Christian jesting?!

Muse · Jul 8, 2014

[SIZE=18pt]There is no such a thing![/SIZE]
[SIZE=12pt]Well, I find no difference between jesting in theatre shows and that practiced by some Christians; both are wonton practices for the uncircumcised to feed on. For me, I have never found one word in the whole bible suggesting jesting, nor have I read any story that implies that, neither is there any godly character in the bible that portrays that kind of nature. Did it escape my eyes? I stand to be corrected.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=12pt]If there be any harmless Christian jokes for [/SIZE][SIZE=18pt]jesting[/SIZE][SIZE=12pt] then the bible is deliberately silent on it. [/SIZE][SIZE=18pt]Jesting [/SIZE][SIZE=12pt]has the same meaning as [/SIZE][SIZE=16pt]flippant[/SIZE][SIZE=12pt], [/SIZE][SIZE=16pt]joking[/SIZE][SIZE=12pt], [/SIZE][SIZE=16pt]kidding[/SIZE][SIZE=12pt], [/SIZE][SIZE=16pt]unserious[/SIZE][SIZE=12pt], etc.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=12pt]All I find is that the bible condemns and blacklists [/SIZE][SIZE=18pt]jesting [/SIZE][SIZE=12pt]as a wicked practices suited for the uncircumcised.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=12pt]Some Christians, lacking the true source of joy, indulge in hewing these broken cisterns in the name of jesting for entertaining their poor souls.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=12pt]To me they commit the two evils as stated in Jeremiah chap 2: living the fountain of living waters they hew to themselves broken cisterns! Is there no joy enough in worshipping, singing, listening to sermons, testifying, praying, meditating, etc? for us to turn to worldliness for entertainment.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=12pt]Eph5:3-7[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]But [/SIZE][SIZE=14pt]fornication[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt], and all [/SIZE][SIZE=14pt]uncleanness[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt], or [/SIZE][SIZE=14pt]covetousness[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt], let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints;[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]Neither [/SIZE][SIZE=14pt]filthiness[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt], nor [/SIZE][SIZE=14pt]foolish talking[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt], nor [/SIZE][SIZE=14pt]jesting[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt], which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]For this ye know, that no [/SIZE][SIZE=14pt]whoremonger[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt], nor [/SIZE][SIZE=14pt]unclean person[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt], nor [/SIZE][SIZE=14pt]covetous man[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt], who is [/SIZE][SIZE=14pt]an idolater[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt], hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]Let no man deceive you with vain words:[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt] for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=14pt]Be not ye therefore partakers with them.[/SIZE]

RANDOR · Jul 8, 2014

Yep..........people who call themselves Christians and still cuss......go figure.
Praise and cursing from the same tongue....this cannot be!

Nomad · Jul 8, 2014

The Greek word for "jesting" in your proof text is "eutrapelia." Like most words, it has more than one meaning. The ESV rightly translates "eutrapelia" as "crude joking." I'll refer you to definition 2 & 2a.

εὐτραπελία
eutrapelia
Thayer Definition:
1) pleasantry, humour, facetiousness
2) in a bad sense
2a) scurrility, ribaldry, low jesting
Part of Speech: noun feminine
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: (meaning well-turned, i.e. ready at repartee, jocose)

Paul most likely has definition 2 and 2a in mind.

Scurrility: Foul mouthed or obscene abuse.

RIbaldry: Behavior or language bordering on indelicacy

Paul is not telling us to be humorless. He's telling us to refrain from crude joking.

RANDOR · Jul 8, 2014

Hey...did ya hear the one about the.................oooops.......

Nomad · Jul 8, 2014

RANDOR said:
Hey...did ya hear the one about the.................oooops.......

:lol:

HammerStone · Jul 8, 2014

The Bible is full of humor, including a reference to a false god turning aside to take a bathroom break (1 Kings 18:27). I agree that we need to be careful in avoiding crass humor that may turn off potential believers or trivialize important manners, but to say that the Bible does not include (or looks down upon) humor would be fallacious.

lforrest · Jul 8, 2014

God's sense of humor:

Numbers 11:4
Numbers 11:31-34

aspen · Jul 9, 2014

umm...you named yourself 'muse'

RANDOR · Jul 9, 2014

Hi Laid..............yes, god does have a sense of humor.....and yours is one of the best. You always make me laugh at your posts.
No one stays forever at these forums.....We are always at are stay at these places goin to find something wrong.....that's why many Christians don't attend church, meetings or bibles studies. It's always the other guy....................

