Proof of the Trinity. No takers?

Dave L said:

Jesus often spoke as the Son/Word. The second person of the trinity. This according to John 1:ff and Hebrews 1:2.

Click to expand...

well let's see,
Psalms 95:7 "For he is our God; and we are the people of his pasture, and the sheep of his hand. To day if ye will hear his voice”
Psalms 95:8 "Harden not your heart, as in the provocation, and as in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
Psalms 95:9 "When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my work.
Psalms 95:10 "Forty years long was I grieved with this generation, and said, It is a people that do err in their heart, and they have not known my ways:
Psalms 95:11 "Unto whom I sware in my wrath that they should not enter into my rest.

Who was this? the Father, son, or the Holy Ghost?.

Now this, 1 Corinthians 10:2 "And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
1 Corinthians 10:3 "And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
1 Corinthians 10:4 "And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
1 Corinthians 10:5 "But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.
1 Corinthians 10:6 "Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.

so who is the ROCK?
Deuteronomy 32:3 "Because I will publish the name of the LORD: ascribe ye greatness unto our God.
Deuteronomy 32:4 "He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.

Who was this? Father, son, or the Holy Ghost.

Or this, Hebrews 3:6 "But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end.
Hebrews 3:7 "Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice,
Hebrews 3:8 "Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
Hebrews 3:9 "When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.
Hebrews 3:10 "Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.
Hebrews 3:11 "So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)
Hebrews 3:12 "Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.
Hebrews 3:13 "But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.
Hebrews 3:14 "For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;
Hebrews 3:15 "While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.
Hebrews 3:16 "For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses.
Hebrews 3:17 "But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness?
Hebrews 3:18 "And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not
Hebrews 3:19 "So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.

who said, "To day if ye will hear his voice" see Hebrews 3:7 above

so, Who was this? Father, son, or the Holy Ghost.

your answer Dave?. 2 strikes already, don't let it be a third..........

PICJAG

101G said:

Mary "Father", "Son", and "Holy Spirit", are titles not Persons. you know that ... right?

Click to expand...

@Dave L post #1118

And you know your belief was refuted by The Church as heretical a looonnnngggg time ago.....Right?

Soooooo whom should I believe? The Christians that lived closest to the time of Christ or you and your ilk?

BTW....from whom are you quoting your belief? From whom did you get it?

Curious Mary

Dave L said:

But, each speak in the first person and refer to the others in the second person for the most part. Jesus' baptism illustrates this vividly.

Click to expand...

Marymog said:

@Dave L post #1118

And you know your belief was refuted by The Church as heretical a looonnnngggg time ago.....Right?

Soooooo whom should I believe? The Christians that lived closest to the time of Christ or you and your ilk?

BTW....from whom are you quoting your belief? From whom did you get it?

Curious Mary

Click to expand...

I'm not sure I understand your position. Each member of the Godhead spoke in reference to the other members of the Godhead from the first person, mentioning them in the second person for the most part, using the rules of grammar. Jesus spoke from the first person of the Father in the second person, using the rules of grammar. The Holy Spirit said certain things in Acts from the first person to others in the second person. The Father spoke from the first person of the Son in the second person, during Jesus' baptism, using the rules of grammar.

Dave L said:

I'm not sure I understand your position. Each member of the Godhead spoke in reference to the other members of the Godhead from the first person, mentioning them in the second person for the most part, using the rules of grammar. Jesus spoke from the first person of the Father in the second person, using the rules of grammar. The Holy Spirit said certain things in Acts from the first person to others in the second person. The Father spoke from the first person of the Son in the second person, during Jesus' baptism, using the rules of grammar.

Click to expand...

I think I was supporting/agreeing with your post: #1118

I support the Trinity doctrine: Three persons in One.

Mary

101G said:

well let's see,
Psalms 95:7 "For he is our God; and we are the people of his pasture, and the sheep of his hand. To day if ye will hear his voice”
Psalms 95:8 "Harden not your heart, as in the provocation, and as in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
Psalms 95:9 "When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my work.
Psalms 95:10 "Forty years long was I grieved with this generation, and said, It is a people that do err in their heart, and they have not known my ways:
Psalms 95:11 "Unto whom I sware in my wrath that they should not enter into my rest.

Who was this? the Father, son, or the Holy Ghost?.

Now this, 1 Corinthians 10:2 "And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
1 Corinthians 10:3 "And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
1 Corinthians 10:4 "And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
1 Corinthians 10:5 "But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.
1 Corinthians 10:6 "Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.

so who is the ROCK?
Deuteronomy 32:3 "Because I will publish the name of the LORD: ascribe ye greatness unto our God.
Deuteronomy 32:4 "He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.

Who was this? Father, son, or the Holy Ghost.

