I found this article about the sola scriptura doctrine online that's really got me thinking.http://www.catholic.com/thisrock/2001/0110fea3.asp
The Bible Alone?
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marksman
My eldest granddaughter showing the result of her
The article you referred to asks some very pertinent questions and points out some things that cannot be disputed. I would like to respond to some of them.First preaching was not generally part of New Testament church life. Discussion was the usual format. In Acts 2 we see that the New Testament church met together for the apostles teaching. They didn’t stand in the front of the room and spout forth. They reclined at the meal table and talked to and with the others present. The New Testament churches’ bible was the apostles teaching as they were passing on what Jesus taught. A bible doesn’t have to be written down to be a bible. The Holy Spirit will lead you into all truth but he hasn’t anything in writing. If you or your church doesn’t acknowledge the power and presence of the Holy Spirit most of what happens will be man’s attempt to reach and please God. When a person says they believe in the bible alone what they are saying is that they believe the truth is to be found there, not in tradition or church dogma. In fact, no one believes the bible to be the word of God. What they believe is their interpretation of the bible. If we all believed the bible to be the word of God there would be no denominations.The best teacher of the truth is the Holy Spirit. The reason that there is so much teaching and instruction in the church is that we have all but pushed the Holy Spirit out of church. Too often we claim all our programmes, rituals, planning and legalism is a product of the Holy Spirit, but that is not the case if you care to read what the scriptures say about the New Testament church. The apostle’s teaching is always more reliable than 21st century man because they were with Jesus for three years. As we know it their teaching is what is found in scripture. Some say but what about all the writing that is not in the cannon of scripture? My response is “what about it? We don’t even act out what we do have in scripture let alone what is not.The best commentary on the bible is the bible itself so any other teaching can only and should confirm what the bible teaches. If it doesn’t then it is heresy. It is true that the bible alone, introduced by Roman Priest Martin Luther was a product of the reformation and the average Christian could not read so they had to believe what the priest said.The New Testament church is an authentic model of belief and practice.I don’t believe for one moment that the Holy Spirit infallibly guides the roman church as most of what it does is no where to be found in scripture i.e. the pope, praying to saints, worship of Mary, priests dressing up like women, transubstantiation, mass, earning your salvation, purgatory to name a few. The Holy Spirit has preserved the oral teaching of the apostles. It is called the New Testament and in it is what he wanted us to know. We will become like the New Testament church when we start following the teachings of the New Testament which in life and practice we generally don’t. Our pattern is to follow the traditions of the reformation which was a response to the apostate roman church. God has move on from there and is moving people into a more authentic experience of New Testament living as in the priesthood of all believers not just a select few with academic qualifications. Finally, the bible does not say that the roman church is the pillar and bulwark of the truth in 1 Tim 3 v 15. 1Ti 3:15 But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth. The word “house is “Oikos” which means family; church is the word “ekklesia” which means congregation of called out ones so the family of God which is the congregation of the called out ones are the pillar and ground of truth. To say that it is the roman church is arrogant in the extreme.
