What's The Unforgivable Sin

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Christina

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Luke 12:10 And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgivenalso Mark 3:9,Matthew 12:31-32All talk of this blasphemeth act that is the unforgivable sin but how and what exactley is this sin committed?
 

Christina

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Almost Pointer its the one that can't be repented of So what is it? To swear allegiance to the instead of christ or Antichrist. God says when you are called before the Anti-christ do not premeditate what you will say God will speak thru you and this goes back to the Lie of the rapture telling people you don't need to learn this stuff your going to be flying out of here anyway.If you do not know that the Anti-christ comes first before Christs true return you could be fooled by the Anti christs claims to be Christ.1.So know that your not flying away (rapture till the 7th trump,when true Christ returns)2.That the Anti Christ comes first (no matter how convincing he will be)3.If you are called before him DO NOT premeditate what to say God will speak4.Never swear your Allegiance to the Anti-christ (the unforgivable sin).
 

HammerStone

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I can say I agree with the both of you.It certainly will be part of the last days when we're before the "Synagogue of Satan" and delivered up; we're supposed to let the Holy Spirit speak through us and honestly that is what we as Christians should desire as well. I know I struggle with this; don't try to be God but try instead to let him work through you. In this world of deceit that's a fine line.The unforgivable sin is to speak against the Holy Spirit. In a nutshell, when you are saved you accept Jesus and thereby receive the Holy Spirit and accept God as your God. We all crucified Jesus on that cross; hence the reason why we are forgiven. However, if you deny the Holy Spirit then you're, in effect, denying being saved and denying God because the Holy Spirit is with you here on out in the rebirth.If I can clarify things a little more, please let me know.
 

pointer

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Almost Pointer its the one that can't be repented of So what is it? To swear allegiance to the instead of christ or Antichrist.
I think very few people actually swear allegiance to the Antichrist, but they are unforgiven anyway. I'm not sure what is meant by 'the instead of christ'. If it means the self, then I think what is said is true.The Holy Spirit convicts everyone of sin who hears the gospel. People either accept that they are sinners, trust in Christ to save them, and change their ways in gratitude, or they refuse to change their ways, even though they know very well that they are wicked and that Jesus has died for them to pay for their sin. That is the sin against the Holy Spirit, and it leads to death, and it did so before the appearance of an AntiChrist.
God says when you are called before the Anti-christ do not premeditate what you will say God will speak thru you
Jesus said that about coming before other groups, not the AntiChrist.'"When you are brought before synagogues, rulers and authorities, do not worry about how you will defend yourselves or what you will say, for the Holy Spirit will teach you at that time what you should say."' Luke 12:11-12 NIV
 

Christina

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Anti-Christ is literally defined as the instead of christ Anti- meaning instead ofanother words the Anti christ will come claiming to be Christ . instead of it being the real Christ.he will be a fake.does that make sense?as Swampfox says inLuke 12 He is speaking of the synagogue of Satan011: And when they bring you unto the synagogues, and unto magistrates, and powers, take ye no thought how or what thing ye shall answer, or what ye shall say: notice it says when they bring you not when you willing come,unto the migiistrates and powers what powers notice verse Luke 12:5 above the power of the one you can kill (the soul ) and cast into hell (which is Satan)005: But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him.
 

HammerStone

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Mark 13 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.The time has come and will come when there will be persecution of Christians. This passage is found in Matthew 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21 all of which specifically deal with the end times. You have to be careful about saying not before the antichrist himself. Obviously, he's one being and won't have the ability to give audience to all 6+ billion people in the world, but that doesn't mean that his representatives won't be there to carry out his work.
 

pointer

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Anti-Christ is literally defined as the instead of christ Anti- meaning instead ofanother words the Anti christ will come claiming to be Christ . instead of it being the real Christ.he will be a fake.does that make sense?
Yes, thank you.
as Swampfox says inLuke 12 He is speaking of the synagogue of Satan011: And when they bring you unto the synagogues, and unto magistrates, and powers, take ye no thought how or what thing ye shall answer, or what ye shall say: notice it says when they bring you not when you willing come,unto the migiistrates and powers what powers notice verse Luke 12:5 above the power of the one you can kill (the soul ) and cast into hell (which is Satan)005: But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him.
I think it is God who throws into hell. Satan will be thrown there himself.
 

