"Hell doesn't last forever"..God is merciful

Stan,

I have already pointed out the flaw in the reasoning you are using. I see no reason to repeat pointing it out especially since you are arguing in circles.

Stan J.

Jesus stated repent or perish and any punishment that is final is eternal.

Revelations 20:10 does a better job supporting your claim but even using it as support has flaws.

It is really difficult to throw indoctrination isn't it?

kerwin said:

Stan,
I have already pointed out the flaw in the reasoning you are using. I see no reason to repeat pointing it out especially since you are arguing in circles.

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I have no idea what you're referring to, seeing as you haven't bothered to quote me.

kerwin said:

Stan J.
Jesus stated repent or perish and any punishment that is final is eternal.
Revelations 20:10 does a better job supporting your claim but even using it as support has flaws.
It is really difficult to throw indoctrination isn't it?

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Again I have no idea what you are talking about because you didn't quote me.

StanJ,

You have been indoctrinated into a certain mindset and so those things from Scripture that disagree with that mindset are hard for you to handle.

I am sure you know what the word "perish" means but believing that those that those who do not repent will "perish" is not comparable to your indoctrination so you reject belief instead of question. It is a common think among human being because it comes from our fallen nature. It is said by those that are expert in that nature that it gives us time to adjust though the downside is that when we do not get though he denial stage.

When Jesus states "perish" in Luke 13:5 it means suffer the final eternal death". In short those who suffer the final are punished forever because they stay dead forever.

I do not even think that Paul, John, Jesus, or anyone else that addressed the issue was teaching a new idea. The Jews still have a teaching among them that the wicked will suffer for 12 months and then given a chance to repent. Those that do not will be destroyed. It is essentially the same teaching that confuses so many because Scripture addresses part of it in one place and another part in another place. I am sure you are aware that even Jesus uses the number 12 so 12 months is equivalent to ages and ages.

You should also be aware translators have their biases that stem from their fallen human natures. In other cases they just make mistakes because translating correctly is a difficult task.

Stan J,

Your complaints are petty. It is a conversation and I only quote when I feel it is necessary. Do a little research if you really cannot figure out what I am speaking about since the conversation is recorded and I am addressing things you have already said to me.

Note I did not quote you here either and yet the written context of this post reveals I am 1) speaking of complaints you made. In addition the unwritten context reveals they are most likely recent posts you made.

Never the less. I will try to remember to post because it may be the custom here even though I have my own customs and I find it unnecessary burdensome.

The 2nd death shall last forever,burning in hell is not....

Revelation 20:9-10 And they marched across the broad expanse of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. But fire came down from heavena and consumed them. 10And the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur, into which the beast and the false prophet had already been thrown. There they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

n2thelight said:

The 2nd death shall last forever,burning in hell is not....

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The second death only the relates to the second resurrection and as such only to those bodies.

StanJ,

StanJ said:

The second death only the relates to the second resurrection and as such only to those bodies.

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So according to you God destroys the body by throwing but not the soul. That claim brings us back to a passage I mentioned earlier.

Jesus teaches us that God can destroy both body and soul in Gehenna.

He never actually states it is not destroyed but they we should fear him because he can but you disagree as you claim the soul is immortal.

So my question is should we fear him because he can destroy both out soul and body in Gehenna or because he can destroy our body and torment our soul forever?

kerwin said:

StanJ,


So according to you God destroys the body by throwing but not the soul. That claim brings us back to a passage I mentioned earlier.

Jesus teaches us that God can destroy both body and soul in Gehenna.

He never actually states it is not destroyed but they we should fear him because he can but you disagree as you claim the soul is immortal.

So my question is should we fear him because he can destroy both out soul and body in Gehenna or because he can destroy our body and torment our soul forever?

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The body and soul in Jewish tradition is not the same as the spirit. The soul represented Life along with all its trappings. The Pharisees believe in the resurrection and as such they believe that the body and spirit was ultimately be rejoined at the resurrection but Jesus was telling them that they should fear The God Who could prevent that we joining and Resurrection and consign them to eternal hell.

StanJ,

Both the wicked and righteous are raised from the dead on Judgement Day. give or take the Age of the Messiah. In other words the soul and body of the wicked will be joined when they are raised from the dead. Though God could choose to prevent the joining he tells us both the wicked and dead will be resurrected. (Acts 24:14-15)

[SIZE=15.995px]So that explanation is flawed.[/SIZE]

kerwin said:

StanJ,

Both the wicked and righteous are raised from the dead on Judgement Day. give or take the Age of the Messiah. In other words the soul and body of the wicked will be joined when they are raised from the dead. Though God could choose to prevent the joining he tells us both the wicked and dead will be resurrected. (Acts 24:14-15)

[SIZE=15.995px]So that explanation is flawed.[/SIZE]

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I'm not talking about judgement day I'm talking about the resurrection that the Jews believed in. You keep getting Old Testament and New Testament issues mixed up. It is not my explanation that is flawed, it is your understanding of the Bible.

kerwinhttp://www.christianityboard.com/user/11007-kerwin/

Both the wicked and righteous are raised from the dead on Judgement Day. give or take the Age of the Messiah. In other words the soul and body of the wicked will be joined when they are raised from the dead. Though God could choose to prevent the joining he tells us both the wicked and dead will be resurrected. (Acts 24:14-15)

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The resurrection happens at death

n2thelight said:

The resurrection happens at death

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What Scripture do you think support that claim?

1 Thessalonians 4:16-18 states otherwise.

StanJ,

StanJ said:

I'm not talking about judgement day I'm talking about the resurrection that the Jews believed in. You keep getting Old Testament and New Testament issues mixed up. It is not my explanation that is flawed, it is your understanding of the Bible.

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Jesus did not come to start a new religion but instead he came to start a new covenant so the old and new covenants are one narrative that is spoken over a large period of time and covers time before and after that period.