(Yellow;46782)
I found this article about the sola scriptura doctrine online that's really got me thinking.http://www.catholic.com/thisrock/2001/0110fea3.asp
Well I didn't read the article because I have had the argument with Catholics In my opinion they have to say what they do because they have their own Bible if they say our Bible is correct it makes theirs wrong. (Im sure Mormons will say the same Anyone that adds or takes away from the Book is not looked upon well by God)So they have to make arguments against it. frankly after many many years of study I find the Bible nearly perfect it is all you need to interpret it correctly it is the inspired Word of God, it only says one thing. The problem is men like to play interpreting it their own way instead of Gods Way thus you get wrong interpretations and many religious denominations it is mans lack of following the Bible as written that leads to the problem they follow their traditions and interpretations before Gods Words'Religion is man trying to be God' Christianity is: 'man letting God be God.' And to do that one only needs his Word
I found this article about the sola scriptura doctrine online that's really got me thinking.http://www.catholic.com/thisrock/2001/0110fea3.asp
Well I didn't read the article because I have had the argument with Catholics In my opinion they have to say what they do because they have their own Bible if they say our Bible is correct it makes theirs wrong. (Im sure Mormons will say the same Anyone that adds or takes away from the Book is not looked upon well by God)So they have to make arguments against it. frankly after many many years of study I find the Bible nearly perfect it is all you need to interpret it correctly it is the inspired Word of God, it only says one thing. The problem is men like to play interpreting it their own way instead of Gods Way thus you get wrong interpretations and many religious denominations it is mans lack of following the Bible as written that leads to the problem they follow their traditions and interpretations before Gods Words'Religion is man trying to be God' Christianity is: 'man letting God be God.' And to do that one only needs his Word
I believe that Sola Scriptura is a heresy and in actual fact, it is impractical and illusionary.In John, Jesus says, "I am the Way the Truth and the Life", in John, Jesus is the Divine "Word of God" that became incarnate to dwell amongst us. Notice something here? It was never Scripture that was necessary for faith it was Jesus Christ and more notably, Jesus' divinity that was absolutely necessary. Who is the object of our faith? Jesus. Who is the incarnation of our God? Jesus. What is the communication of our God? Jesus.Now, how is Sola Scriptura illusionary? When ever we interpret Scripture we bring our own bagage and theological understandings to it. There's no point in denying this. The philosopher, Hans-Georg Gadamer stated that Hermeneutics, or interpreting text, was a broadening of our horizons. We approach the text with our very selves and we never leave ourselves behind. Where ever you go, there you are, is true spacially as well as intellectually. Gadamer stated that if we wish to understand a peice of text, we can do so by becoming familiar with it, by sharing world-views with the text, but we will never be able to understand it completely. This is true of any sort of interpretation, where it be simply sitting down for coffee with a friend discussing life in general or whether it be delving deep into the Deconstruction of Jacques Derrida. (Perhaps more-so for the latter). Yet, it is especially true for a peice of literature as ancient as the Bible. We not only do not share the world-view of the authors of the Bible, we don't even share the same world. In short, we run into very many problems. That is exactly why Sola Scriptura is illusionary and unreasonable. Whenever we interpret Scripture, what we are in fact doing is entering a Tradition of interpretive school of thought. Ironically, most self-proclaimed, Bible-beleiving Christians are the most ignorant of the Hermeneutical methods of Scripture. The title, "Bible-believing" is simply thrown around as a sign which signifies that the person likes to quote Scripture every second sentence whether or not it's even in context.Allan.
First was the Word if you dont believe the Bible is the inspired Word of God you may not like it much here we are a christian Bible study site.
I absolutely love the Bible. I don't have anything against it. I believe it's inspired by God, and to me, that means that God isn't troubled by the fact that it's a very messy book.The Bible is only the Word of God when Jesus is preached through it. The Bible is only inspired when it is used for righteousness, or making something "right"; ie justice.Allan.
Thats good to hear
but I dont agree its a messy book we just lost the ability to learn it right from to many years of mens fast food religion and endless interptations if you let God interpt it makes perfect sense hopefully you'll learn what I mean here.
but I dont agree its a messy book we just lost the ability to learn it right from to many years of mens fast food religion and endless interptations if you let God interpt it makes perfect sense hopefully you'll learn what I mean here.Well, see that's one of the problems.If you give people the opportunity to believe that God is interpreting the Bible through them. You can also give people the opportunity to use their interpretation of the Bible to accomplish their own ends. What we need is a methodology which states that the Bible is interpreted by humans (if it's infallible, it's worthlessly infallible), the methodology should have a self-correcting principle, for instance, St Augustine said:"So if it seems to you that you have understood the divine Scriptures, or any part of them, in such a way that by this understanding you do not build up this twin of love of God and neighbour, then you have not understood them."~ De Doctrina Christiana 1.36.40It is ethics that interprets Scripture.Allan.
The Word of God is infallible, however, men's interpretations are NOT infallible. To find the Truth (minus the things men bring TO biblical interpretation), one must simply look throughout the Word. His Word will not contradict itself. Man, I have debated and written so much on these sort of topics - shattering people's misconceptions, teachings that have come about through a preconceived notion, and are not at all biblical. Sometimes it really amazes me the rubbish people can supposedly 'prove' through Scripture...such things all depends on twisting verses and even words, misusing hebrew and greek, and above all, disregarding CONTEXT!