Christina

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PointerI'm sorry that was not well stated on my part Satan has the power to deceiveif you allow yourself to be deceived and swear allegiance to him denying Christ it can cause the death of the soul (second death) only after the second death does Satan have any power over you.This is why we are told fear not him that can kill your body(physical death ) fear him that can kill your soul (second death) "which AFTER he hath killed hath power to cast into hell"
 

pointer

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PointerI'm sorry that was not well stated on my part Satan has the power to deceiveif you allow yourself to be deceived and swear allegiance to him denying Christ it can cause the death of the soul
The power to deceive is not to have the power to decide eternal fate, which is God's power only. But whatever the truth of that, Jesus did not say that His disciples would be brought before the AntiChrist. The unforgivable sin is the one that is not repented of, and one does not have to have even heard of the AntiChrist, Satan or anyone but Christ in order to be unforgiven and condemned, let alone swear allegiance to anyone- except oneself. One only has to be selfish, to say that wrong is right, to have a bad conscience to be unforgiven.
 

HammerStone

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I think it is God who throws into hell. Satan will be thrown there himself.
That's not even really relevant to what we're talking about here. I'm not at all talking about being thrown into Hell because every Christian knows who does the judging as we were discussing in the other thread. We're talking about the being delivered up as covered in Matthew 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21.
The power to deceive is not to have the power to decide eternal fate, which is God's power only. But whatever the truth of that, Jesus did not say that His disciples would be brought before the AntiChrist. The unforgivable sin is the one that is not repented of, and one does not have to have even heard of the AntiChrist, Satan or anyone but Christ in order to be unforgiven and condemned, let alone swear allegiance to anyone- except oneself. One only has to be selfish, to say that wrong is right, to have a bad conscience to be unforgiven.
The point made by the passage about delivering up to those places is that we alone cannot stand up to Satan. Hence the reason Christ tells us:Luke 10:19Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpion, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.Christ, in this case through the Holy Spirit, gives us the power, it doesn't say you have the power in you or to any such other effect. You don't go toe to toe with Satan because the wisdom of this world is nothing, he'll beat you every time on your own - look at scripture if you don't believe me. Words are really quite meaningless when you get down to it, especially in our legal system. It's no joke that a good lawyer can get you out of anything these days. Satan's one of the best scripture lawyers there ever was.I Corithians 3:19For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.It's no coincidence the latter part of this verse was taken from Job and that it's the only quote from Job in the NT.There's no other verse that says you won't be delivered up unto the actual Antichrist and since this teaching comes straight from the Savior's mouth when asked about the end of the age, I think I'll air on the side of caution.
 

pointer

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That's not even really relevant to what we're talking about here.
That's what I've been trying to say. If anyone can produce a scholarly reference to a connexion of the unforgiven sin with swearing allegiance to the AntiChrist I will be very surprised. There has been a plethora of theories about what the unforgiven sin is, but I have never yet seen scholarly connexion to this matter, or even to it on the 'net.
The point made by the passage
But how is the passage relevant to the unforgiven sin?
 

Christina

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The unforgiven sin is not just sin that has not been forgiven it is a single sin that is singled out because it can not be forgiven even if you asked forgiveness it can only be committed one time only after the Anti-christ has arrived and can only be committed by one of the elect of God with full knowledge of God one who knows, who and what the anti-christ is and swears allegiance to him to save his own physical life thus with full knowledge and free will chooses Satan over God
 

pointer

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The unforgiven sin is not just sin that has not been forgiven
All sin can be repented of. There is no sin that is greater than the blood of Christ. What the blood of Christ cannot cover is unrepentance when the Holy Spirit convicts of sin.
 

Christina

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Then why would it be called the UNFORGIVABLE SIN and singled out from all other sinthis teaching is very deep and not taught by many because they have been to busy telling you repent and you will be raptured out of here and so you dont need to know this is one of the many reasons why the rapture is such a dangerous lie.
 

