Rapture Debate.

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skyangel

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skyangel it is impossible to crucify the Son of God afresh. The bible teaches us that he died once, for all who believe in him by faith. Salvation is a revelation of that truth. it is not something to be grasped, understood received in the heart only to be rejected again and again. it is a one time message for all people. You either accept his salvation message or you do not. There is no middle ground. Jesus is a literal person [a living being] who came in the flesh and returned to his kingdom in the spirit. Your theology is in error.
I am afraid you are the one in error as long as you idolise a physical person.
If you are talking about a physical man as the"Son of God", it is obvious that any man can only physically die once. However, I am not talking about a physical man because God is not a man and neither is the Son of God. The "son of man" is a physical person but the "son of man" did not take away your sins or die for your sins. He merely set an example to follow and that example is to die for your own sins or allow others to crucify you for what they see as sin in your life.
God is a SPIRIT and as a SPIRIT can be "crucified" daily yet still live at the same time. People crucify the Spirit of TRUTH in their hearts and minds all the time when they call the TRUTH a lie and reject it due to perceiving it as a lie.
Physical shedding of physical blood cannot save any person from anything, regardless of who or what they believe is the sacrificial lamb, bull or scapegoat.
Heb 10:4... For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
It is also not possible for the physical blood of a physical man to take away anyones sins.

Jer 31:30 But every one shall die for his own iniquity: every man that eateth the sour grape, his teeth shall be set on edge.
Deut 24:16 The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.

The principle in the above scripture applies in the spiritual as well as the physical aspects of life.
Jesus death and resurrection story is simply a lesson with morals and principles which readers need to learn in order to follow them.
 

JesusIsFaithful

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Speak for yourself. I am one with the TRUTH and LIFE at all times.

John 5:31 If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.

John 7:18 He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.

Romans 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Try some humble pie and join the rest of us that are totally dependent on Christ for all things.

I insult no one any more than Jesus insulted the religious leaders by calling them children of the devil.
Not all professing believers actually believe in the real Christ or follow his sinless example. Most of them are following a false Christ as they continue in their sins.

Jesus addressed the little ones as those that can go astray & to warn believers how they treat them as if they are not His at all.

Matthew 18:10 Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven. 11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost. 12 How think ye? if a man have an hundred sheep, and one of them be gone astray, doth he not leave the ninety and nine, and goeth into the mountains, and seeketh that which is gone astray? 13 And if so be that he find it, verily I say unto you, he rejoiceth more of that sheep, than of the ninety and nine which went not astray. 14 Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish.

Then Jesus expounded on that by addressing how believers were to address those astray within the church.

Matthew 18:15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother. 16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established. 17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.

If you have doubts that Jesus will get that lost sheep that is an unrepentant believers that just got excommunicated from the church, reread Matthew 18:10-14 again.

Paul says the same thing when addressing the falling away from the faith in 2 Thessalonians 2nd chapter as these saved believers will be damned ( inferring becoming a vessel unto dishonor in His House to be left behind at the pre trib rapture event to be resurrected after the great tribulation to serve the King of kings during the milleniel reign of Christ for the coming generations ) and continues to address those that go astray in the 3rd chapter as those that have not faith, that walk not after the tradition taught of us and are disorderly ( verses 1- 7 ), that we, as believers, are to not treat them as the enemy, but admonish them as brothers by withdrawing from their company ( Verses 14-15 ) in the hopes that the Lord will lead them to repentance before He comes as the Bridegroom otherwise, they will be led to repentance by His excommunicating them from the Marriage Supper.

So the little ones can go astray and be lost, and so you are not to condemn them as not saved nor not His but to correct them brotherly and rebuke them when necessary because they are His.

Did Jesus consider how he gave the word to others when he told the Pharisees who claimed to be believers in God that they were blind fools? Was that offending "little ones"? Was he building them up or telling them they were wise for believing in God? Was he encouraging their belief in God?
If a child is offended by being told to grow up, they need to get a LIFE and actually grow up and stop whining about having hurt egos.

They profess to never have believed in Him; therefore you cannot treat those that profess to believe in Him in the same way.

Paul gives a guideline for ministry outreach to those that are astray in and outside the church.

