Proof of the Trinity. No takers?

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101G

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Answer my question first.
I did, one being, and ONE Peson.

One Being.
maybe I can help you out,
Nehemiah 9:6 "Thou, even thou, art LORD alone; thou hast made heaven, the heaven of heavens, with all their host, the earth, and all things that are therein, the seas, and all that is therein, and thou preservest them all; and the host of heaven worshippeth thee.

well for sure that's one of your witness correct, the FATHER Right , "The LORD". he said that HE made all things, and in John 1:3 the WORD said that HE made all things, which is your second witness, correct? Oops ... well either they are the SAME PERSON, or the bible, the scriptures, are contridicting itself, or......... you might be in ERROR..

I'll go with the later..... :cool:
 

Blueberry

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I did, one being, and ONE Peson.


maybe I can help you out,
Nehemiah 9:6 "Thou, even thou, art LORD alone; thou hast made heaven, the heaven of heavens, with all their host, the earth, and all things that are therein, the seas, and all that is therein, and thou preservest them all; and the host of heaven worshippeth thee.

well for sure that's one of your witness correct, the FATHER Right , "The LORD". he said that HE made all things, and in John 1:3 the WORD said that HE made all things, which is your second witness, correct? Oops ... well either they are the SAME PERSON, or the bible, the scriptures, are contridicting itself, or......... you might be in ERROR..

I'll go with the later..... :cool:

Okay. I understand what you think better now. Appreciate your time.

Why do you put "error" in all caps and bright red?
 

Harvest 1874

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By all means, tell us how the doctrine of the Trinity denies the doctrine of Christ's blood being a ransom (this should be good :eating popcorn: )

Those who make light of the word of God show a lack of reverence and respect in the holy things of the Lord, such fell to realize that they not only dishonor the Father but they dishonor themselves as well.

God has arranged for the student of his word certain basic fundamental truths which he deems necessary that one first grasps before they can progresses on to the deeper aspects of the truth. If these basic truths be properly learned it will greatly aid the student from falling prey to many of the various traps and ensnarement’s (errors, false teachings and etc.), which the Adversary through his deluded servants has caused many to stumble.

The problem is that the majority of believers in their haste and desire to learn some of the deeper things of God’s word, such as end time prophecies, the times and the seasons, the second advent and etc., they have neglected to take the time to learn the “first principle doctrines”, and so they are found fumbling about building upon the one sure foundation (their faith in Christ) with many of the wrong materials, viz. “wood, hay and stubble” (the various errors and doctrines propagated by the professing church). It’s like watching a first year medical student attempting to preform surgery who hasn’t yet learned basic anatomy, little wonder they are in so much confusion and are led about from one error to the next.

Instead of being led by and through the first principle doctrines into “the deep things [truths] of God” (1 Cor 2:10) they are found floundering about in “the deep things [errors] of Satan” (Rev 2:24), which “as they say” (the apostate church) are “mysteries”.

There are several first principle doctrines which the Apostle Paul designates as themilk of the word”, which he enumerates in (Heb 6:1, 2), these are of primary importance, and should be thoroughly studied and understood BEFORE attempting to delve into themeat of the word”, but at the core of all these doctrines is one specific doctrine which if all believers had taken the time to rightfully and fully comprehend they would have avoided falling prey to many of the stumbling stones (errors) taught in the professing church today in which many are presently ensnared. That one specific or core doctrine is the RANSOM.

The ransom is the first principle, the very foundation of all true Christian doctrine, every other biblical teaching either stands or falls as it is or is not in harmony with this one central truth. As a “first principle” doctrine (Heb 5:12) it is in truth a part of the “milk of the word” and should be one of the very first lessons learned by the true student of God’s Word, unfortunately Babylon (the professing church) has neglected this lesson, and thus it has lead them into much confusion, especially in regards to the wages of sin, hell, the immortality of the soul, the Trinity, and etc., likewise all considered first principle doctrines (by orthodoxy).

The three most widely held teachings of orthodoxy are the doctrine of the Trinity, the immortality of the soul and eternal torment as the wages of sin. Anyone who professes a belief in any one of these “mysteries” gives clear evidence that they do not understand the ransom, for all three of the foregoing orthodox teachings stand at variance with the scriptural teachings of the ransom.

