See John 4:35-38.Is it harvest time... and are you one of the reapers to whom the Master speaks?
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See John 4:35-38.Is it harvest time... and are you one of the reapers to whom the Master speaks?
I don't know of any group with an already established set of doctrines that always teaches it all right. This is my point. You focus on those named three as if anyone in them is bound to miss the way to God. That is not how God works.You're trying to divert the conversation. God decides who saved and who is not.
But, we know Oneness, Mormonism and Jehovah witnesses, in example, do not teach the biblical God and/or salvation.
There are a lot of people in churches and even in pulpits that are not saved.
Then go preach your message to their unsaved fellows who are hungry and thirsty. Don't try to force feed anyone. Jesus never did that.There are street people and those living in ghettos in Muslim nations and in grass huts in Africat hat are saved.
Is it? Then why did you mention it?Where heaven is is off topic.
What was obvious to them may not be so obvious to you or to me even though we may think so.The apostles talked to a lot of people. Some were so obviously not saved and they warned them they better get saved.
We live for God by faith and knowledge Christianity has been called the most knowledge based religion in the world.
But all of our study without the leading of the Holy Ghost is a wasted effort. God does not give us every answer we want but rather every answer that He decides that we need.God commands us to study to always be prepared with an answer.
Glad you were able to help.Some who do salute strictly by faith are going to get a warm awakening when they die.
I have brought people around by answering their questions on issues that required some knowledge of science.
Even if you are called to preach and/or teach, you can only share what you have with someone whose door is open. For good reason of bad, we are not to break the door down to force feed anyone. God put the choice in each person's hands. Of course you believe you are correct, but so do I and so do many in these groups you describe as cults. Arm twisting is still not allowed.You want turn somebody off the listening that is cynical. Quote the Bible out of.
Paul on the street of idols began talking about their religion and skills. Then he led them around to Christ. Did not start off talking about Christ.
Angels are the harvesters, not humans. But humans are the preachers and we are not told to let God do it all but that we are tools of God who have work to do.
from yesterdays exposes one would not of thought so..It's not a religion that I even carry, but a relationship with the One who died for me on Calvary...
Totally agreed.from yesterdays exposes one would not of thought so..
Maybe so, but if you want to really get to know Christ you are going to have to walk away from all that religion, it puts boxes around God and Jesus , like a plant in a flower pot, your roots have no where to go, so you never grow into that tree that Jesus desires,Totally agreed.
ANY person's relationship with God is just that- a relationship, and it's individual. It's not about labels. We need to see and love the other individuals in our lives, even when it seems like they are doing totally wrong things. If we look to labels or what *we* think someone is, we will miss that person and risk missing Christ.
In my own personal testimony, I hungered and thirsted after righteousness, and was filled, for a full year of studying my Bible...but was not saved...because my righteousness was in the law and not by the faith of Jesus Christ (Philippians 3:9)...I was seeking to establish my own righteousness and was not submitting to the righteousness of the Lord (Romans 10:3-4)...I based not my salvation on what Christ had done for me but rather on what I could do to save myself (see 1 Corinthians 15:1-4)."Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled." Matt 5:6
How do you know who among those is really hungry or thirsty for the right things and who is not? Or in any other group already condemned by the supposed powers that be... which powers are NOT God?
I don't think that having a structured group of believers or communal faith is inherently a bad thing. It can certainly become a very bad thing if it comes to replace/blind that individual relationship a person has with Christ-- totally. But when kept in it's proper supporting role, it can be a very good thing. God is always the King. His servants are (flawed) helpers. Again, nothing to replace that individual relationship with Christ, only support it.Maybe so, but if you want to really get to know Christ you are going to have to walk away from all that religion, it puts boxes around God and Jesus , like a plant in a flower pot, your roots have no where to go, so you never grow into that tree that Jesus desires,
Jesus has so much to offer us, if only we will let him out of that religious box we shove Him in. I do hope you get to see Him, it something you will never forget...than you wont want anything to do with religion. God and Jesus dont have a religious bone between them.
Perhaps you have explained your problem for yourself. Until you understood what was lacking I do not believe God held it against you. When you understood you took care of it. If you had died physically prior to having understood the lack, I don't believe God would have charged you with the lack. Is our God unfair? Is He a respecter of persons? He knows how much we know and we understands what we are doing with what we have and why. Don't sell Him short!In my own personal testimony, I hungered and thirsted after righteousness, and was filled, for a full year of studying my Bible...but was not saved...because my righteousness was in the law and not by the faith of Jesus Christ (Philippians 3:9)...I was seeking to establish my own righteousness and was not submitting to the righteousness of the Lord (Romans 10:3-4)...I based not my salvation on what Christ had done for me but rather on what I could do to save myself (see 1 Corinthians 15:1-4).
