Pre-Trib Rapture is Dead!!!

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Hidden In Him

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So where do you see the future going?

The anti rapture group never answers that question. Nor can they deal with OT prophecy and the book of Revelations and what they say.

Oh, I think we have a ways to go yet. Things are definitely going to get darker, including in the US in the not-so-distant future. But for me there is a lot yet that needs to take place.

I'm honestly not totally familiar with some of these different takes on eschatology. Much of it is still a learning experience for me. I've been exposed to a lot of Pre-Trib and Post-Trib in my life (and even Mid-Trib), but no rapture at all is something new. I'm curious to see what answer you get from Vexatious on what in the world he is. I'm almost afraid to ask.

Hard for me to wrap my mind around a number of these interpretations. It's like unorthodoxy is in its heyday or something, LoL.
 

Nancy

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Oh, I think we have a ways to go yet. Things are definitely going to get darker, including in the US in the not-so-distant future. But for me there is a lot yet that needs to take place.

I'm honestly not totally familiar with some of these different takes on eschatology. Much of it is still a learning experience for me. I've been exposed to a lot of Pre-Trib and Post-Trib in my life (and even Mid-Trib), but no rapture at all is something new. I'm curious to see what answer you get from Vexatious on what in the world he is. I'm almost afraid to ask.

Hard for me to wrap my mind around a number of these interpretations. It's like unorthodoxy is in its heyday or something, LoL.
Word!
 

CoreIssue

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Oh, I think we have a ways to go yet. Things are definitely going to get darker, including in the US in the not-so-distant future. But for me there is a lot yet that needs to take place.

I'm honestly not totally familiar with some of these different takes on eschatology. Much of it is still a learning experience for me. I've been exposed to a lot of Pre-Trib and Post-Trib in my life (and even Mid-Trib), but no rapture at all is something new. I'm curious to see what answer you get from Vexatious on what in the world he is. I'm almost afraid to ask.

Hard for me to wrap my mind around a number of these interpretations. It's like unorthodoxy is in its heyday or something, LoL.

I agree it is hard to wrap ones head around when studying and learning.

But Pretrib deals with a lot of issues and makes sense when the pieces start falling in place for you.

Hang in there and keep studying. Is worth it because it helps in many areas you would not think it would.
rapture1.gif
 

Hidden In Him

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I agree it is hard to wrap ones head around when studying and learning.

But Pretrib deals with a lot of issues and makes sense when the pieces start falling in place for you.

Hang in there and keep studying. Is worth it because it helps in many areas you would not think it would.
View attachment 4625

I appreciate that, and thanks for the nice post.
One thing you can rest assure of: I will not accuse you of being the spawn of Beelzebub himself for believing in Pretribulationism, LoL. :)
 
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Keraz

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So where do you see the future going?

The anti rapture group never answers that question. Nor can they deal with OT prophecy and the book of Revelations and what they say.
This is sheer rubbish and deliberate slander of those who refute your rapture belief.
We do deal with all of the Bible and one thing that cannot be found in that big Book, is where the Lord says He will take His people to heaven.
We Christians have work to do here; escaping, shooting thru, beam me up Scotty; is not an option. Not even science fiction has such an incredible fable as going to live with God in heaven, while He smashes those left behind.
Even Captain Kirk only went back to the Enterprise, where he had trouble enough!

This is what the future holds for all of us;
An End Times Sequence of Prophesied Events, scripturally proven:

1. The next prophesied event, The Lord’s Day of Vengeance and wrath, which will be an explosion of the suns surface; a CME, a strike at noon day, Zephaniah 2:4, that will devastate and depopulate the entire Middle East region, excepting for a remnant of Jewish Christians in Jerusalem. Isaiah 31:5, Ezekiel 30:1-5, Amos 1 & 2:1-5, Romans 9:27

2. From this event, in the Land of Israel, 2/3 will die, the remaining 1/3 will be refined by fire and only a remnant will survive, acknowledging the Lord. This is the fire judgement of all the world, the Lord’s Day of wrath; the Sixth Seal. Revelation 6:12-17, Isaiah 63:1-6, Ezekiel 5:1-3, Isaiah 33:14, Deuteronomy 32:41-43, Jeremiah 12:14, Ezekiel 21:1-7, Ezekiel 14:21-23, Zechariah 12:11-14, Zechariah 13:7-9, Joel 2:1-11

