"The Lord's Day" Revelation 1:10*10ἐγενόμην ἐν πνεύματι ἐν τῃ̂ κυριακῃ̂ ἡμέρᾳ καὶ ἤκουσα ὀπίσω μου φωνὴν μεγάλην ὡς σάλπιγγος [1][1] Black, Matthew ; Martini, Carlo M. ; Metzger, Bruce M. ; Wikgren, Allen: The Greek New Testament. Third edition (Corrected). Federal Republic of Germany : United Bible Societies, 1983John’s unique use in the New Testament (1:10) of the dative expression, the Lord ’s Day ( τῃ̂ κυριακῃ̂ ἡμέρᾳ), appears to be influenced by the repeated use of the similar dative expression that day ( ἐκείνῃ τῃ̂ ἡμέρᾳ) in the Septuagint (LXX), to designate the day of the Lord (Zech 12-14, etc.). This observation seems to have been overlooked by those who insist that John’s use of Lord's day refers to Sunday (Thomas, Osborne). John likely would have been quite familiar with the dative construction of that day from the Septuagint (Zech 12:8 ἐκείνῃ τῃ̂ ἡμέρᾳ) and could have quite easily penned the dative Lord's day instead of that day, with the same intended eschatological meaning, having just been confronted with a vision of the glorified Christ. Indeed, John had just finished quoting Zechariah 12:10 (Rev 1:7) where we find a passage (Zech 12-14) with repeated use of that day (LXX) referring to the day when the Lord comes. The context of Chapter One: (1:1) "revelation of Jesus Christ...", (1:7) "Behold He is coming with the clouds...", (1:8) "the One who is to come...", point to "Lord's day" as John's choice of words to describe the eschatological day of the Lord. To propose, as some do, that John would believe it necessary to reveal what day of the week he received the Revelation, and leave out the time frame for the events, is without precedent among God's prophets. Some might object to this assertion and point out that John was writing "Sunday" in much the same way he had just written that he was "on the island called Patmos," just as unnecessary a detail to include as saying it was "Sunday." However, John's epistolary remarks in verse nine set the stage for the dramatic contrast in verse ten, that he went from being a prisoner on an island called Patmos, to present in the Spirit in the day of the Lord. The fact that Lord's Day is preceded by in the Spirit (ἐν πνεύματι) also tends to point the meaning in the direction of the day of the Lord. John uses the phrase in the Spirit four times, 1:10, 4:2, 17:3, 21:10. Each use introduces or is followed by John being transported to a place, or shown a vision, inaccessible to him under normal circumstances. Why would John find it necessary to tell us that such was necessary to get to a day of the week? Lord's Day clearly follows in the Spirit and is separate and distinct from John's remarks in verse nine. Any attempt to pluck Lord's Day away from its position and relation to in the Spirit in 1:10 appears to introduce an inconsistent exegesis of the text (ἐν πνεύματι). Certainly of importance is the additional fact that following John's notice that he was in the Spirit in the Lord's day, John immediately begins presenting information about the coming of the Lord, the day of the Lord. First, Jesus speaks to His churches, warning and encouraging them about His coming, and then, the events preceding, attending, and following His coming are revealed. [It is noteworthy that, just as the coming of Christ is announced with a trumpet (1 Thess. 4:16; Matt.24:31), so is all that John reveals to us here (Rev. 1:10).] The Lord's Day expression is never used in the Bible to designate Sunday, the Sabbath, or a day of the week meant for worship (unless, as Mounce, p. 76, and others argue, this is the meaning here). Thomas (vol. 1, p. 91) suggests that this is possibly "the first use of this name for Sunday." But all the writers of the New Testament who made any reference to Sunday, including Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, and Paul, designated Sunday exclusively with the phrase "first day of the week" (cf. Mt. 28:1, Mk. 16:2, 9; Lk. 24:1, John 20:1, 19; Acts 20:7; 1 Cor 16:2). Thomas (ibid.) says the Lord's Day is used "a short time after the writing of the Apocalypse" to designate Sunday. But, a check of his sources raises questions about this conclusion. The Didache (14:1) has the word for Lord, but does not have the word day, the expression under discussion does not appear. Ignatius' Epistle to the Magnesians, in a similar style, simply has the word Lord, but not day. The Gospel of Peter (Evangelia Petri) likewise makes no mention of day. Melito of Sardis (165-175 AD) is claimed by Eusebius to have written a paper entitled, The Lord's Day, but again the word for day does not actually appear in the title, and the contents of the book have not survived for our examination. And the time when Melito wrote, between 165-175 AD, is certainly not "a short time" after John wrote the book of Revelation, especially if the early dating of Revelation proves to be true. The argument for Lord's Day meaning Sunday would be far more persuasive if the evidence for the use of the term pre-dated John's use in 1:10. [Note: "Etymology is not particularly helpful as a guide to the meaning of a term in any given context. Semantic context is the more reliable guide." Reference Manual for New Testament Interpretation (© various). This document reflects the latest edition of a variety of sources prepared or employed by various professors who have taught New Testament exegesis at Gordon-Conwell Theological Seminary over many years.] Later in church history (as in our day) Christians would refer to Sunday, or the day set aside for worship, as "the Lord's day." However, "the day of the Lord," "that day," and "the day" are