Or this, Hebrews 3:6 "But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end.
Hebrews 3:7 "Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice,
Hebrews 3:8 "Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
Hebrews 3:9 "When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.
Hebrews 3:10 "Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.
Hebrews 3:11 "So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)
Hebrews 3:12 "Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.
Hebrews 3:13 "But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.
Hebrews 3:14 "For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;
Hebrews 3:15 "While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.
Hebrews 3:16 "For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses.
Hebrews 3:17 "But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness?
Hebrews 3:18 "And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not
Hebrews 3:19 "So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.

who said, "To day if ye will hear his voice" see Hebrews 3:7 above

so, Who was this? Father, son, or the Holy Ghost.

your answer Dave?. 2 strikes already, don't let it be a third..........

PICJAG

Click to expand...

Your scriptures prove nothing. Jesus' baptism proves everything revealing the three distinct persons of the Godhead at once present and yet God. You are trying to drag the Islamic and Jewish understanding of God into the scriptures. But the NT refutes you clearly revealing God as the trinity. Like history proves, you are identical to Islam and Judaism in your version of God. And have nothing to do with the Christian understanding which is trinitarian.

Have you considered Oneness' denial of the Father and the Son, (two persons) is a trait of those with the "spirit of Antichrist"? “Who is the liar, if not the one who denies that Jesus is the Messiah? This one is the antichrist: the one who denies the Father and the Son.” (1 John 2:22) (HCSB)

Christianity is the only religion that is trinitarian in the worship of God. All other religions are Oneness in their worship of God. Oneness Pentecostals broke off from trinitarian Christendom in the early 1900s.

“They went out from us, but they did not belong to us; for if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us. However, they went out so that it might be made clear that none of them belongs to us.” (1 John 2:19) (HCSB)

Jews who rejected Jesus believe basically the same as Oneness and Islam by denying the trinity. Christianity is the only religion that worships God in trinity.

Dave L said:

Have you considered Oneness' denial of the Father and the Son, (two persons) is a trait of those with the "spirit of Antichrist"? “Who is the liar, if not the one who denies that Jesus is the Messiah? This one is the antichrist: the one who denies the Father and the Son.” (1 John 2:22) (HCSB)

Christianity is the only religion that is trinitarian in the worship of God. All other religions are Oneness in their worship of God. Oneness Pentecostals broke off from trinitarian Christendom in the early 1900s.

“They went out from us, but they did not belong to us; for if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us. However, they went out so that it might be made clear that none of them belongs to us.” (1 John 2:19) (HCSB)

Jews who rejected Jesus believe basically the same as Oneness and Islam by denying the trinity. Christianity is the only religion that worships God in trinity.

Click to expand...

First thanks for the reply,

second, you said nothing, but to help you and a few more out, I suggest, you read these sites, it might help you and a few others.

I don't recomend it, nor support this site, but it might put your mind to rest on a few things.

it have some intresting papers on the subject matter we're speaking about.

Here is the Home page web link Right Word Truth | Rightly Dividing The Word Of Truth
just click on the Papers, next to Home.

I have not read all of the papers in details, but i always gleem information.

here is a breakdown of the four Papers on our subject.

Rightly Dividing the Word of Truth


THE TRINITY: IS GOD THREE PERSONS IN ONE?

https://rightwordtruth.com/the-trinity-is-god-three-persons-in-one/


THE TRINITY PART TWO: ELOHIM

https://rightwordtruth.com/the-trinity-part-two-elohim/


THE TRINITY PART THREE: THE SCRIPTURAL EVIDENCE THAT DISPROVES THE DOCTRINE

https://rightwordtruth.com/the-trinity-part-three-the-scriptural-evidence-that-disproves-the-doctrine/


THE TRINITY PART FOUR: DOES JESUS CHRIST SIT NEXT TO GOD IN HEAVEN?

https://rightwordtruth.com/the-trinity-part-four-does-jesus-christ-sit-next-to-god-in-heaven/



JESUS CHRIST IS BOTH JEHOVAH AND THE MANIFESTATION OF JEHOVAH

https://rightwordtruth.com/jesus-christ-is-both-jehovah-and-the-manifestation-of-jehovah/


take your TIME for the writer of the papers goes step by step in his analysis of what he belives.

PS as I said, I do not endorse thes paper, but they bring out some good facts in his argument.

PICJAG

101G said:

First thanks for the reply,

second, you said nothing, but to help you and a few more out, I suggest, you read these sites, it might help you and a few others.

I don't recomend it, nor support this site, but it might put your mind to rest on a few things.

it have some intresting papers on the subject matter we're speaking about.

Here is the Home page web link Right Word Truth | Rightly Dividing The Word Of Truth
just click on the Papers, next to Home.

I have not read all of the papers in details, but i always gleem information.

here is a breakdown of the four Papers on our subject.

