Question about heaven

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verzanumi24

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Shalom, verzanumi24.



You're right, of course. I was speaking more to the issue of whether we will recognize others, but there is no "Heaven" in the traditional sense. However, we should qualify that:

First, there MAY be a "Heaven" if the spirits of people who have died do, in fact, go to Paradise when they die and if Paradise can be said to be "Heaven."

"Paradise" is an English transliteration of the Greek word "paradeisos," which in turn is a transliteration of the Hebrew word "pardeec" meaning "a park; an orchard." It is a nickname for the New Jerusalem where Yeshua` (Jesus) went after He ascended, because in the New Jerusalem exists the Tree of Life and the Water of Life. He SAID He was going to "prepare us a place in His Father's house," and Yochanan (John) said that the New Jerusalem was the "tabernacle of God." The word "tabernacle" comes from the Greek word "skeenee" meaning a Bedouin "tent," much as that in which Avraham (Abraham) lived.

Second, after the Millennium - the first 1000 years of Yeshua's reign - the New Jerusalem will descend to the New Earth (re-created after the Fire which occurs immediately after the Millennium). At that time, "Heaven," if you will allow it to be called that, will be on earth.

Third, there is no "Heaven," per se, as a non-material, immaterial or other-dimensional place. The word "heaven" comes from the Greek word "ouranos" which means the "sky." No better place is this seen than in the Greek New Testament of Matthew 16:1-4:

The KJV says,

Matthew 16:1-4
1 The Pharisees also with the Sadducees came, and tempting desired him that he would shew them a sign from heaven.
2 He answered and said unto them, When it is evening, ye say, It will be fair weather: for the sky is red.
3 And in the morning, It will be foul weather to day: for the sky is red and lowring. O ye hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky; but can ye not discern the signs of the times?
4 A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas. And he left them, and departed.
KJV


The Greek NT says,

Kata Maththaion 16:1-4
1 Kai proselthontes hoi Farisaioi kai Saddoukaioi peirazontes epeerooteesan auton seemeion ek tou ouranou epideixai autois.
2 Ho de apokritheis eipen autois,
"Opsias genomenees legete, 'Eudia, purrazei gar ho ouranos.'
3 Kai prooi, 'Seemeron cheimoon, purrazei gar stugnazoon ho ouranos.' To men prosoopon tou ouranou ginooskete diakrinein, ta de seemeia toon karioon ou dunasthe?
4 Genea poneera kai moichalis seemeion epizeetei, kai seemeion ou dotheesetai autee ei mee to seemeion Ioona."
Kai katalipoon autous apeelthen.
Greek New Testament (United Bible Societies)


Notice that the SAME WORD translated "heaven" in verse 1 is translated "sky" in verses 2 and 3! (Endings just determine case and number.)

Now, there ARE other Greek words translated as "heaven," "heavens," or "heavenly": ouranothen, mesouraneema, ouranios, and epouranios. However, each of these is based upon "ouranos." The word "ouranothen" means "from ouranos"; "mesouraneema" means "in the middle of ouranos"; "ouranios" is an adjective form that means "of ouranos"; and "epouranios" means "of above-ouranos." The only one that refers to some place other than the "sky" is "epouranios." If it means "of above-the-sky," then it refers to what we call "outer space." This word is sometimes translated as "celestial," as in 1 Corinthians 15:40-41:

1 Corinthians 15:40-41
40 There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
41 There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory.
KJV


So, as one can see, "celestial" (epouranios) refers to bodies such as the "sun," "moon," and "stars." It is also currently used of the New Jerusalem:

Hebrews 12:22
22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly (Greek: epouranios) Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
KJV


However, when the city comes down to the New Earth, it comes out of the "ouranos":

Revelation 21:2
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven (Greek: ouranos), prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
KJV


Now, I don't know if or why we would be zipping all over the universe, but we could...I suppose. However, one must admit that this is pure speculation because the Scriptures are silent about this part of what you wrote.

Shalom again, verzanumi24.



Sure it is! Why not? Just because Paul chose to leave it nebulous so that it applies to all, that doesn't mean that he meant it in some figurative way! To the contrary, he IS talking about the future, and he is talking about when "that which is perfect (mature) is come." Why would you say otherwise? Please don't be contrary just to be contrary. We have enough of that on this board already!


The structure of the sentence does not support your argument. There is nothing in that chapter where the author was addressing the question that OP is asking. And besides, the belief that mainstream Christians have that they are going to go to Heaven when Jesus returns is not Biblical.
 

Retrobyter

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Shalom, verzanumi24.

So, what happens to the believers when they die? What are you advocating? (You might be surprised if I agree.)
 

verzanumi24

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Shalom, verzanumi24.

So, what happens to the believers when they die? What are you advocating? (You might be surprised if I agree.)

The Bible says the spirit of the dead (whether they are a believer or non believer) goes back to God. Now when Jesus returns that Bible says that the dead in Christ will rise first and the believers that are alive their bodies will changed, and they will rise up to meet Jesus in the air. So no doubt the believer or saints will have a body but it will be a glorified body but everyone will be recognizable. The believer will not be spirit because spirit does not have a body. The Bible says the believer will have a spiritual body. Only human beings will have a body and Jesus has a body because He is one of us and the saints will have a body just like Jesus’ body when He returns.