used throughout the Bible to designate the eschatological day of the Lord, the event when the Lord Jesus comes again. John is saying that the Revelation he received pertained to the time concerning the events surrounding the coming of the Lord Jesus. The observation (Thomas, op. cit.) that John uses the dative of Lord (adjectival, "Lord's day") contributes nothing to his argument that the meaning is Sunday. The genitive is the customary case for adjectives; the dative for adverbs (Wallace, p.76). Peter, using the genitive as John uses the dative, writes (2 Peter 3:12), "God's Day," της του θεου ἡμέρας an adjectival use of God in the genitive with the noun day. This is especially noteworthy in that Peter uses this construction as a synonymous way of stating "the day of the Lord," which he had referenced in the same passage (ἡμέρα κυρίου 2 Peter 3:10). Walvoord says, "The adjectival form can be explained on the ground that in the Old Testament there was no adjectival form for "Lord," and therefore the noun had to be used" (p.42). Nothing from history, or from the way John uses the Greek language, compels us to conclude that by "Lord's day," he meant anything different than "day of the Lord." Kittel observes, "A genitive του κυρίου might have been used instead of the adjective." [Gerhard Kittel, Editor. Theological Dictionary of the New Testament, Vol. 3 (Grand Rapids, 1976), p.1096] The attempts to import the later future meaning of this phrase, "Sunday," into the present context is an example of the exegetical fallacy (Carson, p. 32) described as "semantic anachronism." The reader should refer to Carson's discussion of μάρτυς (Rev. 2:13). If John wished to communicate to his readers the day of the week on which he received the Revelation, we would not expect him to select a term which was virtually unheard of as a designation for a day of the week. It still remains a fact that no historical document establishes "Lord's Day" as a designation for any day of the week up to the time of the writing of the Revelation. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------It still remains a fact that no historical document establishes "Lord's Day" as a designation for any day of the week up to the time of the writing of the Revelation. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------It is especially critical to note that at the outset John is giving us the time frame of the events and revelation he is about to show his readers. All that follows is to be found in the Lord's Day. Compromising this point has resulted in the mess we are in today with all the different suggestions for other time frames for the events portrayed in the Revelation given us by John. Please prayerfully consider re-thinking and changing your position if yours is different. Remember the warning at the end of the book.
Lord's Day is Day of The Lord
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It is especially critical to note that at the outset John is giving us the time frame of the events and revelation he is about to show his readers. All that follows is to be found in the Lord's Day. Compromising this point has resulted in the mess we are in today with all the different suggestions for other time frames for the events portrayed in the Revelation given us by John. Please prayerfully consider re-thinking and changing your position if yours is different. Remember the warning at the end of the book.
(Emphasis added) Copied from : http://expressright.com/day.aspxThis is simply not true. All that follows is NOT a part of the day of the Lord. The seven churches existed in John's day, and John's letters were surely delivered to them as soon as they were written: again, events not in the "day of the Lord."In fact, the John does not get to the "day of the Lord," until after the 6th seal, as seen in this verse:Rev 616 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?Therefore, it is certain that John was only telling them that he was in the spirit on a Sunday. There is nothing unusual about that. Daniel gives the day of the month that a vision happened.Dan 104 And in the four and twentieth day of the first month, as I was by the side of the great river, which is Hiddekel; 5 Then I lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and behold a certain man clothed in linen, whose loins were girded with fine gold of Uphaz:Ezekiel does the same:Ezekiel 1 1 Now it came to pass in the thirtieth year, in the fourth month, in the fifth day of the month, as I was among the captives by the river of Chebar, that the heavens were opened, and I saw visions of God. Coop
(Emphasis added) Copied from : http://expressright.com/day.aspxThis is simply not true. All that follows is NOT a part of the day of the Lord. The seven churches existed in John's day, and John's letters were surely delivered to them as soon as they were written: again, events not in the "day of the Lord."In fact, the John does not get to the "day of the Lord," until after the 6th seal, as seen in this verse:Rev 616 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?Therefore, it is certain that John was only telling them that he was in the spirit on a Sunday. There is nothing unusual about that. Daniel gives the day of the month that a vision happened.Dan 104 And in the four and twentieth day of the first month, as I was by the side of the great river, which is Hiddekel; 5 Then I lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and behold a certain man clothed in linen, whose loins were girded with fine gold of Uphaz:Ezekiel does the same:Ezekiel 1 1 Now it came to pass in the thirtieth year, in the fourth month, in the fifth day of the month, as I was among the captives by the river of Chebar, that the heavens were opened, and I saw visions of God. Coop
