Once in Heaven, can you lose your salvation?

Taken said:

The House, the Kingdom, the Heaven....all are simply references to, in context, specific holy places, under Gods holiness. void of evil.
There was no intent to MAKE God the house, the kingdom, the heaven.

It is simply denoting holy places where God dwells, even as you mention WITHIN saved and born again men.

Also was revealed, as ByGrace said, what a man DOES do, shall position them IN Gods "house", "kingdom", "mansion", and you reinterated.

I agree with all of that; you and ByGrace, saying the same thing in different words.

I do not agree with your last part.



Every man saved and born again, SHALL have occupancy IN the Kingdom of God.
Some shall be accounted great...as you mentioned, their rewards for their Works.
Some shall be accounted least...as Scripture reveals....no glorifiying works, no rewards.

Well, the fact is Every born again man SHALL receive the reward of the Crown of Life.
And yes some will receive MORE Crowns for their Works, and some will NOT receive MORE Crowns for their Works....yet they WILL be all together with the SAME ONE indwelling Holy Spirit, and shall occupy the SAME, new earth, as occupants of Gods holy Kingdom on Earth.

All works, NOT glorifying to God, be it by a Saved man or Unsaved man, SHALL BE Burned.

God Bless,
Taken.

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A kingdom is simply a territory ruled by a king. It's the same word that God/Jesus used for in regards to the kingdom of God. Men have had their kingdoms, ruling over other human beings. The difference between God's kingdom from men's kingdoms is that in God's kingdom, the saints are not subjects, but are also future kings themselves, whom will rule not only over the Earth but entire universe. This is the purpose for why God created the universe.....for His children to have their own territory to exercise their right to rule.

verzanumi24 said:

A kingdom is simply a territory ruled by a king. It's the same word that God/Jesus used for in regards to the kingdom of God. Men have had their kingdoms, ruling over other human beings. The difference between God's kingdom from men's kingdoms is that in God's kingdom, the saints are not subjects, but are also future kings themselves, whom will rule not only over the Earth but entire universe. This is the purpose for the why God created the universe.....for His children to have their own territory to exercise their right to rule.

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some supporting Scripture here would be good; it's in There, right? Just occluded.

Taken said:

Nations as the sea?

Eh, nah. Nations are countries, lands with borders, with governmental leadership, and the people thereof.

In the beginning, water was before land. Land rose up out of the seas as God divided the seas. Via Gods control over the weather and land, earthquakes, etc., men have observed dry land rising up out of the seas, and they also may or may not become "nations".

Abraham's promise was for him to be a "father" of many nations, which is to say, Abraham is a father to many men, 1)whose abode is in the many different nations; 2)whom such men have the Seed of God.

God Bless,
Taken

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If noticed, I put the book of Revelation in brackets. The book of Isaiah used mountains to symbolically represents Nation. The book of Daniel used it at least once, to represent the kingdom of God.

bbyrd009 said:

some supporting Scripture here would be good; it's in There, right? Just occluded.

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The saints will possess the kingdom of God forever


Daniel 7:18 (KJV)
18 But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever.


Jesus told His disciples that it's the Father's desired to give them His kingdom


Luke 12:32 (ASV)
32 Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom.



The saints will judge the world and even angels. A king is a judge....God was also called Judge of the Earth. Genesis 18:25


1 Corinthians 6:2-3 (KJV)
2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?


The saints will rule on the Earth


Revelation 5:9-11 (KJV)
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;
10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.
11 And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands;


Two important things to take note of in the verse below. Jesus is currently sitting on His Father's throne in Heaven, and but Jesus said, those who over they will sit on His throne. When Jesus returns, He will sit on the throne He inherited from His ancestor David. That's the throne all of God's people will sit with Him on and rule over the Earth.


Luke 1:32 (ASV)
32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Most High: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:


Isaiah 9:7 (ASV)
7 Of the increase of his government and of peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to establish it, and to uphold it with justice and with righteousness from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of Jehovah of hosts will perform this.


The saints will rule alongside Jesus

Revelation 3:21 (KJV)
21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.


The saints will be given power over the Nations


Revelation 2:26-27 (KJV)
26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:
27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.



The kingdom of God will never stop increasing.....this is talking about the territory, and the territory cannot be limited to just the Earth.


Isaiah 9:7 (KJV)
7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.


When God creates something He creates it for a purpose, this includes the universe that has countless stars and planets revolving around them.


The creation is in bondage until the sons of God have been set free from their bondage


Romans 8:19-22 (ASV)
19 For the earnest expectation of the creation waiteth for the revealing of the sons of God.
20 For the creation was subjected to vanity, not of its own will, but by reason of him who subjected it, in hope
21 that the creation itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the liberty of the glory of the children of God.
22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.


This creation that in Romans 8 19 -22, is not limited to the Earth, it includes the entire universe. The planets in the universe are in a state of emptiness and lifelessness. But it will not remain in that state forever. When the children of God have been glorifed, they will release the universe from it's bondage.

verzanumi24 said:

This creation that in Romans 8 19 -22, is not limited to the Earth, it includes the entire universe. The planets in the universe are in a state of emptiness and likenesses. But it will not remain in that state forever. When the children of God have been glorifed, they will release the universe from it's bondage.