2 Timothy 2:24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, 25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth; 26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

Excommunication is to be done when they refuse to repent, but this is not to be done out of hatred towards them but the iniquity that they do. They should be treated as a heathen or a publican as Jesus said, but Paul clarifies that as not treating them as the enemy, but as you would a neighbor since he is being admonished as a brother still. Once he repents, he is allowed back in. He does not need to be saved again when he is already saved. He just needs His help as his Good Shepherd to help him discern the iniquity by His words in the KJV so he can ask Him for help in departing from that iniquity.

So see Christ in every professing believer, but see Christ loving even those that have gone astray to get them even after He excommunicates them at the pre trib rapture event for they have been bought with a price and sealed as His but not every saved believer will be found as abiding in Him as His disciples to be ready as well as willing to go when the Bridegroom comes.

May God cause the increase in both our walks with Him in the light of His words.
 

Angelina

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I am afraid you are the one in error as long as you idolise a physical person.
If you are talking about a physical man as the"Son of God", it is obvious that any man can only physically die once. However, I am not talking about a physical man because God is not a man and neither is the Son of God. The "son of man" is a physical person but the "son of man" did not take away your sins or die for your sins. He merely set an example to follow and that example is to die for your own sins or allow others to crucify you for what they see as sin in your life.
God is a SPIRIT and as a SPIRIT can be "crucified" daily yet still live at the same time. People crucify the Spirit of TRUTH in their hearts and minds all the time when they call the TRUTH a lie and reject it due to perceiving it as a lie.
Physical shedding of physical blood cannot save any person from anything, regardless of who or what they believe is the sacrificial lamb, bull or scapegoat.. He's the son of God because he came from heaven. He had to be born in the flesh so that he could experience
Heb 10:4... For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
It is also not possible for the physical blood of a physical man to take away anyones sins.

You are deliberately misinterpreting what I am saying. skyangel, Jesus was and is the son of man and the son of God. He's the son of man because he was conceived in the flesh through Mary via the Holy Spirit.
John 3:13 tells us that Jesus came from heaven as the Son of man.

You said ~ "The "son of man" is a physical person but the "son of man" did not take away your sins or die for your sins." Yet when perceiving the thoughts of the scribes, Jesus states in Matthew 9:6 that he, the Son of man, has the authority on earth to forgive sins.

Matthew 20:28
tells us that the son of man came to give his life as a ransom for' many.

In Acts 7:55-56 Stephen was about to be stoned, filled by the Holy Spirit, he gazed into heaven and saw God’s glory, with Jesus standing at the right hand of God, and he said, “Look! I see the heavens opened and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God!

You cannot die for your own sins because you have no mediator between you and God Almighty. You're just not good enough! You're sins are like filthy rags before a Holy God. That's why Jesus had to come because he was a sinless, pure, sacrifice on our behalf. He endured the cross for the sake of all those who believe in him by faith.

You cannot crucify God daily, you can only deal with you're own sinful nature through repentance and forgiveness but only after you have become a believer by faith in Jesus and his message of salvation. Becoming more like Christ is a journey. Once you are actually saved the Holy Spirit comes to live within you and helps you to become more like Christ. It's called the process of sanctification becoming more like Christ is a lifetime journey...
 

skyangel

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John 5:31 If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.

John 7:18 He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.

Romans 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Try some humble pie and join the rest of us that are totally dependent on Christ for all things.

I think very soberly since I have the mind of Christ with which to think. I prefer sobriety to false humility.
You depend on an invisible person. I depend on LIFE and TRUTH itself and on the WAY they work.
John 5:37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.

Jesus also spoke of himself and said a lot about himself. Did that make his witness about himself untrue?
Do you believe these things he said about himself ?.....>>>
John 8:12, John 9:5, I am the light of the world.
John 12:46 I am come a light into the world...
John 14:6 I am the way, the truth, and the life....

So is Jesus the Light of the world or are you ( believers) the light of the world?
Matt 5:14 Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.

What do you say about yourself?
Are you the light of the world or not?
Is Jesus the light of the world or not?

If you do not believe that you are the light of the world, and cannot honestly confess to being the light of the world, then you are walking in darkness and do not have the LIGHT of LIFE but any "light" which you convince yourself is in you is actually darkness.

Matt 6:23 But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness!











I am the light of the world because Jesus witnessed
 

skyangel

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So see Christ in every professing believer, but see Christ loving even those that have gone astray to get them even after He excommunicates them at the pre trib rapture event for they have been bought with a price and sealed as His but not every saved believer will be found as abiding in Him as His disciples to be ready as well as willing to go when the Bridegroom comes.