3. The Land is regenerated and becomes productive – after only a short time period. Isaiah 32:15-20, Isaiah 43:19-21, Ezekiel 36:8-12, Amos 9:13-15

4. All the faithful Christian people will gather into Greater Israel and only true believers in Christ will live in the land, the others are excluded. They are ‘a vast throng, uncountable, from every race, tribe, nation and language – wearing white robes’. Of faith. Revelation 7:9-14, Isaiah 35:1-10, Micah 2:12, Ezekiel 34:11-20, Ezekiel 39:25-29, Micah 7:11-12 , Romans 9:24-26

5. They form the new nation of Beulah. Isaiah 62:1-5, Isaiah 66:7-14 and live in peace and prosperity for several years. Isaiah 51:3, Psalms 107:35-38, Amos 9:13-15

6. They select their own leaders. Jeremiah 3:15, Jeremiah 30:21

7. They build a new Temple. Zechariah 6:15, Zechariah 8:9-15, Revelation 11:1-2

8. A huge army from the North (Gog, from Magog) advances to attack and is totally destroyed Ezekiel 38:8-12, Ezekiel 38:21-23, Joel 2:20

9. By this great display of rescue, the people of Beulah will revere their God. Ezekiel 39:21-24

10. Many of the Beulahites agree to a seven year peace treaty with the Leader of the One World government. Daniel 9:27a. Daniel 11:32 This is a bad mistake; Isaiah 28:14-15

11. The 7 year treaty is broken at the midpoint, commencing the Tribulation. The Anti- Christ comes to Jerusalem and takes control of Beulah. Zechariah 14:1-2 God allows him to have power over ‘the Holy ones of the Most High” for 3½ years. Daniel 9:27b, Daniel 11:31-34, Revelation 13:7

12. Half of the population of Beulah will be taken to a place of safety, those who relied on God only and refused the 7 year treaty. Rev. 12:14, Zechariah 14:2

13. The Anti Christ [Satan] places his image in the Temple. Daniel 7:25, 2 Thessalonians 2:4,

14. This is the time of the great Tribulation: 7 Trumpet and 7 Bowl judgements.

The Christians left in Beulah, are tested by this difficult time, but two witnesses will prophesy and teach them. Revelation 11:1-13, Revelation 12:6-17, Matthew 24:21-22

15. Exactly 1260 days later, Jesus Returns with the resurrected believers killed by the AC, and commences His Millennial reign, destroying the armies of the Anti-Christ and imprisoning Satan in the battle of Armageddon. Daniel 12:7, Revelation 19:11-16, Revelation 20:4

16. Jesus gathers His chosen ones, the faithful Christians back from their place of safety, and those Gentiles who have not taken the ‘mark of the beast’. Matthew 24:31

17. After the 1000 years; Satan is again released and gathers a vast army from all corners of the world. They are cremated and Satan is thrown into the lake of fire. Revelation 20:9-10

18. The Great White Throne Judgement – the Books are opened and all the people who have ever lived are judged. Revelation 20:11-13

19. Death and Hades are thrown into the lake of fire along with those not in the Book of Life. (The second death) Revelation 20:14-15

20. A new heaven and earth, with Jerusalem at its center, comes down from heaven. Only those whose names are in the Lamb’s Book of Life enter. God lives there too. Revelation 21

Ref: logostelos.info
 
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Nancy

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This is sheer rubbish and deliberate slander of those who refute your rapture belief.
We do deal with all of the Bible and one thing that cannot be found in that big Book, is where the Lord says He will take His people to heaven.
We Christians have work to do here; escaping, shooting thru, beam me up Scotty; is not an option. Not even science fiction has such an incredible fable as going to live with God in heaven, while He smashes those left behind.
Even Captain Kirk only went back to the Enterprise, where he had trouble enough!