But I repeat, there is no scripture in the Bible that says the believer is going to Heaven……our home will be the Earth and even God Himself will come and live with man.
 

revturmoil

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The Bible says the spirit of the dead (whether they are a believer or non believer) goes back to God. Now when Jesus returns that Bible says that the dead in Christ will rise first and the believers that are alive their bodies will changed, and they will rise up to meet Jesus in the air. So no doubt the believer or saints will have a body but it will be a glorified body but everyone will be recognizable. The believer will not be spirit because spirit does not have a body. The Bible says the believer will have a spiritual body. Only human beings will have a body and Jesus has a body because He is one of us and the saints will have a body just like Jesus’ body when He returns.

But I repeat, there is no scripture in the Bible that says the believer is going to Heaven……our home will be the Earth and even God Himself will come and live with man.

I agree with your post but I tend to believe that in most cases a spirit does have a body. That too is something that can be debated forever.

As far as what happens when we die? I say we go to paradise and wait for the resurrection. Some people think we come back to earth. I'm not sure or concerned. I think we go to the New Jerusalem....whereever that may be!But I repeat, there is no scripture in the Bible that says the believer is going to Heaven……and even God Himself will come and live with man.

Absolutely the truth!

our home will (NOT) be the Earth

I see it that way too....so far!


God Himself will (NOT) come and live with man


And I agree with that too.
 

verzanumi24

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I agree with your post but I tend to believe that in most cases a spirit does have a body. That too is something that can be debated forever.

As far as what happens when we die? I say we go to paradise and wait for the resurrection. Some people think we come back to earth. I'm not sure or concerned. I think we go to the New Jerusalem....whereever that may be!But I repeat, there is no scripture in the Bible that says the believer is going to Heaven……and even God Himself will come and live with man.

Absolutely the truth!

There is no scripture that say anyone goes to paradise when they die and Heaven is not a paradise.....nowhere is Heaven describe as being a paradise. A paradise is like a park or a garden which the Bible says the Earth will become during the millennium. And spirit by definition is without body or else it would not be called spirit. So when the body dies the spirit leaves the body and goes to the place of the dead it does not go to Heaven.

I see it that way too....so far! !

That is not what I said…..you edited my post to make it fit what you believe. So let me repeat it…..our home will be the Earth.

And I agree with that too.

I did not say that either…. So let me repeat what I said again….God will come and live on the Earth with man.

If you disagree with me that is fine (though I could have post the scriptures that proves what I'm saying) but do not edit my post to make it say what I did not say.
 

revturmoil

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There is no scripture that say anyone goes to paradise when they die and Heaven is not a paradise.....nowhere is Heaven describe as being a paradise. A paradise is like a park or a garden which the Bible says the Earth will become during the millennium. And spirit by definition is without body or else it would not be called spirit. So when the body dies the spirit leaves the body and goes to the place of the dead it does not go to Heaven.



That is not what I said…..you edited my post to make it fit what you believe. So let me repeat it…..our home will be the Earth.



I did not say that either…. So let me repeat what I said again….God will come and live on the Earth with man.

If you disagree with me that is fine (though I could have post the scriptures that proves what I'm saying) but do not edit my post to make it say what I did not say.

Sorry I misquoted you.

If we don't go to paradise where do we go? Everyone else went to paradise other than a chosen few before the Lord's resurrection.
Altars of Rev. 6 is symbolic of paradise. That's why the martyrs are told to wait a little longer. Jesus told the repented theif that he would go to paradise. And every word used to describe where we go infer a place of peace and rest or paradise type setting.

When you say God will come and live on earth with man do you mean Jesus?
 

verzanumi24

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Sorry I misquoted you.

If we don't go to paradise where do we go? Everyone else went to paradise other than a chosen few before the Lord's resurrection.
Altars of Rev. 6 is symbolic of paradise. That's why the martyrs are told to wait a little longer. Jesus told the repented theif that he would go to paradise. And every word used to describe where we go infer a place of peace and rest or paradise type setting.

There is no scripture in the Bible that said that anyone went to paradise before or after Jesus' resurrection. Much of the book of Revelation is symbolic so you should not take everything in it as literal. Even in Genesis when Cain killed his brother Able God said the voice of his brother's blood cried out from the ground(Genesis 4:10) but no one actually believe that Able's blood literally cried out from the ground. So why would you think that when it says that the martyrs cried out that they literally did that? And it does not say they were in paradise either. And where was Jesus after He died? Does the Bible say that Jesus was in paradise when He died? Do you know what a paradise it? The problem is that a lot of people make certain assumptions instead of studying the entire Bible to learn the truth and I’m including a lot of pastors and ministers.....they pick and chose what parts of the Bible they read or study so they end up coming to faulty conclusions.




When you say God will come and live on earth with man do you mean Jesus?

No, not just Jesus God the Father Himself will live on the Earth with man.
 

verzanumi24

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Jesus told the thief on the cross beside him,Today you will be with me in paradise.

So you are saying that Jesus did not die that He was not in the grave as He said He would for three days and three nights?

Matthew 12:40 (ASV)
[sup]40 [/sup]for as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the whale; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.


And after Jesus was raised from the dead He did not want anyone to touch Him because He said He had not yet assened to the Father.....so He was not in Heaven either.
John 20:17 (ASV)
[sup]17 [/sup]Jesus saith to her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended unto the Father: but go unto my brethren, and say to them, I ascend unto my Father and your Father, and my God and your God.