(lecoop;50419)
(Emphasis added) Copied from : http://expressright.com/day.aspxThis is simply not true. All that follows is NOT a part of the day of the Lord. The seven churches existed in John's day, and John's letters were surely delivered to them as soon as they were written: again, events not in the "day of the Lord."In fact, the John does not get to the "day of the Lord," until after the 6th seal, as seen in this verse:Rev 616 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?Therefore, it is certain that John was only telling them that he was in the spirit on a Sunday. There is nothing unusual about that. Daniel gives the day of the month that a vision happened.Dan 104 And in the four and twentieth day of the first month, as I was by the side of the great river, which is Hiddekel; 5 Then I lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and behold a certain man clothed in linen, whose loins were girded with fine gold of Uphaz:Ezekiel does the same:Ezekiel 1 1 Now it came to pass in the thirtieth year, in the fourth month, in the fifth day of the month, as I was among the captives by the river of Chebar, that the heavens were opened, and I saw visions of God. Coop
first of all John was having a vision he was taken to the day of Lord that happens at the 7th and last trump he was looking back in time to him. to us its future. Secondly yes the churches really existed but they were types of the churches that would come. Have you ever heard there is nothing new under the sun? God teaches in types most everything had preceeding type that does not mean it wont happen again or represent something else.Just as Jonah three days in the Whale was a type of Jesus to come. The bible is full of them.Revelation 1:10 "I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,"This verse is the key to understanding the book of Revelation. Without a clear and full understanding of it, the entire book just will not make sense. The sequence of order will seem strange. "I"; this is John speaking and telling us where he was. "I was in the Spirit", not in his flesh body; "on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet". John is taken forward in time, "in the Spirit", to the day of the Lord. The "Day of the Lord" is not referring to Sunday or Saturday. This is the same "Day of the Lord" Paul speaks about in I Thessalonians 5:2, as "coming as a thief in the night". Later in II Thessalonians 2:2-3 Paul makes it clear that at the "Day of the Lord" Christ's return will not happen until "after there will be a great falling away first; and "that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition". Satan must be revealed in his role as the Antichrist first, before that seventh trumpet can sound, the last trumpet.
(Emphasis added) Copied from : http://expressright.com/day.aspxThis is simply not true. All that follows is NOT a part of the day of the Lord. The seven churches existed in John's day, and John's letters were surely delivered to them as soon as they were written: again, events not in the "day of the Lord."In fact, the John does not get to the "day of the Lord," until after the 6th seal, as seen in this verse:Rev 616 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?Therefore, it is certain that John was only telling them that he was in the spirit on a Sunday. There is nothing unusual about that. Daniel gives the day of the month that a vision happened.Dan 104 And in the four and twentieth day of the first month, as I was by the side of the great river, which is Hiddekel; 5 Then I lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and behold a certain man clothed in linen, whose loins were girded with fine gold of Uphaz:Ezekiel does the same:Ezekiel 1 1 Now it came to pass in the thirtieth year, in the fourth month, in the fifth day of the month, as I was among the captives by the river of Chebar, that the heavens were opened, and I saw visions of God. Coop
first of all John was having a vision he was taken to the day of Lord that happens at the 7th and last trump he was looking back in time to him. to us its future. Secondly yes the churches really existed but they were types of the churches that would come. Have you ever heard there is nothing new under the sun? God teaches in types most everything had preceeding type that does not mean it wont happen again or represent something else.Just as Jonah three days in the Whale was a type of Jesus to come. The bible is full of them.Revelation 1:10 "I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,"This verse is the key to understanding the book of Revelation. Without a clear and full understanding of it, the entire book just will not make sense. The sequence of order will seem strange. "I"; this is John speaking and telling us where he was. "I was in the Spirit", not in his flesh body; "on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet". John is taken forward in time, "in the Spirit", to the day of the Lord. The "Day of the Lord" is not referring to Sunday or Saturday. This is the same "Day of the Lord" Paul speaks about in I Thessalonians 5:2, as "coming as a thief in the night". Later in II Thessalonians 2:2-3 Paul makes it clear that at the "Day of the Lord" Christ's return will not happen until "after there will be a great falling away first; and "that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition". Satan must be revealed in his role as the Antichrist first, before that seventh trumpet can sound, the last trumpet.
