of the words “Jesus” and “Christ”?

Answer: For the English-speaking Christians Jesus Christ is the person who lived in the first century Judea, the Messiah of God of Israel, who died through crucifixion in 28 A.D. and was resurrected on the third day. But do the Christians know the real Jesus Christ and how many of them of them know His true name?

However, few of them know His true name: Yeshua. When the gospels were translated into Greek and Latin for the gentile believers, the name Yeshua had to go through a difficult transliteration into Greek, since there was no sh-sound in the language: Ἰησοῦς, Iesus (eeh-soos). From Greek to Latin the name became Iesus (yeh-zus) and from Latin into English: Jesus, as letter “j” replaced “i” to depicts the new y-sound in Latin. What may be interesting for the reader is that the Hebrew name for Joshua and Jesus is one and the same: Yehoshua or the short form Yeshua. One name appears in the Greek translations of the Hebrew and Apostolic scriptures: Iesus, but for well-known doctrinal reasons the translators chose two different foreign names for the Hebrew name Yehoshua: Joshua and Jesus.

Love, Walter

Grailhunter · Friday at 5:02 PM

WalterandDebbie said:
Hello Grailhunter, I have been following this thread,

Latin is Iesus: What is the origin of the words “Jesus” and “Christ”? | Time of Reckoning Ministry

What is the origin of the words “Jesus” and “Christ”?
Posted by Navah on Nov 22, 2018

Question: What is the origin of the words “Jesus” and “Christ”?

Answer: For the English-speaking Christians Jesus Christ is the person who lived in the first century Judea, the Messiah of God of Israel, who died through crucifixion in 28 A.D. and was resurrected on the third day. But do the Christians know the real Jesus Christ and how many of them of them know His true name?

However, few of them know His true name: Yeshua. When the gospels were translated into Greek and Latin for the gentile believers, the name Yeshua had to go through a difficult transliteration into Greek, since there was no sh-sound in the language: Ἰησοῦς, Iesus (eeh-soos). From Greek to Latin the name became Iesus (yeh-zus) and from Latin into English: Jesus, as letter “j” replaced “i” to depicts the new y-sound in Latin. What may be interesting for the reader is that the Hebrew name for Joshua and Jesus is one and the same: Yehoshua or the short form Yeshua. One name appears in the Greek translations of the Hebrew and Apostolic scriptures: Iesus, but for well-known doctrinal reasons the translators chose two different foreign names for the Hebrew name Yehoshua: Joshua and Jesus.

Love, Walter

Trust me I have heard all this in college. It its silly. You cannot translate Ἰησοῦς, Iesus to Jesus. If you translated this word to English it would be healer. No Greek people with this name. Miriam would not name her Son Ἰησοῦς, Iesus. No J's in the scriptures.....Joshua was Yeshua. Job--Yob Jacob---Yacob etc. The Hebrews were big on Y's the Greek and Aramaic were not.
It is common knowledge that Christ's name was Yeshua. Kinda like Ed and Edward --- Yeshua or Yehoshua.
No excuse for it, we can pronounce and spell the names of the characters in the scriptures in English and there is no reason not to.

The name Mary is interesting. Her name was Miriam, after Moses' sister, but she got in trouble and her name means rebellion. The translators did not like that so they changed it to Maria....and then to Mary.

NayborBear · Friday at 5:48 PM

PS95 said:
No one is certain. While I think He understands if we do mispronounce it ,It's wrong to insist that we know for sure. The most important thing is- Is God your Father? I call him abba- my Father. Jesus never taught us to use anything other than, Father. Not once! Nor did He use anything but Father.

Indeed He IS! :dusted:

NayborBear · Friday at 5:58 PM

Grailhunter said:
It looks like you showed me in later revisions of the Geneva Bible that the word Jesus was used. Still that is after 1500. But I will check it out, thanks.
The rest of it is wrong.
For example....
In the Septuagint (LXX), the Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible, the name Yeshua (יֵשׁוּעַ) — a shortened form of Yehoshua (יְהוֹשֻׁעַ) — is rendered as Ἰησοῦς (Iēsous), the same Greek form used in the New Testament for the Messiah.

Christ's name Yeshua was a common name and appeared in the Hebrew Bible but not in Septuagint.
There is no way to translate from Ἰησοῦς (Iēsous) to Jesus. Again no J's in the scriptures. Did they not know Yeshua was His name for all that time? Could they not spell Yeshua? I don't know and no one really knows where the word Jesus came from.

Again Miriam would not give her Son a Greek word for a name and the scriptures say that only one name can be called upon for salvation......so I will stick with Yeshua.

