Sabbath-Keeping

JesusIsFaithful said:

Okay, but be ready to see why clarity is needed even within your own last post.


Jesus did not asks us to keep the seventh day Sabbath holy in John 14:15, because if those were the commandments He was talking about, then no one would be getting the Holy Ghost because that was the condition for keeping His commandments if you apply John 14:15 like that. That means you were using John 14:15 as inferring that is how we are saved which is by keeping "those" commandments.

John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; 17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

So then what commandments was Jesus talking about that comes with the promise of the eternally indwelling Holy Ghost? Let's start at the top.

John 14:1Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.

That was the first commandment. Then it is repeated severla more times before coming to verse 15.

John 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. 11 Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake. 12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.
So that supports the simplicity of the gospel as those were the "commandments" Jesus was talking about that comes with the promise of the forever indwelling Holy Ghost which is by believing in Him. So you pretty much have to take John 14:15 in context to foind out what commandments Jesus was actually talking about, and He was not talking about keeping the seventh day Sabbath holy at all.



Do note your conclusion as being the opposite of what you are saying about not keeping the seventh day Sabbath holy. Those who do not keep the seventh day Sabbath holy are those that do not love Him and therefore they are eternally lost. How is that not saying that believing in Jesus Christ for our salvation is not enough for us to be saved because you have to keep the seventh day Sabbath holy?

To clarify my position with His help, I had referred to 1 John 3:22-24 where verse 23 was John specifically noting the two commandments necessary for "abiding in Him"; not as if both commandments are necessary for salvation. The first is necessary for salvation, but the second one to love others is not a means for salvation but as a means and a testimony of how we are abiding in Him as His disciples.


And yet there is no little gem of plainly teaching the church in any epistle to even remind believers to keep the seventh day Sabbath holy since Gentiles would need that instructions since they do not practise that. Nowhere.. not once... did Paul or any of the disciples plainly warned Gentile believers of the necessity to keep the seventh day Sabbath holy.

And automatically imputing that commandment into any reference of that being of His commandments is hardly convincing for the amount of emphasis you claim is God's will on the matter for christians to follow.


Exodus 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: 10But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

You are not to benefit off of other people working on the sabbath day & so as far as I am concern, you have not been really keeping the seventh day Sabbath holy at all when you buy things that you should have done the day before or cook things that should have been prepared the day before ( without reheating it on the sabbath day ).

You access the internet in your house & under your roof.

Joshua 24:15And if it seem evil unto you to serve the Lord, choose you this day whom ye will serve;....but as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.

I believe you are saved, but I also believe that by the standard you judge others by, you will be found wanting by the standard you had been claiming to keep, but have not, brother. This does not mean you did not love Him, but this does mean you need to reassess how you are emphasizing the keeping of the seventh day Sabbath holy per the Old Covenant when we are not under that covenant at all.

Romans 14:4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand. 5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind. 6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. ....8 For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.

So how is Jesus able to make a non-sabbath day keeper stand? Because He is Lord of the Sabbath.

You want Jesus's stand on the issue of the sabbath day? Here it is.

Matthew 12:1At that time Jesus went on the sabbath day through the corn; and his disciples were an hungred, and began to pluck the ears of corn and to eat. 2 But when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto him, Behold, thy disciples do that which is not lawful to do upon the sabbath day. 3 But he said unto them, Have ye not read what David did, when he was an hungred, and they that were with him; 4 How he entered into the house of God, and did eat the shewbread, which was not lawful for him to eat, neither for them which were with him, but only for the priests? 5 Or have ye not read in the law, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless?

6 But I say unto you, That in this place is one greater than the temple. 7 But if ye had known what this meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice, ye would not have condemned the guiltless. 8 For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.

Now after Jesus gave two examples of how those that had broken the sabbath day were guiltless because of the temple, He refer to one greater then the temple in the place where He was speaking to in verse 6-8 as to why Jesus is able to make a non-sabbath day keeper stand as Paul had testified in Romans 14:4. May God increase you in the knowledge of Him of how His righteousness is bringing you Home.

Romans 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. 27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

There are commandments for abiding in Him as His disciples so that we may run that race for the high prize of our calling to be received as that vessel unto honour in His House in attending the Marriage Supper held in His honour, but we do so by trusting in Him as our Good Shepherd which is why the crowns we shall receive shall be cast at His feet because they are His crowning achievements in us.