Very few indeed have any idea what the ransom is or what it represents, true they believe that Jesus shed his blood in behalf of the sinner, “For Without shedding of blood there is no remission” (Heb 9:22), but this is as far as their understanding of the matter generally goes, they fell to understand the true significance of what Christ paid in behalf of the sinner, the true cost of his sacrifice.

A proper understanding and acceptance of the TRUE doctrine of the ransom is essential to ones calling and election, to their growth and membership in the body of Christ, for it is thehubthrough which every other feature of the divine truth radiates.”

We will not here attempt to explain the doctrine as we believe we have already thoroughly done so in our blog post entitled, The Ransom, which if carefully studied and considered would show to the unprejudiced mind that the idea of the Trinity is contrary to the divine testimony, as are the other two commonly held errors of the professing church.
 

101G

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OK my trinitertians post #471 is still out there to be answered, as well as many more, but this one is at the last.

so have at it.

PICJAG
 

Blueberry

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Take note of it, .... (smile). nothing personal...

man. who is made up of 90% water
By weight, the average human adult male is approximately 60% water and the average adult female is approximately 50%
Body water - Wikipedia

I see no need to scream error here.
I am sure you can note this just fine.

The unanswered question was in regards to modalism. I was apparently not clear enough on that.

You started out so pleasant.

Oh well.
:confused:
 

justbyfaith

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One God eternally and simultaneously present in three persons as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

I agree, but would clarify that by saying that the Persons are distinct, not separate.

The Textus Receptus and/or the Majority Text is one of the most corrupted text out there.

lie.

As in 'me, myself and I'

Does that not refer to one person--you?

they have neglected to take the time to learn the “first principle doctrines”,

One of the first principle doctrines is the Deity of Christ, John 8:24; as it is essential to salvation and one of thee first things you must learn when becoming a true Christian.

Anyone who professes a belief in any one of these “mysteries” gives clear evidence that they do not understand the ransom, for all three of the foregoing orthodox teachings stand at variance with the scriptural teachings of the ransom.

How so?

We will not here attempt to explain the doctrine as we believe we have already thoroughly done so in our blog post entitled, The Ransom,

Okay, I will look into it shortly.
 

Blueberry

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Does that not refer to one person--you?

I am not God, but just one human being.

It may have been a bad analogy on my part? Was doing about 3 things at once and not giving this stuff my undivided attention.
 

101G

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By weight, the average human adult male is approximately 60% water and the average adult female is approximately 50%
Body water - Wikipedia

I see no need to scream error here.
I am sure you can note this just fine.

The unanswered question was in regards to modalism. I was apparently not clear enough on that.

You started out so pleasant.

Oh well.
:confused:
so I can take this as you cannot answer the question?

no problem, Good day
 

justbyfaith

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I am not God, but just one human being.

It may have been a bad analogy on my part? Was doing about 3 things at once and not giving this stuff my undivided attention.

You are one person composed of spirit and soul and body--a trinity in nature...nevertheless you are not three persons. If that were the case you would be something like what I would call triphrenic; since your triune nature is confined to a singular human body and is not three bodies. You are not three people but one; however there are three aspects of who you are that can sometimes be in conflict. It is a trichotomoy of flesh, soul, and spirit. These can sometimes in scripture be referred to as the dichotomy of flesh and spirit (see Galatians 5:16-24); which battle for the rights to what is in between them, the soul.
 
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Netchaplain

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I'm glad you brought that out. what do you say to this verse,
Titus 2:10 "Not purloining, but shewing all good fidelity; that they may adorn the doctrine of God our Saviour in all things".

would not God here is the The copulative of "our Saviour", where as "our Saviour" is the predicate to the subject "God", yes or no?.

and if so then God in Isa 35:4 is then the "Father" as you states, would not JESUS who is "our Saviour" is actually the "Father" yes or no?.
No, because the Son (Jhn 3:16), like the Spirit "proceeded from the Father (Jhn 15:26)!