Pronouncing of the name Jesus "'Yaw-'Soo-uh" is pretty much spoken like we would say the name "Joshua." Only with the "Yaw" sound instead of the "Juh" sound.

Grailhunter · Friday at 9:59 PM

NayborBear said:
Pronouncing of the name Jesus "'Yaw-'Soo-uh" is pretty much spoken like we would say the name "Joshua." Only with the "Yaw" sound instead of the "Juh" sound.

NayborBear · Saturday at 10:17 AM

Grailhunter said:

My apologies Grailhunter! I didn't proofread my post very well!
'Yeh-'Shew-eh is a more correct pronunciation for Messiah.
As 'Yaw-uh-'Vay is a more correct pronunciation for the Covenant God of Israel.

Grailhunter · Saturday at 11:05 AM

NayborBear said:
My apologies Grailhunter! I didn't proofread my post very well!
'Yeh-'Shew-eh is a more correct pronunciation for Messiah.
As 'Yaw-uh-'Vay is a more correct pronunciation for the Covenant God of Israel.

There Yea go.....
I have went to college on these things and so accuracy is important to me. Besides that is there any reason not to use the real names of the characters of the Bible, particularly of God the Father and God the Son. Does God care if we call them any name under sun? I guess we will find out.

If you ever got to Jerusalem, ask them how do you pronounce your city in Hebrew.

NayborBear · Saturday at 12:40 PM

Grailhunter said:
There Yea go.....
I have went to college on these things and so accuracy is important to me. Besides that is there any reason not to use the real names of the characters of the Bible, particularly of God the Father and God the Son. Does God care if we call them any name under sun? I guess we will find out.

If you ever got to Jerusalem, ask them how do you pronounce your city in Hebrew.

Well? There's a "saying" that goes:
"Tis a far better endeavor to be "golfing" and thinking about GOD,"
"Then it is to be in "Church", thinking about "golfing!"

So? Although a more correct pronunciation is more (how can I say) "preferred?"
Is not NEAR as important as "what goes through one's mind" regardless of one's pronunciation.

Just sharing that which I've "learnt", from (how can I say) "BEING learnt!"

Although I started a "mail in college" course from M.B.I. (Moody Bible Institute)?
It was (how can I say) "interrupted", and was taken (willingly I might add) to here:
Hebrews 6:1
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection(completeness); not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith TOWARD God,
To "THIS (how can I say) Institution of Higher Spiritual Learning and education:
Isaiah 28:
5 In that day shall the Lord of hosts be for a crown of glory, and for a diadem of beauty, unto the residue of his people,
6 And for a spirit of judgment to him that sitteth in judgment, and for strength to them that turn the battle to the gate.
7 But they also have erred through wine, and through strong drink are out of the way; the priest and the prophet have erred through strong drink, they are swallowed up of wine, they are out of the way through strong drink; they err in vision, they stumble in judgment.
9 Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts.
10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:
15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves:
18 And your covenant with death shall be disannulled (BEEN HERE), and your agreement with hell shall not stand (BEEN HERE TOO! Spirtiual WARFARE is NOT a choice! Tis REQUIRED!); when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then ye shall be trodden down by it. (this is what I mean by "being LEARNT)
19 From the time that it goeth forth it shall take you: for morning by morning shall it pass over, by day and by night: and it shall be a vexation only to understand the report(.
21 For the Lord shall rise up as in mount Perazim, he shall be wroth as in the valley of Gibeon, that he may do his work, his strange work; and bring to pass his act, his strange act.

In which the "Teacher/s therein?"
Are a (how can I say) quite a BIT more "adamant" in one's application of what is being given!
It's either "LEARN?"
Or? You will BE "LEARNT!"
No....If....and....or BUTS!

So? Not sure what you or anyone else may call it?
But? "Tis a long STRANGE trip it's BEEN!"
And?.....It AIN'T over YET!

Grailhunter · Saturday at 3:20 PM

NayborBear said:
Well? There's a "saying" that goes:
"Tis a far better endeavor to be "golfing" and thinking about GOD,"
"Then it is to be in "Church", thinking about "golfing!"

So? Although a more correct pronunciation is more (how can I say) "preferred?"
Is not NEAR as important as "what goes through one's mind" regardless of one's pronunciation.

Just sharing that which I've "learnt", from (how can I say) "BEING learnt!"

