Is punishment in hell eternal?

(treeoflife;57526)
Jag,After Jesus was resurrected, He still had the wounds in his flesh. Now, you did say He was in His "spirit body." So, will our spiritual bodies have blemishes and imperfections in them left from wounds made to our physical body? Will we inherit the kingdom maimed, in our spirit bodies, if our physical bodies sustained damage in this life?John 20:25-27Also, where did Jesus' "flesh body" go? The tomb was, and remains, empty.John 20:1-8
I agree that His flesh was empty cause no one saw it. Flesh and blood and flesh and bones are two different things... His flesh and bones can not lose blood. Why? Cause he already died physically...

(thesuperjag;57534)
I agree that his flesh was empty cause no one saw it. Flesh and blood and flesh and bones are two different things... His flesh and bones can not lose blood. Why? Cause he already died physically...
After Jesus was resurrected, He still had the wounds in his flesh. Will our spiritual bodies have blemishes and imperfections in them left from wounds made to our physical body? Also, where did Jesus' "flesh body" go? The tomb was, and remains, empty.

(treeoflife;57535)
(thesuperjag;57535)
I agree that his flesh was empty cause no one saw it. Flesh and blood and flesh and bones are two different things... His flesh and bones can not lose blood. Why? Cause he already died physically...
After Jesus was resurrected, He still had the wounds in his flesh. Will our spiritual bodies have blemishes and imperfections in them left from wounds made to our physical body? Also, where did Jesus' "flesh body" go? The tomb was, and remains, empty.Ahem, do I have to repeat what I said in the first sentence...NO ONE saw His flesh when He was in the tomb.I Corinthians 15:44 - It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.I Corinthians 15:50 - Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

(thesuperjag;57536)
Ahem, do I have to repeat what I said in the first sentence...NO ONE saw His flesh when He was in the tomb.I Corinthians 15:44 - It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.I Corinthians 15:50 - Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
Hey, nobody likes to repeat themselves (neither do I), but you still have not answered the questions. Where did Jesus physical body go? You still haven't said it in plain words or with scripture, so I can only ask again. Am I left to conclude that you aren't answering plainly because doing so will lead you to an answer that disagrees with what you have been saying about Jesus walking around in a "spiritual body", on Earth? Nobody is saying that flesh and blood goes into the Kingdom of God. Jesus was brought back to life, on Earth, and EARTH IS NOT THE KINGDOM OF GOD.Paul tells us that we will be resurrected (in heaven, where flesh and blood do not go) a spiritual body. Of course this is true. That really does not say anything about Jesus walking around, on Earth, after he was resurrected from the dead, on Earth. Jesus wasn't in His Kingdom when He was resurrected, on Earth... that doesn't happen until His ascension later. It is when after/during His ascension that Jesus goes to heaven again, at which point, it is no doubt that He is changed in the *twinkling of an eye*. On Earth, Jesus was very much flesh, before and after His resurrection. I ask you these two specific questions about Jesus to help point that out.After Jesus was resurrected, He still had the wounds in his flesh. The only body of Jesus that existed was the one walking around before them--there was no other body.If this earthly-resurrected-body was Jesus' "spiritual body", then His physical body must be around somewhere (which it was not). Either that, or if this is His spiritual body, it has wounds suffered in the physical. So then will our spiritual bodies, just like Jesus, have wounds? Will our physical imperfections in this life translate into our spiritual bodies in the next life? Jesus was cruicified in the flesh, and yet, his wounds remain in his spiritual body? This is displayed by the nail marks in His hands and the spear hole/imprint in His side.

amen!

(treeoflife;57535)
After Jesus was resurrected, He still had the wounds in his flesh. Will our spiritual bodies have blemishes and imperfections in them left from wounds made to our physical body? Also, where did Jesus' "flesh body" go? The tomb was, and remains, empty.
A little common sense and reading in context answers this one easily. Matthew 17 clearly describes the transfiguration of Jesus. After his death- He WAS in a glorifed body. Why didnt anyone see him? Because He CHOSE not to be seen. Dont you remember when he walked and talked with those 2 men- they were telling this "stranger" how sad they were that this "man of God" was killed. They even invited the stranger into their home. When they broke the bread- then their eyes were opened. Plain and simple- Jesus was in a glorifed body- that could also do the things of the spirit (remain unseen, walk through things)There is only one reason why Jesus' body- Even NOW has those scars- Because he is the Lamb of God that was SLAIN. These holes are for us. It seems like you are trying to differentiate the glorified/transfigured body of Christ- and trying to say when He comes in his Fathers glory it will be different. Jesus Christ- the same yesterday, now, and forever.

Without speaking for him, I think that was Tree's point. If Jesus is still the same today, then He is still a Man. Human males have bodies. If this is not so, then am not sure how one claims He is the same today as He was before His death on the Cross. Not having a body certainly does not sound like the Man described in the NT.

