Westboro Baptist Church

Episkopos said:

Define born-again.

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Why? You don't know? You didn't ask for a definition when you called 'faith in Christ and being born-again' nothing but 'human belief' and 'weird faith'.

But now you want a definition. Please... I gave you a definition already and you acted on it. Now you want another definition so as to weasel out of it in some way. Just say what you mean, don't be scared.

This is what you said. You consider the evangelical faith, faith in Jesus Christ resulting in being born-again' as 'human belief' and 'weird'. A typical Romanist view. In other words, not just Westboro, but all other evangelicals who believe the same.

Stranger

Episkopos said:

Here is a verse in the NT that shows that you don't understand...

Luke 1:5 There was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.
6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.

They were not even Christian...

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This does not contradict (Rom. 3:10). They were 'righteous before God' as all who are 'righteous before God' are. They placed faith in God, and God imputed righteousness to them.

All of mans righteousness is nothing but filthy rags. As (Rom. 3:10) says in quoting Isaiah.

Stranger

Stranger said:

This does not contradict (Rom. 3:10). They were 'righteous before God' as all who are 'righteous before God' are. They placed faith in God, and God imputed righteousness to them.

All of mans righteousness is nothing but filthy rags. As (Rom. 3:10) says in quoting Isaiah.

Stranger

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What? God didn't impute anything here. Luke declared they were righteous. That's because...he understood righteousness.

You can't see the contradiction because you don't yet understand righteousness.

Luke was talking about THEIR righteousness. God's righteousness had not been given yet as Jesus was not yet glorified.

Episkopos said:

What? God didn't impute anything here. Luke declared they were righteous. That's because...he understood righteousness.

You can't see the contradiction because you don't yet understand righteousness.

Luke was talking about THEIR righteousness. God's righteousness had not been given yet as Jesus was not yet glorified.

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So you're saying Luke contradicts Paul.

No, Luke says nothing of the sort. He says they were 'righteous before God'. You are not 'righteous before God' unless you are covered with the righteousness of God which is obtained by faith. They had faith, do you agree? Because they had faith, the righteousness they were covered in was the imputed righteousness of God.

So, explain the contradiction you have in (Luke 1:6) and (Rom. 3:10).

Stranger

Stranger said:

So you're saying Luke contradicts Paul.

No, Luke says nothing of the sort. He says they were 'righteous before God'. You are not 'righteous before God' unless you are covered with the righteousness of God which is obtained by faith. They had faith, do you agree? Because they had faith, the righteousness they were covered in was the imputed righteousness of God.

So, explain the contradiction you have in (Luke 1:6) and (Rom. 3:10).

Stranger

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You are trying to reconcile 2 ideas that you don't understand...by saying...I understand. You aren't here to learn anything that is plain.

In both cases we are talking about a human righteousness.

No one is as righteous as God is. IN COMPARISON our best efforts are like menstrual cloths.

But God, being merciful, doesn't expect more than the strength we have been given. He grades on a curve. So to whom much is given...more is required. But also to whom less is given...LESS is required, So then Zech and Elisabeth did what they did wholeheartedly in the best way they could.

Zech...was actually in unbelief when it came to matters outside his experience. So he was NOT in the righteousness of God...Which IS miraculous. Zechariah was a super down to earth guy that had difficulty with something men can't do. So he was blind for a while. Do you understand better? I didn't think so.

Zach and Elisabeth walked in their own righteousness which was seen as pleasing to God...in respect to their strength.

The righteousness of God is imparted to those who have forsaken their lives...emptied their vessels...to receive the life of Christ and live from there. It means walking as Jesus did...without spot or wrinkle.

Those who have walked with Jesus in Zion...know the amazing power that is His grace usward. It is an eternal intimacy...of love and peace.

Episkopos said:

You are trying to reconcile 2 ideas that you don't understand...by saying...I understand. You aren't here to learn anything that is plain.

In both cases we are talking about a human righteousness.

No one is as righteous as God is. IN COMPARISON our best efforts are like menstrual cloths.

But God, being merciful, doesn't expect more than the strength we have been given. He grades on a curve. So to whom much is given...more is required. But also to whom less is given...LESS is required, So then Zech and Elisabeth did what they did wholeheartedly in the best way they could.

Zech...was actually in unbelief when it came to matters outside his experience. So he was NOT in the righteousness of God...Which IS miraculous. Zechariah was a super down to earth guy that had difficulty with something men can't do. So he was blind for a while. Do you understand better? I didn't think so.

Zach and Elisabeth walked in their own righteousness which was seen as pleasing to God...in respect to their strength.

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I haven't seen anything of value to learn from you yet. When I do, you'll be the first to know.

Indeed, no one is as righteous as God is. That is why the need for imputed righteousness. No, God does not grade on a curve concerning righteousness.