(koulourakia_girl;46884)
The Word of God is infallible, however, men's interpretations are NOT infallible.
I believe in an economic God. And again, this sort of concept of God requires a theodicy, if God can work through people, in spite of people to bring about a truly perfect book, then why wouldn't God stop the Tsunami for instance? (koulourakia_girl;46884)
Man, I have debated and written so much on these sort of topics - shattering people's misconceptions, teachings that have come about through a preconceived notion, and are not at all biblical. Sometimes it really amazes me the rubbish people can supposedly 'prove' through Scripture...such things all depends on twisting verses and even words, misusing hebrew and greek, and above all, disregarding CONTEXT!
The problem though is that just as Gadamer said, we can never truly understand the objective text, we will always bring ourselves to the text. Where ever you go there you are! When ever you interpret Scripture, you will always believe it to be inerrant you will always interpret it so that it doesn't contradict. Whenever I interpret Scripture I will always use hermeneutical tools which were developed by Biblical scholarship. Does that make my interpretation right? There is no right, per se. There is only interpretation. Don't confuse what I'm saying though for "There is no wrong", I absolutely believe that there is wrong. It is wrong to use Scripture to tell women that they're not as good as men. It is wrong to use Scripture to tell homosexuals that they're less than human or that they are evil or sick. It is wrong to use Scripture to tell Palestinians that they have no right to any land or national identity. Allan.
The Word of God is infallible, however, men's interpretations are NOT infallible.
I believe in an economic God. And again, this sort of concept of God requires a theodicy, if God can work through people, in spite of people to bring about a truly perfect book, then why wouldn't God stop the Tsunami for instance? (koulourakia_girl;46884)
Man, I have debated and written so much on these sort of topics - shattering people's misconceptions, teachings that have come about through a preconceived notion, and are not at all biblical. Sometimes it really amazes me the rubbish people can supposedly 'prove' through Scripture...such things all depends on twisting verses and even words, misusing hebrew and greek, and above all, disregarding CONTEXT!
The problem though is that just as Gadamer said, we can never truly understand the objective text, we will always bring ourselves to the text. Where ever you go there you are! When ever you interpret Scripture, you will always believe it to be inerrant you will always interpret it so that it doesn't contradict. Whenever I interpret Scripture I will always use hermeneutical tools which were developed by Biblical scholarship. Does that make my interpretation right? There is no right, per se. There is only interpretation. Don't confuse what I'm saying though for "There is no wrong", I absolutely believe that there is wrong. It is wrong to use Scripture to tell women that they're not as good as men. It is wrong to use Scripture to tell homosexuals that they're less than human or that they are evil or sick. It is wrong to use Scripture to tell Palestinians that they have no right to any land or national identity. Allan.
(marksman;46835)
I don’t believe for one moment that the Holy Spirit infallibly guides the roman church as most of what it does is no where to be found in scripture i.e. the pope, praying to saints, worship of Mary, priests dressing up like women, transubstantiation, mass, earning your salvation, purgatory to name a few.
I'll address the rest of your post later (I really should be studying for my Lit test right now:studyBut I couldn't let this one pass. I've been studying Catholicism for a while now and I've come to find that, unlike what I've heard, Catholics don't worship Mary or the saints and they certainly do not believe that they can earn their salvation, so please stop spreading errors. If you really want to know what they teach, then ask them and see what they actually teachIf you want to critizice Catholicism, then criticize Catholicism, not your idea of Catholicism.@ KrissI really can't discuss this with you unless you actually read the article and tell me what you see is wrong with it.Peace in Christ
I don’t believe for one moment that the Holy Spirit infallibly guides the roman church as most of what it does is no where to be found in scripture i.e. the pope, praying to saints, worship of Mary, priests dressing up like women, transubstantiation, mass, earning your salvation, purgatory to name a few.
