Before Jesus, do you believe people went to some bad place in the afterlife?

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Miss Hepburn

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What is your concept of where people went before Jesus was born...
A terrible place?
Or Jews, Hindus, Sikhs, atheists, early Greeks that believed in Zues and Athena....also a terrible place?
Would a Jewish man not see his Christian wife and family on the Other Side, in your idea or
belief system?
Thanks.
Any thoughts, scripture ...go for it. ☺
 
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bbyrd009

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amadeus

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Consider what Paul wrote:

"For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)" Rom 2:14-15

And then here what Jesus said regarding a Roman soldier:

"When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.
And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.
But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." Matt 8"10-12

And His further words regarding a gentile of long before his own natural birth in Bethlehem:

"And many lepers were in Israel in the time of Eliseus the prophet; and none of them was cleansed, saving Naaman the Syrian." Luke 4:27

And consideration the words of Ruth, the Moabitess, also a gentile by birth:

"And Ruth said, Intreat me not to leave thee, or to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God:
Where thou diest, will I die, and there will I be buried: the LORD do so to me, and more also, if ought but death part thee and me" Ruth 1:16-17

Where any of them went for the moment really doesn't matter so long as they went to the right place in the end...


Consider who would have been among those who arosed from their sleep here:

"Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.
And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;
And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many." Matt 27:50-53
Would they have a worse place than any of us who have believed on Him?
 

7angels

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What is your concept of where people went before Jesus was born...
A terrible place?
Or Jews, Hindus, Sikhs, atheists, early Greeks that believed in Zues and Athena....also a terrible place?
Would a Jewish man not see his Christian wife and family on the Other Side, in your idea or
belief system?
Thanks.
Any thoughts, scripture ...go for it. ☺
"Bosom of Abraham" refers to the place of comfort in the Biblical Sheol (or Hades in the Greek Septuagint version of the Hebrew scriptures from around 200 BC, and therefore so described in the New Testament) where the righteous dead await Judgment Day.

The Bosom of Abraham occurs in only one New Testament passage, the parable of the rich man and Lazarus, which is only in the gospel of Luke (16:19–31; see Luke 16:22 and Luke 16:23). Leprous Lazarus is carried by the angels to that destination after death. Abraham's bosom contrasts with the destination of a rich man who ends up in Hades. The account corresponds closely with documented 1st century AD Jewish beliefs (see above), that the dead were gathered into a general tarrying-place, made equivalent with the Sheol of the Old Testament. In Christ's account, the righteous occupied an abode of their own, which was distinctly separated by a chasm from the abode to which the wicked were consigned. The chasm is equivalent to the river in the Jewish version, but in Christ's version there is no angelic ferryman, and it is impossible to pass from one side to the other.

as for where people go that are of other religions go when they die is hell because Jesus said, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me” (John 14:6). Jesus himself is saying there isn’t any other pathway to the Father except through me. Peter, later in the book of Acts, picks that up when he says, “There is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved” (Acts 4:12). Peter is taking Jesus’s words and carrying them forward into the mission of the church by saying there isn’t any other name you can call upon in order to be saved.

God bless
 

truthquest

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These scriptures come to mind.

Heb. 11:13 These died in faith, all of them, and they did not receive their promise, but they saw it from a distance and rejoiced in it and confessed that they were foreigners and nomads in The Earth. 14 But those who say these things show that they seek their City. 15 And if they had been seeking that city which they had left, they had time to return again to it. 16 Now it is apparent that they longed for better than that, which is in Heaven; because of this, God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared a City for them.

I Tim. 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior;
4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

Ezekiel 18:32 "For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone who dies," declares the Lord GOD. "Therefore, repent and live."