But your strength......is needed in the body (church)...whether here or out there.

But never run because you don't like something............Thank God Jesus didn't run.

If ya don't like something...........just stand.......the Holy Spirit does not want to run with you......it wants you to share
that which you just did.
Others need to hear what you have to say........it just reminds them to get reeled back in.

She will never get to read this..............because...me thinks I'm one that is on her ignore list.

Angelina · Jul 9, 2014

I agree with the above that humor is an acceptable form of social interaction in this type of platform. Ephesians 5 states:

3 But fornication and all uncleanness or covetousness, let it not even be named among you, as is fitting for saints; 4 neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor coarse jesting, which are not fitting, but rather giving of thanks.

...and this is where we need to be careful as HS has already pointed out. filthiness, foolish talk and coarse jesting is not in the same league as good humored christian bantering. The question is...where do you draw the line. What one person may define as humorous may come across as rude and disrespectful to someone else. Try putting yourself in someone else's shoes for a moment and see if you think it's funny from their point of view. If isn't then... just don't go there. :huh:

Laid, I have removed your post because it contains mod decisions being discussed in public, which is a breach of forum rules as you already know. I'm sorry to see you go but I also think that you probably already made that decision well before now. I wish you well in your endeavors...

Shalom and Blessings!

Muse · Jul 10, 2014

Nomad said:
The Greek word for "jesting" in your proof text is "eutrapelia." Like most words, it has more than one meaning. The ESV rightly translates "eutrapelia" as "crude joking." I'll refer you to definition 2 & 2a.

εὐτραπελία
eutrapelia
Thayer Definition:
1) pleasantry, humour, facetiousness
2) in a bad sense
2a) scurrility, ribaldry, low jesting
Part of Speech: noun feminine
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: (meaning well-turned, i.e. ready at repartee, jocose)

Paul most likely has definition 2 and 2a in mind.

Scurrility: Foul mouthed or obscene abuse.

RIbaldry: Behavior or language bordering on indelicacy

Paul is not telling us to be humorless. He's telling us to refrain from crude joking.

Certainly not! Paul is not telling us to be humorless. But the Christian’s sense of humor should be Christian …. Holy and chaste, that which becometh godliness and that can maintain the Holy presence of God around. Unnecessary carry-on and laughter always grieves the Holy Spirit away, worse still when the name of the Lord is dragged into it … it borders on sacrilege! The human sense of humor and jesting have an extremely thin boundary, and any Christian must be quite on the lookout to escape crossing that invisible boundary every now and then! The bible does not record any event regarding any two saints telling each other sweet nothings! A joke is just a joke and it can never be a “holy joke” by the way. We wonder why there is very little presence of God around many Christians today. How could it be when we spend all our time telling and entertaining jokes or watching the same on dirt screens![SIZE=12pt]“[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt]Even in laughter the heart is sorrowful; and the end of that mirth is heaviness[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt].”[/SIZE]

HymnSeeker · Jul 10, 2014

Crude joking is a hard thing to refrain from, at least in the blue collar work setting.

I find this one of my largest stumbling blocks since coming to Christ, because it's just so easy to make the odd off color joke in the boredom of a 12 hour shift.

Muse · Jul 10, 2014

aspen said:
umm...you named yourself 'muse'

Not an English name by the way, but what about the bible verse and your own experience?

HammerStone said:
The Bible is full of humor, including a reference to a false god turning aside to take a bathroom break (1 Kings 18:27). I agree that we need to be careful in avoiding crass humor that may turn off potential believers or trivialize important manners, but to say that the Bible does not include (or looks down upon) humor would be fallacious.

Lets keep to the point, humor and jesting are quite different!

Cracking jokes to cheer one another as Christians is quite pathetic. That’s a profane use of the sense of humor. Of course David wasn’t dancing moodily before the Ark! Holy joy provokes holy laughter. On Pentecostal Day I don’t think the apostles were moody and sad. Miriam with her fellow women didn’t dance up and down the shores of the Red Sea without laughter! But that has nothing close to jesting.