Neither Jesus nor the thief was in paradise because they were dead......the paradise that Jesus was talking about was the world during the millennium when Jesus is ruling as king of kings on the Earth. That is when the thief will be in paradise with Jesus along with all those who have died. The translaters put the comma in the wrong place after they transated that scripture in English.

This is how its translated

Luke 23:43 (ASV)
[sup]43 [/sup]And he said unto him,
Verily I say unto thee, To-day shalt thou be with me in Paradise.


This is how it should be translated

Luke 23:43
[sup]43 [/sup]And he said unto him,
Verily I say unto thee To-day, shalt thou be with me in Paradise.


Notice that last one that I place the comma between the word Day and the word Shall......that is where the comma should be. People seem not to know that comma, period, exclamation sign and so on were not in Greek or Hebrew so a translator has to try to figure out where a period or a question mark would go and they don't always get it right.
 

revturmoil

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There is no scripture in the Bible that said that anyone went to paradise before or after Jesus' resurrection. Much of the book of Revelation is symbolic so you should not take everything in it as literal. Even in Genesis when Cain killed his brother Able God said the voice of his brother's blood cried out from the ground(Genesis 4:10) but no one actually believe that Able's blood literally cried out from the ground. So why would you think that when it says that the martyrs cried out that they literally did that? And it does not say they were in paradise either. And where was Jesus after He died? Does the Bible say that Jesus was in paradise when He died? Do you know what a paradise it? The problem is that a lot of people make certain assumptions instead of studying the entire Bible to learn the truth and I’m including a lot of pastors and ministers.....they pick and chose what parts of the Bible they read or study so they end up coming to faulty conclusions.

No, not just Jesus God the Father Himself will live on the Earth with man.

What do you mean that...

There is no scripture in the Bible that said that anyone went to paradise before or after Jesus' resurrection

What did Jesus mean when he said, "today you will be with me in paradise?"

Who and where are the people waiting for a resurrection under the altar in Rev. 6?

Altars are symbolic of altars. “And Jesus said to him, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, today you will be with me in Paradise’.” (Luke 23:43)

When speaking about Lazarus and the rich man in Luke 16:19 Jesus said, "there was a certain rich man."

I take that literal because said, "there was!" It's not a parable. What is Abraham's bosom?

What does Ephesian's 4:9 mean to you?

Ephesians 4:9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?

What did Jesus mean when He said in Revelation 1:18, “I am he who lives, and was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore. Amen. And I have the keys of Hades and of Death.”

Where did Jesus and the repented theif that followed Him go when they died?

Matthew 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

I've alway's believed that paradise was part of Hades.

Who are these spirits Jesus preached to in prison?

1 Peter 3:19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;

Some people say there is no more paradise because of this verse....and I disagree!

2 Corinthians 12:2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.
3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)
4 How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

Paradise is "the intermediate state."

Baker's dictionary of theology.

By the intermediate state is meant that realm or condition in which the soul exist between the death of the body and the resurrection. That such a state is a reality is acknowledged by practically all branches of our christian church. Differences of opinion regarding it have to do primarily with the nature of of the state, as to whether or not it is pugatorial, in character, whether or not the soul may reform and repent, and whether the soul is concious or asleep.

The bible has comparatively little to say about the intermediate state, evidently because it is only a tempory condition. Rather it focuses attention on the return of Christ and the new era that is to follow. There are however several passages that teach that it is a state of concious existence for both the righteous and the wicked. For the righteous it is a time of rest and of blessedness and joy. And for the wicked it involves suffering. The parable of the rich man and Lazarus represents Lazarus as concious and blessed in Abraham's bosom, while the rich man is in torment (Luke 16:19-31). While on the cross Christ promised the penitent theif, "Today shalt thou be with me in paradise" (Luke 23:43). And John say's: "Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from henceforth: yes, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labors; for their works follow with them" (Rev. 14:13 ASV). See also 2 Cor. 5:8 and Phil. 1:23. From these verses we learn that after the death of the body the saints live gloriously in the presence of God and amid the transcendent splendor of paradise.

The intermediate state is sometimes characterized as a state of rest does not mean that those who have a part in it are idle or inactive. Rather the word "rest" carries with it the idea of satisfaction in labor, or joy in accomplishment. All of the unpleasant features are removed so that the activity of the saints is no longer "toil" or "labor".
But even for the righteous the intermediate state is a time of imperfection, first, because the spirit is without a body, which for human beings is an abnormal condition; and, second, because the rewards promised to the saints are not given in their fulness until the second coming of Christ. See Luke 14:14 and 2 Tim. 4:8. The blessings of the intermediate state, great as they are, are to be looked upon as only an earnest and foretaste of the good things which are to come.
The life of man is thus represented as falling not into two but into three states. First there is the period from birth until death, which is life in the present world and in the natural body. Second, there is life in the intermediate state, which is life without the body. And third, there is life in the resurrection body and in the fulness of heaven (qv) which is the final and eternal state.

The third state is when we go to heaven
 

verzanumi24

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What do you mean that...



What did Jesus mean when he said, "today you will be with me in paradise?"

Who and where are the people waiting for a resurrection under the altar in Rev. 6?

Altars are symbolic of altars. “And Jesus said to him, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, today you will be with me in Paradise’.” (Luke 23:43)

When speaking about Lazarus and the rich man in Luke 16:19 Jesus said, "there was a certain rich man."