(waquinas;57547)
Without speaking for him, I think that was Tree's point. If Jesus is still the same today, then He is still a Man. Human males have bodies. If this is not so, then am not sure how one claims He is the same today as He was before His death on the Cross. Not having a body certainly does not sound like the Man described in the NT.
I will admit this. I am not so good at explaining things. Hence the reason I let a thing called Scriptures to do the talking. Besides Scriptures needs no man to explain these things.If we had scars, it wouldn't be on our spiritual / glorifying at all. But it was on Christ's glorifying body.

(waquinas;57547)
Without speaking for him, I think that was Tree's point. If Jesus is still the same today, then He is still a Man. Human males have bodies. If this is not so, then am not sure how one claims He is the same today as He was before His death on the Cross. Not having a body certainly does not sound like the Man described in the NT.
Please read my post again, I didnt say he was a mere man now. I said his body was glorified and transfigured. Once again- the reason why HE has the visible real scars- is to SHOW what he has suffered for us- and for His Father. I think you may still be trying to keep him too worldly.

Hell is not a place of eternal torture, God did not create His children to torment some of them for ever! The term "for ever and ever" is an idiom meaning that no longer shall they be for ever. The torment is in being blotted out and not partaking of Heaven with God for an eternity. So complete will this blotting out of a soul be that nobody else will ever know that they had even existed. This is the SECOND death.And it truly shall be a torment to those whom, having just stood before God Himself on Judgment Day, they will have just spoke face to face with God and can see the Glory of Heaven, then they must march into the Lake of Fire never to be anymore. Below we see some Scriptures that document that 'hell' is an eternal perishment, not torture.2 Pet 3:99 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. (KJV)1 Cor 1:1818 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. (KJV)At this present time there is only one soul that has been condemned (by name) to 'hell' (eternal perishing), and that is satan. Below we see it said of satan "never shalt thou be any more." It does not say that satan will roast and suffer in the fires of hell or in some eternal Nazi-type torture chamber of God - God forbid!:Ezek 28:18-1918 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more. (KJV)Below you see a veiled reference to the complete blotting out of a soul till there is nothing left. The below Scripture is speaking about those involved in the occult and what happens to them on Judgment day. They are cast into the flame (the lake of fire) [Rev 20:14]. And then there is nothing left of them, no remains glowing warm, nothing left to burn. This of course goes against the common perception that man has of a "Hell" as a place of eternal burning and suffering. I hope you can see it in the Scripture, like I said, it veiled or somewhat hidden:Isa 47:11-1511 Therefore shall evil come upon thee; thou shalt not know from whence it riseth: and mischief shall fall upon thee; thou shalt not be able to put it off: and desolation shall come upon thee suddenly, which thou shalt not know.12 Stand now with thine enchantments, and with the multitude of thy sorceries, wherein thou hast laboured from thy youth; if so be thou shalt be able to profit, if so be thou mayest prevail.13 Thou art wearied in the multitude of thy counsels. Let now the astrologers, the stargazers, the monthly prognosticators, stand up, and save thee from these things that shall come upon thee.14 Behold, they shall be as stubble; the fire shall burn them; they shall not deliver themselves from the power of the flame: there shall not be a coal to warm at, nor fire to sit before it.15 Thus shall they be unto thee with whom thou hast laboured, even thy merchants, from thy youth: they shall wander every one to his quarter; none shall save thee. (KJV)Below we see one of satan's many names "the son of perdition" which means "the son who is judged to PERISH." Some people may tell you that the son of perdition was Judas Iscariot whom betrayed Christ, but in verse 4 below we see what this 'son of perdition' will be doing. Judas never claimed to be God! The son of perdition is satan by another name, and antichrist by yet another. But it is the same one entity:II Th 2:3-43 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. (KJV)And even furthermore, below we see the place that those judged to 'hell' go. It is the lake of Fire, not 'hell' as we often conceive it to be. In fact, the word 'hell' in the Bible is actually translated from a Hebrew word that means 'the grave' and also the garbage dump outside of Jerusalem. In the lake of Fire souls perish, they are not tormented day after day for ever and ever.Rev 20:12-1512 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. (KJV)Below we see the Lake of Fire being dried up and the evil ones are never anymore. That my friend is the SECOND death and that is true hell to those who perish!Rev 21:1-81 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. (KJV)http://biblestudysite.com/answers6.htm#1