May God cause the increase in both our walks with Him in the light of His words.

I do see Christ in every professing believer. I just see a false Christ in many of them. The real Christ is in very FEW. You obviously can't even tell the difference between the real one and the false one since both are called Christ and both are totally invisible to you.

It is a sad thing to see you so blind to the Truth (Christ). I hope you wake up to the fact that you will never see a physical person (bridegroom) arrive in any literal clouds at any time in future.

All who are abiding in Christ (TRUTH) are already "married" to Christ and already ONE with Him in the very same way that the Jesus character in the story was ONE with the Father. His prayers were answered before he prayed them. John 17
Isaiah 65:24 And it shall come to pass, that before they call, I will answer; and while they are yet speaking, I will hear.

Obviously you are not yet ONE with Christ (TRUTH). If you were, you would not be waiting to get "married" to a "bridegroom" and become one with him at some future date.
Married people who are already ONE in body, mind and spirit do not need to wait for their "wedding" to happen at a later date because they are already ONE flesh.
Matt 19:5-8 For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh. Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
Mark 10:8 And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh.
 

skyangel

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You are deliberately misinterpreting what I am saying. skyangel, Jesus was and is the son of man and the son of God. He's the son of man because he was conceived in the flesh through Mary via the Holy Spirit.
John 3:13 tells us that Jesus came from heaven as the Son of man.

You said ~ "The "son of man" is a physical person but the "son of man" did not take away your sins or die for your sins." Yet when perceiving the thoughts of the scribes, Jesus states in Matthew 9:6 that he, the Son of man, has the authority on earth to forgive sins.

Matthew 20:28
tells us that the son of man came to give his life as a ransom for' many.

In Acts 7:55-56 Stephen was about to be stoned, filled by the Holy Spirit, he gazed into heaven and saw God’s glory, with Jesus standing at the right hand of God, and he said, “Look! I see the heavens opened and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God!

You cannot die for your own sins because you have no mediator between you and God Almighty. You're just not good enough! You're sins are like filthy rags before a Holy God. That's why Jesus had to come because he was a sinless, pure, sacrifice on our behalf. He endured the cross for the sake of all those who believe in him by faith.

You cannot crucify God daily, you can only deal with you're own sinful nature through repentance and forgiveness but only after you have become a believer by faith in Jesus and his message of salvation. Becoming more like Christ is a journey. Once you are actually saved the Holy Spirit comes to live within you and helps you to become more like Christ. It's called the process of sanctification becoming more like Christ is a lifetime journey...

I am not misinterpreting your words Gabrielle. I am trying to help you understand the difference between the "Son of God" aspect of a person and the "son of man" aspect of the same person.
All people on this planet are the "Son of God" as well as the "son of man" since all have a spiritual aspect as well as a carnal fleshly aspect.
The spiritual aspect is conceived through Spirit and born of Spirit. The fleshly aspect is conceived by the flesh and born of flesh.
Flesh is never born of spirit according to John 3:6 "That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit."
Therefore any teaching which convinces people that a mans fleshly body was born of spirit is a false teaching.

John 3:13 applies to all sons of men and not just to one person. All people came from "heaven" in the first place if you believe that God created all things in heaven before he put them on Earth. Gen 2:4-5, Jer 1:5

The "son of man" is not just one man but all men. All men on Earth have the same authority to forgive any sins of other people who sin against them.
As for giving ones life as a ransom for many. That is simply an example that all "sons of men" ought to follow.
How many Christians would ask God or any human judge to take their lives and put them in "hell" or punish them instead of someone else who they judge to deserve punishment a lot more than they do? How many would give their own lives for another person especially someone who falsely accused them of doing wrong when they never did wrong? Very FEW. They are mostly too busy trying to convince themselves they are saved because they believe in an invisible man who has supernatural powers and trying to convince those who do not believe in mythical people that they will go to hell if they don't believe in that character.
The character himself said "And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world." John 12:47
Yet Christians spend their lives judging and condemning all who do not believe instead of adopting the same attitude that the story book character Jesus had.