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

1 Kings 8:39 then hear in heaven Your dwelling place, and forgive and act and render to each according to all his ways, whose heart You know, for You alone know the hearts of all the sons of men,
 
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pia

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What is your concept of where people went before Jesus was born...
A terrible place?
Or Jews, Hindus, Sikhs, atheists, early Greeks that believed in Zues and Athena....also a terrible place?
Would a Jewish man not see his Christian wife and family on the Other Side, in your idea or
belief system?
Thanks.
Any thoughts, scripture ...go for it. ☺
Jesus told a story of the rich man and the poor man who both died.....One went into the bosom of Abraham, the other, on the other side of an impassable chasm, where it says he thirsted......Seems even then there were at least two alternatives..
 

pastor marty

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Jesus told a story of the rich man and the poor man who both died.....One went into the bosom of Abraham, the other, on the other side of an impassable chasm, where it says he thirsted......Seems even then there were at least two alternatives..
**********NAH !*** The're all in purgatory/forced 2 read Christian Science."band-aids are of the devil"propaganda /living next 2 Mormon wife-brothels and having only Jehovah Witless speeches on the radio !!!& hoping 4 the judgement,{assuming they repent} so's they can get out !!!(answer 4 Audrey;also)************<m>*******o_O
 

bbyrd009

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as for where people go that are of other religions go when they die is hell because Jesus said, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me” (John 14:6). Jesus himself is saying there isn’t any other pathway to the Father except through me. Peter, later in the book of Acts, picks that up when he says, “There is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved” (Acts 4:12). Peter is taking Jesus’s words and carrying them forward into the mission of the church by saying there isn’t any other name you can call upon in order to be saved.
good way to justify yourself to yourself, religion-wise, but of course not even a little bit true, as Scripture makes plain in several parables
 

pastor marty

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Consider what Paul wrote:

"For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)" Rom 2:14-15

And then here what Jesus said regarding a Roman soldier:

"When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.
And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.
But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." Matt 8"10-12

And His further words regarding a gentile of long before his own natural birth in Bethlehem:

"And many lepers were in Israel in the time of Eliseus the prophet; and none of them was cleansed, saving Naaman the Syrian." Luke 4:27

And consideration the words of Ruth, the Moabitess, also a gentile by birth:

"And Ruth said, Intreat me not to leave thee, or to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God:
Where thou diest, will I die, and there will I be buried: the LORD do so to me, and more also, if ought but death part thee and me" Ruth 1:16-17

Where any of them went for the moment really doesn't matter so long as they went to the right place in the end...


Consider who would have been among those who arosed from their sleep here:

"Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.
And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;
And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many." Matt 27:50-53
Would they have a worse place than any of us who have believed on Him?
[/QUOTE/ ***************(Permission 2 print your epistle;please !) Dead prophets rise to praise & lament HE who was rejected !*************Awesome !*******never picked up on that*******PAX***<m>******
 

VictoryinJesus

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"Bosom of Abraham" refers to the place of comfort in the Biblical Sheol (or Hades in the Greek Septuagint version of the Hebrew scriptures from around 200 BC, and therefore so described in the New Testament) where the righteous dead await Judgment Day.

The Bosom of Abraham occurs in only one New Testament passage, the parable of the rich man and Lazarus, which is only in the gospel of Luke (16:19–31; see Luke 16:22 and Luke 16:23). Leprous Lazarus is carried by the angels to that destination after death. Abraham's bosom contrasts with the destination of a rich man who ends up in Hades. The account corresponds closely with documented 1st century AD Jewish beliefs (see above), that the dead were gathered into a general tarrying-place, made equivalent with the Sheol of the Old Testament. In Christ's account, the righteous occupied an abode of their own, which was distinctly separated by a chasm from the abode to which the wicked were consigned. The chasm is equivalent to the river in the Jewish version, but in Christ's version there is no angelic ferryman, and it is impossible to pass from one side to the other.

as for where people go that are of other religions go when they die is hell because Jesus said, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me” (John 14:6). Jesus himself is saying there isn’t any other pathway to the Father except through me. Peter, later in the book of Acts, picks that up when he says, “There is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved” (Acts 4:12). Peter is taking Jesus’s words and carrying them forward into the mission of the church by saying there isn’t any other name you can call upon in order to be saved.