(kriss;50424)
first of all John was having a vision he was taken to the day of Lord that happens at the 7th and last trump he was looking back in time to him. to us its future. Secondly yes the churches really existed but they were types of the churches that would come. Have you ever heard there is nothing new under the sun? God teaches in types most everything had preceeding type that does not mean it wont happen again or represent something else.Just as Jonah three days in the Whale was a type of Jesus to come. The bible is full of them.Revelation 1:10 "I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,"This verse is the key to understanding the book of Revelation. Without a clear and full understanding of it, the entire book just will not make sense. The sequence of order will seem strange. "I"; this is John speaking and telling us where he was. "I was in the Spirit", not in his flesh body; "on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet". John is taken forward in time, "in the Spirit", to the day of the Lord. The "Day of the Lord" is not referring to Sunday or Saturday. This is the same "Day of the Lord" Paul speaks about in I Thessalonians 5:2, as "coming as a thief in the night". Later in II Thessalonians 2:2-3 Paul makes it clear that at the "Day of the Lord" Christ's return will not happen until "after there will be a great falling away first; and "that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition". Satan must be revealed in his role as the Antichrist first, before that seventh trumpet can sound, the last trumpet.
Sorry, but this is pitiful exegesis. neither does any comentary I found agree with you.
Jamieson, Fausset & Brown on the Lord's day--Though forcibly detained from Church communion with the brethren in the sanctuary on the Lord's day, the weekly commemoration of the resurrection, John was holding spiritual communion with them. This is the earliest mention of the term, "the Lord's day."The theory that the day of Christ's second coming is meant, is untenable. "The day of the Lord" is different in the Greek from "the Lord's (an adjective) day," which latter in the ancient Church always designates our Sunday,
Matthew Henry3. The day and time in which he had this vision: it was the Lord’s day, the day which Christ had separated and set apart for himself, as the eucharist is called the Lord’s supper. Surely this can be no other than the Christian sabbath, the first day of the week, to be observed in remembrance of the resurrection of Christ. Let us who call him our Lord honour him on his own day, the day which the Lord hath made and in which we ought to rejoice. 4. The frame that his soul was in at this time: He was in the Spirit. He was not only in a rapture when he received the vision, but before he received it; he was in a serious, heavenly, spiritual frame, under the blessed gracious influences of the Spirit of God. God usually prepares the souls of his people for uncommon manifestations of himself, by the quickening sanctifying influences of his good Spirit. Those who would enjoy communion with God on the Lord’s day must endeavour to abstract their thoughts and affections from flesh and fleshly things, and be wholly taken up with things of a spiritual nature.
John Gill's Exposition of the BibleI was in the Spirit on the Lord's day…Not on the Jewish sabbath, which was now abolished, nor was that ever called the Lord's day, and had John meant that, he would have said on the sabbath day; much less the Jewish passover, but the first day of the week is designed; ....Justin Martyr F26 tells us, who lived within about fifty years after this time, that on the day called (th tou) (hliou hmera) , "Sunday", (by the Greeks,) the Christians met together in one place, and read the Scriptures, and prayed together, and administered the ordinance of the supper; and this, he adds, was the first day in which God created the World, and our Saviour Jesus Christ rose from the dead; yea, Barnabas F1, the companion of the Apostle Paul, calls this day the eighth day, in distinction from the seventh day sabbath of the Jews, and which he says is the beginning of another world; and therefore we keep the eighth day, adds he, joyfully, in which Jesus rose from the dead, and being manifested, ascended unto heaven: and this day was known by the ancients by the name of "the Lord's day"; as by Ignatius F2, Irenaeus F3, Tertullian F4, Origen F5, and others;
Geneva Study BibleThen at what time, and by what means, namely, by the Spirit and the word, and that on the Lord’s day, which ever since the resurrection of Christ, was consecrated for Christians: that is to say, to be a day of rest, as in (Revelation 1:10) Thirdly, who is the author that calls him, and what is the sum of his calling. (g) Patmos is one of the islands of Sporas, where John was banished according to some historians. 1:10 I was in the h Spirit on the i Lord’s day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, (h) This is a holy trance expressed, with which the prophets were entranced, and being carried out of the world, conversed with God: and so Ezekiel says often, that he was carried from place to place by the Spirit, and that the Spirit of the Lord came on him. (i) He calls it the Lord’s day, which Paul calls the first day of the week;
PEOPLES NEW TESTAMENT 10. I was in the Spirit. Was lifted to that spiritual exaltation in which revelations are given. On the Lord's day. The day of the Lord's Resurrection, the first day of the week. In the earlier apostolic writings the day was called "the first day of the week," but by the close of the century it began to be called "the Lord's day," as here. Epistles of Barnabas, Ignatius and Dionysius, written near this time, so style it, and the name is of common occurrence from this time onward, and is confined to Sunday. It is not confounded with the "Sabbath day" of many centuries.
