Why did God love and forgive David so?

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Stranger

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I see no short simple answer for the first part: God loves everyone. But, consider the following:

"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." John 3:16

What is the "world" that God loved? From the context of the verse it appears to me that it was people, people to whom He granted a means by which they need not ever die. It does not, however, say that He loves all people. Consider these verses:

"I have loved you, saith the LORD. Yet ye say, Wherein hast thou loved us? Was not Esau Jacob's brother? saith the LORD: yet I loved Jacob,
And I hated Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness." Mal 1:2-3

It seems that God who is Love according to scripture did not love Esau. Why not? Was it that Esau in the final totality of him was found here among the things that God hates?

"These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
[1] A proud look,
[2] a lying tongue,
[3] and hands that shed innocent blood,
[4] An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations,
[5] feet that be swift in running to mischief,
[6] A false witness that speaketh lies,
[7] and he that soweth discord among brethren." Prov 6:16-19

Reference was made also this verse on this thread:

"For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord." Rom 8:38-39

So then once we have it [the love of God] none of those things can separate us from it. But... can we walk away from it or cast it away from ourselves?

"For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame." Heb 6:4-6

That does not sound to me like a person could not walk away or cast away the enlightment received, the gift received, the Word of God tasted even though he of course should not. Could that or would that, however, be the unforgivable sin?

Another question we might ask is, Can God loves someone He hates? Can we?

I remember a young lady I knew when I was in college who had a young daughter. She married the father momentarily to give the child legitimacy. She told me she hated her daughter because of what her existence had done and continued to do to her life... her "freedom". At the time she said she loved for daughter for being the sweet little person that she was, the fruit of her own body.

So then again the question: Can God love someone He hates? Could He for example have loved Esau whom He hated?

On the second part, God forgives everyone, consider these words:

"For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses." Matt 6:14-15




.

Consider this brother, (Rom. 9:8-13), "...For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;....As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated."

Stranger
 
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FHII

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gotta disagree, imo he was obv chosen bc of something he did, too
Its in Acts 13:22 that we learn that David was a man after God's heart. But there is more to the quote:
Acts 13:22 KJV
And when he had removed him, he raised up unto them David to be their king; to whom also he gave testimony, and said, I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after mine own heart, which shall fulfil all my will.

David fulfilled all of God's will. God didn't fulfil it, David did. Furthermore God wasn't a man after his own heart, David was.

I absolutely agree that God chose David. That is the first and foremost qualification. But David responded. He had God in him and could do no other because he was chosen. David himself would probably disagree with me, but David still did what was bidden of him.

Sheesh! A little love for David! Anyone?
 

Miss Hepburn

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Sheesh! A little love for David! Anyone?
What I know personally from God is that He so wants to be known...
David "got God". :]
What a joy, what a thing this is for Our Father God. ☺ ♡
 
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amadeus

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Consider this brother, (Rom. 9:8-13), "...For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;....As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated."

Stranger
It can be a hard question and the answer a hard message, but I will hold on it for now.
 

Stranger

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It can be a hard question and the answer a hard message, but I will hold on it for now.

Consider this also. (Rev. 2:6) "But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate." (Rev. 2:15) "So hast thou also them that hold the doctrine of the Nicolaitans, which thing I hate.

Concerning (John 3:16), God so loved the 'world'. This speaks to the world order, not every individual in the world. The individual is found in the 'whosoever'. We are told later, (1 John 2:15), to "Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him."

Consider Christ's prayer. (John 17:6) "I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world:...." (17:8) "...they have believed that thou didst sen me." (17:9) "I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine." (17:20) "Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;"

Stranger
 
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mjrhealth

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Another question we might ask is, Can God loves someone He hates? Can we?
Bigger question,, how can love hate, they are complete opposites, either God is love or He is not, which is it???

Luk_6:32 For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them.

another one

Mat_5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

now How is it that God would expect us to do something He Himself will not do???
 

Stranger

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Bigger question,, how can love hate, they are complete opposites, either God is love or He is not, which is it???