Although I started a "mail in college" course from M.B.I. (Moody Bible Institute)?
It was (how can I say) "interrupted", and was taken (willingly I might add) to here:
Hebrews 6:1
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection(completeness); not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith TOWARD God,
To "THIS (how can I say) Institution of Higher Spiritual Learning and education:
Isaiah 28:
5 In that day shall the Lord of hosts be for a crown of glory, and for a diadem of beauty, unto the residue of his people,
6 And for a spirit of judgment to him that sitteth in judgment, and for strength to them that turn the battle to the gate.
7 But they also have erred through wine, and through strong drink are out of the way; the priest and the prophet have erred through strong drink, they are swallowed up of wine, they are out of the way through strong drink; they err in vision, they stumble in judgment.
9 Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts.
10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:
15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves:
18 And your covenant with death shall be disannulled (BEEN HERE), and your agreement with hell shall not stand (BEEN HERE TOO! Spirtiual WARFARE is NOT a choice! Tis REQUIRED!); when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then ye shall be trodden down by it. (this is what I mean by "being LEARNT)
19 From the time that it goeth forth it shall take you: for morning by morning shall it pass over, by day and by night: and it shall be a vexation only to understand the report(.
21 For the Lord shall rise up as in mount Perazim, he shall be wroth as in the valley of Gibeon, that he may do his work, his strange work; and bring to pass his act, his strange act.

In which the "Teacher/s therein?"
Are a (how can I say) quite a BIT more "adamant" in one's application of what is being given!
It's either "LEARN?"
Or? You will BE "LEARNT!"
No....If....and....or BUTS!

So? Not sure what you or anyone else may call it?
But? "Tis a long STRANGE trip it's BEEN!"
And?.....It AIN'T over YET!

I am sure you are trying to make a point......Kind of a dull point.

NayborBear · Saturday at 7:16 PM

Grailhunter said:
I am sure you are trying to make a point......Kind of a dull point.

Then I shan't bore you any longer.
And ask your forgiveness!

Hebrews 5:11
Of whom we have many things to say, and hard to be uttered, seeing ye are dull of hearing.

Wick Stick · Saturday at 8:45 PM

Grailhunter said:
Does God care if we call them any name under sun? I guess we will find out.

When the ancient city of Ninevah was excavated, archaeologists found a single period of monotheism. One would think this was after Jonah visited, and the city turned to God.

During that period, the people there called God "NBW" rather than "YHVH."

TrevorHL · Sunday at 12:40 AM

Greetings NayborBear,

NayborBear said:
"Tis a far better endeavor to be "golfing" and thinking about GOD,"
"Then it is to be in "Church", thinking about "golfing!"

I suggest that if either of these have been your experience then it would be worthwhile finding a better meeting and fellowship. I read your post early this Sunday morning and again this afternoon after our weekly Memorial Meeting and fellowship and suggest that I have never felt the two sentiments that you have expressed in the 45 years that I have been meeting at my present regional location and also in the many years when I lived in Sydney and attended three different meetings and I preferred the third one.

Kind regards
Trevor

WalterandDebbie · Sunday at 1:36 PM

PS95 said:
Dear Walter and Debbie-
Are you guys born Jewish? You are still under 613 laws of torah?
I looked around on that site. It's a bit disturbing. It's Kabaalah.. Reincarnation of the soul so that you have multiple chances at life to get it right. This site should not be paid attention to.
I agree with Trevor- I'm surprised that you disagree. There is no valid reason to disagree. This site seems a bit like Gnosticism. Be careful.

Hello, PS95: how are you all? No, we were not born Jewish. We are keeping what God commanded, in today's life, except for the sacrificial and priesthood laws, according to Leviticus 23:1-44 KJV, Leviticus 23 King James Version 23 And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying, 2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the Lord, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.

Passover At Even

Thursday 4-6-23 5th. Day Of The Weekly Cycle Nisan 14, 5783 18th. Spring Day Leviticus 23 The Weekly Sabbath 1 And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying, 2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the Lord, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations...

www.christianityboard.com

Walter

TrevorHL · Sunday at 5:35 PM

Greetings again Walter,

WalterandDebbie said:
Concerning the feasts of the Lord, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.

WalterandDebbie said:
Passover
4 These are the feasts of the Lord, even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons.
5 In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is the Lord's passover.

Do you also keep the Memorial Bread and Wine on a weekly basis as instituted by Jesus who is the True Passover Lamb?

Kind regards
Trevor

WalterandDebbie · Sunday at 9:23 PM

TrevorHL said:
Greetings again Walter,

Do you also keep the Memorial Bread and Wine on a weekly basis as instituted by Jesus who is the True Passover Lamb?

Kind regards
Trevor

Hello TrevorHL, how are you all? We are well. We/and my wife were discussing what we think you are asking. We used to do it, years ago, at a church service weekly on a Sunday, or some other day as Communion. Or some other name, different groups call it. But we are not with that kind of understanding. Ever since we learned about The Christian-Messianic Passover Haggadah

But can you show anywhere? Where Christ taught that, if you are asking that?

Love, Walter and Debbie

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