It is also clear that you have no idea where John actually shows the start of the "day of the Lord." I would suggest that you read Isaiah 2:19-21, then read what happens at the 6th seal. Then read Joel 2:31, and again, compare with the events of the 6th seal. I will even help:Isa 210 Enter into the rock, and hide thee in the dust, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty. 11 The lofty looks of man shall be humbled, and the haughtiness of men shall be bowed down, and the LORD alone shall be exalted in that day. 12 For the day of the LORD of hosts shall be upon every one that is proud and lofty, and upon every one that is lifted up; and he shall be brought low: ...19 And they shall go into the holes of the rocks, and into the caves of the earth, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth. 20 In that day a man shall cast his idols of silver, and his idols of gold, which they made each one for himself to worship, to the moles and to the bats; 21 To go into the clefts of the rocks, and into the tops of the ragged rocks, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth.Joel 231 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and terrible day of the LORD come. Rev 612 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; ...15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; 16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?The breaking of the 6th seal, is the final fulfillment of these two prophecies - showing us clearly (if one can read without preconcieved glasses) that the start of the day of the Lord will take place at the 7th seal."the key to understanding the book of Revelation" is revelation knowledge: receiving from the Lord, just as Paul did on many occasions. I do not believe your theory: "Without a clear and full understanding of it, the entire book just will not make sense. The sequence of order will seem strange." You are the one that wants to "rearrange" John's God given chronology. The book makes sense to me, believing that John was "in the Spirit" on a Sunday.Sorry, But at this time, John was not taken forward in time. He was only "in the Spirit." This does NOT mean that he was out of his body. It just means that his spirit man was above his flesh, and in control. He was seeing and hearing in the realm of the spirit. I have been there, "in the spirit" several times. In fact, one time was when the Holy Spirit came to me speaking, about how I could find the exact midpoint of the 70th week, (and the entire 70th week) "clearly marked" in Revelation. It was as if I was a bystander, as I listened to my spirit and the Holy Spirit speak to each other.The very next verse tells us that he was still very much in his own time zone, so to speak:Rev 1:11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea. I do not think Paul would agree with your take on 2 Thes 2, either. He is not saying what you think he is saying.Coop
first of all John was having a vision he was taken to the day of Lord that happens at the 7th and last trump he was looking back in time to him. to us its future. Secondly yes the churches really existed but they were types of the churches that would come. Have you ever heard there is nothing new under the sun? God teaches in types most everything had preceeding type that does not mean it wont happen again or represent something else.Just as Jonah three days in the Whale was a type of Jesus to come. The bible is full of them.Revelation 1:10 "I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,"This verse is the key to understanding the book of Revelation. Without a clear and full understanding of it, the entire book just will not make sense. The sequence of order will seem strange. "I"; this is John speaking and telling us where he was. "I was in the Spirit", not in his flesh body; "on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet". John is taken forward in time, "in the Spirit", to the day of the Lord. The "Day of the Lord" is not referring to Sunday or Saturday. This is the same "Day of the Lord" Paul speaks about in I Thessalonians 5:2, as "coming as a thief in the night". Later in II Thessalonians 2:2-3 Paul makes it clear that at the "Day of the Lord" Christ's return will not happen until "after there will be a great falling away first; and "that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition". Satan must be revealed in his role as the Antichrist first, before that seventh trumpet can sound, the last trumpet.
Sorry, but this is pitiful exegesis. neither does any comentary I found agree with you.
Jamieson, Fausset & Brown on the Lord's day--Though forcibly detained from Church communion with the brethren in the sanctuary on the Lord's day, the weekly commemoration of the resurrection, John was holding spiritual communion with them. This is the earliest mention of the term, "the Lord's day."The theory that the day of Christ's second coming is meant, is untenable. "The day of the Lord" is different in the Greek from "the Lord's (an adjective) day," which latter in the ancient Church always designates our Sunday,
Matthew Henry3. The day and time in which he had this vision: it was the Lord’s day, the day which Christ had separated and set apart for himself, as the eucharist is called the Lord’s supper. Surely this can be no other than the Christian sabbath, the first day of the week, to be observed in remembrance of the resurrection of Christ. Let us who call him our Lord honour him on his own day, the day which the Lord hath made and in which we ought to rejoice. 4. The frame that his soul was in at this time: He was in the Spirit. He was not only in a rapture when he received the vision, but before he received it; he was in a serious, heavenly, spiritual frame, under the blessed gracious influences of the Spirit of God. God usually prepares the souls of his people for uncommon manifestations of himself, by the quickening sanctifying influences of his good Spirit. Those who would enjoy communion with God on the Lord’s day must endeavour to abstract their thoughts and affections from flesh and fleshly things, and be wholly taken up with things of a spiritual nature.