The Son and Spirit are always said to come from the Father or God, because They always represent, not His presence but His will in all things. It is never said that the Father or that God has ever come from the Son or Spirit. Hence that God the Father is in the highest position according to the Son and Spirit, though They Three are equal in Deity, power and essence.

If They were all here in this life in presence, there would be three Deities on the earth, but for now there is only One in presence (who stands for the Father and Son), the Holy Spirit, while the presence of the Father and Son are in Heaven. The presence of the watching eyes of the Father and Son from heaven are always everywhere simultaneously, but not Their presence which is in Heaven.

Thus Titus 2:10 and esp. verse 13 (and all other like passages) are also demonstrations of Christ’s full representation (Col 2:9) of the Father in being addressed as God, same as we would address His Father as God, or the Holy Spirit of God as God (Act 5:3, 4).

I find this also to be exemplified in Isa 9:6 concerning Christ’s “name,” which are titles of who He represents or stands for. In creation Jesus is like a Father or Mighty God, but not in the Trinity which confirms a distinction of Three Individuals. Jesus is not the Father and the Father is not Jesus, hence the Son has been with the Father from everlasting (eternity past and prior to creation) and proceeds from the Father. Have a view of Gill’s comment here on Isa 9:6 concerning “the Mighty God and “the everlasting Father.”
Isaiah 9 Commentary - John Gill's Exposition on the Whole Bible

This may be my final reply for now on the subject of the Trinity because I believe there has been enough discussion to get this general concept without potentially adding excessive information which might only serve to cloud the issue (allowing some soak-in time).

Also appreciate your kind and respectful manor of communication in the “Word of Truth.”

Blessings!
 

Blueberry

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You are one person composed of spirit and soul and body--a trinity in nature...nevertheless you are not three persons. If that were the case you would be something like what I would call triphrenic; since your triune nature is confined to a singular human body and is not three bodies. You are not three people but one; however there are three aspects of who you are that can sometimes be in conflict. It is a trichotomoy of flesh, soul, and spirit. These can sometimes in scripture be referred to as the dichotomy of flesh and spirit (see Galatians 5:16-24); which battle for the rights to what is in between them, the soul.

Appreciate all the effort, really do, but I am not a trinity. I am one human being. I do not have a triune nature. AFAIK?

I am not three people. I am nobody, but somebody in Christ.

Did my spirit begat my soul? I may be some kind of 'phrenic' :confused:, but I don't want to talk about that right now.

Will read this carefully over again at some point. Haven't even had time to properly address the question(s) put to me yet. Sorry this stuff is just not my top priority at the moment. Perhaps something I should not have casually wandered into this afternoon? Just came across some stuff that I wanted to share. So I posted it.
 

Enoch111

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Appreciate all the effort, really do, but I am not a trinity. I am one human being. I do not have a triune nature.
You may be misunderstanding what is being said. Human beings are tripartite beings -- body, soul, and spirit (but from God's perspective, spirit, soul, and body, with the spirit as the most important component).

1. Before a person is regenerated, the spirit is dead. That is why Scripture says that we are *quickened* (made alive) by the Holy Spirit, and this is even the phrase used regarding the resurrection of Christ.

2. When a person dies physically, the soul and spirit are separated from the body. Those who are in Christ go to be with Christ is Heaven. Those who are without Christ go to Hades. There is no such thing as Soul Sleep, and there is no way that the souls and spirits (though distinct) are ever separated. At the Resurrection/Rapture, those same souls and spirits of the saints will be reunited with their immortal bodies, in order to return to Heaven with glorified bodies.

3. Getting back to the Godhead, there are three distinct divine Persons within the Godhead -- Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. They are all God, they are ONE GOD, yet there are three Persons. We are to simply accept this by faith, since this is what the Bible reveals.
 
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Prayer Warrior

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You may be misunderstanding what is being said. Human beings are tripartite beings -- body, soul, and spirit (but from God's perspective, spirit, soul, and body, with the spirit as the most important component).

1. Before a person is regenerated, the spirit is dead. That is why Scripture says that we are *quickened* (made alive) by the Holy Spirit, and this is even the phrase used regarding the resurrection of Christ.