Whether you believe people can die for their own sins or not makes no difference to the fact that IT IS WRITTEN in...Jer 31:30, Deut 24:16, Ezek 18:20... that everyone will die for their own sins.
The "wages" of sin is death and all people reap what they sow whether they believe in any gods or not. All people face the consequences of their own actions.
Just because a person claims to believe in Christ and calls Jesus Lord makes no difference to their so called "salvation".
Matt 7:22-23 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Becoming the LIGHT of the world is not a lifetime journey. You are either LIGHT or you are darkness. There is no in between.
Darkness flees as soon as the light arrives. It simply cannot stay in the same place as LIGHT because LIGHT will always destroy it. That is the nature of LIGHT.
Light represents sinlessness. Darkness represents sin. You simply cannot abide in the LIGHT and continue to sin. People who confess Jesus as Lord and still continue to sin are simply lying to themselves and making excuses for themselves by claiming it will take their whole life before they can become sinless or sinfree. They are trying to serve two masters. LIGHT will always cause those sinners and workers of iniquity who abide in darkness to flee with the darkness in which they abide. It makes no difference how many of them claim to believe in Jesus Christ. Ultimately they are following a false Christ and believing in some weak "Light" which cannot totally remove darkness (sin) from them till after they physically die. Ironically all dead people are sin free regardless of what they believed when they were alive. Dead people simply cannot sin since they can't do anything at all.





 

JesusIsFaithful

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Jesus also spoke of himself and said a lot about himself. Did that make his witness about himself untrue?
Do you believe these things he said about himself ?.....>>>
John 8:12, John 9:5, I am the light of the world.
John 12:46 I am come a light into the world...
John 14:6 I am the way, the truth, and the life....

The Son's self testimony is backed up by John the Baptist's and a greater testimony from God the Father.

John 5:31 If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true. 32 There is another that beareth witness of me; and I know that the witness which he witnesseth of me is true. 33 Ye sent unto John, and he bare witness unto the truth. 34 But I receive not testimony from man: but these things I say, that ye might be saved. 35 He was a burning and a shining light: and ye were willing for a season to rejoice in his light. 36 But I have greater witness than that of John: for the works which the Father hath given me to finish, the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me. 37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.

The Son has seen the shape of the Father as referenced below, but others have heard the voice of the father at Jesus's water baptism.

John 1:18No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

John 6:46Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.

Matthew 3:15 And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him. 16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him: 17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

The use of the word "invisible" in how it is used in scripture means "not presently seen", but your error may prevent you from realizing that in the scripture. I can only hope in Christ that He will set you free from this error and this vanity you seem to be on.

I think very soberly since I have the mind of Christ with which to think. I prefer sobriety to false humility.

Denying Christ in believers or denying them as married to Him as you are doing below is a work & a testimony of denying Him. So repent.

I do see Christ in every professing believer. I just see a false Christ in many of them. The real Christ is in very FEW. You obviously can't even tell the difference between the real one and the false one since both are called Christ and both are totally invisible to you.

It is a sad thing to see you so blind to the Truth (Christ). I hope you wake up to the fact that you will never see a physical person (bridegroom) arrive in any literal clouds at any time in future.

All who are abiding in Christ (TRUTH) are already "married" to Christ and already ONE with Him in the very same way that the Jesus character in the story was ONE with the Father. His prayers were answered before he prayed them. John 17
Isaiah 65:24 And it shall come to pass, that before they call, I will answer; and while they are yet speaking, I will hear.

Obviously you are not yet ONE with Christ (TRUTH). If you were, you would not be waiting to get "married" to a "bridegroom" and become one with him at some future date.
Married people who are already ONE in body, mind and spirit do not need to wait for their "wedding" to happen at a later date because they are already ONE flesh.
Matt 19:5-8 For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh. Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
Mark 10:8 And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh.

Matthew 12:39But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:

You have to be married to the Bridegroom to be accused as committing adultery towards God by chasing after seducing spirits to receive for signs.

1 Corinthians 6:15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid. 16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh. 17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit. 18 Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body. 19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? 20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

Cannot be considered a harlot for committing an act of fornication unless believers are married to Christ. Committing the act does not negate the marriage because they are still One with Christ. That is why they are called to repent or else be left behind thus cast into great tribulation.

Revelation 2:21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. 22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. 23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

So I suggest you go before that throne of grace for His wisdom in correcting your errors and your standard of judgments of condemning believers as not His, les ye be judged.