This is what the future holds for all of us;
An End Times Sequence of Prophesied Events, scripturally proven:

1. The next prophesied event, The Lord’s Day of Vengeance and wrath, which will be an explosion of the suns surface; a CME, a strike at noon day, Zephaniah 2:4, that will devastate and depopulate the entire Middle East region, excepting for a remnant of Jewish Christians in Jerusalem. Isaiah 31:5, Ezekiel 30:1-5, Amos 1 & 2:1-5, Romans 9:27

2. From this event, in the Land of Israel, 2/3 will die, the remaining 1/3 will be refined by fire and only a remnant will survive, acknowledging the Lord. This is the fire judgement of all the world, the Lord’s Day of wrath; the Sixth Seal. Revelation 6:12-17, Isaiah 63:1-6, Ezekiel 5:1-3, Isaiah 33:14, Deuteronomy 32:41-43, Jeremiah 12:14, Ezekiel 21:1-7, Ezekiel 14:21-23, Zechariah 12:11-14, Zechariah 13:7-9, Joel 2:1-11

3. The Land is regenerated and becomes productive – after only a short time period. Isaiah 32:15-20, Isaiah 43:19-21, Ezekiel 36:8-12, Amos 9:13-15

4. All the faithful Christian people will gather into Greater Israel and only true believers in Christ will live in the land, the others are excluded. They are ‘a vast throng, uncountable, from every race, tribe, nation and language – wearing white robes’. Of faith. Revelation 7:9-14, Isaiah 35:1-10, Micah 2:12, Ezekiel 34:11-20, Ezekiel 39:25-29, Micah 7:11-12 , Romans 9:24-26

5. They form the new nation of Beulah. Isaiah 62:1-5, Isaiah 66:7-14 and live in peace and prosperity for several years. Isaiah 51:3, Psalms 107:35-38, Amos 9:13-15

6. They select their own leaders. Jeremiah 3:15, Jeremiah 30:21

7. They build a new Temple. Zechariah 6:15, Zechariah 8:9-15, Revelation 11:1-2

8. A huge army from the North (Gog, from Magog) advances to attack and is totally destroyed Ezekiel 38:8-12, Ezekiel 38:21-23, Joel 2:20

9. By this great display of rescue, the people of Beulah will revere their God. Ezekiel 39:21-24

10. Many of the Beulahites agree to a seven year peace treaty with the Leader of the One World government. Daniel 9:27a. Daniel 11:32 This is a bad mistake; Isaiah 28:14-15

11. The 7 year treaty is broken at the midpoint, commencing the Tribulation. The Anti- Christ comes to Jerusalem and takes control of Beulah. Zechariah 14:1-2 God allows him to have power over ‘the Holy ones of the Most High” for 3½ years. Daniel 9:27b, Daniel 11:31-34, Revelation 13:7

12. Half of the population of Beulah will be taken to a place of safety, those who relied on God only and refused the 7 year treaty. Rev. 12:14, Zechariah 14:2

13. The Anti Christ [Satan] places his image in the Temple. Daniel 7:25, 2 Thessalonians 2:4,

14. This is the time of the great Tribulation: 7 Trumpet and 7 Bowl judgements.

The Christians left in Beulah, are tested by this difficult time, but two witnesses will prophesy and teach them. Revelation 11:1-13, Revelation 12:6-17, Matthew 24:21-22

15. Exactly 1260 days later, Jesus Returns with the resurrected believers killed by the AC, and commences His Millennial reign, destroying the armies of the Anti-Christ and imprisoning Satan in the battle of Armageddon. Daniel 12:7, Revelation 19:11-16, Revelation 20:4

16. Jesus gathers His chosen ones, the faithful Christians back from their place of safety, and those Gentiles who have not taken the ‘mark of the beast’. Matthew 24:31

17. After the 1000 years; Satan is again released and gathers a vast army from all corners of the world. They are cremated and Satan is thrown into the lake of fire. Revelation 20:9-10

18. The Great White Throne Judgement – the Books are opened and all the people who have ever lived are judged. Revelation 20:11-13

19. Death and Hades are thrown into the lake of fire along with those not in the Book of Life. (The second death) Revelation 20:14-15

20. A new heaven and earth, with Jerusalem at its center, comes down from heaven. Only those whose names are in the Lamb’s Book of Life enter. God lives there too. Revelation 21

Ref: logostelos.info
Great references. Good post!
 

