Gospel of Grace?

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skypair

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Where is this gospel given? It comes from the epistles, but the gospel of Jesus Christ comes from Acts. So I want to make some observations about this.

1) The gospel of grace is man's "reverse engineering" of the gospel of Jesus Christ. By that I mean, the gospel of grace is cobbled together from passages where the biblical author, usually Paul, is addressing those who are already saved. He is telling them about their sanctification, not about their justification.

2) There are zero passages in scripture that say we are saved by "faith alone," but there is a passage that says that we are not justified (saved) "by faith only." (Jas 4:24)

3) Those who believe by "faith alone" have not been born again nor received the Holy Spirit. This tells us that they do not understand the things that they think they do (1Cor 2:14). So let's find out why.

Acts 5:32 tells us that the Holy Ghost is "given to those that obey Him." So what does the gospel that we KNOW saves tell us to do? "Repent and … receive the Holy Ghost." (2:38) Could it be any more clear that what "faith only's" believe is the gospel of grace, the gospel of men?

Repentance throughout the Bible is the method by which the unregenerate sinner enters into saving relationship and into covenant God (Acts 2:36-40). And it is obviously so .. 3000 men were saved by it!

Repentance is not only a change of the mind (believing) but a change of the heart (faith) by which we put off the old man and put on the new man, the new creation (Col 3:9-10, Eph 4:24). 2Cor 10:5 has it that we also "Cast off every imagination and high thing [gospel of grace] that exalts itself above the knowledge of God and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ." — which is what Acts 2:40 is about.

And this IS good news .. not the fact that we are sinners bound for hell but that God has made a way of escape!

skypair
 

Miss Hepburn

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Well, THAT was an amazing bit of research and explanation!
icon_cheers.gif


More, please...
glasses10.gif


Hey, does anyone know why the Bible verses were not able to be clicked on?
Here lemme try exactly what was in the first post...
Acts 2:40 ok....try another one:
Psalm 139:1

Are we doing something different? Neither worked...
 

James Roberts

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Ephesians 2:8-10 (NASB)
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and [1] that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

Footnotes:
  1. Ephesians 2:8 I.e. that salvation
New American Standard Bible (NASB)
Copyright © 1960, 1962, 1963, 1968, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1975, 1977, 1995 by The Lockman Foundation
 
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James Roberts

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ha, i love the Bible
created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.
So the good works didn't originate with us. If they did and we could be saved because of them, Jesus died for no reason. Ha, I love the Bible too!
 
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GodsGrace

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Where is this gospel given? It comes from the epistles, but the gospel of Jesus Christ comes from Acts. So I want to make some observations about this.

1) The gospel of grace is man's "reverse engineering" of the gospel of Jesus Christ. By that I mean, the gospel of grace is cobbled together from passages where the biblical author, usually Paul, is addressing those who are already saved. He is telling them about their sanctification, not about their justification.

2) There are zero passages in scripture that say we are saved by "faith alone," but there is a passage that says that we are not justified (saved) "by faith only." (Jas 4:24)

3) Those who believe by "faith alone" have not been born again nor received the Holy Spirit. This tells us that they do not understand the things that they think they do (1Cor 2:14). So let's find out why.

Acts 5:32 tells us that the Holy Ghost is "given to those that obey Him." So what does the gospel that we KNOW saves tell us to do? "Repent and … receive the Holy Ghost." (2:38) Could it be any more clear that what "faith only's" believe is the gospel of grace, the gospel of men?

Repentance throughout the Bible is the method by which the unregenerate sinner enters into saving relationship and into covenant God (Acts 2:36-40). And it is obviously so .. 3000 men were saved by it!

Repentance is not only a change of the mind (believing) but a change of the heart (faith) by which we put off the old man and put on the new man, the new creation (Col 3:9-10, Eph 4:24). 2Cor 10:5 has it that we also "Cast off every imagination and high thing [gospel of grace] that exalts itself above the knowledge of God and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ." — which is what Acts 2:40 is about.

And this IS good news .. not the fact that we are sinners bound for hell but that God has made a way of escape!

skypair
Wow.
What a great post.
Never have seen it posted like this before.
I agree totally with you and will be reading along.
 

GodsGrace

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created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.
So the good works didn't originate with us. If they did and we could be saved because of them, Jesus died for no reason. Ha, I love the Bible too!
Good works could not save us.
Works could not be the reason for our salvation.
However, do you agree that "works", however we want to describe them, are necessary AFTER salvaton?
IOW, if we do no works (let's call it deeds since works has such a bad reputation) does this mean we truly are not saved??
 

skypair

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Wow.
What a great post.
Never have seen it posted like this before.
I agree totally with you and will be reading along.
Thanks, Godsgrace. :) What I have found is that those who believe in faith alone 1) not only leave the question of faith in what? alone (so many churches teach that if you have faith in what they teach, you are saved) but also 2) they do not understand the difference between changing their minds/spirits and changing their hearts/souls.