I take that literal because said, "there was!" It's not a parable. What is Abraham's bosom?

What does Ephesian's 4:9 mean to you?

Ephesians 4:9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?

What did Jesus mean when He said in Revelation 1:18, “I am he who lives, and was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore. Amen. And I have the keys of Hades and of Death.”

Where did Jesus and the repented theif that followed Him go when they died?

Matthew 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

I've alway's believed that paradise was part of Hades.

Who are these spirits Jesus preached to in prison?

1 Peter 3:19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;

Some people say there is no more paradise because of this verse....and I disagree!

2 Corinthians 12:2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.
3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)
4 How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

Paradise is "the intermediate state."

Baker's dictionary of theology.

By the intermediate state is meant that realm or condition in which the soul exist between the death of the body and the resurrection. That such a state is a reality is acknowledged by practically all branches of our christian church. Differences of opinion regarding it have to do primarily with the nature of of the state, as to whether or not it is pugatorial, in character, whether or not the soul may reform and repent, and whether the soul is concious or asleep.

The bible has comparatively little to say about the intermediate state, evidently because it is only a tempory condition. Rather it focuses attention on the return of Christ and the new era that is to follow. There are however several passages that teach that it is a state of concious existence for both the righteous and the wicked. For the righteous it is a time of rest and of blessedness and joy. And for the wicked it involves suffering. The parable of the rich man and Lazarus represents Lazarus as concious and blessed in Abraham's bosom, while the rich man is in torment (Luke 16:19-31). While on the cross Christ promised the penitent theif, "Today shalt thou be with me in paradise" (Luke 23:43). And John say's: "Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from henceforth: yes, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labors; for their works follow with them" (Rev. 14:13 ASV). See also 2 Cor. 5:8 and Phil. 1:23. From these verses we learn that after the death of the body the saints live gloriously in the presence of God and amid the transcendent splendor of paradise.

The intermediate state is sometimes characterized as a state of rest does not mean that those who have a part in it are idle or inactive. Rather the word "rest" carries with it the idea of satisfaction in labor, or joy in accomplishment. All of the unpleasant features are removed so that the activity of the saints is no longer "toil" or "labor".
But even for the righteous the intermediate state is a time of imperfection, first, because the spirit is without a body, which for human beings is an abnormal condition; and, second, because the rewards promised to the saints are not given in their fulness until the second coming of Christ. See Luke 14:14 and 2 Tim. 4:8. The blessings of the intermediate state, great as they are, are to be looked upon as only an earnest and foretaste of the good things which are to come.
The life of man is thus represented as falling not into two but into three states. First there is the period from birth until death, which is life in the present world and in the natural body. Second, there is life in the intermediate state, which is life without the body. And third, there is life in the resurrection body and in the fulness of heaven (qv) which is the final and eternal state.

The third state is when we go to heaven

Read post #49 it may answer some of your questions.
 

revturmoil

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Read post #49 it may answer some of your questions.

I don't have any questions. The ones I asked were directed to you and others!

What you said here is incorrect,


This is how its translated

Luke 23:43 (ASV)
[sup]43 [/sup]And he said unto him,
Verily I say unto thee, To-day shalt thou be with me in Paradise.


This is how it should be translated

Luke 23:43
[sup]43 [/sup]And he said unto him,
Verily I say unto thee To-day, shalt thou be with me in Paradise.

Does Jesus ever say "today" I'm telling you this...?

What an outright fabrication! There's no reason for a dying man on a cross to convey to someone and remind them that he is saying something "today!"

You distort the scriptures to fit a false doctrine...which is always the case! The JW'S do the same on this one.

TODAY was the day they both died and that day they were both in paradise!

http://www.gci.org/bible/luke/comma
 

ENOCH2010

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Paul said to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. The body dies and the soul returns to God that gave it
I agree nobody is going to heaven to stay,the new Jerusalem is comming here after the 1000 year reign,but until then the soul at death goes back to the Father.
 

MTPockets

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This subject of this Thread relates to another question which needs to be answered first:
What does the following verse mean? -> "And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus", (Eph 2:6)

Would you agree that the verb "and made us" is past tense? Meaning: we are now already/presently seated in heavenly places?

Also, check the related verses below:
Eph 1:3
Eph 3:10
Eph 1:20

It seems to me that the question needing answer is essentially: What's the difference between "heaven" (as most people express it) and "heavenly places"?

What does it means to be "seated in heavenly places"?
 

verzanumi24

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I don't have any questions. The ones I asked were directed to you and others!

What you said here is incorrect,




Does Jesus ever say "today" I'm telling you this...?

What an outright fabrication! There's no reason for a dying man on a cross to convey to someone and remind them that he is saying something "today!"

You distort the scriptures to fit a false doctrine...which is always the case! The JW'S do the same on this one.

TODAY was the day they both died and that day they were both in paradise!

http://www.gci.org/bible/luke/comma

Tell me this; where or what is that paradise that you believe Jesus and the thief was that day? Is it Heaven or what? Do you believe that comma or question mark are in Hebrew or Greek, yes or no?
 

Retrobyter

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Shalom, MTPockets.

This subject of this Thread relates to another question which needs to be answered first:
What does the following verse mean? -> "And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus", (Eph 2:6)

Would you agree that the verb "and made us" is past tense? Meaning: we are now already/presently seated in heavenly places?