I'll address the rest of your post later (I really should be studying for my Lit test right now:study
But I couldn't let this one pass. I've been studying Catholicism for a while now and I've come to find that, unlike what I've heard, Catholics don't worship Mary or the saints and they certainly do not believe that they can earn their salvation, so please stop spreading errors. If you really want to know what they teach, then ask them and see what they actually teachIf you want to critizice Catholicism, then criticize Catholicism, not your idea of Catholicism.@ KrissI really can't discuss this with you unless you actually read the article and tell me what you see is wrong with it.Peace in Christ
marksman
My eldest granddaughter showing the result of her
It is wrong to use Scripture to tell Palestinians that they have no right to any land or national identity.
Do I detect an interpretation of man here? If you mean a right to the land of Israel, then it is quite clear the answer is no as the bible says 46 times that God has promised it to the Jews. The Palenstinians do have a homeland. It is called Jordan. When the Balfour declaration was made in 1948 to give the land of Israel to the Jews, Jordan promised to resettle all the Palestinians living in Israel. Unfortunately, as is so often with Arab promises they are never kept, so the Palestinians were left to fend for themselves in Israel after 1948 instead of being resettled as promised.The Palestinians living under Jewish government are doing well. The Palestinians living under Palestinians government are living in poverty. Yasser Arrafat whittled away $1.3 billion of aid money into his own private Swiss bank accounts.Much of the aid money being given to the Gaza strip is being used to buy arms, not to relieve poverty. The leadership of the Palestine government have an interest in keeping people poor as it enables then to have the finger pointed at the Jews and have them blamed for their woes.Duirng the Intefada, the UN passed hundreds of motions condeming Israel but not one condeming the Palestinians for deliberately killing women and children. At the Oslo accord, Arrafat was offered 95% of the land he wanted. He responded by attacking the Jews. There is no doubt that most of the problems that the Palestinians face is of their own making. If they don't want to live under jewish rule in Israel, all they have to do is move to Jordan which is their land, and the problem would be solved. Australia is not my land. If I don't like what they do here all I have to do is go back to where I was born. Problem solved.
Do I detect an interpretation of man here? If you mean a right to the land of Israel, then it is quite clear the answer is no as the bible says 46 times that God has promised it to the Jews. The Palenstinians do have a homeland. It is called Jordan. When the Balfour declaration was made in 1948 to give the land of Israel to the Jews, Jordan promised to resettle all the Palestinians living in Israel. Unfortunately, as is so often with Arab promises they are never kept, so the Palestinians were left to fend for themselves in Israel after 1948 instead of being resettled as promised.The Palestinians living under Jewish government are doing well. The Palestinians living under Palestinians government are living in poverty. Yasser Arrafat whittled away $1.3 billion of aid money into his own private Swiss bank accounts.Much of the aid money being given to the Gaza strip is being used to buy arms, not to relieve poverty. The leadership of the Palestine government have an interest in keeping people poor as it enables then to have the finger pointed at the Jews and have them blamed for their woes.Duirng the Intefada, the UN passed hundreds of motions condeming Israel but not one condeming the Palestinians for deliberately killing women and children. At the Oslo accord, Arrafat was offered 95% of the land he wanted. He responded by attacking the Jews. There is no doubt that most of the problems that the Palestinians face is of their own making. If they don't want to live under jewish rule in Israel, all they have to do is move to Jordan which is their land, and the problem would be solved. Australia is not my land. If I don't like what they do here all I have to do is go back to where I was born. Problem solved.
You must interprit the Bible with the Bible thru the working of the Holy Spirit. If what you interprit contradicts something else, then you have interprited wrong. Many interprit the Bible to hate or to promote their own lust. The homosexuals will interprit the Bible to condone their lust, while ignoring the Bible stating it is an abomination. Does this mean we hate the homosexuals or believe they are evil? No, their actions speak for themselves. The Palestinians were not even a people group until Israel became a nation once again. They were merely nomadic tribes of people of differing beliefs and nationalities. Yasser Arafat was an Egyptian until he united the nomads as one people group. Jordan tried to respect their offer to Arafats people, but then Arafat tried to overthrow their government and was forced out. Those who claim to be Palestinians are actually the dreggs of many cultures, the rejects and they are constantly manipulated by their own people to cause harm to Israel. As for women in the interpritation of Scripture, you are right, it has been abused. Women are equal but seperate, but what we must also understand is that God holds the men accountable for what the women and children do. So if the women or children do not respect the position of the men, then they make themselves less than the men and the same can be said for the men.