We are created soul, spirit, and body. The spirit processes what we see and hear and decides first whether to believe .. but then it has to decide whether to commit one's life to what they believe. So many churches get to that first choice but then never commit their hearts to what they believe through repentance.

Do you see how this works out? My own brother told me today that he thinks man is only soul and body. So, to him, simply believing is salvation and there is nothing more he can do in order to be saved — and there =is nothing more that God commands him to do in order to be saved .. that is contrary to what Acts 2:38, 3:19, 17:30, 20:21, 26:20 do COMMAND.

skypair
 
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DPMartin

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Where is this gospel given? It comes from the epistles, but the gospel of Jesus Christ comes from Acts. So I want to make some observations about this.

1) The gospel of grace is man's "reverse engineering" of the gospel of Jesus Christ. By that I mean, the gospel of grace is cobbled together from passages where the biblical author, usually Paul, is addressing those who are already saved. He is telling them about their sanctification, not about their justification.

2) There are zero passages in scripture that say we are saved by "faith alone," but there is a passage that says that we are not justified (saved) "by faith only." (Jas 4:24)

3) Those who believe by "faith alone" have not been born again nor received the Holy Spirit. This tells us that they do not understand the things that they think they do (1Cor 2:14). So let's find out why.

Acts 5:32 tells us that the Holy Ghost is "given to those that obey Him." So what does the gospel that we KNOW saves tell us to do? "Repent and … receive the Holy Ghost." (2:38) Could it be any more clear that what "faith only's" believe is the gospel of grace, the gospel of men?

Repentance throughout the Bible is the method by which the unregenerate sinner enters into saving relationship and into covenant God (Acts 2:36-40). And it is obviously so .. 3000 men were saved by it!

Repentance is not only a change of the mind (believing) but a change of the heart (faith) by which we put off the old man and put on the new man, the new creation (Col 3:9-10, Eph 4:24). 2Cor 10:5 has it that we also "Cast off every imagination and high thing [gospel of grace] that exalts itself above the knowledge of God and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ." — which is what Acts 2:40 is about.

And this IS good news .. not the fact that we are sinners bound for hell but that God has made a way of escape!

skypair



who is faith only's?

and Paul does talk about what justifies the believer:


Rom_2:13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

Rom_3:4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

Rom_3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Rom_3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Rom_3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

Rom_3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Rom_3:30 Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.

Rom_4:2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

Rom_4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Rom_4:25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Rom_5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

Rom_5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Rom_5:16 And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.

Rom_5:18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

Rom_8:30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Rom_8:33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

1Co_4:4 For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord.

1Co_6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Gal_2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Gal_2:17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.

Gal_3:8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

Gal_3:11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

Gal_3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

Gal_5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

1Ti_3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Tit_3:7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.


which is based on his knowledge of the Torah:

Gen 15:4 And, behold, the word of the LORD came unto him, saying, This shall not be thine heir; but he that shall come forth out of thine own bowels shall be thine heir.
Gen 15:5 And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be.
Gen 15:6 And he believed in the LORD; and he counted it to him for righteousness.
Gen 15:7 And he said unto him, I am the LORD that brought thee out of Ur of the Chaldees, to give thee this land to inherit it.


and the revelation of Christ.


you confuse works with faith and Paul's teachings in the mist of the arguments of law and grace a nd faith he experienced in his day.


you have to believe (faith) to repent and belief comes by knowing [To perceive (a thing or person) as identical with one perceived before, or of which one has a previous notion; to recognize; to identify.] and knowing comes by revelation.

so the principal thing that is accounted to the Abraham as righteousness "he believed in the LORD" according to scripture. works are simply the result of what ever a person has faith in or believes and trusts. works don't justify, God justifies, works are the evidence of what is believed and or trusted.

for example Abram believed and trusted the Word of God and packed his stuff and family and went to the promised land. he didn't have to repent and believe. God revealed His Word that expressed God's will to Abram for Abram that is what is good for Abram and Abram because he trusted the Lord his God went.


teenagers either trust and believe their parent's judgment of what is good for them, or they don't. should they learn come to the realization ( trust and believe) that their parents judgements are good for them then they repent (change their ways or mind). belief and trust is the principle thing, and if the trust and belief is genuine then the works will be according to the belief.

again works justify nothing, because without the faith there is no works according to the faith.
 
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tabletalk

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Thanks, Godsgrace. :) What I have found is that those who believe in faith alone 1) not only leave the question of faith in what? alone (so many churches teach that if you have faith in what they teach, you are saved) but also 2) they do not understand the difference between changing their minds/spirits and changing their hearts/souls.