God bless

The rich man thirst. Jesus gave the woman by the well living water. The Lamb leads to fountains of living water.

Revelation 7:16-17
[16] They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. [17] For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.

Lazarus is The Spirit (Christ) which means "God has helped" sent from the bosom of the Father. Jesus Christ (the Lamb) laid without the gate. Matthew 25:40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

John 1:18
[18] No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

The only begotten Son sent to us from the bosom of the Father. The great chasm (gulf, breach, rupture) separates the rich man from Lazarus... is sin. Relationship lost. Luke 16:23,27-31
[23] And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. [27] Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house: [28] For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. [29] Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. [30] And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. [31] And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

But this passage is in Luke; a prayer and plea for God to send His Spirit. God did send His Son. God did what the rich man asked and raised one from the dead. God poured out His Spirit on man.


Luke 16:22-23
[22] And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; [23] And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

There is now a way over the chasm, the way is Jesus Christ. He that crosses over sin and separation by the way prepared by God, that way being Christ over the chasm will thirst no more and is comforted...By the Spirit of God sent from His bosom. The comforter.John 16:7-13 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. [8] And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: [9] Of sin, because they believe not on me; [10] Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; [11] Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged. [12] I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. [13] Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.


This place we go, it seems either relationship with God is restored, or we are without Relationship. Without Relationship there is darkness and there remains a gulf (sin) separating us from The bosom of the Father.
 
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7angels

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The rich man thirst. Jesus gave the woman by the well living water. The Lamb leads to fountains of living water.

Revelation 7:16-17
[16] They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. [17] For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.

Lazarus is The Spirit (Christ) which means "God has helped" sent from the bosom of the Father. Jesus Christ (the Lamb) laid without the gate. Matthew 25:40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

John 1:18
[18] No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

The only begotten Son sent to us from the bosom of the Father. The great chasm (gulf, breach, rupture) separates the rich man from Lazarus... is sin. Relationship lost. Luke 16:23,27-31
[23] And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. [27] Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house: [28] For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. [29] Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. [30] And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. [31] And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

But this passage is in Luke; a prayer and plea for God to send His Spirit. God did send His Son. God did what the rich man asked and raised one from the dead. God poured out His Spirit on man.


Luke 16:22-23
[22] And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; [23] And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

There is now a way over the chasm, the way is Jesus Christ. He that crosses over sin and separation by the way prepared by God, that way being Christ over the chasm will thirst no more and is comforted...By the Spirit of God sent from His bosom. The comforter.John 16:7-13 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. [8] And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: [9] Of sin, because they believe not on me; [10] Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; [11] Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged. [12] I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. [13] Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.


This place we go, it seems either relationship with God is restored, or we are without Relationship. Without Relationship there is darkness and there remains a gulf (sin) separating us from The bosom of the Father.
you are correct but the thread is asking:
Before Jesus, do you believe people went to some bad place in the afterlife?

to my understanding you are referring to after Christ. nice post though.
 

7angels

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good way to justify yourself to yourself, religion-wise, but of course not even a little bit true, as Scripture makes plain in several parables
if i have said anything unscriptural please tell me. where do you think atheists and buddhists and ect go when they die and why? that is the part you cut out and pasted in your post #9.

God bless
 
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VictoryinJesus

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you are correct but the thread is asking:
Before Jesus, do you believe people went to some bad place in the afterlife?

to my understanding you are referring to after Christ. nice post though.

I am sorry. You are right.
"Before Jesus, do you believe people went to some bad place in the afterlife?"

Any place separate from God is a bad place. Those separate from God "thirst". That is my answer. Separation from being comforted by the Father is the focal point of the parable of the Rich man and Lazarus. What that means for those dead, is the same as the living: there is still only one way over to the Father, and that way has been declared. John 1:18 tells us: "No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him."
 

amadeus

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(Permission 2 print your epistle;please !) Dead prophets rise to praise & lament HE who was rejected !*************Awesome !*******never picked up on that*******PAX***<m>**
Hey it all comes from God, doesn't it? You have His permission and mine as well as you think you need it.
Give God the glory!
 