CoreIssue

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This is sheer rubbish and deliberate slander of those who refute your rapture belief.
We do deal with all of the Bible and one thing that cannot be found in that big Book, is where the Lord says He will take His people to heaven.
We Christians have work to do here; escaping, shooting thru, beam me up Scotty; is not an option. Not even science fiction has such an incredible fable as going to live with God in heaven, while He smashes those left behind.
Even Captain Kirk only went back to the Enterprise, where he had trouble enough!

This is what the future holds for all of us;
An End Times Sequence of Prophesied Events, scripturally proven:

1. The next prophesied event, The Lord’s Day of Vengeance and wrath, which will be an explosion of the suns surface; a CME, a strike at noon day, Zephaniah 2:4, that will devastate and depopulate the entire Middle East region, excepting for a remnant of Jewish Christians in Jerusalem. Isaiah 31:5, Ezekiel 30:1-5, Amos 1 & 2:1-5, Romans 9:27

2. From this event, in the Land of Israel, 2/3 will die, the remaining 1/3 will be refined by fire and only a remnant will survive, acknowledging the Lord. This is the fire judgement of all the world, the Lord’s Day of wrath; the Sixth Seal. Revelation 6:12-17, Isaiah 63:1-6, Ezekiel 5:1-3, Isaiah 33:14, Deuteronomy 32:41-43, Jeremiah 12:14, Ezekiel 21:1-7, Ezekiel 14:21-23, Zechariah 12:11-14, Zechariah 13:7-9, Joel 2:1-11

3. The Land is regenerated and becomes productive – after only a short time period. Isaiah 32:15-20, Isaiah 43:19-21, Ezekiel 36:8-12, Amos 9:13-15

4. All the faithful Christian people will gather into Greater Israel and only true believers in Christ will live in the land, the others are excluded. They are ‘a vast throng, uncountable, from every race, tribe, nation and language – wearing white robes’. Of faith. Revelation 7:9-14, Isaiah 35:1-10, Micah 2:12, Ezekiel 34:11-20, Ezekiel 39:25-29, Micah 7:11-12 , Romans 9:24-26

5. They form the new nation of Beulah. Isaiah 62:1-5, Isaiah 66:7-14 and live in peace and prosperity for several years. Isaiah 51:3, Psalms 107:35-38, Amos 9:13-15

6. They select their own leaders. Jeremiah 3:15, Jeremiah 30:21

7. They build a new Temple. Zechariah 6:15, Zechariah 8:9-15, Revelation 11:1-2

8. A huge army from the North (Gog, from Magog) advances to attack and is totally destroyed Ezekiel 38:8-12, Ezekiel 38:21-23, Joel 2:20

9. By this great display of rescue, the people of Beulah will revere their God. Ezekiel 39:21-24

10. Many of the Beulahites agree to a seven year peace treaty with the Leader of the One World government. Daniel 9:27a. Daniel 11:32 This is a bad mistake; Isaiah 28:14-15

11. The 7 year treaty is broken at the midpoint, commencing the Tribulation. The Anti- Christ comes to Jerusalem and takes control of Beulah. Zechariah 14:1-2 God allows him to have power over ‘the Holy ones of the Most High” for 3½ years. Daniel 9:27b, Daniel 11:31-34, Revelation 13:7

12. Half of the population of Beulah will be taken to a place of safety, those who relied on God only and refused the 7 year treaty. Rev. 12:14, Zechariah 14:2

13. The Anti Christ [Satan] places his image in the Temple. Daniel 7:25, 2 Thessalonians 2:4,

14. This is the time of the great Tribulation: 7 Trumpet and 7 Bowl judgements.

The Christians left in Beulah, are tested by this difficult time, but two witnesses will prophesy and teach them. Revelation 11:1-13, Revelation 12:6-17, Matthew 24:21-22

15. Exactly 1260 days later, Jesus Returns with the resurrected believers killed by the AC, and commences His Millennial reign, destroying the armies of the Anti-Christ and imprisoning Satan in the battle of Armageddon. Daniel 12:7, Revelation 19:11-16, Revelation 20:4

16. Jesus gathers His chosen ones, the faithful Christians back from their place of safety, and those Gentiles who have not taken the ‘mark of the beast’. Matthew 24:31

17. After the 1000 years; Satan is again released and gathers a vast army from all corners of the world. They are cremated and Satan is thrown into the lake of fire. Revelation 20:9-10

18. The Great White Throne Judgement – the Books are opened and all the people who have ever lived are judged. Revelation 20:11-13

19. Death and Hades are thrown into the lake of fire along with those not in the Book of Life. (The second death) Revelation 20:14-15

20. A new heaven and earth, with Jerusalem at its center, comes down from heaven. Only those whose names are in the Lamb’s Book of Life enter. God lives there too. Revelation 21

Ref: logostelos.info

Revelation 3:10 says the Church will not go through the tribulation, which is a testing of all who live up on the earth.