(Red_Letters88;57545)
A little common sense and reading in context answers this one easily. Matthew 17 clearly describes the transfiguration of Jesus. After his death- He WAS in a glorifed body. Why didnt anyone see him? Because He CHOSE not to be seen. Dont you remember when he walked and talked with those 2 men- they were telling this "stranger" how sad they were that this "man of God" was killed. They even invited the stranger into their home. When they broke the bread- then their eyes were opened. Plain and simple- Jesus was in a glorifed body- that could also do the things of the spirit (remain unseen, walk through things)There is only one reason why Jesus' body- Even NOW has those scars- Because he is the Lamb of God that was SLAIN. These holes are for us. It seems like you are trying to differentiate the glorified/transfigured body of Christ- and trying to say when He comes in his Fathers glory it will be different. Jesus Christ- the same yesterday, now, and forever.
He never changes... right. He is the same as He has always been. Since you believe He was in a "glorified" or spiritual body after being raised from the dead (nobody has yet to tell me where His physical body went), then does that mean His glorified/transfigured body *always* contained the scaring suffered during His crucifixion on Earth... even before it? Even before humans, while Lucifer was worshiping in heaven, before Lucifer was cast out? Did Jesus contain the scars even then, since He never changes?Jesus raised Lazarus, and the two others from the dead, in their flesh. Paul raised a man from the dead, in his flesh, after falling from the loft and dying. Just because a person is raised from the dead doesn't mean they are in their spiritual body. God restored the flesh so that it would have it's fully bodily function again as it is supposed to.A little common sense and context would tell us that Jesus was raised from the dead in the same flesh that He was cruicified in, with the scars He received on the cross, and using the only body to be found. He wouldn't have returned to His glorified self until finally leaving Earth, following His final appearance and going to heaven.Sorry, just not seeing it. Jesus literally rose from the dead in the same body He went down in. If you want to say He was glorified in some way, that's fine. I have no doubt that He would have been very glorious, but His physical body was nowhere to be found. It was the same body. If this same body was somehow transfigured in the tomb, into a spiritual body, therby giving account for no body being found... then we can talk about that. But, it is the same body. I just don't see why we would need to believe that Jesus was in a spiritual body until He returned to heaven where flesh and blood do not go and cannot inherit.

(treeoflife;57572)
....Sorry, just not seeing it. ....
Got the right button that time trees, maybe you should put it on the shelf until you are able to see it. :study:

(tomwebster;57584)
Got the right button that time trees, maybe you should put it on the shelf until you are able to see it. :study:
Well, if you're too busy, not showing it to me, using God's Word, that is exactly what I'll do.

[Treeoflife]
He never changes... right. He is the same as He has always been. Since you believe He was in a "glorified" or spiritual body after being raised from the dead (nobody has yet to tell me where His physical body went), then does that mean His glorified/transfigured body *always* contained the scaring suffered during His crucifixion on Earth... even before it? Even before humans, while Lucifer was worshiping in heaven, before Lucifer was cast out? Did Jesus contain the scars even then, since He never changes?
First of all- Both of us have taken Hebrews 13:8 out of context- As I believe it does not refer to appearances. Second, Why are you having such a difficult time with this one? Read Matthew 17 and tell me nothing dramatic happened to the Lords body.
Jesus raised Lazarus, and the two others from the dead, in their flesh. Paul raised a man from the dead, in his flesh, after falling from the loft and dying. Just because a person is raised from the dead doesn't mean they are in their spiritual body. God restored the flesh so that it would have it's fully bodily function again as it is supposed to.
We are talking about the Lamb of God that was slain- you CANT compare that to some ordinary sinner in the flesh. It was clear as day (choosing not to be recognized, walking through walls, just appearing out of nowhere) that this was His old body- holes, scars- Overall appearance- yet this was also a glorified body. He could appear anywhere out of nowhere after the resurrection yet he still sat down and ate with them.
A little common sense and context would tell us that Jesus was raised from the dead in the same flesh that He was cruicified in, with the scars He received on the cross, and using the only body to be found. He wouldn't have returned to His glorified self until finally leaving Earth, following His final appearance and going to heaven.
I never said it WASNT the same body (flesh and bone). I dont know any other way to say this- the reason the Lords body still had/ perhaps has those scars and holes- is for US. This is to show US the sacrifice that was made on our behalf. This is not just some guy crossing over after death and keeping the "effects of his death"
Sorry, just not seeing it. Jesus literally rose from the dead in the same body He went down in. If you want to say He was glorified in some way, that's fine. I have no doubt that He would have been very glorious, but His physical body was nowhere to be found. It was the same body. If this same body was somehow transfigured in the tomb, into a spiritual body, therby giving account for no body being found... then we can talk about that. But, it is the same body. I just don't see why we would need to believe that Jesus was in a spiritual body until He returned to heaven where flesh and blood do not go and cannot inherit.
Once again- I never said he was transfigured in the tomb. I said- Read Matthew 17 and tell me what YOU think its saying/ what happened?Btw, Treeoflife- If you want to continue lets start a new thread ( we are way of course to the OP)