Also, check the related verses below:
Eph 1:3
Eph 3:10
Eph 1:20

It seems to me that the question needing answer is essentially: What's the difference between "heaven" (as most people express it) and "heavenly places"?

What does it means to be "seated in heavenly places"?

No, it is not the past tense. It is the aorist indicative active tense which is timeless and only expressed as past tense in English because we have no equivalent. There are three ways that the aorist indicative can be expressed: constative, ingressive, and effective, depending on where the emphasis lies. If the stress is placed on the beginning of the action, it is ingressive; if the stress is placed on the conclusion or the end results of the action, it is effective. If the point-action is unmodified, it is constative. In this passage, because we are focusing on the END RESULTS, it is the effective expression. Thus, this needs to be thought of as a "done deal" and the action is punctiliar; that is, it treats the action as a point - it does not distinguish between complete or incomplete action, as does the present tense and the imperfect tense.

The difference between "heaven," which is most of the time from the Greek word "ouranos" meaning the "sky," and the "heavenlies" or "heavenly places" in this particular verse, the adjective form "epouranios" meaning "of above-the-sky," is whether Paul was referring to the atmosphere of our planet or outer space. The same adjective, "epouranios," is used as a modifier for the "heavenly" (New) Jerusalem in Hebrews 12:22. It was also translated as "celestial" in 1 Corinthians 15:40-41, referring to the "celestial" bodies, the sun, the moon and the stars.

Shalom, verzanumi24.

So you are saying that Jesus did not die that He was not in the grave as He said He would for three days and three nights?

Matthew 12:40 (ASV)
[sup]40 [/sup]for as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the whale; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.


And after Jesus was raised from the dead He did not want anyone to touch Him because He said He had not yet assened to the Father.....so He was not in Heaven either.
John 20:17 (ASV)
[sup]17 [/sup]Jesus saith to her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended unto the Father: but go unto my brethren, and say to them, I ascend unto my Father and your Father, and my God and your God.



Neither Jesus nor the thief was in paradise because they were dead......the paradise that Jesus was talking about was the world during the millennium when Jesus is ruling as king of kings on the Earth. That is when the thief will be in paradise with Jesus along with all those who have died. The translaters put the comma in the wrong place after they transated that scripture in English.

This is how its translated

Luke 23:43 (ASV)
[sup]43 [/sup]And he said unto him,
Verily I say unto thee, To-day shalt thou be with me in Paradise.


This is how it should be translated

Luke 23:43
[sup]43 [/sup]And he said unto him,
Verily I say unto thee To-day, shalt thou be with me in Paradise.


Notice that last one that I place the comma between the word Day and the word Shall......that is where the comma should be. People seem not to know that comma, period, exclamation sign and so on were not in Greek or Hebrew so a translator has to try to figure out where a period or a question mark would go and they don't always get it right.

Sorry, but that is a bad way to handle Scripture. Kaoticprofit is correct.

Luke 23:43
43 Kai eipen autoo,
"Ameen soi legoo, seemeron met' emou esee en too Paradeisoo."
Greek New Testament

The Greek is basically the same as the English translation: "seemeron," translated as "to day," FOLLOWS the Greek comma; it does NOT precede it!
 

verzanumi24

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It's already been explained in my previous 2 post! You just didn't read it or the link!

The Bible says that at dead the spirit goes back to God.....it does not say anything about paradise. The story that Jesus told of Lazarus and the rich man was not describe as if they were in paradise. Paradise has to do with having tree, flowers and so on. And Jesus never said that He was in paradise when He was dead.

Shalom, MTPockets.



No, it is not the past tense. It is the aorist indicative active tense which is timeless and only expressed as past tense in English because we have no equivalent. There are three ways that the aorist indicative can be expressed: constative, ingressive, and effective, depending on where the emphasis lies. If the stress is placed on the beginning of the action, it is ingressive; if the stress is placed on the conclusion or the end results of the action, it is effective. If the point-action is unmodified, it is constative. In this passage, because we are focusing on the END RESULTS, it is the effective expression. Thus, this needs to be thought of as a "done deal" and the action is punctiliar; that is, it treats the action as a point - it does not distinguish between complete or incomplete action, as does the present tense and the imperfect tense.

The difference between "heaven," which is most of the time from the Greek word "ouranos" meaning the "sky," and the "heavenlies" or "heavenly places" in this particular verse, the adjective form "epouranios" meaning "of above-the-sky," is whether Paul was referring to the atmosphere of our planet or outer space. The same adjective, "epouranios," is used as a modifier for the "heavenly" (New) Jerusalem in Hebrews 12:22. It was also translated as "celestial" in 1 Corinthians 15:40-41, referring to the "celestial" bodies, the sun, the moon and the stars.

Shalom, verzanumi24.



Sorry, but that is a bad way to handle Scripture. Kaoticprofit is correct.

Luke 23:43
43 Kai eipen autoo,
"Ameen soi legoo, seemeron met' emou esee en too Paradeisoo."
Greek New Testament

The Greek is basically the same as the English translation: "seemeron," translated as "to day," FOLLOWS the Greek comma; it does NOT precede it!

This is that same scripture in the Greek, now tell me where do you see a comma in that verse?

Luke 23:43 (Scrivener)
[sup]43 [/sup]κaι ειπεν aυτω ο ιησους aμην λεγω σοι σημερον μετ εμου εση εν τω πaρaδεισω
 

Retrobyter

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Shalom verzanumi24.

