Eternal Security

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justbyfaith

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You are interpreting the scripture based on your preconceived bias.

Also, Have you considered that in calling YHWH His Father, Jesus was making Himself equal with God according to the apostle John (in John 5:18)?
 

Rollo Tamasi

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I see you are still deceived by using "The" in front of those titles even though it is not found in the Hebrew text. Jehu's name means "He is Yah" or "Yah is He". Does that indicate to you that he is YHWH? Yeshua is a "mighty el"/"mighty warrior"/ "powerful warrior" and a host of other ways "el gibbor" can be translated. He CANNOT be "The Mighty God" because there is only one true God which is what using a capital "G" and the article "The" would denote. And even if you refuse to use the correct Hebrew translation of "father of eternity", Yeshua can still be consider a "father" since he has "seed" (Isaiah 53:10) and he will live forever.

You want me to believe Yeshua is God based on handful of verses that erroneously use "God" with a capital "G" when referring to him. Yet, you will ignore almost 100 verses that use the word "Son" when referring to him which shows he is NOT his own father. You also ignore another 58 verses where Yeshua calls YHWH "my Father" indicating he is NOT YHWH. Not to mention all the times Yeshua's Father is called the God of Abraham...or that Yeshua calls "my God".

You continue on in your deceived state worshiping your God/Man and I'll stick to "worshiping" the Son of God.
So, do you believe in eternal security or not?

aBible.com

Isaiah 12:2 (KJV) Behold, God is my salvation; I will trust,
and not be afraid: for the Lord Jehovah is my strength and my song;
he also is become my salvation.

Isaiah 45:22 (KJV) Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends
of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.

Luke 2:11 (KJV) For unto you is born this day in the city of
David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

Acts 4:12 (KJV) Neither is there salvation in any other: for
there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must
be saved.

It seems only God can save, yet the Bible says Jesus saves.
 
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gadar perets

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You are interpreting the scripture based on your preconceived bias.

Also, Have you considered that in calling YHWH His Father, Jesus was making Himself equal with God according to the apostle John (in John 5:18)?
Yes, I have considered that and reject it as a faulty belief by those Jews who believed that. The Scriptures clearly tell us there is no equality between the Father and the Son. The Father (God/YHWH) is the "head of Messiah" (1 Corinthians 11:3). Consider Yeshua's own words in John 14:28, "...for my Father is greater than I."; John 10:29, "My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all..."; and John 13:16, "Verily, verily, I say unto you, The servant [Yeshua] is not greater than his lord [Father YHWH]; neither he that is sent [Yeshua] greater than he that sent him [Father YHWH]."
 

gadar perets

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So, do you believe in eternal security or not?

aBible.com

Isaiah 12:2 (KJV) Behold, God is my salvation; I will trust,
and not be afraid: for the Lord Jehovah is my strength and my song;
he also is become my salvation.

Isaiah 45:22 (KJV) Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends
of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.

Luke 2:11 (KJV) For unto you is born this day in the city of
David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

Acts 4:12 (KJV) Neither is there salvation in any other: for
there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must
be saved.

It seems only God can save, yet the Bible says Jesus saves.
Thanks for this nonjudgmental post.

I believe in eternal security as long as one remains in Messiah Yeshua. Once a person renounces him as their Saviour, they are lost forever. It is NOT that such people were never really IN Messiah. I know several people that truly loved him until the day they came to believe he was not the true Messiah of Scripture.

As for the Scriptures you posted, where they meant to prove eternal security or to prove Jesus is God? If the latter, then I suggest you review the post I made showing we have two Saviours. YHWH is the ultimate Saviour of all mankind and He saves us through His Son Yeshua whom He appointed to that role. If it wasn't for YHWH, we would not have Yeshua as our Saviour.
 

Rollo Tamasi

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Thanks for this nonjudgmental post.

I believe in eternal security as long as one remains in Messiah Yeshua. Once a person renounces him as their Saviour, they are lost forever. It is NOT that such people were never really IN Messiah. I know several people that truly loved him until the day they came to believe he was not the true Messiah of Scripture.

As for the Scriptures you posted, where they meant to prove eternal security or to prove Jesus is God? If the latter, then I suggest you review the post I made showing we have two Saviours. YHWH is the ultimate Saviour of all mankind and He saves us through His Son Yeshua whom He appointed to that role. If it wasn't for YHWH, we would not have Yeshua as our Saviour.
You're all messed up.
That group of yours has done a number on you
 

justbyfaith

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Yes, I have considered that and reject it as a faulty belief by those Jews who believed that.

It was the belief of the apostle John, which he penned under the inspiration of the Holy Ghost.

The Scriptures clearly tell us there is no equality between the Father and the Son. The Father (God/YHWH) is the "head of Messiah" (1 Corinthians 11:3).