2. When a person dies physically, the soul and spirit are separated from the body. Those who are in Christ go to be with Christ is Heaven. Those who are without Christ go to Hades. There is no such thing as Soul Sleep, and there is no way that the souls and spirits (though distinct) are ever separated. At the Resurrection/Rapture, those same souls and spirits of the saints will be reunited with their immortal bodies, in order to return to Heaven with glorified bodies.

3. Getting back to the Godhead, there are three distinct divine Persons within the Godhead -- Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. They are all God, they are ONE GOD, yet there are three Persons. We are to simply accept this by faith, since this is what the Bible reveals.
justbyfaith was clearly comparing the Godhead with the tripartite nature of humans. That's not a valid comparison. Humans consist of three parts, but we are not a trinity--3 persons.
 

justbyfaith

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there would be three Deities on the earth,

There is only one God according to the shema of the Jewish people (in Deuteronomy 6:4). This concept is basic even to a faith that will not save--it is essential to a faith that does (James 2:19)

I do not have a triune nature. AFAIK?

You do, 1 Thessalonians 5:23.

Will read this carefully over again at some point. Haven't even had time to properly address the question(s) put to me yet. Sorry this stuff is just not my top priority at the moment.

Quite alright; take your time.

and there is no way that the souls and spirits (though distinct) are ever separated.

Actually, see Hebrews 4:12.

justbyfaith was clearly comparing the Godhead with the tripartite nature of humans. That's not a valid comparison. Humans consist of three parts, but we are not a trinity--3 persons.

Considering the definitions of the word parts in tripartite and triune, you are saying that the Godhead is more absolutely one than is spirit and soul and body. For God is triune--three in one. But man is tripartite--made of three parts.

This serves to prove my point quite nicely. God is not tripartite--made of three parts. He is Triune--three in one.

This means that there is not a second God that descended to become the human Jesus, or, an eternally begotten Son (for He was begotten in the incarnation, Luke 1:35, Romans 1:3); and that neither did 1/3 of God descend to become a Man.

The only option left is that God Himself (the Father) descended to become a Man. His name shall be called the Everlasting Father; and the zeal of the LORD of hosts shall perform this.
 
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Prayer Warrior

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There is only one God according to the shema of the Jewish people (in Deuteronomy 6:4). This concept is basic even to a faith that will not save--it is essential to a faith that does (James 2:19)



You do, 1 Thessalonians 5:23.



Quite alright; take your time.



Actually, see Hebrews 4:12.



Considering the definitions of the word parts in tripartite and triune, you are saying that the Godhead is more absolutely one than is spirit and soul and body. For God is triune--three in one. But man is tripartite--made of three parts.

This serves to prove my point quite nicely. God is not tripartite--made of three parts. He is Triune--three in one.

This means that there is not a second God that descended to become the human Jesus, or, an eternally begotten Son (for He was begotten in the incarnation, Luke 1:35, Romans 1:3); and that neither did 1/3 of God descend to become a Man.

The only option left is that God Himself (the Father) descended to become a Man. His name shall be called the Everlasting Father; and the zeal of the LORD of hosts shall perform this.

My point is that God is three persons (and yet one God), but humans are not three persons, but only three parts. There are so many verses that convince me of the Trinity as "triune God—three coexistent, co-eternal Persons who are God," but I'm sure they've all been stated in this thread already, so I will bow out.

(The quoted portion is from gotquestions.org.)
 
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Helen

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My point is that God is three persons (and yet one God), but humans are not three persons, but only three parts. There are so many verses that convince me of the Trinity as "triune God—three coexistent, co-eternal Persons who are God," but I'm sure they've all been stated in this thread already, so I will bow out.

(The quoted portion is from gotquestions.org.)

I "thought" that I knew where all this was going...I "thought" that I was getting it...but now my head is spinning again... LOL :D

It seems to me that everyone is saying the same thing....which probably shows that I still don't have a clue and I am not locked down on any one version of the trinity securely.

I just know that Father, Son and Holy Spirit are GOD.
Other than that, I know nothing about it.

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