Christina

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If you do not understand this teaching then put it on the back burner and continue your studying and return to it ocasionally and see if your understaning has increased, there are many levels to Gods teachings and not everyone has the same level of understanding and know one knows it all.Even Christ didn't know when the end would come only his father in heaven knows.
 

pointer

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Then why would it be called the UNFORGIVABLE SIN and singled out from all other sin
Precisely because unrepentance cannot be acceptable to a holy God. One cannot be with God and say that murder, theft etc. are acceptable. One may commit murder, theft, adultery, or bear false witness, even persecute the church, and be forgiven, but refusing to admit that they are sins is truly unforgivable.If we look at the contexts of Jesus' statements in Luke and in Matthew, we see that they have different content, but, imv, have similar import. '"He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters. And so I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come."' Matt 12:30-32 NIVWhy did Jesus say that those not with Him are against Him? Because one can be neutral about many things; football, Picasso, music, the colour green, beef sandwiches, but one cannot be neutral about sin. If a beef sandwich stands between you and starvation, and someone steals that last beef sandwich, you cannot be neutral, unless you are indifferent about dying. Now Jesus stood against theft and murder, and promised eternal destruction on account of them, so one cannot be neutral about Jesus, either. So to reject Jesus is to say that theft and murder are acceptable. It is to say that one has no need of a saviour, because one has done nothing wrong. The Holy Spirit convicts of sin all who hear the gospel, so those who rebel against His conviction cannot be forgiven.'"I tell you, whoever acknowledges me before men, the Son of Man will also acknowledge him before the angels of God. But he who disowns me before men will be disowned before the angels of God. And everyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven."' Luke 12:8-10 NIVHere Jesus says the same thing, but in a different way. To acknowledge Jesus is to acknowledge 'sin, righteousness and judgement'; my sin, His righteousness, His righteous judgement of my sin. Those who deny or disown Jesus deny their sin, and deny Jesus' judgement of them.
 

Christina

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You are talking apples and oranges this particular sin is called UNFORGIVABLE !!!!!meaning it CAN NOT be repented for and the committing of it has a different penalty than all other sin the penalty of the second death no other sin has this penalty.This is a truth your arguments wont change it as I've said If you do not understand it put it aside for now if you don't agree with it thats your choice.All the debating in the world won't change the truth of Gods word.
 

pointer

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You are talking apples and oranges this particular sin is called UNFORGIVABLE !!!!!meaning it CAN NOT be repented for
Every sin can be repented of, except unrepentance. This is absolutely fundamental and it is essential that people are reassured about this. No-one should ever be concerned that they have committed a sin that cannot be forgiven, because the very fact that they show concern means that they have a Godly concern that comes from the Holy Spirit. Nobody irrevocably swears allegiance to anyone, certainly not the AntiChrist, who was not even mentioned in the gospels, and who has yet to be revealed. The reason for Jesus making this statement is crystal clear:'"He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters. And so I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven."'It is a matter of fundamental choice, not of making some strange commitment to someone that one knows next to nothing about.Christ died for the sins of the whole world, not for some of them. He has paid the price, the whole price, and for that reason no rebellion against God can remain. People are never condemned for actual sins committed, because they are all done away with, once and for all. People and angels are condemned and destroyed as rebels for rejecting Christ, for rejecting authority, and for no other reason.
and the committing of it has a different penalty than all other sin the penalty of the second death no other sin has this penalty.
The second death is the penalty for all who reject Christ, yes. It is not a special fate reserved for special sinners. The vast majority of people commit the unforgivable sin, simply because they live for themselves, not for Christ.
 

Christina

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it can only be committed one time only after the Anti-christ has arrived and can only be committed by one of the elect of God with full knowledge of God one who knows, who and what the anti-christ is and swears allegiance to him to save his own physical life thus with full knowledge and free will chooses Satan over God
I did not say anyone could commit the unforgivable sin you are right that there is no average sin that can not be forgiven by repentance. You keep wanting to compare it(this unforgivable sin) to everyday sins we have all committed at sometime for no man is without sin and repentance is the cure for sin but you will not find any scripture that says unrepentantance is the unforgivable sin that is your take on it.Not what Gods word says It says there is a time coming in the Future(after arrival of Anti-christ) that speaks of a certain Sin that can ONLY be committed by a select few at a select time that if committed will be unforgivableThis speaks of a sin of a type of blasphemy that can only be committed ONCE After the Anti-christ by an ELECT of God that KNOWS what he is doing and Denys God with FULL Knowledge of what he is doing I doubt it will ever be committed but that doesn't change the fact that Gods warns us of it and speaks of it