I don't know of any group with an already established set of doctrines that always teaches it all right. This is my point. You focus on those named three as if anyone in them is bound to miss the way to God. That is not how God works.
"Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled." Matt 5:6
How do you know who among those is really hungry or thirsty for the right things and who is not? Or in any other group already condemned by the supposed powers that be... which powers are NOT God?
Then go preach your message to their unsaved fellows who are hungry and thirsty. Don't try to force feed anyone. Jesus never did that.
Is it? Then why did you mention it?
What was obvious to them may not be so obvious to you or to me even though we may think so.
But... who among Christians knows the difference between what he really knows and what he only believes? Are there not some things that each of us thinks he knows but actually only believes? Is it not possibly or even likely that some of those things are embraced in error?
"He must increase, but I must decrease" John 3:30
But all of our study without the leading of the Holy Ghost is a wasted effort. God does not give us every answer we want but rather every answer that He decides that we need.
Glad you were able to help.
Even if you are called to preach and/or teach, you can only share what you have with someone whose door is open. For good reason of bad, we are not to break the door down to force feed anyone. God put the choice in each person's hands. Of course you believe you are correct, but so do I and so do many in these groups you describe as cults. Arm twisting is still not allowed.
If humans are not harvesters, why you insist on putting these outside the Church when they say they belong? Because you are right? Even that does not give you the right to push them out.
amadeus said: ↑
Is it harvest time... and are you one of the reapers to whom the Master speaks?
Moses was in the desert for 40 years alone till he was ready, even Jesus after His baptism went into the desert for 40 days, Noah in the Ark 40 days and 40 nights, the israelites 40 years in the desert, if you want to know Christ and God than you have to become separated from the world and all this religious stuff, it will just hinder your walk more than help it.. Nice to have friends id rather know Christ... can be a very lonely walk, but you get out of it what you put in.. A thousand years in church doesnt compare to a moment with Christ. But it is your choice....I don't think that having a structured group of believers or communal faith is inherently a bad thing. It can certainly become a very bad thing if it comes to replace/blind that individual relationship a person has with Christ-- totally. But when kept in it's proper supporting role, it can be a very good thing. God is always the King. His servants are (flawed) helpers. Again, nothing to replace that individual relationship with Christ, only support it.
Perhaps you have explained your problem for yourself. Until you understood what was lacking I do not believe God held it against you. When you understood you took care of it. If you had died physically prior to having understood the lack, I don't believe God would have charged you with the lack. Is our God unfair? Is He a respecter of persons? He knows how much we know and we understands what we are doing with what we have and why. Don't sell Him short!
So you did not push, but you have excluded or agreed to the exclusion that someone else had put in place. Ultimately how is that different?2 Corinthians 11:4 New International Version (NIV)
4 For if someone comes to you and preaches a Jesus other than the Jesus we preached, or if you receive a different spirit from the Spirit you received, or a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it easily enough.
I never said a word about pushing anybody out. So don't go there.
So then shake the dust with regard to her if you believe that applies. If it does then your conversation with her should be finished. But remember that you're not at the door to her home, but on an open forum and you invited her to the thread. She is the guest. You don't consider the way you treated your guest as being rude?Revelation 14:14-20 New International Version (NIV)
Harvesting the Earth and Trampling the Winepress
14 I looked, and there before me was a white cloud, and seated on the cloud was one like a son of mana]">[a] with a crown of gold on his head and a sharp sickle in his hand. 15 Then another angel came out of the temple and called in a loud voice to him who was sitting on the cloud, “Take your sickle and reap, because the time to reap has come, for the harvest of the earth is ripe.” 16 So he who was seated on the cloud swung his sickle over the earth, and the earth was harvested.
17 Another angel came out of the temple in heaven, and he too had a sharp sickle. 18 Still another angel, who had charge of the fire, came from the altar and called in a loud voice to him who had the sharp sickle, “Take your sharp sickle and gather the clusters of grapes from the earth’s vine, because its grapes are ripe.” 19 The angel swung his sickle on the earth, gathered its grapes and threw them into the great winepress of God’s wrath. 20 They were trampled in the winepress outside the city, and blood flowed out of the press, rising as high as the horses’ bridles for a distance of 1,600 stadia,
1 Corinthians 3:7 New International Version (NIV)
7 So neither the one who plants nor the one who waters is anything, but only God, who makes things grow.
John 4:37 New International Version (NIV)
37 Thus the saying ‘One sows and another reaps’ is true.
I have gotten people out of cults but it required patience and diligence and accuracy.