[SIZE=14pt]Psalms 126[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]When the LORD turned again the captivity of Zion, we were like them that dream.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]Then was our mouth filled with laughter, and our tongue with singing[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt]: then said they among the heathen, The LORD hath done great things for them.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]The LORD hath done great things for us; whereof we are glad.[/SIZE]

A Christian is never so much on slippery ground than when in a jolly, mirth, carefree mood. Well I have not only learned from scriptures but by sad experience! Christianity is not only in the pages of the Bible but also in the hearts of born-again Christians bearing her fruits of joy, gladness, happiness, etc. no need of borrowing any from the world! No need of splitting hairs to know what is acceptable and good … it must simply pass the test of holiness, temperance

and sobriety.
[SIZE=14pt]Ecclesiastes 7[/SIZE]
It is better to go to the house of mourning, than to go to the house of feasting: for that is the end of all men; and the living will lay it to his heart.
Sorrow is better than laughter: for by the sadness of the countenance the heart is made better.
The heart of the wise is in the house of mourning; but the heart of fools is in the house of mirth.
It is better to hear the rebuke of the wise, than for a man to hear the song of fools.
For as the crackling of thorns under a pot, so is the laughter of the fool: this also is vanity.

“Secular” laughter can do nothing but chock the Spirit.
Remember the devil is the biggest jokester the creation ever had … just look around his world… that is one of his biggest field of entertainment.

laid renard · Jul 11, 2014

Angelina said:
Laid, I have removed your post because it contains mod decisions being discussed in public, which is a breach of forum rules as you already know. I'm sorry to see you go but I also think that you probably already made that decision well before now. I wish you well in your endeavors...

Shalom and Blessings!

Respect Privacy. This includes your own. Under no circumstances will you publicly share any correspondences or personal information of any member. On top of that, please do not share your own information publicly on the forum. Aside from attracting spam bots that will inevitably result in inboxes bursting with spam, it is never a good idea to give our personal information. We obviously cannot moderate private messages, but be advised that you never really know who is on the receiving end of that information. Any personal information posted in a topic will be removed.

And what part of the above forum rules did I break by saying :

"...someone made a joke about masturbation on an introduction thread. I reported it and yet it was not removed."

???

The above statement does not say what was said in the pms.

I reported a vulgar post, which is there for every one to see in plain site.

I reported it. An act on my part, so who's privacy was I betraying by that act ?

It was not removed, an act clearly shown by the fact that it is still there.

So I ask again, whose privacy did I break ?

I feel you removed my post because it agreed with the OP concerning the language getting out of hand on these boards.

I have my post copied down work for word. It made the site look bad, without betraying anyone's privacy, so it was removed. even though it was on topic. Discussing the out of hand talk.

Well, I take that back. Don't shoot the messenger. If the site looked bad in relationship to my post, it was the sites fault. I was just reporting what I saw.

Once again, on topic with the OP, as was my original post, where I stated, "this place needs some good 'ol fashioned straightening up.

Unless..... you agree that masturbation jokes belong on a Christian site..... :huh:

Madad21 · Jul 11, 2014

Muse said:
Cracking jokes to cheer one another as Christians is quite pathetic. That’s a profane use of the sense of humor.

Im sorry muse last time I looked was born with a sense of humor

When a mans heart is cheerful he shows rejoicing in however that man as an INDIVIDUAL shows it. (Individuals made by God in His image)

Humor and Sex are two things we are given, perversion of both ruins a man, through humor his mouth can be full of deceit and through perversion of sex he is given over to his perversion and both are unclean.

However sex in the way it is meant in marriage is glorifying to the Lord who created it, and the same with humor among brothers is for uplifting the heart and fellowship.

I suffer depression from time to time because i am isolated in much of my life muse, I have Christ and I love him dearly and when I cry out in loneliness he sends me friends who provide company and lots of joking and laughter, it heals my Spirit and I live again, I feel like everything's going to be ok and I thank Christ for them.

You have absolutely no idea.

When some one at your church makes a funny comment do you leave them a sour look????

I see only one good use for the word "Pathetic" in this thread.