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hmm, maybe, not sure the universe is in any bondage myself

bbyrd009 said:

hmm, maybe, not sure the universe is in any bondage myself

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That's because you don't see it the way God does. Do people build a house or a building but have no intention to have it occupied? Why would God create the universe, but have no intention for the planets in it to have life and living beings on those planets? The God I know is a purposfull God, not the one that christians have in their minds.

verzanumi24 said:

That's because you don't see it the way God does.

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ah, jeez, and you do?

verzanumi24 said:

Do people build a house or a building but have no intention to have it occupied?

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quite often i guess; being fractious here

verzanumi24 said:

Why would God create the universe, but have no intention for the planets in it to have life and living beings on those planets?

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oh, i could think of several reasons--even though fwiw i agree with you here pretty much--one being to illuminate how special "the dust of the earth" is, or to display His Majesty in other perspectives, time, space, even physics maybe. Iow to allow physicists room to discover how precisely the universe was constructed, or to reveal the nature of time. Some other metaphysical possibilities too i guess

verzanumi24 said:

The God I know is a purposfull God, not the one that christians have in their minds.

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all the gods i know have fallen

tho i get you, yes

bbyrd009 said:

all the gods i know have fallen

tho i get you, yes

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The only God that exist is the only true God.....the one that created the heavens and the Earth. But the one that christians have in their minds was put in their by those they listen to and not the Bible.

Isaiah 29:13 (ASV)
13 And the Lord said, Forasmuch as this people draw nigh unto me, and with their mouth and with their lips to honor me, but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear of me is a commandment of men which hath been taught them;

Taken said:

That's a pretty encompassing statement having ALL Christians rejecting the Lord God Almighty. Don't agree.



"Forasmuch" as "THIS PEOPLE".

Not a secret some people the DO give lip service which does not match their true hearts thoughts.

But I do not think that applies to ALL Christians or ALL men.

God Bless,
Taken

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If one is not obeying Jesus then they have rejected God. To prove my point, how many christians are preaching the kingdom of God?

Taken said:

Man has, Yes, pretty much mimicked God, having a succession of rulers, ie the Royal family...

And during the 1,000 yr reign, Christ will be King of His Kingdom, and mortal men will still rule in their lands.



And who shall these saint rulers and children be ruling?
And what shall Christ be King of?

God Bless,
Taken

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The saints will rule with Jesus and will possess eternal life. The only mortal human beings will be those Jesus and the saints will be rulling over. But even they will eventually become possessors of eternal life, and enter the kingdom of God and be kings as well.

Taken said:

Isaiah 66: 1

Heaven is Gods Throne.

God Bless,
Taken

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All is saying is God is bigger than the Earth and Heaven.

Taken said:

So, you were talking about the 1,000 yr reign, but did not identify that specific time.

You seemed to be initially speaking of After the 1,000 year reign.

During the 1,000 year reign, Christ will be King of His Kingdom; saved and born again men will be occupants, His People, of His Kingdom.

The mortals shall have kingdoms, with their own mortal kings. Each "mortal" kingdom shall be established having the Word of God, being taught, obeyed of the people, a pilgrimage to Christ's Kingdom (yearly I think).

For some of the kingdoms; the generational descending to KEEP Gods Word, shall prevail;
And their pilgrimages shall prevail;

For others of such mortal kingdoms; the generational descending to KEEP Gods Word, shall fail;
And their pilgrimages shall haut.

THOSE ^ such mortal kingdoms, shall as has happened throughout the history of mankind, shall be easily influenced, by Satan, when he is released at the end for the 1,000 year reign. They SHALL fall into the same damnination of pryor men, who rejected God.

(That is not to say, DURING the 1,000 year reign, immortal men, from Christ's Kingdom, will not visit such mortal kingdoms, and minister unto the mortals.....likely so. But they will not be the rulers of such kingdoms).

Disagree with your blanket "they will become possesses of eternal life". No, all do not.

Some WILL, some WILL Not.

God Bless,
Taken

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Yes, but you don't seen to understand that the saints, the righteous men and women of God in the Old Testament will not be mortal. Arent you aware that Jesus said the saints will rule with Him?.....that when Jesus returns the saints and all the rightious men and woman of God who have died, will be raised from the dead and given glorified bodies. They will no longer be mortal. Aren't you aware that the scripture say that they will be like Jesus, because they will see Him as He is? If you like, I can show you the scriptures that I'm refering to that back up what I'm saying.

Taken said:

That carte blanche statement I would disagree with.

Hear, heartfully believe, elect the Lord, Accept His gift of change ones WHOLE, present your Whole changed body, soul, spirit TO Him....
IS doing the Will of God.
^ THAT is one WHO is WITH the Lord Forever.

IF THAT ^ one does Works in the Lords Name;
THAT such Works Glorifies His name,
...THAT one shall be rewarded.
IF That ones Works do not glorify His name,
...those works shall be burned, and obviously the one shall not be rewarded for those works.



It's your point, you prove it.

I personally do not believe ALL saved and born again men ARE called to Do the same things.

1 Cor 12:
4: diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit

8: one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom: to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit.

9: To another faith by the same Spirit: to another the gift of healing by the same Spirit.

God Bless,
Taken

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Then it means you disagree with Jesus. The Father commaned us in the scriptures to listen to Jesus. Jesus onced asked, why call Him Lord and not do what He say to do? Jesus even said, if we don't listen to those whom He has sent out, they are not listing to Him, and and those who are not listing Him are not listing to the Father.

It's every child of God's responsibility to be preaching the kingdom of God, regardless of what gifts they were given.