Keeping the sabbath day holy is not one of His commandments for us to keep, but we are free to regard the day in honouring Him just as we are free not to because we know it is His righteousness that is bringing us Home.

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Questor said:

Keeping the Sabbath, which always fell on a Saturday until 321 AD, when the Catholic Church decreed keeping Sabbath on Sunday instead, since it would conveniently fall on the same day as all those Sun worshipers that gathered at the temples of Apollo, is not the be all and end all of G-d's desires for those He has called to become His children, but it is something that He does desire from those who love him...not to tally up points in how well you obey the commandments, nor to be like the rest of the world, but to honor Him, and His wishes.

If you wish to do honor to G-d, to YHVH, you will read the Bible, and see what it says as a whole, not what is taught in one liners in any church, and not by doing what sounds nice.

And if you truly love Yeshua haMashiach, you will heed his words.




Matthew 7:21-23 (KJV)
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Iniquity means lawlessness.


Matthew 7:22-23 (YLT)
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, lord, have we not in thy name prophesied? and in thy name cast out demons? and in thy name done many mighty things?
23 and then I will acknowledge to them, that--I never knew you, depart from me ye who are working lawlessness.



Matthew 7:21-27 (CJB)
21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord!’ will enter the Kingdom of Heaven, only those who do what my Father in heaven wants.
22 On that Day, many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord! Didn’t we prophesy in your name? Didn’t we expel demons in your name? Didn’t we perform many miracles in your name?’
23 Then I will tell them to their faces, ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!’
24 “So, everyone who hears these words of mine and acts on them will be like a sensible man who built his house on bedrock.
25 The rain fell, the rivers flooded, the winds blew and beat against that house, but it didn’t collapse, because its foundation was on rock.
26 But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not act on them will be like a stupid man who built his house on sand.
27 The rain fell, the rivers flooded, the wind blew and beat against that house, and it collapsed — and its collapse was horrendous!”




I have done my duty. I have warned you to listen to Yeshua, and not to your preachers, not to the siren song of the Adversary who says you need not DO anything, only Believe.

Belief only shows in your actions, not in the desires of your mind, so what you actually do matters. I did not say this, Yeshua said it with every step that he took. Become more like Him each day, and do as he did, and you will be his disciple, and not Satan's.

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Axehead said:

Where the Road Ends

The conscience, our own anxiety, and all slaves of the law bid us go the way of obedience to the very end in order to find peace with God. But the way of obedience has no end. It lies endlessly before you, bringing continually severer demands and constantly growing indebtedness. If you seek peace on that road, you will not find peace, but the debt of ten thousands talents instead.

But now Christ is the end of the law;
the road ends at His feet, and here
His righteousness is offered
to everyone who believes.

It is to that place, to Jesus only, that God has wanted to drive you with all your unrest and anguish of soul.

Bo Giertz
The Hammer of God

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"He that saith, I know Him, and keepeth not His commandments is a LIAR and the truth is not in him."

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for Jesus Himself wrote the Ten Commandments in stone

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mjrhealth said:

And anyone who insists on keeping the law to do good does not have the love of God in him.

God did, manipulating what is written to try distort the truth is doing you no favours. Jesus is teh truth and there is no lie in Him.

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2) Saying Christ Himself wrote the Ten Commandments and is the God of the OT is not manipulation or distortion - it is Scriptural, whether we object to it or not:

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mjrhealth said:

It is not scriptual, show me one bible that says such a thing,you have just lied. yes you broke one of teh ten commandments that you are so earnestly holding onto. You just twisted teh truth, which made the truth a lie, you again just broke the law.

Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Luk 16:15 And he said unto them, Ye are they which justify yourselves before men; but God knoweth your hearts: for that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God.
Luk 16:16 The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.

Yes these pharisees that insisted they kept the law and what did Christ say of them,

Mat 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
Mat 23:24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.
Mat 23:25 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.
Mat 23:26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.
Mat 23:27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.
Mat 23:28 Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.

Have you ever noticed that no one, not anyone but you and your religion have this thing about breaking the law, no one but you have insisted that those without the law would deliberatly break them, everything you speak of is all about you, where does Christ get the glory, where is love, did teh Law replace love, was it not Love that was always in place, but it was always the law that the pharisees chose to use. What has changed.

Hos 6:6 For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.

No one here has any trouble with saturday nor sunday worship nor any other day, neither does God pay heed to such trivial matters.