You're dreaming stuff up now. Scripture is clear that Zacharias and Elisabeth were already 'righteous before God'. (Luke 1:6) There was no unbelief in him.

You had to add unbelief to Zacharias so as to negate the imputed righteousness of God. My, my, the lengths some will go.

Stranger

Episkopos said:

The righteousness of God is imparted to those who have forsaken their lives...emptied their vessels...to receive the life of Christ and live from there. It means walking as Jesus did...without spot or wrinkle.

Those who have walked with Jesus in Zion...know the amazing power that is His grace usward. It is an eternal intimacy...of love and peace.

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That is a lie straight out of hell. A man made works righteousness. Your righteousness, not God's. God's righteousness is never imparted due to your good works. Your good works stink. Your righteousness stinks.

Stranger

Stranger said:

That is a lie straight out of hell. A man made works righteousness. Your righteousness, not God's. God's righteousness is never imparted due to your good works. Your good works stink. Your righteousness stinks.

Stranger

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LOL This is a typical religious answer that denies the power of the righteousness of God...reducing everything to religion...

When Jesus said...without Me you can do nothing. \Why don't religious people refuse to believe that people can lift a briefcase...without Christ?

So people aren't so foolish...in that way.

But they are for righteousness.

Jesus meant...without Me you can't do anything ETERNAL.

LIKEWISE the righteousness of God is to do the things that are ETERNAL.

But you will not understand this...instead you will send me to hell in your ignorance.

Episkopos said:

LOL This is a typical religious answer that denies the power of the righteousness of God...reducing everything to religion...

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Typical answers from you. If it disagrees with you then it is just 'religion'. Yet you offer nothing to disprove it. What you have said is a lie.

Stranger

It has become quite clear to me that the whole purpose of this thread is to establish the Westboro Church as a hate group. And then make that link to all evangelical churches as the Westboro Church is a Protestant evangelical church. In other words, they are using 'Westboro' for evangelicals just like they use 'Nazi' for anything white.

And of course they have the answer to all of this. It is to love everyone. To do good. Don't be as concerned with doctrine. It's all about you loving and doing and feeling good.

Stranger

Stranger said:

It has become quite clear to me that the whole purpose of this thread is to establish the Westboro Church as a hate group. And then make that link to all evangelical churches as the Westboro Church is a Protestant evangelical church. In other words, they are using 'Westboro' for evangelicals just like they use 'Nazi' for anything white.

And of course they have the answer to all of this. It is to love everyone. To do good. Don't be as concerned with doctrine. It's all about you loving and doing and feeling good.

Stranger

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Imagine wanting people to love everyone? Commies.

Episkopos said:

Imagine wanting people to love everyone? Commies.

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You can love all the people you want but it does nothing to obtain the righteousness of God. Do all the good works you want, your righteousness still stinks. And none of your good works affects God in covering you with His righteousness. So, go ahead and 'imagine' all you want. But your imagination is equally at odds with God.

Stranger

Actually No one is expecting you Stranger to be anything but a bulwark against love and goodness.

Stranger said:

You can love all the people you want but it does nothing to obtain the righteousness of God. Do all the good works you want, your righteousness still stinks. And none of your good works affects God in covering you with His righteousness. So, go ahead and 'imagine' all you want. But your imagination is equally at odds with God.

Stranger

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The righteousness of God is attainable by grace through faith. You must try this...

Episkopos said:

The righteousness of God is attainable by grace through faith. You must try this...

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That contradicts what you said in post (#66). So, which is it?

Stranger

Episkopos said:

Actually No one is expecting you Stranger to be anything but a bulwark against love and goodness.

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I am against this so-called pseudo-love for mankind. Which is nothing but a work of the flesh. And then using that pseudo-love as barometer to use for Christians. To say if they don't love everyone, which of course means especially them and those like them, then how can they claim to be Christian. Nauseous.

Stranger

Stranger said:

That contradicts what you said in post (#66). So, which is it?

Stranger

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Only to you...because you seriously don't understand what you are spewing about. I am magnifying the Lord and HIS righteousness. You have lowered it to something you think you already have...which is as plain as day....you have never known.

But you can learn...well...it is possible.

if you let go your bigotry...you could profit by being on the forum.

Stranger said:

I am against this so-called pseudo-love for mankind. Which is nothing but a work of the flesh. And then using that pseudo-love as barometer to use for Christians. To say if they don't love everyone, which of course means especially them and those like them, then how can they claim to be Christian. Nauseous.

Stranger

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Are you part of the "organization"...in the southern states?

Episkopos said:

I am seeing what is in the church...and find you there curiously haunting the place with your judgment of the world.

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You're non-osas correct?

Gal 2:4 This matter arose because some false believers had infiltrated our ranks to spy on the freedom we have in Christ Jesus and to make us slaves.