We are in the end times and there the context is the two harvests of revelations.
But apparently you were not speaking in those terms so I posted the appropriate verse.
I also remind you the apostles were told to shake the dust off their sandals and keep moving with certain people.
But nothing I said justified you saying basically either agree with me or get out.
I repeat, we are commanded to study under the guidance of the Holy Spirit.
Whether you know it or not what you say appears to say study is pretty much irrelevant.
See 2 John 1:9-11 (kjv).
For all you know I am interested in what she believes and wanted to know her response to the attacks against her faith on the website in question.
Now of course we are to be "edifying" in what we preach (I just today read 2 Corinthians 12:19)...
However, there is a time and a place for tearing down that which is not of the Lord (Jeremiah 1:10) so that you can rebuild on that foundation what is of the Lord. Of course, I do not consider myself an expert by any means concerning dealing with Mormons; and so I do not know that I would even be able to build on that foundation anything that I might be able to finish (unless the building that stands on the foundation now were completely demolished; at which point I might be able to build the true Christian faith on a naked foundation).
We are commanded not to fellowship with the unfruitful deeds of darkness in Ephesians 5:11 (but rather to reprove them).
Understanding that a statement like this may even drive you, @"ByGrace" into the very heart of Mormonism, as a reaction to that which you find to be uncouth; I make the statement anyway, knowing that every person is responsible for the choices that they make when they are faced with what the word of God truly says (and they don't like it). And that if you go to hell because you don't like the words of the preacher and are therefore hankering for false doctrine, it is certainly not the preacher's fault; for he was merely speaking forth the words of sound doctrine. It was prophesied that near the end, men would not endure sound doctrine any more; but would heap up for themselves teachers to tell them what their itching ears want to hear. And the preacher who speaks forth ear-itching statements because he wants the person under his authority to continue to listen to him, isn't faithful.
You directed this whole exposé to her initially.
But remember that you're not at the door to her home, but on an open forum and you invited her to the thread.
Wow, who died and made you the Judge of God's people?
You know nothing about her heart.
I believe she has been very gracious in even responding to you.
I wouldn't have done so.
You were biased against her from the start because she said she was a Mormon and you already had placed all Mormons into what you classify as a cult. All guilty until proven innocent. You directed this whole exposé to her initially. She responded in a polite manner. Your purpose seemingly was to prove that she was in error and should abandon her church in favor of what you were offering.
Did you believe God needed you to prove her error to her?
but as obedience to God to obtain His approval,
Your beliefs are your own, but you accusations based on presumptions of guilt rather innocence should be opposed.
She is promoting "Another Testament of Jesus Christ" simply by saying that she believes in it and by putting her best foot forward.I don't believe that @Jane_Doe22 tried to preach a gospel.
I don't believe that @Jane_Doe22 tried to preach a gospel. She simply answered your questions. You did not take her as she was or really find out how she was. You were biased against her from the start because she said she was a Mormon and you already had placed all Mormons into what you classify as a cult. All guilty until proven innocent. You directed this whole exposé to her initially. She responded in a polite manner. Your purpose seemingly was to prove that she was in error and should abandon her church in favor of what you were offering. What you were offering smelled pretty badly presuming she had nothing worthwhile at all.
When she attempted to correct you, you dismissed her explanations and to worked to finish your task. Did you believe God needed you to prove her error to her?
What you said about Oneness doesn't bother me. I have been baptized by immersion in Jesus' name four times and I consider myself to be a true Trinitarian. I do feel that some who think that they believe in the Trinity, actually believe in Tritheism, however; which is relevant to the discussion on Mormonism since Mormons are verily Tritheists and then Polytheists in their theology. I am also very secure in my faith as a Oneness Pentecostal (I consider myself to be such because of my baptisms, not because of my understanding of the Trinity, which I think may differ from that of most Oneness Pentecostals since I was never indoctrinated by the church; but I could be wrong).I think the reality here is you don't like what I said about Oneness.
Well actually, since you insist, ever since Pentecost. all men ever needed was , is the Holy Spirit, its that most put the bible above Him ,even God and Jesus, it is not Gods doing, We where after Pentecost meant to be led by His Spirit and be taught by Him just so few believe they can, that is the fault of religion and men not God. And so today God doesnt need teaches, prophets evangelists etc, since now we can all know these thing, but that requires Eyes to see, ears to hear, and faith...Here you go again with the old thing of leave it up to the Holy Spirit. If that were the case the prophets in the apostles were never needed. Nor is the Bible.