We are created soul, spirit, and body. The spirit processes what we see and hear and decides first whether to believe .. but then it has to decide whether to commit one's life to what they believe. So many churches get to that first choice but then never commit their hearts to what they believe through repentance.

Do you see how this works out? My own brother told me today that he thinks man is only soul and body. So, to him, simply believing is salvation and there is nothing more he can do in order to be saved — and there =is nothing more that God commands him to do in order to be saved .. that is contrary to what Acts 2:38, 3:19, 17:30, 20:21, 26:20 do COMMAND.

skypair


You said: "The spirit processes what we see and hear and decides first whether to believe .. but then it has to decide whether to commit one's life to what they believe."

Can you provide some Scriptural support for that statement of truth? Or, would it just be a summary of what you believe the spirit of a person does?
 

GodsGrace

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Thanks, Godsgrace. :) What I have found is that those who believe in faith alone 1) not only leave the question of faith in what? alone (so many churches teach that if you have faith in what they teach, you are saved) but also 2) they do not understand the difference between changing their minds/spirits and changing their hearts/souls.

We are created soul, spirit, and body. The spirit processes what we see and hear and decides first whether to believe .. but then it has to decide whether to commit one's life to what they believe. So many churches get to that first choice but then never commit their hearts to what they believe through repentance.

Do you see how this works out? My own brother told me today that he thinks man is only soul and body. So, to him, simply believing is salvation and there is nothing more he can do in order to be saved — and there =is nothing more that God commands him to do in order to be saved .. that is contrary to what Acts 2:38, 3:19, 17:30, 20:21, 26:20 do COMMAND.

skypair
Hi Skypair
You believe in the Trichotomy of man.
Some believe in the Dichotomy of man. In that case the spirit is together with the soul.
I also believe in the Trichotomy of man because it's easier to explain how we're made up.

In this case the spirit DOES have an affect on the soul.

Many today believe in faith only. NOWHERE did Jesus say to have faith only. It does say in John 6:29, by Jesus Himself, that the work of God is that we believe in whom He has sent. (Jesus)

Of course, in this case - and the ONLY one in the gospels, we'd have to stop and explain what believe means. It DOES NOT mean a mental belief. Even the demons believe in that sense of the word. In Greek it means something totally different of course. It means TO FOLLOW, and to trust and to learn from.

I often ask for one verse where Jesus says to only believe in Him and you'll be saved. It's nowhere to be found.

I fear the problem is that Paul is very much misunderstood. Peter himself says this.
2 Peter 3:16

If it seemed difficult then, you could imagine now with the difference in culture and language or linguistics.
 

skypair

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Can you provide some Scriptural support for that statement of truth? Or, would it just be a summary of what you believe the spirit of a person does?
Oh, you probably didn't realize that our spirit is our mind -- our intellect. We hear or see things every second, process what we see or hear, and make decisions about what to do with the information, right? And if we believe what we hear, often we use that information to see if it is true. A stock tip, a cooking tip, a salvation tip, etc. :)

That's what the people at Pentecost (Acts 2:37-40) were doing with the "tip" Peter gave them about Jesus Christ and salvation. Why would they want to use it? Because it was actionable! If they felt guilty in their hearts (and they did), they could repent of sin turning to Christ and receive salvation.

Do you see that?

skypair
 

skypair

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In this case the spirit DOES have an affect on the soul.
Right .. and when he BELIEVES in his spirit or mind that he is a sinner, there is a conflict called conviction going on in his soul, which is his heart and conscience, that must be reconciled by repenting from the heart from sin and to God in the name of Jesus Christ. (Acts 2:38)

Many today believe in faith only. NOWHERE did Jesus say to have faith only.
Yes, I agree. In fact, James 4:24 says "...man is not justified by faith only."

But you know what faith only does cause? It opens the door to commercializing salvation. Yeah, each church can tell its audience what "faith alone" consists of and no one is the wiser except those who repent as God commands! Instead of believing that doctrines of men, we ought to just go back to the gospel at Pentecost where we know that 3000+ people were saved. Go find any gospel you think that you want to believe and see if people were actually saved there, folks.

skypair
 
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James Roberts

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Good works could not save us.
Works could not be the reason for our salvation.
However, do you agree that "works", however we want to describe them, are necessary AFTER salvaton?
IOW, if we do no works (let's call it deeds since works has such a bad reputation) does this mean we truly are not saved??
Good works and deeds will follow us as Christians. A Christian without good works, one has to wonder if they are truly saved? Have they been born again? Are they a seed landing on rocky soil which cannot generate healthy roots? Good works are certainly evidence.
 
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