(Yellow;46905)
I'll address the rest of your post later (I really should be studying for my Lit test right now:studyBut I couldn't let this one pass. I've been studying Catholicism for a while now and I've come to find that, unlike what I've heard, Catholics don't worship Mary or the saints and they certainly do not believe that they can earn their salvation, so please stop spreading errors. If you really want to know what they teach, then ask them and see what they actually teachIf you want to critizice Catholicism, then criticize Catholicism, not your idea of Catholicism.@ KrissI really can't discuss this with you unless you actually read the article and tell me what you see is wrong with it.Peace in Christ
We dont need to discuss this I made a small statement that is fact we have been bombared with Catholics on this site and still have some so I do not need to read up on them. I simply said they have their own Bible and they do and its not the same as ours. We arent going to discuss the good and bad of Catholics and there is plenty of both in all religions. Its against our rules to single out Christian religions for discussions
I'll address the rest of your post later (I really should be studying for my Lit test right now:study
But I couldn't let this one pass. I've been studying Catholicism for a while now and I've come to find that, unlike what I've heard, Catholics don't worship Mary or the saints and they certainly do not believe that they can earn their salvation, so please stop spreading errors. If you really want to know what they teach, then ask them and see what they actually teachIf you want to critizice Catholicism, then criticize Catholicism, not your idea of Catholicism.@ KrissI really can't discuss this with you unless you actually read the article and tell me what you see is wrong with it.Peace in ChristWe dont need to discuss this I made a small statement that is fact we have been bombared with Catholics on this site and still have some so I do not need to read up on them. I simply said they have their own Bible and they do and its not the same as ours. We arent going to discuss the good and bad of Catholics and there is plenty of both in all religions. Its against our rules to single out Christian religions for discussions
(Yellow;46905)
I'll address the rest of your post later (I really should be studying for my Lit test right now:study But I couldn't let this one pass. I've been studying Catholicism for a while now and I've come to find that, unlike what I've heard, Catholics don't worship Mary or the saints and they certainly do not believe that they can earn their salvation, so please stop spreading errors. If you really want to know what they teach, then ask them and see what they actually teachIf you want to critizice Catholicism, then criticize Catholicism, not your idea of Catholicism. @ Kriss I really can't discuss this with you unless you actually read the article and tell me what you see is wrong with it. Peace in Christ
a great quote from....uh..... I forget who " millions of people hate the catholic church for what they think it is, only about ten hate it for what it really is." as for us catholics havng our own bible, taking your refering to the catechism, you are completley off Kriss. first all of the cathescism is inspired by two things, the bible, and from the saints who were inspired by God, two reliable sources. second off, the catechism never take precedence over the bible. The bible is much more important to catholics. third off, the cathecism is no more than a book on what we believe. Calling the cathecism the catholics bible is like me calling bruce wilkinsons "prayer of Jabez" your bible. Yes you may believe in the message of the book but its not nearly as important as the bible to you. I encourage all of you to find out what the catholic church really believes and what your church preacher tells you that they believe. I as most of you know am not telling you to agree with what the catholic church says. even I, who am a catholic, take disagreement on some of the catholic believes.But at least find out what there believes really are. another great quote ( and I forget who said this too, maybe our local bishop) " The catholic church has done the worst advertising job in the world."------------------------------------------------------------------------- As for Sola scripture, what the catholic church believes is that scripture can not be open to interpretation by everyone or anyone, or we'll split up into 33,000 different churches. ( anybody want to test that theory.) We need some kind of authority to interpret the scriptures, someone/a group which knows what there talking about. I agree on that much. Where I disagree with the catholic church is this. That the catholic is the only authority whcih can correctly interpret the scriptures since they are the one and only true church. give me a break, Gods church is the christians not the catholics. I believe that an authority which can rightly interpret scriptures will only be possible when the christian church is unified, where we stop building walls between us. Sola scripture, agree with the concept, disagree with the teaching. God blessRyan Fitz PS. to yellow me and Kriss have been at it ( when it comes to catholicism) for about what is it 8 months now??? maybe 6???