Rightly Dividing the Word of Truth


THE TRINITY: IS GOD THREE PERSONS IN ONE?

https://rightwordtruth.com/the-trinity-is-god-three-persons-in-one/


THE TRINITY PART TWO: ELOHIM

https://rightwordtruth.com/the-trinity-part-two-elohim/


THE TRINITY PART THREE: THE SCRIPTURAL EVIDENCE THAT DISPROVES THE DOCTRINE

https://rightwordtruth.com/the-trinity-part-three-the-scriptural-evidence-that-disproves-the-doctrine/


THE TRINITY PART FOUR: DOES JESUS CHRIST SIT NEXT TO GOD IN HEAVEN?

https://rightwordtruth.com/the-trinity-part-four-does-jesus-christ-sit-next-to-god-in-heaven/



JESUS CHRIST IS BOTH JEHOVAH AND THE MANIFESTATION OF JEHOVAH

https://rightwordtruth.com/jesus-christ-is-both-jehovah-and-the-manifestation-of-jehovah/


take your TIME for the writer of the papers goes step by step in his analysis of what he belives.

PS as I said, I do not endorse thes paper, but they bring out some good facts in his argument.

PICJAG

Click to expand...

I don't trust anything you recommend. If you reject the trinity you reject the Christ of the bible. It's that basic. You are closer to Islam and other Oneness world religions than you are to the Christian faith. And this includes all whom you take stock in.

Dave L said:

I don't trust anything you recommend. If you reject the trinity you reject the Christ of the bible. It's that basic. You are closer to Islam and other Oneness world religions than you are to the Christian faith. And this includes all whom you take stock in.

Click to expand...

afraid of the TRUTH?, did you hear what I said, I do not recommend nor support it

justbyfaith said:

It seems to me that "patriitpassianism" is no heresy...for it is clearly taught by Hebrews 9:16-21. It took me long time to realize it perfectly, but after reading it many times I realized that it must be saying that the Father died (for the fact that an Old Covenant/Testament was ratified)...and this can only be if Jesus is the Father and He died through His soul being separated from His body.



This scripture is saying that he is antichrist who denies Jesus Christ...and that this amounts to denying the Father and the Son. I would say because Jesus is the Father and the Son...and therefore to deny Jesus is to deny both of them. Because Jesus is the Father and the Son (Isaiah 9:6).

And for the record, I hold that the Father is a distinct Person from the Son...He both inhabits eternity apart from dwelling in a body of flesh (Isaiah 57:15), and He dwells in a body of flesh (1 John 4:1-3, 2 John 1:7)...therefore He is two Persons (one inhabiting eternity and the other being a Man) and yet the same Person (because it is the same Spirit indwelling the Man).

You don't like my terminology...but you can't refute any of this with scripture. How do I know? Because the scripture does not contradict itself, and what I am saying is substantiated by scripture.

Click to expand...

This is where you fulfill the criteria for having the spirit of Antichrist. John says you deny the Father AND the Son. You do this by saying the Father IS the Son. The word AND does not allow for your interpretation meaning you probably have the wrong spirit.

101G said:

afraid of the TRUTH?, did you hear what I said, I do not recommend nor support it

Click to expand...

God does not allow us to listed to false prophets. It is a grave sin.

justbyfaith said:

That is your interpretation...I would say that you are denying the who the Son really is...and the Father...by denying that they are one and the same Spirit, Lord, and God (1 Corinthians 12:4-6).

Click to expand...

You are in danger rejecting Christ as revealed in scripture and trying to deceive those who follow the true Christ.

justbyfaith said:

I think that it is established even among Trinitarians that Jesus is God. John 8:24 speaks of the condemnation of those who don't. John 8:58 in light of John 8:59, John 10:31-33, and Exodus 3:14 shows that Jesus is either the great I AM or else He is a blasphemer.

What most people don't see in Trinitarian circles is that God is primarily defined in scripture as the Father (1 Corinthians 8:6, Ephesians 4:6, Romans 15:6, James 3:9) and that the very basics of our faith is that there is one God (James 2:19).

Click to expand...

John says those who deny the Father AND the Son have the spirit of Antichrist. This you do when you say the Father IS the Son, clearly debunked at Jesus' baptism. Then you go about enticing the children of God with the same false doctrine.

justbyfaith said:

More and more I am seeing that it is those who accept the historic Trinitarian view (rather than what the Bible says about the doctrine) who are rejecting the true Christ of scripture; for they are the ones drawing the line in the sand...it is dogma in rejection of what the Bible really says...

There is no scriptural backup given for your pov, @Dave L.

I have given a great wealth of scripture to support what I am saying.

So, as I said before, if what I am saying is rejection of the Trinity, then I reject the Trinity; for I know that what I am saying is biblical.

Nevertheless I also know that what I am saying is not in denial of the true Trinity.

Haven't I made the distinction in the members of the Godhead clear in my preaching?

Click to expand...

The Jews who rejected Jesus were no doubt the Antichrists John spoke of. But you believe exactly as the do. If John says they deny the Father AND the Son, he condemns you too for saying the same when you say the Father IS the Son.

justbyfaith said:

I received Jesus Christ in a powerful way when I was 16 years of age. If I have the spirit of antichrist, then I have fallen away from Christ; and therefore another of your pet doctrines is in danger...OSAS.

Click to expand...

I don't believe OSAS. You are in over your head on this and need to repent. You have the wrong spirit if you say the father IS the son. You cannot have a son without a father. You cannot have a father without a son.