Yes, Jesus is subordinate to the Father as being the continuation of Him in human flesh because He Himself came to set the example of what it means to be a subject of the kingdom.

Consider Yeshua's own words in John 14:28, "...for my Father is greater than I."; John 10:29,

Indeed, Jesus was less than the Father in His humanity (John 14:28), but equal in His Deity (John 5:18). I have already mentioned this. The doctrine is called the hypostatic union; it is the concept that Jesus is 100% God and 100% Man. Of course in His humanity He is not Omnipresent and has emptied Himself of some of the attributes of Deity (see Philippians chapter 2). But He is still the same Person who inhabited eternity as the Everlasting Father; only now He exists in a body of human flesh.

"My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all..."; and John 13:16, "Verily, verily, I say unto you, The servant [Yeshua] is not greater than his lord [Father YHWH]; neither he that is sent [Yeshua] greater than he that sent him [Father YHWH]."

You failed to give a scripture reference for these last two; so I decline to comment; except that I believe the first scripture mentioned has within its context the Lord Jesus saying, "I and my Father are One;" and the second reference does not have in the text what you included in brackets. Were you referring to Luke 6:40?
 
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gadar perets

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You failed to give a scripture reference for these last two; so I decline to comment; except that I believe the first scripture mentioned has within its context the Lord Jesus saying, "I and my Father are One;" and the second reference does not have in the text what you included in brackets. Were you referring to Luke 6:40?
I gave you the reference, John 13:16. You even quoted my reference, but failed to read it in your haste to refute my post.
 

justbyfaith

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I gave you the reference, John 13:16. You even quoted my reference, but failed to read it in your haste to refute my post.
Indeed, John 13:16 is talking about Jesus being the Lord of the disciples and not what you interpreted it to be.
 

justbyfaith

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I gave you the reference, John 13:16. You even quoted my reference, but failed to read it in your haste to refute my post.
Okay, my bad. Somehow the reference (John 10:29) ended up being on the end of the previous thing and I didn't notice it because of that (I normally expect the reference to be on the end of the quote rather than before it).
 

justbyfaith

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Thanks for this nonjudgmental post.

I believe in eternal security as long as one remains in Messiah Yeshua. Once a person renounces him as their Saviour, they are lost forever. It is NOT that such people were never really IN Messiah. I know several people that truly loved him until the day they came to believe he was not the true Messiah of Scripture.

As for the Scriptures you posted, where they meant to prove eternal security or to prove Jesus is God? If the latter, then I suggest you review the post I made showing we have two Saviours. YHWH is the ultimate Saviour of all mankind and He saves us through His Son Yeshua whom He appointed to that role. If it wasn't for YHWH, we would not have Yeshua as our Saviour.
There is only one name given that saves, of a Saviour. Is that name Jehovah or Jesus?

Why doesn't Jehovah make His own name the name that saves if He is a Saviour apart from Jesus?
 

APAK

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Concerning our Holy and Divine God Almighty, the sole source and author and savior of our salvation (His WORD), and his 100% human being, later made immortal, his Son, Jesus Christ, the 100% human instrument of His WORD through his (the Father's) spirit; the perfect sinless sacrifice for our salvation...John 1:1-3 and 14

(Joh 14:28) Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I. (KJV)

Jesus the son of God is not as great as his Father, ever, in this world or the next age. The Father is always greater in many ways, including his power (the Almighty), omnipotence, foreknowledge, love, wisdom and the sole creator of all; including his son.

Those that do not believe that Jesus was born a human being, a 100% man (no incarnation mentioned at all - of a previous deity status, or an earthly deity status, of an impossible dual nature or a demi-god) as the son of God, opposes in spirit and mind, Jesus Christ and his spiritual presence, and therefore the Father’s presence by extension.

(Joh 5:18) Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself (as they thought- who could blame these 'blinded' men, and they were of course wrong in their assessment) equal with God. (KJV)

The Pharisees said that Jesus was making himself equal with his Father, as he said he was the son of God. Of course, Jesus never did say he was equal in power or he is/was or I am he, at all. They thought that because he was calling himself God’s son, he was also believing he was equal in all ways as God. And of course again, Jesus never did make this comparison, ever. They never believed he was God himself only that he may have the same power and authority, somehow. Many professing Christians are behind the same veil of 'blindness' today as the Pharisees, and therefore do not know the real Jesus Christ.

Blessings,

APAK
 

gadar perets

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There is only one name given that saves, of a Saviour. Is that name Jehovah or Jesus?
Neither. YHWH and Yeshua both save. Reread my post concerning who our Saviour is.

Why doesn't Jehovah make His own name the name that saves if He is a Saviour apart from Jesus?
He has. The problem is, you read the Son into those texts making the real YHWH non-existant.