She knows what that article teaches.
I'll address the rest of your post later (I really should be studying for my Lit test right now:study
But I couldn't let this one pass. I've been studying Catholicism for a while now and I've come to find that, unlike what I've heard, Catholics don't worship Mary or the saints and they certainly do not believe that they can earn their salvation, so please stop spreading errors. If you really want to know what they teach, then ask them and see what they actually teachIf you want to critizice Catholicism, then criticize Catholicism, not your idea of Catholicism. @ Kriss I really can't discuss this with you unless you actually read the article and tell me what you see is wrong with it. Peace in Christa great quote from....uh..... I forget who " millions of people hate the catholic church for what they think it is, only about ten hate it for what it really is." as for us catholics havng our own bible, taking your refering to the catechism, you are completley off Kriss. first all of the cathescism is inspired by two things, the bible, and from the saints who were inspired by God, two reliable sources. second off, the catechism never take precedence over the bible. The bible is much more important to catholics. third off, the cathecism is no more than a book on what we believe. Calling the cathecism the catholics bible is like me calling bruce wilkinsons "prayer of Jabez" your bible. Yes you may believe in the message of the book but its not nearly as important as the bible to you. I encourage all of you to find out what the catholic church really believes and what your church preacher tells you that they believe. I as most of you know am not telling you to agree with what the catholic church says. even I, who am a catholic, take disagreement on some of the catholic believes.But at least find out what there believes really are. another great quote ( and I forget who said this too, maybe our local bishop) " The catholic church has done the worst advertising job in the world."------------------------------------------------------------------------- As for Sola scripture, what the catholic church believes is that scripture can not be open to interpretation by everyone or anyone, or we'll split up into 33,000 different churches. ( anybody want to test that theory.) We need some kind of authority to interpret the scriptures, someone/a group which knows what there talking about. I agree on that much. Where I disagree with the catholic church is this. That the catholic is the only authority whcih can correctly interpret the scriptures since they are the one and only true church. give me a break, Gods church is the christians not the catholics. I believe that an authority which can rightly interpret scriptures will only be possible when the christian church is unified, where we stop building walls between us. Sola scripture, agree with the concept, disagree with the teaching. God blessRyan Fitz PS. to yellow me and Kriss have been at it ( when it comes to catholicism) for about what is it 8 months now??? maybe 6???
Sorry if I offened you LGF you know I wouldnt intentioally do soWhat I was refering to was the catholic bible is not the same as ours it has added books Macbees,Jubliees ect. I never said a thing about cathecism I even said I did not read the articleI was simply making the pointyou have a book that has added books we dont have
(Yellow;46905)
I'll address the rest of your post later (I really should be studying for my Lit test right now:studyBut I couldn't let this one pass. I've been studying Catholicism for a while now and I've come to find that, unlike what I've heard, Catholics don't worship Mary or the saints and they certainly do not believe that they can earn their salvation, so please stop spreading errors. If you really want to know what they teach, then ask them and see what they actually teachIf you want to critizice Catholicism, then criticize Catholicism, not your idea of Catholicism.Peace in Christ
Hi Yellow.I am not a Catholic and was invited to two services and to my surprise they did not worship Mary , or even mention her. There were no golden candlesticks or other religious icons. All the teaching was directly out of the bible. Communion was clearly stated as a symbol of rememberance of the Life of Christ given on the cross etc. It was one of the most Christian services I have ever attended. I was ashamed of my pre-conceived notions.I went on to discover they quietly fed the homeless and hungry for years in our small city and nobody else did. (there are 14 protestant churches in this town as well).I am sure there are other Catholic congregations who do things differently but that was my experience.Arnie M.