John Gill's Exposition of the BibleI was in the Spirit on the Lord's day…Not on the Jewish sabbath, which was now abolished, nor was that ever called the Lord's day, and had John meant that, he would have said on the sabbath day; much less the Jewish passover, but the first day of the week is designed; ....Justin Martyr F26 tells us, who lived within about fifty years after this time, that on the day called (th tou) (hliou hmera) , "Sunday", (by the Greeks,) the Christians met together in one place, and read the Scriptures, and prayed together, and administered the ordinance of the supper; and this, he adds, was the first day in which God created the World, and our Saviour Jesus Christ rose from the dead; yea, Barnabas F1, the companion of the Apostle Paul, calls this day the eighth day, in distinction from the seventh day sabbath of the Jews, and which he says is the beginning of another world; and therefore we keep the eighth day, adds he, joyfully, in which Jesus rose from the dead, and being manifested, ascended unto heaven: and this day was known by the ancients by the name of "the Lord's day"; as by Ignatius F2, Irenaeus F3, Tertullian F4, Origen F5, and others;
Geneva Study BibleThen at what time, and by what means, namely, by the Spirit and the word, and that on the Lord’s day, which ever since the resurrection of Christ, was consecrated for Christians: that is to say, to be a day of rest, as in (Revelation 1:10) Thirdly, who is the author that calls him, and what is the sum of his calling. (g) Patmos is one of the islands of Sporas, where John was banished according to some historians. 1:10 I was in the h Spirit on the i Lord’s day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, (h) This is a holy trance expressed, with which the prophets were entranced, and being carried out of the world, conversed with God: and so Ezekiel says often, that he was carried from place to place by the Spirit, and that the Spirit of the Lord came on him. (i) He calls it the Lord’s day, which Paul calls the first day of the week;
PEOPLES NEW TESTAMENT 10. I was in the Spirit. Was lifted to that spiritual exaltation in which revelations are given. On the Lord's day. The day of the Lord's Resurrection, the first day of the week. In the earlier apostolic writings the day was called "the first day of the week," but by the close of the century it began to be called "the Lord's day," as here. Epistles of Barnabas, Ignatius and Dionysius, written near this time, so style it, and the name is of common occurrence from this time onward, and is confined to Sunday. It is not confounded with the "Sabbath day" of many centuries.
It is also clear that you have no idea where John actually shows the start of the "day of the Lord." I would suggest that you read Isaiah 2:19-21, then read what happens at the 6th seal. Then read Joel 2:31, and again, compare with the events of the 6th seal. I will even help:Isa 210 Enter into the rock, and hide thee in the dust, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty. 11 The lofty looks of man shall be humbled, and the haughtiness of men shall be bowed down, and the LORD alone shall be exalted in that day. 12 For the day of the LORD of hosts shall be upon every one that is proud and lofty, and upon every one that is lifted up; and he shall be brought low: ...19 And they shall go into the holes of the rocks, and into the caves of the earth, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth. 20 In that day a man shall cast his idols of silver, and his idols of gold, which they made each one for himself to worship, to the moles and to the bats; 21 To go into the clefts of the rocks, and into the tops of the ragged rocks, for fear of the LORD, and for the glory of his majesty, when he ariseth to shake terribly the earth.Joel 231 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and terrible day of the LORD come. Rev 612 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; ...15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; 16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: 17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?The breaking of the 6th seal, is the final fulfillment of these two prophecies - showing us clearly (if one can read without preconcieved glasses) that the start of the day of the Lord will take place at the 7th seal."the key to understanding the book of Revelation" is revelation knowledge: receiving from the Lord, just as Paul did on many occasions. I do not believe your theory: "Without a clear and full understanding of it, the entire book just will not make sense. The sequence of order will seem strange." You are the one that wants to "rearrange" John's God given chronology. The book makes sense to me, believing that John was "in the Spirit" on a Sunday.Sorry, But at this time, John was not taken forward in time. He was only "in the Spirit." This does NOT mean that he was out of his body. It just means that his spirit man was above his flesh, and in control. He was seeing and hearing in the realm of the spirit. I have been there, "in the spirit" several times. In fact, one time was when the Holy Spirit came to me speaking, about how I could find the exact midpoint of the 70th week, (and the entire 70th week) "clearly marked" in Revelation. It was as if I was a bystander, as I listened to my spirit and the Holy Spirit speak to each other.The very next verse tells us that he was still very much in his own time zone, so to speak:Rev 1:11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea. I do not think Paul would agree with your take on 2 Thes 2, either. He is not saying what you think he is saying.Coop