101G

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GINOLJC, to all
@ VJ. your post #11 was very interesting. one or two thing I disagreed with, but over all it's a GREAT post. after this post I'm going to give you a "LIKE". not saying that you was right or wrong, but consider this The rich man thirst. "Jesus gave the woman by the well living water. The Lamb leads to fountains of living water". true, when someone thirst, there is a LACK, supportive scripture, Amos 8:11 "Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the LORD". that thirst the rich man had was not a natural thirst, but a "lack" in the hearing of the word of God. you're on point about the water, and your Revelation 7:16-17 top it off perfectly. I commend you there.

Next, "This place we go, it seems either relationship with God is restored, or we are without Relationship. Without Relationship there is darkness and there remains a gulf (sin) separating us from The bosom of the Father". agree on the sin that separate. but the term "PLACE", not saying that you're right or wrong, just to me the word "place" do not render unto me a location, but an estate, or stated of mind. let me give an example, Ephesians 2:6 "And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus". is that a location or a state of mind?. sit, here means in company with Philippians 2:5 "Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus". so this to me, not saying that you're right or wrong, to be in the right relationship we need to have the same mind. a different mind is like having another gospel.

third, the name Lazarus, U said, "Lazarus is The Spirit (Christ) which means "God has helped" sent from the bosom of the Father." years ago when studying on Abraham the man he was worried about an inheritance, (a SON). listen, Genesis 15:2 "And Abram said, Lord GOD, what wilt thou give me, seeing I go childless, and the steward of my house is this Eliezer of Damascus?". did you see it? if not, A. childless was in reference to inheritance. and B. no servant inherit the Kingdom of God, but only Sons. scripture, Galatians 4:6 & 7 "And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father 7 "Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ".
see, Eliezer in Hebrew is H461 אֱלִיעֶזֶר 'Eliy`ezer (el-ee-eh'-zer) n/p.
1. (meaning) God of help.
see, VJ you'er on point and correct. on a scale of 1-10 i'll give you a 20, a double potion... :cool:.

see, if I never would have took my time and read your post, I might have, you might have, we might have missed this revelation.

conclusion: thirst for the word of God, and get a relationship with God, (BORN AGAIN), hence become his Sons and Daughters, and inherit the Kingdom of your FATHER. amen

keep up the good work, and may God richly bless you.

Peace in Christ Yeshua.
 

bbyrd009

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if i have said anything unscriptural please tell me. where do you think atheists and buddhists and ect go when they die and why? that is the part you cut out and pasted in your post #9.

God bless
ah, you see some cut and paste in #9? hmm
where do i think they go? Who cares? All go to the same place
no one knows where they go when they die
(except Christian believers of course, they know everything lol)
who are you to judge another man's servant?
if you dig a ditch for someone, you end up in it yourself
 
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bbyrd009

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I am sorry. You are right.
"Before Jesus, do you believe people went to some bad place in the afterlife?"

Any place separate from God is a bad place. Those separate from God "thirst". That is my answer. Separation from being comforted by the Father is the focal point of the parable of the Rich man and Lazarus. What that means for those dead, is the same as the living: there is still only one way over to the Father, and that way has been declared. John 1:18 tells us: "No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him."
boy, the RM and Lazarus is sure doing heavy duty lol, for a parable. Any characterizations that this parable gives one, that inevitably form in any mind as they listen, can also be tested with Scripture, right. Or can also cause other Scripture to become invisible in a sense, too. The Father is not inaccessible, right now, wadr; and the dead know nothing.
 

bbyrd009

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(except Christian believers of course, they know everything lol)
and Christian pastors, yikes, don't even get me started lol. See Paul's wolves came in, and we got some mush put together by a bunch of blind guys now, who will rush to assure you about predestination, and blithely quote Paul as saying "absent from the body is present with the Lord," but have never even heard of Nehushtan, see, and never preach sermons on King Saul and Samuel being in the same place when they die