Luk_6:32 For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them.

another one

Mat_5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

now How is it that God would expect us to do something He Himself will not do???

Love cannot hate. They are different actions. God can love and God can hate. Love is not God. Hate is not God. God is God Who does both love and hate.

God loves the world. He does not want us to love the world. God can love the world and not be affected by it. We cannot.

Stranger
 

Miss Hepburn

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Bigger question,, how can love hate, ...
I stopped reading there..thank you.
To the many thinking God can hate I would only ask, "Have ya met God?"
Or have you formed ideas about this Holy, Pure Spiritual Being from early Man's perceptions?
My gosh..Be still and meet Him...know Him.
[...I say.]
 
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bbyrd009

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people to whom He granted a means by which they need not ever die.
hmm
It seems that God who is Love according to scripture did not love Esau.
Esau I have hated?
It seems that God who is Love according to scripture did not love Esau.
hmm

yup, guess it does seem that way, huh
And I hated Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness." Mal 1:2-3

It seems that God who is Love according to scripture did not love Esau.
yet ol' Esau seemed to be doing fine several years after his heritage got "laid waste" though, huh.
appeared to me that it was Jacob who was plexing at the reunion, not Esau?

why the apparent discrepancy, do you think?
 
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DPMartin

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Another question we might ask is, Can God loves someone He hates? Can we?
.

The problem is most people that go on and on and on about God is love and Hs love is unconditional think they know what love is because they love something. Well if you love wickedness then how is that God like? If you love your family and friends, so what, the wicked do also.


But just what is it that God loves? Because the scripture verifies that there are things and people He hates. Just because God is love, doesn’t mean He loves everything, and doesn’t mean His love is unconditional. When it comes down to it, He loves the fulfillment of His Word according to His satisfaction. And the whole bible shows that. He loved Abraham and gave His Word to Abraham and if you’ve haven’t notice Israel is back some 37 hundred years later. Despite all that Israel did. Hence its His Word He loves, note the same was made flesh and is His Beloved Son.


Note in the following that hearing God’s Word supersedes what we usually see as the first commandment:


Mar 12:28 And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that he had answered them well, asked him, Which is the first commandment of all? 29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: 30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. 31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.


When the Creator and Judge made things in His creation, it was through His Word, He spoke and He saw that it was good. That which refuses to hear and or follow through in the fulfillment of His Word is hated. You can bet on that. It can be forgiven under the “Grace” if one repents but notice that the Grace must be granted. Mercy must be granted and repentance accepted.


So, the “God having unconditional love” theology, is taught by those who would have you think that there is no need to meet any conditions what so ever.


For example, there are churches that promote the notion that one can not only be gay but continue practicing the same and its alright with God because His love is unconditional. And if the same was told that no God’s love is conditional the bible says so over and over. You are a what after that?


A bigot a bully a white raciest any thing the world has tagged and redefined for its purpose of bring Christianity down to, you can be anything you chose, and be a Christian, oh yea don’t forget to bring that warm and fuzzy supportive disposition as though everyone you talk to is 5 years old.
 

101G

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Addressing the OP, "Why did God love and forgive David so?". he had a good pair of knees. and he had a kept tongue.

Peace in Christ Yeshua.
 
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Helen

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Bigger question,, how can love hate, they are complete opposites, either God is love or He is not, which is it???

Good question indeed. :)

I have never had the answer...except to believe that what is written was not how the original meaning was intended!!
But there again...there is much in the OT that can only be reconciled when we understand that "this" very tiny flash of life that we count time...is not the whole story.
I do believe that whoever said it first..." ...and they all lived happily ever after.." had an insight into God. :D
I there I STICK. lol
 

Helen

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Love cannot hate. They are different actions. God can love and God can hate. Love is not God.

Agree that Love is not God, but God IS Love! period.

We all know 1 John 4:7-10 backward.
"Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God.
8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love
."
Love is His nature.
But in all this something else is being said too.
And I don't even try to understand it... :)