LOL... whatever lecoop....that is exactly why they created the pre-trib raptrure doctrine they failed to understand rev.as it was not met to be understood until the latter days and knowledge increased instead of trying to understand it right.They invented a doctrine to avoid having to teach it.Why because the realized that what they had been teaching was wrong. So its no wonder you do not get any of it. as I said belive what you like.....And for some of your ideasI suggest you get this little booklet and see what the early church fathers taught before the church polluted all this teaching these church fathers were taught by the apostels. http://www.christianityboard.com/free-book...-rev-t6226.html
Samy is absoulty right this is the DAY OF THE COMING OF THE LORDThe New Testament calls it a day of “wrath,” a day of “visitation,” and the “great day of God Almighty” (Revelation 16:4) and refers to a still-future fulfillment when God’s wrath is poured out on unbelieving Israel (Isaiah 22; Jeremiah 30:1-17; Joel 1-2; Amos 5; Zephaniah 1) and on the unbelieving world (Ezekiel 38–39; Zechariah 14). The Scriptures indicate that “the day of the Lord” will come quickly, like a thief in the night (Zephaniah 1:14-15; 2 Thessalonians 2:2), and therefore we as Christians must be watchful and ready for the coming of Christ. Besides being a time of judgment, it will also be a time of salvation as God will deliver Israel, fulfilling His promise that “all of Israel will be saved” (Romans 11:26),Do you have any clue who All Israel is? (Eze37) forgiving their sins and restoring His people to the land He promised to Abraham (Isaiah 10:27; Jeremiah 30:19-31, 40; Micah 4; Zechariah 13). The final outcome of the day of the Lord will be that “the arrogance of man will be brought low and the pride of men humbled; the Lord alone will be exalted in that day” (Isaiah 2:17). The ultimate or final fulfillment of the prophecies concerning “the day of the Lord” will come at the end of history when with wondrous power God will punish evil and fulfill all His promises.I know Im wasting my breath here on you so I'll dust off my feet and leave it at that.
(kriss;50470)
Samy is absoulty right this is the DAY OF THE COMING OF THE LORD
I will agree with you here: Jesus does come during the day of the Lord. It is not a 24 hour day: it is an extended period of time: some include the 1000 years in it - some do not. Again, it is not a 24 hour day. The day of the Lord, and the 70th week, start at the same time. The day of the Lord includes the 70th week, so it MUST be at least 7 years long. However, soon after the 70th week ends, Jesus will return and face the battle of Armageddon.
The New Testament calls it a day of “wrath,” a day of “visitation,” and the “great day of God Almighty” (Revelation 16:4) and refers to a still-future fulfillment when God’s wrath is poured out on unbelieving Israel (Isaiah 22; Jeremiah 30:1-17; Joel 1-2; Amos 5; Zephaniah 1) and on the unbelieving world (Ezekiel 38–39; Zechariah 14). The Scriptures indicate that “the day of the Lord” will come quickly, like a thief in the night (Zephaniah 1:14-15; 2 Thessalonians 2:2), and therefore we as Christians must be watchful and ready for the coming of Christ.
Both the day of the LOrd, and His coming are likened to a theif in the night. Paul mentions "sudden destruction."1 Thessalonians 52 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. 3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. 4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. 5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. 6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober. 7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. 8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. 9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, 10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. Whether we are alive, or have fallen asleep (died) in Christ, we should live together with Him. (think John 14, and the mansions).What is Paul saying? the rapture of the church is what brings on or triggers the day of the Lord. Paul hints it, and John proves it.
Besides being a time of judgment, it will also be a time of salvation as God will deliver Israel, fulfilling His promise that “all of Israel will be saved” (Romans 11:26),Do you have any clue who All Israel is? (Eze37) forgiving their sins and restoring His people to the land He promised to Abraham (Isaiah 10:27; Jeremiah 30:19-31, 40; Micah 4; Zechariah 13).
I agree.
The final outcome of the day of the Lord will be that “the arrogance of man will be brought low and the pride of men humbled; the Lord alone will be exalted in that day” (Isaiah 2:17). The ultimate or final fulfillment of the prophecies concerning “the day of the Lord” will come at the end of history when with wondrous power God will punish evil and fulfill all His promises.I know Im wasting my breath here on you so I'll dust off my feet and leave it at that.
Actually, I agree with much of what you said. We seem to disagree on when the day of the Lord starts. Why don't you show where you believe the day of the Lord starts, and why? I said it starts with the 7th seal, and I showed scriptures that hint strongly of this timing. A good understanding of John's chronology, also shows this to be correct.Coop
Samy is absoulty right this is the DAY OF THE COMING OF THE LORD
I will agree with you here: Jesus does come during the day of the Lord. It is not a 24 hour day: it is an extended period of time: some include the 1000 years in it - some do not. Again, it is not a 24 hour day. The day of the Lord, and the 70th week, start at the same time. The day of the Lord includes the 70th week, so it MUST be at least 7 years long. However, soon after the 70th week ends, Jesus will return and face the battle of Armageddon.