Angelina · Jul 11, 2014

my post

Laid, I have removed your post because it contains mod decisions being discussed in public, which is a breach of forum rules as you already know.

Laid

I reported it. An act on my part, so who's privacy was I betraying by that act ?
It was not removed, an act clearly shown by the fact that it is still there. So I ask again, whose privacy did I break ?

You had reported a situation using the report button which was addressed by me. It had been addressed and the perpetrator had been dealt with accordingly. Mods may or may not affirm that an action has been taken regarding a report, at their own discretion. It is also at their discretion that a post is removed, In my opinion, this post did not need to be removed.

You then decided to address the privately reported incident by publicly discussing it in this thread and also at the end of another thread that I had posted in. Please note the blue underlined...

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These rules are not that difficult to follow, so no need in pushing the limits. They are only here to make the discussion fair to everyone. Ultimately, violations of the above are at the sole discretion of the staff here at Christianity Board. If you have an issue with one staff member, feel free to contact another or ask to speak to a superior, the hierarchy functions like this:

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Muse · Jul 14, 2014

Madad21 said:
Im sorry muse last time I looked was born with a sense of humor

When a mans heart is cheerful he shows rejoicing in however that man as an INDIVIDUAL shows it. (Individuals made by God in His image)

Humor and Sex are two things we are given, perversion of both ruins a man, through humor his mouth can be full of deceit and through perversion of sex he is given over to his perversion and both are unclean.

However sex in the way it is meant in marriage is glorifying to the Lord who created it, and the same with humor among brothers is for uplifting the heart and fellowship.

I suffer depression from time to time because i am isolated in much of my life muse, I have Christ and I love him dearly and when I cry out in loneliness he sends me friends who provide company and lots of joking and laughter, it heals my Spirit and I live again, I feel like everything's going to be ok and I thank Christ for them.

You have absolutely no idea.

When some one at your church makes a funny comment do you leave them a sour look????

I see only one good use for the word "Pathetic" in this thread.

why not seek edification through the bible provided way....than apply means which you might grief the Spirit. I DON'T EXPECT A CHRISTIAN TO SPEAK FUNNY THINGS FOR EDIFICATION. I WILL POLITELY CORRECT THEM, THAT WE HAVE BETTER WAYS OF EDIFICATION: "Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord. And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him."
The bible condemns jesting and to me the bible is always right.
I belief the Holy Spirit is a comforter enough, He has all I need to make me happy and His presence is wonderful. There is no real edification outside fellowship upon the realities of the bible by the Holy Spirit.
I believe in the sense of humor, and we have a lot of wholesome words, sayings and testimonies which can cause quite some lightness of heart, which is not jesting. Being funny and carry-on cannot be the Christian way. . So I must avoid it, whether from Christians or non-Christians.
WE SHALL GIVE ACCOUNT FOR EVERY IDLE WORD WE SPEAK.
MATT. 12: 35-37
[SIZE=14pt]A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=14pt]But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=14pt]For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.[/SIZE]

in jesting its very easy to speak idle or sacrilegious words. some can offend, some can insult, some can be defiling....

Guestman · Jul 14, 2014

The language of many who call themselves "Christian" is infiltrated with unclean speech, such as my mother's sister who was often crude in her speech (even after growing old), telling obscene jokes so that my mother told her sister that she did not want to hear them.

For those who are desirous of being "holy, because I, Jehovah your God, am holy" (Lev 19:2) after learning "the truth" (2 Tim 2:18), these have thus thrown away any coarse and unclean speech.

The apostle Paul wrote to the Ephesians: "Let sexual immorality and every sort of uncleanness or greediness not even be mentioned among you, just as is proper for holy people; neither shameful conduct nor foolish talking nor obscene jesting (Greek eutrapelia, meaning "scurrility [that means "coarseness, vulgarity, or a lack of refinement"], ribaldry [that means "language or behavior that is humorous but rude and vulgar, often involving jokes about sex"], low jesting", Thayer's Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament, pg 263)—things that are not befitting—but rather the giving of thanks. For you know this, recognizing it for yourselves, that no sexually immoral person or unclean person or greedy person, which means being an idolater, has any inheritance in the Kingdom of the Christ and of God."(Eph 5:3-5)

Paul wrote to the Colossian Christians: "But now you must put them all away from you: wrath, anger, badness, abusive speech, and obscene talk (Greek aischrologia, meaning "low and obscene speech") out of your mouth."(Col 3:8) Many who profess to be "Christian" visit porno websites, filling their minds and hearts with filthy, slutty, unclean thoughts and speech.