I'll address the rest of your post later (I really should be studying for my Lit test right now:study
But I couldn't let this one pass. I've been studying Catholicism for a while now and I've come to find that, unlike what I've heard, Catholics don't worship Mary or the saints and they certainly do not believe that they can earn their salvation, so please stop spreading errors. If you really want to know what they teach, then ask them and see what they actually teachIf you want to critizice Catholicism, then criticize Catholicism, not your idea of Catholicism.Peace in ChristHi Yellow.I am not a Catholic and was invited to two services and to my surprise they did not worship Mary , or even mention her. There were no golden candlesticks or other religious icons. All the teaching was directly out of the bible. Communion was clearly stated as a symbol of rememberance of the Life of Christ given on the cross etc. It was one of the most Christian services I have ever attended. I was ashamed of my pre-conceived notions.I went on to discover they quietly fed the homeless and hungry for years in our small city and nobody else did. (there are 14 protestant churches in this town as well).I am sure there are other Catholic congregations who do things differently but that was my experience.Arnie M.
marksman
My eldest granddaughter showing the result of her
If you really want to know what they teach, then ask them and see what they actually teach
That is precisely what I did. I worked for three years in the catholic education system and besides having to follow their teaching as a condition of obtaining a job, I spent a lot of time asking questions of the devout catholics on the staff. What I told you they told me. I asked one senior catholic "what does wine taste like when it is turned into blood at the mass?"His reply was "Wine."I asked him if he didn't think someone was having a lend of him claiming the wine became the blood of Jesus. He was quite adamant that the wine was blood even though it tasted like wine. Every catholic teacher that I asked said they had to earn their salvation, it wasn't guaranteed and they couldn't understand the fact that I knew I was saved and didn't have to do the right things to get it in the end. Whatever you think the catholics do or don't teach, that is what they believe and live by. By the way, all of them said they prayed to Mary and venerated her in the hope that God might listen to them through her.
That is precisely what I did. I worked for three years in the catholic education system and besides having to follow their teaching as a condition of obtaining a job, I spent a lot of time asking questions of the devout catholics on the staff. What I told you they told me. I asked one senior catholic "what does wine taste like when it is turned into blood at the mass?"His reply was "Wine."I asked him if he didn't think someone was having a lend of him claiming the wine became the blood of Jesus. He was quite adamant that the wine was blood even though it tasted like wine. Every catholic teacher that I asked said they had to earn their salvation, it wasn't guaranteed and they couldn't understand the fact that I knew I was saved and didn't have to do the right things to get it in the end. Whatever you think the catholics do or don't teach, that is what they believe and live by. By the way, all of them said they prayed to Mary and venerated her in the hope that God might listen to them through her.
Most all of what you say is true and we have discussed them all on this site before anyone who wants to know more can ask yelllow or Letsgofishing in a Private message No one bother to post a lets bash the catholics type post or it will be deletedthanks
marksman
My eldest granddaughter showing the result of her
Now, how is Sola Scriptura illusionary? When ever we interpret Scripture we bring our own bagage and theological understandings to it. There's no point in denying this.
Yes there is as there is much in scripture that does not need an interpretation. For example it says that all have sinned and come short of God's glory. What needs interpretation there? It is a simple statement of fact.Another fact is that no one can come to the Father except through Jesus. No interpretation needed.Another fact is that Jesus is the way, the truth and the life. You won't get it any other way. There are people who God has given brilliant minds to and can see clearly the meaning of scripture. Derek Prince is one example of this. He was the youngest ever Cambridge University professor (age 25) and then God saved him through reading the scripture for himself. He found the truth in doing this as God gave him an understanding of the words without interpretation through the holy spirit. Along with that came the spiritual gift of teaching and he has been doing that for 60 years.
Yes there is as there is much in scripture that does not need an interpretation. For example it says that all have sinned and come short of God's glory. What needs interpretation there? It is a simple statement of fact.Another fact is that no one can come to the Father except through Jesus. No interpretation needed.Another fact is that Jesus is the way, the truth and the life. You won't get it any other way. There are people who God has given brilliant minds to and can see clearly the meaning of scripture. Derek Prince is one example of this. He was the youngest ever Cambridge University professor (age 25) and then God saved him through reading the scripture for himself. He found the truth in doing this as God gave him an understanding of the words without interpretation through the holy spirit. Along with that came the spiritual gift of teaching and he has been doing that for 60 years.
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