Matthew 7:1Judge not, that ye be not judged. 2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

You can judge the works to condemn the works, but you are not to judge the believers in condemning the believers as not His nor Him being in them les you deny Him in them and thus denying Him.
 

skyangel

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The Son has seen the shape of the Father as referenced below, but others have heard the voice of the father at Jesus's water baptism.

John 1:18No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

John 6:46Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.

Matthew 3:15 And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him. 16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him: 17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

The use of the word "invisible" in how it is used in scripture means "not presently seen", but your error may prevent you from realizing that in the scripture. I can only hope in Christ that He will set you free from this error and this vanity you seem to be on.

Read your own judgement and apply it to yourself.
I am not the one who does "not presently see God" I clearly see God daily. That is a fact regardless of whether you choose to believe it or not.
You are not only blind to the Father on Earth in the flesh at all times but you have never heard his voice either if you were never at Jesus water baptism. Were you there? The answer to that is a definite NO.

No carnal minded man who is of the world hath seen God at any time, .... "At any time" would include any time in the past and include the Pharisees in the story who saw Jesus standing in front of them but due to their spiritual blindness did not see or recognise him as who he was at all.

The only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
The 0NLY begotten Son is not a single individual because God is a Spirit which is not confined to an individual and therefore the "only begotten Son" of a spirit can only be the spirit which is also not confined to a physical individual. To clarify that for you, consider the concept that God IS Love. What fruit or offspring does Love beget? Love can only beget Love. The Spirit of Love can only produce the Spirit of Love not any other Spirit or offspring but that does not mean that LOVE is only ONE individual person in all of eternity that can see LOVE. All who live in LOVE and embrace LOVE can see LOVE. When you see LOVE you see the Father ( God) because God IS Love.
If you ever come to realise that, you will no longer be idolising a mythical god as a person in the sky.
He which is of God, he hath seen the Father.
That "He" can also be translated as ANYONE who is of LOVE (God) has seen and can always see LOVE ( God, The Father)
I sincerely hope that revelation dawns on you one day and your eyes are opened to see what you presently do not see.
 

skyangel

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Denying Christ in believers or denying them as married to Him as you are doing below is a work & a testimony of denying Him. So repent.
Repent of what? Telling the Truth about what I see? I have no need to repent of speaking the Truth of what I see and perceive since it is not wrong to speak the Truth about what you see.
A person who has been married to another become ONE FLESH according to bible principles.
If professing believers were ONE FLESH with Christ, they would not be waiting for him to return in the literal clouds one day because they would already be together with him at all times since their marriage which united them as ONE FLESH.


Matthew 12:39But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:

You have to be married to the Bridegroom to be accused as committing adultery towards God by chasing after seducing spirits to receive for signs.

Yes and it is the believers who profess to be married to Christ, the bridegroom, and give lip service to being ONE with him, who are seeking after the sign of his return or coming as if they are not ONE with him in the flesh on Earth right now. They are looking for another Christ to arrive. They have been seduced by the spirit of deception and follow after another Christ seeking for his arrival on Earth because they are not satisfied with the Christ which is ONE with them and IN THEM in the flesh right Now on Earth.
Those professing believers need to wake up to themselves and stop being so blind.

Cannot be considered a harlot for committing an act of fornication unless believers are married to Christ. Committing the act does not negate the marriage because they are still One with Christ. That is why they are called to repent or else be left behind thus cast into great tribulation.
So are you married to Christ or not? Are you ONE with Christ in the flesh on Earth or not?
If so, why are you still waiting for another Christ to return to Earth in the flesh?

So I suggest you go before that throne of grace for His wisdom in correcting your errors and your standard of judgments of condemning believers as not His, les ye be judged.

Feel free to apply your own judgements to yourself since they do not apply to me. I am not the one waiting for an individual supernatural person to physically arrive in literal clouds one day in future. My eyes were opened long ago to the deception of that doctrine.

Matthew 7:1Judge not, that ye be not judged. 2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
That is why I am referring you to your own judgements which apply to you alone.

You can judge the works to condemn the works, but you are not to judge the believers in condemning the believers as not His nor Him being in them les you deny Him in them and thus denying Him.

You have no clue what you are talking about so I forgive your errors.
It is not hard to see who is deceived by false doctrines when you can see God (the Spirit of LIFE) every day in the flesh on this Earth.
I condemn no one. Their own words and actions condemn them.
When you are spiritually mature, it is as easy to see who is spiritually immature and still chasing after mythical gods as it is for a physically mature person to recognise another person who still believes in fairy tales and know they have not mentally matured.
 