That is quite clear. If you are here you will go through the testing. But it says the Church will not.

It also says Israel will be restored as covenant nation. But you have the church and Israel co-existing.

Israel and Church are coheirs. Church does not become Israel and Israel does not become Church.

The Church is the bride at the wedding supper of the lamb in heaven. It returns with Christ at the second coming. But you say it never leaves.
 

Heart2Soul

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Revelation 3:10 says the Church will not go through the tribulation, which is a testing of all who live up on the earth.

That is quite clear. If you are here you will go through the testing. But it says the Church will not.

It also says Israel will be restored as covenant nation. But you have the church and Israel co-existing.

Israel and Church are coheirs. Church does not become Israel and Israel does not become Church.

The Church is the bride at the wedding supper of the lamb in heaven. It returns with Christ at the second coming. But you say it never leaves.
This is a letter written to the church of Philadelphia......and since there were 7 churches addressed in Revelation then this cannot apply to "THE CHURCH"....the other churches mentioned also belonged to Christ.....this letter references the spiritual condition of that specific church.
the hour of temptation is referring to worshipping the false Christ....and receiving his mark. IMHO!!!!!!

7 And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth;

8 I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word, and hast not denied my name.

9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

13 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.
 

CoreIssue

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This is a letter written to the church of Philadelphia......and since there were 7 churches addressed in Revelation then this cannot apply to "THE CHURCH"....
Since this is also addressing seven church ages, it most assuredly is a message to the Church.

After all, there was no tribulation period or rapture back then.


the other churches mentioned also belonged to Christ.....this letter references the spiritual condition of that specific church.

Which is of no value to us today if only then.

the hour of temptation is referring to worshipping the false Christ....and receiving his mark. IMHO!!!!!!

Which is part of the tribulation period of seven years.


7 And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth;

8 I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word, and hast not denied my name.

9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

13 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

It was addressed to the churches then and now.
 

Heart2Soul

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It was addressed to the churches then and now.
Revelation 3:10 was written specifically to the church of Philadelphia.
This chart may or may not help understand the differences....depends on the reader.
7-churches-in-chart-form1-e1338397806865.gif
 

CoreIssue

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Okay....but in this thread you are quoting scripture pertaining to one of the seven churches.....and implying that it is referring to "The Church" that will be raptured.....what happened to the other churches?

The aspects pointed out in the seven churches all existed today either separately or mixed. None of the seven churches of then exist today as they were then.

Christ addressed individuals within each church, not each church as a whole.

Today the sixth and seventh church aspects are in play. You are one or the other. If the sixth you will be raptured. If the seventh that you will be spit out into the tribulation.

The sixth is true church. The seventh apostate, so not church at all.

In example, look of the catholic church. It did not exist in, but it's aspects most assuredly exist today in the seventh church.
 

Keraz

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Revelation 3:10 says the Church will not go through the tribulation, which is a testing of all who live up on the earth.
But Revelation 13:10 and 14:12 both say we must endure until the end.
That is quite clear. If you are here you will go through the testing. But it says the Church will not.
I do agree that the seven letters can apply to the Church today, but so as to not contradict the many scriptures that say we will experience the Lord's Day of wrath, Rev 3:10 means that the Lord will protect His own. This protection is confirmed in many other prophesies. Isaiah 43:2, Psalms 91, +
It also says Israel will be restored as covenant nation. But you have the church and Israel co-existing.
The Jewish State of Israel will be gone and only a remnant will survive. Romans 9:27
The Israel the God makes His Covenant with, will be and is now; the Israelites of God, His faithful Christians. Galatians 6:14-16
Israel and Church are coheirs. Church does not become Israel and Israel does not become Church.
You fail to make a proper distinction: The established Church and the Jewish State of Israel are two separate entities, but the Messianic Jews and the born again Christians are one people. John 17:20-23 They will join their brethren, Jeremiah 50:4-5, and the faithful Christians from every race, nation and language will migrate to the holy Land and live there in peace and prosperity. Isaiah 35:1-10, Ezekiel 34:11-16, Romans 9:24-26
The Church is the bride at the wedding supper of the lamb in heaven. It returns with Christ at the second coming. But you say it never leaves.
Nowhere does the Bible say the Wedding takes place in heaven, You just assume that.
As the Church of God remains on earth, so the Wedding must happen here. I believe the scene in Revelation 7:9, which is in Jerusalem, may be the Wedding celebration. Jesus is revealed then, to His people. 2 Thessalonians 1:10, Revelation 14:1