Here is some statistics that show this to be the case: (1) Every second, nearly 30,000 persons view pornographic Web sites.[1.8 million every minute, 108 million every hour] (2) Every minute, internet users send more than 1.7 million pornographic e-mails.[102 million every hour, 2.6 billion every 24 hours] (3) Every hour, nearly two hard-core pornographic videos are released in the United States. (4) Every day, an average of more than two million pornographic movies (yes, 2 million a day) are rented in the United States alone. (5) Every month, nearly 9 out of 10 young men and 3 out of 10 young women in the United States view pornography. The porno industry is an estimated $100 billion a year industry. (source of information, August 1 issue, 2013 Watchtower entitled "Pornography - Harmless or Toxic", pg 5, available for free download)

We are what we fed our minds, be it from the raunchy, perverted sexual media to that which is morally clean. David wrote: "I will not set anything worthless before my eyes. I hate the deeds of those who deviate from what is right; I will have nothing to do with them."(Ps 101:3)

David avoided anyone who did not have clean moral standards, even asking: "O Jehovah, who may be a guest in your tent ? Who may reside in your holy mountain ? The one who is walking faultlessly, practicing what is right and speaking the truth in his heart......He rejects anyone who is contemptible, but he honors those fearing Jehovah."(Ps 15:1, 2, 4)

Madad21 · Jul 14, 2014

Muse said:
why not seek edification through the bible provided way....than apply means which you might grief the Spirit. I DON'T EXPECT A CHRISTIAN TO SPEAK FUNNY THINGS FOR EDIFICATION. I WILL POLITELY CORRECT THEM, THAT WE HAVE BETTER WAYS OF EDIFICATION: "Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord. And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him."
The bible condemns jesting and to me the bible is always right.
I belief the Holy Spirit is a comforter enough, He has all I need to make me happy and His presence is wonderful. There is no real edification outside fellowship upon the realities of the bible by the Holy Spirit.
I believe in the sense of humor, and we have a lot of wholesome words, sayings and testimonies which can cause quite some lightness of heart, which is not jesting. Being funny and carry-on cannot be the Christian way. . So I must avoid it, whether from Christians or non-Christians.
WE SHALL GIVE ACCOUNT FOR EVERY IDLE WORD WE SPEAK.
MATT. 12: 35-37
[SIZE=14pt]A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=14pt]But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=14pt]For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.[/SIZE]

in jesting its very easy to speak idle or sacrilegious words. some can offend, some can insult, some can be defiling....

When you use all caps in your posts it is like you are shouting, when has shouting at a person ever convinced them of anything, its immature and irritating in my opinion. Christ never did it and for obvious reasons.

Humor has a time and place with that I agree, humor should not be perverted as I also agree, otherwise humor is as good as any tool for the Christian.

A Christian should not be rude or disgusting or so silly that someone thinks all you do is talk nonsense.

Psalms 1:1-2
1 Blessed is the one
who does not walk in step with the wicked
or stand in the way that sinners take
or sit in the company of mockers,
2 but whose delight is in the law of the Lord,
and who meditates on his law day and night.

Yes The Bible is a great source for edification with that I do not argue, but we also need fellowship and other believers, and it is part of the normal relationship of man to share laughter and good will.

I know I am in Christ and I certainly know when I am in rebuke, and when I am sharing light hearted banter with fellow brothers I feel my Spirit lift not rebuked.

We have a pastor who has been with the Salvation army all his life and is now in his 70's before the main speaker comes in he is up the front making us laugh with all his dry silly jokes, everybody is laughing and relaxed and enjoying each others company and ready to be taught, he is also very wise with many years of experience behind him, he is a great mentor and someone I look up to. With all that that man has gone through he should have nothing to be happy about, but his humor is rejoicing because he has the assurance of God promises and so nothing can take his laughter from him. This is his strength and his defiance against an enemy that would have him destroyed not up lifted.

May you be blessed brother

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