Truth

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I know that there will be stones cast,! Paul was stoned, beaten, cast into prison, and brought before rulers. Al the Jewish Apostles were killed in one way or another to bring the Truth to the world. At the time that our Savior walked this earth, the Religious leaders had departed Moses, and had started their own man made Religion. There is the Torah- [ the five books of Moses]- The Pharisees claimed that there is the Oral Torah transmitted down through time, to the Pharisees from Moses and that they the Pharisees had the ability to discern the Scriptures accurately. So they began to add to the Commandments of God. Simply said they kept the people in check with their rules, regulations,statues,doctrines and their Commandments. The Savior came into a nation of people that were not keeping the Covenant due to their leaders. I Quote "The Truth will Set You Free" Free from Man Made Religion, and here we are in this age dealing with the doctrines, rules and regulations and Commandments of Man. This Rapture Theology is just that! It has been two thousand years + sense the death, burial, and resurrection of our Savior, and as in his time Satan has had plenty of time to twist things to the tickling ears of man. The Jews were Blinded in part, and also these Gentiles are blinded. 2nd Thessalonians chap 2 vers 10&11-- with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive "The Love of the Truth, that they might be saved. 11- And for this reason GOD will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie. This fits with those who believe in something that the Scriptures do not Support! God never meant for His word to be difficult to understand, but man has made it that way through Theology! What Man Thinks!!! sorry folks, there aint no pre trib Rapture, get a grip, Pray for the love of the Truth, it is a Gift. God is Truth,Love, long-suffering,full of Grace and abundant in Mercy. Mercy is why we are still here, I thank Him Every Shabbot for His Mercy, which gives us time to try to reestablish the Truth that was First Delivered to the Apostles, with the LOVE of God. God is Love and Truth.
 

keras

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The basic premise of a rapture removal to heaven is unsupported by any scripture. It is only by inference and supposition that such an idea is believed. All of the prophesies that have been used to prove a rapture can be seen to actually mean something else altogether.
It is Written that we Christians are not appointed to experience God’s wrath. So it is assumed by the rapture adherent’s that this means removal, but they make this assumption without consideration of the many verses saying how God will protect His people during His times of wrath and judgement upon the ungodly.

We Christians have been told what we are expected to do:
Matthew 28:19-20 Go to all the peoples, baptize them and teach them all that I have commanded you and I will be with you always, to the end of time. Micah 6:8

Jesus is with us spiritually now and will be here physically after He Returns for His Millennium reign.
This does not in any way even hint that we leave our work on earth and go to heaven. Jesus comes down from heaven and eventually God too, will dwell on earth. Rev 21:3
 

skyangel

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The basic premise of a rapture removal to heaven is unsupported by any scripture. It is only by inference and supposition that such an idea is believed. All of the prophesies that have been used to prove a rapture can be seen to actually mean something else altogether.
It is Written that we Christians are not appointed to experience God’s wrath. So it is assumed by the rapture adherent’s that this means removal, but they make this assumption without consideration of the many verses saying how God will protect His people during His times of wrath and judgement upon the ungodly.

We Christians have been told what we are expected to do:
Matthew 28:19-20 Go to all the peoples, baptize them and teach them all that I have commanded you and I will be with you always, to the end of time. Micah 6:8

Jesus is with us spiritually now and will be here physically after He Returns for His Millennium reign.
This does not in any way even hint that we leave our work on earth and go to heaven. Jesus comes down from heaven and eventually God too, will dwell on earth. Rev 21:3

The millennium reign of Jesus on Earth is also a false doctrine.
No physical man is ever coming down from the sky in literal clouds to physically reign on Earth at any time.
John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

If he ever did come to reign on the physical Earth, Everyone would be able to say Christ is "here" or "there" or in Jerusalem or wherever else he might happen to be on the day but that will never happen. Scripture says do not believe anyone who says he is in any particular location. If that is true yesterday and Today, it will still be true Tomorrow and for all eternity.

Mar 13:21 And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not:

Matt 24:23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.

As for God dwelling on Earth, according to scripture he is already dwelling on Earth since he is everywhere at all times.

Psalm 139:7-8 Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence? If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.
 