The New Testament calls it a day of “wrath,” a day of “visitation,” and the “great day of God Almighty” (Revelation 16:4) and refers to a still-future fulfillment when God’s wrath is poured out on unbelieving Israel (Isaiah 22; Jeremiah 30:1-17; Joel 1-2; Amos 5; Zephaniah 1) and on the unbelieving world (Ezekiel 38–39; Zechariah 14). The Scriptures indicate that “the day of the Lord” will come quickly, like a thief in the night (Zephaniah 1:14-15; 2 Thessalonians 2:2), and therefore we as Christians must be watchful and ready for the coming of Christ.
Both the day of the LOrd, and His coming are likened to a theif in the night. Paul mentions "sudden destruction."1 Thessalonians 52 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. 3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. 4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. 5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. 6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober. 7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. 8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. 9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, 10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. Whether we are alive, or have fallen asleep (died) in Christ, we should live together with Him. (think John 14, and the mansions).What is Paul saying? the rapture of the church is what brings on or triggers the day of the Lord. Paul hints it, and John proves it.
Besides being a time of judgment, it will also be a time of salvation as God will deliver Israel, fulfilling His promise that “all of Israel will be saved” (Romans 11:26),Do you have any clue who All Israel is? (Eze37) forgiving their sins and restoring His people to the land He promised to Abraham (Isaiah 10:27; Jeremiah 30:19-31, 40; Micah 4; Zechariah 13).
I agree.
The final outcome of the day of the Lord will be that “the arrogance of man will be brought low and the pride of men humbled; the Lord alone will be exalted in that day” (Isaiah 2:17). The ultimate or final fulfillment of the prophecies concerning “the day of the Lord” will come at the end of history when with wondrous power God will punish evil and fulfill all His promises.I know Im wasting my breath here on you so I'll dust off my feet and leave it at that.
Actually, I agree with much of what you said. We seem to disagree on when the day of the Lord starts. Why don't you show where you believe the day of the Lord starts, and why? I said it starts with the 7th seal, and I showed scriptures that hint strongly of this timing. A good understanding of John's chronology, also shows this to be correct.Coop
I dont entirely disagree, but I doubt we will see it the same way.Rev.8:1 When he opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven for about half an hour. Tell me what is this 1/2 hour? Why is there silence?
(kriss;50490)
I dont entirely disagree, but I doubt we will see it the same way.Rev.8:1 When he opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven for about half an hour. Tell me what is this 1/2 hour? Why is there silence?
I cannot answer with any authority. All I can say is, I know this "7" marks the beginning of the day of the Lord, and of the 70th week. It could be like the "calm before the storm" or a little time of silence, for the awesome display of God's power to come.However, there are some events that seem to take place during that time, or probably right after it. There will be many family members that miss the rapture, while others make it: husbands left behind, or wives left behind, or children left behind. But many prayers have been offered for these loved ones left behind, and God will answer these prayers. They are very precious to Him. They will be top priority on earth, during the 70th week. I chat with many kids in China. Only a few are open to being born again, and I pray a lot for the others. Many other Christians are praying for the lost. These prayers also will be heard by God. God will do everything in His power to get them to repent and come to Him. Millions with turn to him during the 70th week. Many church goers that were not really born again, will realize their mistake, and will become serious with God. Most will lose their head to the beast.Rev 8:3 And another angel came and stood at the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given unto him much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne. 4 And the smoke of the incense, which came with the prayers of the saints, ascended up before God out of the angel's hand.Coop
I dont entirely disagree, but I doubt we will see it the same way.Rev.8:1 When he opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven for about half an hour. Tell me what is this 1/2 hour? Why is there silence?
I cannot answer with any authority. All I can say is, I know this "7" marks the beginning of the day of the Lord, and of the 70th week. It could be like the "calm before the storm" or a little time of silence, for the awesome display of God's power to come.However, there are some events that seem to take place during that time, or probably right after it. There will be many family members that miss the rapture, while others make it: husbands left behind, or wives left behind, or children left behind. But many prayers have been offered for these loved ones left behind, and God will answer these prayers. They are very precious to Him. They will be top priority on earth, during the 70th week. I chat with many kids in China. Only a few are open to being born again, and I pray a lot for the others. Many other Christians are praying for the lost. These prayers also will be heard by God. God will do everything in His power to get them to repent and come to Him. Millions with turn to him during the 70th week. Many church goers that were not really born again, will realize their mistake, and will become serious with God. Most will lose their head to the beast.Rev 8:3 And another angel came and stood at the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given unto him much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne. 4 And the smoke of the incense, which came with the prayers of the saints, ascended up before God out of the angel's hand.Coop
I correspond with two prominent N.T. scholars (one a Ph.D in Greek at Wheaton and one a PhD and ThD at Dallas) regarding my work. The one at Wheaton largely agrees with my position on Lord's Day (Wheaton), the other, at Dallas, does not. Neither dismisses me with the apparent ease you find. Many prominent commentators agree with this position. samy
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