You need to rethink your beliefs, coreissue, as they just don't relate to what the Bible says.
 

Heart2Soul

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None of the seven churches of then exist today as they were then.
okay.
Today the sixth and seventh church aspects are in play. You are one or the other. If the sixth you will be raptured. If the seventh that you will be spit out into the tribulation.
This contradicts what you just stated above...."none exist today as then....but today the 6th and 7th are in play".....

Physically the 7 seven churches do not exist as then....and referring to a specific denomination such as Catholic really gets away from the seven churches which were addressed....so we have numerous denominations of churches today....far more than seven....so in my opinion the spiritual condition of those 7 churches can be found in one way or another in our church today....so the question would be....what spiritual condition is your church in today and how will it prevail in the end times.
 
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CoreIssue

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But Revelation 13:10 and 14:12 both say we must endure until the end.

This is during the tribulation. We are already gone.


I do agree that the seven letters can apply to the Church today, but so as to not contradict the many scriptures that say we will experience the Lord's Day of wrath, Rev 3:10 means that the Lord will protect His own. This protection is confirmed in many other prophesies. Isaiah 43:2, Psalms 91, +

You're quoting things that are not trib prophecies, but promises to the OT.

The Jewish State of Israel will be gone and only a remnant will survive. Romans 9:27
The Israel the God makes His Covenant with, will be and is now; the Israelites of God, His faithful Christians. Galatians 6:14-16

Nope. Israel is never called church in church is never called Israel in the flesh.


You fail to make a proper distinction: The established Church and the Jewish State of Israel are two separate entities, but the Messianic Jews and the born again Christians are one people. John 17:20-23 They will join their brethren, Jeremiah 50:4-5, and the faithful Christians from every race, nation and language will migrate to the holy Land and live there in peace and prosperity. Isaiah 35:1-10, Ezekiel 34:11-16, Romans 9:24-26

You are inventing claims.


Nowhere does the Bible say the Wedding takes place in heaven, You just assume that.
As the Church of God remains on earth, so the Wedding must happen here. I believe the scene in Revelation 7:9, which is in Jerusalem, may be the Wedding celebration. Jesus is revealed then, to His people. 2 Thessalonians 1:10, Revelation 14:1

More inventions

You need to rethink your beliefs, coreissue, as they just don't relate to what the Bible says.

You're the one that needs to rethink.
 

Vexatious

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So where do you see the future going?

The anti rapture group never answers that question. Nor can they deal with OT prophecy and the book of Revelations and what they say.

Christians do have some different views on the future (your view of the future isn't Christian). One historically common view is postmillennialism, that the church will continue to grow and then Christ will return when the whole world is Christian.
 

CoreIssue

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okay.

This contradicts what you just stated above...."none exist today as then....but today the 6th and 7th are in play".....

Physically the 7 seven churches do not exist as then....and referring to a specific denomination such as Catholic really gets away from the seven churches which were addressed....so we have numerous denominations of churches today....far more than seven....so in my opinion the spiritual condition of those 7 churches can be found in one way or another in our church today....so the question would be....what spiritual condition is your church in today and how will it prevail in the end times.
Christians do have some different views on the future (your view of the future isn't Christian). One historically common view is postmillennialism, that the church will continue to grow and then Christ will return when the whole world is Christian.
My view is held by millions.

Dominionist are the majority to believe in postmillennialism. A minority belief that has almost disappeared.

Mid-trib is another minority belief.

Most believe in pre trib, post trib and amil(extremely non-literal and mostly catholic.