DPMartin

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The basic premise of a rapture removal to heaven is unsupported by any scripture. It is only by inference and supposition that such an idea is believed. All of the prophesies that have been used to prove a rapture can be seen to actually mean something else altogether.
It is Written that we Christians are not appointed to experience God’s wrath. So it is assumed by the rapture adherent’s that this means removal, but they make this assumption without consideration of the many verses saying how God will protect His people during His times of wrath and judgement upon the ungodly.

We Christians have been told what we are expected to do:
Matthew 28:19-20 Go to all the peoples, baptize them and teach them all that I have commanded you and I will be with you always, to the end of time. Micah 6:8

Jesus is with us spiritually now and will be here physically after He Returns for His Millennium reign.
This does not in any way even hint that we leave our work on earth and go to heaven. Jesus comes down from heaven and eventually God too, will dwell on earth. Rev 21:3


the thing is God is not an escape route for the believer, the believer survives the situation and or circumstances because the Lord God is with him, and he is delivered, even from death. and since our God is a consuming fire, then its of God to survive the fire we must go through.
 

buddyt

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Please Brother do some research into the Book God has provided for you. Paul wrote most of the New Testament. Or should I say dictated it to Luke. Paul spoke many tongs and was a very Blessed Man but had bad eyesight thus the need for someone to write for him. Don't take my word for it check it out for yourself.
 

buddyt

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It's impossible to get those who are Brain Washed into believing in the so called Rapture. Even unto giving Scripture, Gods own words telling them he is against it. Ezekiel 13;20-21
 

Truth

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As in the days of Noah, all those who would not listen to Noah! 100 years Noah spoke to the people warning after warning, being mocked until that day when the rains came. they all died. Noah and seven others floated above Gods Judgement, and on the great and terrible day of the Lord, those who sleep will be resurrected, and I tell you a mystery fellow believers, we who are still alive!!! will be changed in the twinkling of an eye.AT THE LAST TRUMP, then the bowels of wrath are poured out, every mountain will be brought low, and every valley will be raised, sounds like the Earth is going to be ripped up like a garden with a rototiller. this is when we will be gathered up with the Lord, and like Noah we will be above Gods Judgments. thank you Keras, the three Gospel accounts where Yeshua [Jesus] spells out to the Apostles about His return, paraphrasing the Prophet Danial,which most Theologians say already accrued, when Antiacus roasted the pig on the alter when the Greek's conquered Israel. known as the Maccabees, not in the cannon of scripture But our Savior went up to the Feast of Dedication, now known as Hanukkah. just another way to ignore the words of Jesus and Give the Apostle Paul presidents in the new Testament. And by the way Paul dosnt teach a pre trib rapture
 
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ScottA

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Yet it did when God defined an evening and a morning as the first day and each day after that in creation week.

Seeing how His Kingdom will reign on earth, time exists for at the end of the millenial reign of Christ, Satan will be released from the pit for a small season.

We can be thankful that it is only for a season.
Context does not equal time...anymore than "Once Upon a Time." Time (history), is his story. That's all.
 

rockytopva

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But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. - Matthew 24:36

Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. - Matthew 24:42

We know not the hour when the Lord comes, so we are commanded to watch. If this was post trib there would be no need of watching, as it would be obvious. And... It would be rather a quick trip to rise with him when he is already returning to earth?

The disturbing thing about the post trib view is it makes it rather obvious that Christ is not returning to earth anytime soon, so why watch for it? These people normally end up in the partying scenes of nightclubs and bars.
 

n2thelight

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But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. - Matthew 24:36

Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. - Matthew 24:42

We know not the hour when the Lord comes, so we are commanded to watch. If this was post trib there would be no need of watching, as it would be obvious. And... It would be rather a quick trip to rise with him when he is already returning to earth?

The disturbing thing about the post trib view is it makes it rather obvious that Christ is not returning to earth anytime soon, so why watch for it? These people normally end up in the partying scenes of nightclubs and bars.

No we don't know the day or our,yet through scripture we suppose to know the season.
You quote Matt 24 ,which clearly states that He comes AFTER the trib.

The quick rise is from flesh to our spiritual bodies.

Post trib,we are watching the birth pangs and if the things He said would happen before His return,has not happened,well we know it's not Him.

The disturbing thing about pre trib is you think Christ return is immanent ,which can't be as the signs He told you to watch for has to happen first.He told you that so you wouldn't be taken out of season.

Show me one verse in scripture where Christ return is said to be immanent?