The Bible says that at death the spirit goes back to God.....it does not say anything about paradise. The story that Jesus told of Lazarus and the rich man was not describe as if they were in paradise. Paradise has to do with having trees, flowers and so on. And Jesus never said that He was in paradise when He was dead.

This is that same scripture in the Greek, now tell me where do you see a comma in that verse?

Luke 23:43 (Scrivener)
[sup]43 [/sup]κaι ειπεν aυτω ο ιησους aμην λεγω σοι σημερον μετ εμου εση εν τω πaρaδεισω

Look, I'm prone to agree with you because I believe that people do not go to "Heaven" when they die but must experience the resurrection of their bodies before their life will continue. They must be re-created. This all goes back to a MASSIVE study in "heaven," "hell," "soul" and "spirit" I did back in the 70s and 80s in which I looked up EVERY verse of Scripture that had ANYTHING to do with the afterlife.

However, Yeshua` certainly DID say that the thief on the cross beside Him WOULD be with Him in "paradise" ("en too paradeisoo" above), although perhaps not that very day.

You need to know that there ARE Scriptures that say that Paradise is something which we may anticipate:

In Revelation 2:7, Yochanan records Yeshua` as saying,

Revelation 2:1-7
1 Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write; These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks;
2 I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars:
3 And hast borne, and hast patience, and for my name's sake hast laboured, and hast not fainted.
4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.
5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.
6 But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate.
7 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.
KJV


Then, in Revelation 22:1-2 we read:

Revelation 22:1-2
22 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.
KJV


And this relates to Revelation 21:21:

Rev 21:9-21
9 And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
11 Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;
12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
13 On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.
14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.
15 And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof.
16 And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal.
17 And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.
18 And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass.
19 And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;
20 The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolite; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.
21 And the twelve gates were twelve pearls; every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.
KJV


So, the Holy Jerusalem, the New Jerusalem, has a street of pure gold and within the median of the street and on both sides of the river, one could find the Tree of Life. Therefore, it is safe to conclude that either the New Jerusalem CONTAINS Paradise or may indeed BE Paradise, God's PARK!

Furthermore, it is the New Heaven or Sky, the THIRD Heavens, the THIRD Skies, according to Peter in 2 Peter 3:3-13, to which Paul was referring in 2 Corinthians 12:1-4:

2 Corinthians 12:1-4
1 It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord.
2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up (Greek: "harpagenta" = "snatched away," not "up") to the third heaven.
3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)
4 How that he was caught up (Greek: "heerpagee" = "he was snatched away," not "up") into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.
KJV


2 Peter 3:3-13
3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens (#1) were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
7 But the heavens (#2) and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens (#3) and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
KJV


And this corresponds to Revelation 21:1-3:

Revelation 21:1-3
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
KJV


So, I believe that Paradise is just another name for the New Jerusalem or at least for the New Park within the New Jerusalem that will spill out on the New Earth after it lands.
 

verzanumi24

Advanced Member
Aug 17, 2007
775
65
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New Yonk City
Shalom verzanumi24.



Look, I'm prone to agree with you because I believe that people do not go to "Heaven" when they die but must experience the resurrection of their bodies before their life will continue. They must be re-created. This all goes back to a MASSIVE study in "heaven," "hell," "soul" and "spirit" I did back in the 70s and 80s in which I looked up EVERY verse of Scripture that had ANYTHING to do with the afterlife.

However, Yeshua` certainly DID say that the thief on the cross beside Him WOULD be with Him in "paradise" ("en too paradeisoo" above), although perhaps not that very day.

You need to know that there ARE Scriptures that say that Paradise is something which we may anticipate:

In Revelation 2:7, Yochanan records Yeshua` as saying,

Revelation 2:1-7
1 Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write; These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks;
2 I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars:
3 And hast borne, and hast patience, and for my name's sake hast laboured, and hast not fainted.
4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.
5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.
6 But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate.
7 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.
KJV


Then, in Revelation 22:1-2 we read:

Revelation 22:1-2
22 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.
KJV


And this relates to Revelation 21:21:

Rev 21:9-21
9 And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
11 Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;
12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
13 On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.
14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.
15 And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof.
16 And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal.
17 And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.
18 And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass.
19 And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;
20 The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolite; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.
21 And the twelve gates were twelve pearls; every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.
KJV


So, the Holy Jerusalem, the New Jerusalem, has a street of pure gold and within the median of the street and on both sides of the river, one could find the Tree of Life. Therefore, it is safe to conclude that either the New Jerusalem CONTAINS Paradise or may indeed BE Paradise, God's PARK!

Furthermore, it is the New Heaven or Sky, the THIRD Heavens, the THIRD Skies, according to Peter in 2 Peter 3:3-13, to which Paul was referring in 2 Corinthians 12:1-4:

2 Corinthians 12:1-4
1 It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord.
2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up (Greek: "harpagenta" = "snatched away," not "up") to the third heaven.
3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)
4 How that he was caught up (Greek: "heerpagee" = "he was snatched away," not "up") into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.
KJV


2 Peter 3:3-13
3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens (#1) were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
7 But the heavens (#2) and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens (#3) and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
KJV


And this corresponds to Revelation 21:1-3:

Revelation 21:1-3
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
KJV


So, I believe that Paradise is just another name for the New Jerusalem or at least for the New Park within the New Jerusalem that will spill out on the New Earth after it lands.
Shalom verzanumi24.