As for the law being a burden, its no burden to me nor some others here, it is certainly not causing us any great stress,

Mat 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
Mat 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
Mat 11:30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

If the law is no burden to you, why do you have to twist the truth and re write the bible , lie to make a point.

It is no wonder it says.

Tit_3:9 But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.

Joh 7:19 Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law? Why go ye about to kill me?

WHo was the law given to??

How will you ever see the truth if you do not take things to Christ and get revelation.

In all His Love

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Just as heaven would be hell for the dope addict who wouldn't be able to find any heroin there, for the gambler who could not find a casino there, for the fornicator who could not find a brothel there, or for the Sun worshiper who would find his god outshined by the glory of Jesus, ALL those who fight against and refuse to keep God's commandments down here will find heaven a place of torment, while those who love Jesus will happily keep His commandments for all eternity.

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Phoneman777 said:

This is a false interpretation of "end of the Law". James says "you have heard of the patience of Job and seen the END OF THE LORD". Should we conclude that this means the Lord has come to an end? The only dead end road is the one with the name "Iniquity Boulevard", on which those who travel it refuse to turn from their sin and will consequently suffer the most dreadful fate of all: "Depart from Me ye that work iniquity."

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mjrhealth said:

If a drug addict should make it to heaven He would no longer have teh world with him, the world would no longer be a problem, if a gambler should make it to heaven no longer with his flesh why would he even think of gambling, would not be on his mind, why would a fornicator have any issues to be in Heaven he would be washed clean with the blood of Christ

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Axehead said:

Here is another "dead end".

Gal 3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

Turn around while you still have time.

(Rom 3:19) Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

(Rom 3:20) Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Salvation by faith, alone!

What is the penalty if you are unable to go to a religious building on the weekend?

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Nothing could be further from the truth than the idea that in the end God will "flip a switch" and instantly cause all of our sinful desires to evaporate.

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Son of God, His grace and Commandments, a

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and not the sun god/satan and his days of sunday, dec 25th and easter, all of which are non Biblical and of pagan origin!

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Someone should tell MJR Health you cannot earn forgiveness of sins

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mjrhealth said:

And that phone man is exactly what happens. What dont you understand. Everything we do is vanity, futility. You just dont get it do you. These religious people who insist on keeping teh sabbath, or going to church every sunday, spend all their lives trying to beat their flesh into submission, than when thy stand before God expecting Him to praise them for all their works, than there is the drug addict, teh drunkard spend all their lives in torment and on their death bed give their lives to teh Lord, and what do teh religious gain, Nothing teh reward is the same, the way is teh same, "BY GRACE YOU ARE SAVED BY FAITH. Their are no brownie points with God he is no respector of persons.

Luk 17:7 But which of you, having a servant plowing or feeding cattle, will say unto him by and by, when he is come from the field, Go and sit down to meat?
Luk 17:8 And will not rather say unto him, Make ready wherewith I may sup, and gird thyself, and serve me, till I have eaten and drunken; and afterward thou shalt eat and drink?
Luk 17:9 Doth he thank that servant because he did the things that were commanded him? I trow not.
Luk 17:10 So likewise ye, when ye shall have done all those things which are commanded you, say, We are unprofitable servants: we have done that which was our duty to do.

Again,

YOU CANNOT EARN GOD LOVE, it comes at no cost, its free.

There is no sin in heaven.

Jesus condemend sin to teh flesh.

Rom_8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

No matter how hard you try, you will no more righteous then the next man.

We offer no excuses we are just imperfect people.

In all His Love

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heretoeternity said:

Seems MrjHealth has problems reading my post and the Bible references contained therein....if he would read it and the Bible references he will learn the truth and it will make him free from all the spiritual confusion he is obviously experiencing...the Bible is very clear on the subject of God's law, the ten commandments, and the seventh day Sabbath day being an integral part of them....read it and learn MrJHealth, and remember always that Salvation is through the Son of God, His grace and commandments and not the sungod/satan and his doctrines and days of sunday, dec 25th and easter, all of which are non Biblical and of pagan origin!

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false idea that salvation is a license to continue in sin

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"Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God." 1 Cor. 7:1 KJV

"Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless." 2 Peter 3:14 KJV

"Be ye perfect even as your Father in heaven is perfect." Matthew 5:48 KJV

"For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness." 1 Thessalonians 4:7 KJV

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