Look, I'm prone to agree with you because I believe that people do not go to "Heaven" when they die but must experience the resurrection of their bodies before their life will continue. They must be re-created. This all goes back to a MASSIVE study in "heaven," "hell," "soul" and "spirit" I did back in the 70s and 80s in which I looked up EVERY verse of Scripture that had ANYTHING to do with the afterlife.

However, Yeshua` certainly DID say that the thief on the cross beside Him WOULD be with Him in "paradise" ("en too paradeisoo" above), although perhaps not that very day.

You need to know that there ARE Scriptures that say that Paradise is something which we may anticipate:

In Revelation 2:7, Yochanan records Yeshua` as saying,

Revelation 2:1-7
1 Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write; These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks;
2 I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars:
3 And hast borne, and hast patience, and for my name's sake hast laboured, and hast not fainted.
4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.
5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.
6 But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate.
7 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.
KJV


Then, in Revelation 22:1-2 we read:

Revelation 22:1-2
22 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.
KJV


And this relates to Revelation 21:21:

Rev 21:9-21
9 And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
11 Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;
12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
13 On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.
14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.
15 And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof.
16 And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal.
17 And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.
18 And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass.
19 And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;
20 The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolite; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.
21 And the twelve gates were twelve pearls; every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.
KJV


So, the Holy Jerusalem, the New Jerusalem, has a street of pure gold and within the median of the street and on both sides of the river, one could find the Tree of Life. Therefore, it is safe to conclude that either the New Jerusalem CONTAINS Paradise or may indeed BE Paradise, God's PARK!

Furthermore, it is the New Heaven or Sky, the THIRD Heavens, the THIRD Skies, according to Peter in 2 Peter 3:3-13, to which Paul was referring in 2 Corinthians 12:1-4:

2 Corinthians 12:1-4
1 It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord.
2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up (Greek: "harpagenta" = "snatched away," not "up") to the third heaven.
3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)
4 How that he was caught up (Greek: "heerpagee" = "he was snatched away," not "up") into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.
KJV


2 Peter 3:3-13
3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens (#1) were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
7 But the heavens (#2) and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens (#3) and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
KJV


And this corresponds to Revelation 21:1-3:

Revelation 21:1-3
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
KJV


So, I believe that Paradise is just another name for the New Jerusalem or at least for the New Park within the New Jerusalem that will spill out on the New Earth after it lands.



[font="Arial""]Jesus simply meant that the man would be in the second resurrection along with the House of Israel, the people of Sodom and Gomorrah, Jews of Jesus' day and all those who did not repent before they died. Jesus was assuring him that all is not hopeless despite how things may seem....this is good news for all people believers as well as none believers.[/font]

[font="Arial""][/font][font="Arial""][/font]

[font="Arial""]Ezekiel 37:1-14 (NKJV) [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]1 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]The hand of the Lord came upon me and brought me out in the Spirit of the Lord, and set me down in the midst of the valley; and it [font="Arial""]was[/font] full of bones. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]2 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]Then He caused me to pass by them all around, and behold, [font="Arial""]there were[/font] very many in the open valley; and indeed [font="Arial""]they were[/font] very dry. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]3 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And He said to me, "Son of man, can these bones live?" So I answered, "O Lord God, You know." [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]4 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]Again He said to me, "Prophesy to these bones, and say to them, 'O dry bones, hear the word of the Lord! [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]5 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]Thus says the Lord God to these bones: "Surely I will cause breath to enter into you, and you shall live. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]6 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]I will put sinews on you and bring flesh upon you, cover you with skin and put breath in you; and you shall live. Then you shall know that I [font="Arial""]am[/font] the Lord." ' " [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]7 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]So I prophesied as I was commanded; and as I prophesied, there was a noise, and suddenly a rattling; and the bones came together, bone to bone. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]8 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]Indeed, as I looked, the sinews and the flesh came upon them, and the skin covered them over; but [font="Arial""]there was[/font] no breath in them. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]9 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]Also He said to me, "Prophesy to the breath, prophesy, son of man, and say to the breath, 'Thus says the Lord God: "Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe on these slain, that they may live." ' " [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]10 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]So I prophesied as He commanded me, and breath came into them, and they lived, and stood upon their feet, an exceedingly great army. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]11 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]Then He said to me, "Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel. They indeed say, 'Our bones are dry, our hope is lost, and we ourselves are cut off!' [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]12 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]Therefore prophesy and say to them, 'Thus says the Lord God: "Behold, O My people, I will open your graves and cause you to come up from your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]13 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]Then you shall know that I [font="Arial""]am[/font] the Lord, when I have opened your graves, O My people, and brought you up from your graves. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]14 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]I will put My Spirit in you, and you shall live, and I will place you in your own land. Then you shall know that I, the Lord, have spoken [font="Arial""]it[/font] and performed [font="Arial""]it,"[/font] says the Lord.' " [/font]
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[font="Arial""]Revelation 20:1-5 (ASV) [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]1 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven, having the key of the abyss and a great chain in his hand. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]2 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And he laid hold on the dragon, the old serpent, which is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years, [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]3 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]and cast him into the abyss, and shut it, and sealed it over him, that he should deceive the nations no more, until the thousand years should be finished: after this he must be loosed for a little time. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]4 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus, and for the word of God, and such as worshipped not the beast, neither his image, and received not the mark upon their forehead and upon their hand; and they lived, and reigned with Christ a thousand years. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]5 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]The rest of the dead lived not until the thousand years should be finished[/font][font="Arial""]. This is the first resurrection. [/font]
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[font="Arial""]Jesus said the people of His generation will be resurredted with the people of Nineveh, the queen of the South, the people of Sodom and the people of Tyre[/font][font="Arial""][/font]

[font="Arial""]Matthew 12:41-42 (ASV) [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]41 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]The men of Nineveh shall stand up in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for they repented at the preaching of Jonah; and behold, a greater than Jonah is here. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]42 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]The queen of the south shall rise up in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and behold, a greater than Solomon is here. [/font]
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[font="Arial""] [/font][font="Arial""][/font]

[font="Arial""]Luke 10:12-14 (NASB77) [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]12 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]"I say to you, it will be more tolerable in that day for Sodom, than for that city.[/font][font="Arial""] [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]13 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]"Woe to you, Chorazin! Woe to you, Bethsaida! For if the miracles had been performed in Tyre and Sidon which occurred in you, they would have repented long ago, sitting in sackcloth and ashes.[/font][font="Arial""] [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]14 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]"But it will be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon in the judgment, than for you.[/font][font="Arial""] [/font]
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[font="Arial""] [/font][font="Arial""][/font]

[font="Arial""], Acts 24:15 (NKJV) [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]15 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]I have hope in God, which they themselves also accept, that[font="Arial""] there will be a resurrection of [/font][font="Arial""]the[/font][font="Arial""] dead[/font], both of [font="Arial""]the[/font] just [font="Arial""]and [/font][font="Arial""]the[/font][font="Arial""] unjust[/font]. [/font]
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[font="Arial""] [/font][font="Arial""][/font]

[font="Arial""]The world will be a different place than it is now that even the desert will be like a garden[/font][font="Arial""][/font]

[font="Arial""]Isaiah 35:1-10 (ASV) [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]1 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]The wilderness and the dry land shall be glad; and the desert shall rejoice, and blossom as the rose. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]2 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]It shall blossom abundantly, and rejoice even with joy and singing; the glory of Lebanon shall be given unto it, the excellency of Carmel and Sharon: they shall see the glory of Jehovah, the excellency of our God. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]3 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]Strengthen ye the weak hands, and confirm the feeble knees. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]4 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]Say to them that are of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come with vengeance, with the recompense of God; he will come and save you. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]5 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]Then the eyes of the blind shall be opened, and the ears of the deaf shall be unstopped. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]6 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]Then shall the lame man leap as a hart, and the tongue of the dumb shall sing; for in the wilderness shall waters break out, and streams in the desert. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]7 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And the glowing sand shall become a pool, and the thirsty ground springs of water: in the habitation of jackals, where they lay, shall be grass with reeds and rushes. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]8 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And a highway shall be there, and a way, and it shall be called The way of holiness; the unclean shall not pass over it; but is shall be for the redeemed: the wayfaring men, yea fools, shall not err therein. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]9 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]No lion shall be there, nor shall any ravenous beast go up thereon; they shall not be found there; but the redeemed shall walk there: [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]10 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]and the ransomed of Jehovah shall return, and come with singing unto Zion; and everlasting joy shall be upon their heads: they shall obtain gladness and joy, and sorrow and sighing shall flee away. [/font]
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[font="Arial""] [/font][font="Arial""][/font]

[font="Arial""]A prophecy of Jesus as the chief King over the Earth and glimps of what the Earth will be like then.[/font][font="Arial""][/font]

[font="Arial""]Isaiah 11:1-16 (ASV) [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]1 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And there shall come forth a shoot out of the stock of Jesse, and a branch out of his roots shall bear fruit. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]2 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And the Spirit of Jehovah shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of Jehovah. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]3 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And his delight shall be in the fear of Jehovah; and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither decide after the hearing of his ears; [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]4 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]but with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and decide with equity for the meek of the earth; and he shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth; and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]5 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And righteousness shall be the girdle of his waist, and faithfulness the girdle of his loins. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]6 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And the wolf shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]7 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together; and the lion shall eat straw like the ox. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]8 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the adder's den. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]9 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain; for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of Jehovah, as the waters cover the sea. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]10 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And it shall come to pass in that day, that the root of Jesse, that standeth for an ensign of the peoples, unto him shall the nations seek; and his resting-place shall be glorious. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]11 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord will set his hand again the second time to recover the remnant of his people, that shall remain, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]12 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And he will set up an ensign for the nations, and will assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]13 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]The envy also of Ephraim shall depart, and they that vex Judah shall be cut off: Ephraim shall not envy Judah, and Judah shall not vex Ephraim. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]14 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And they shall fly down upon the shoulder of the Philistines on the west; together shall they despoil the children of the east: they shall put forth their hand upon Edom and Moab; and the children of Ammon shall obey them. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]15 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And Jehovah will utterly destroy the tongue of the Egyptian sea; and with his scorching wind will he wave his hand over the River, and will smite it into seven streams, and cause men to march over dryshod. [/font]
[sup][font="Arial""]16 [/font][/sup][font="Arial""]And there shall be a highway for the remnant of his people, that shall remain, from Assyria; like as there was for Israel in the day that he came up out of the land of Egypt. [/font]
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