Why isn't the shroud of turin in the bible

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GodsGrace

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(1)

(2)



You are just being obtuse...and playing games.

Answer to number 1 is YES!

Answer to number 2 is - You just don't like is answer, so you just keep repeating the question. How come the rest of us understand what Amadeus is saying, and you keep pretending not to!!

You said to Willie in your post 150 -
Quote...
"If his answer is so clear then please reveal it to me."

And there we have it.
God has either revealed Himself to you and speaks to you, or He has not.
It's called FAITH.
We are people of faith, not a people who have to see signs and miracles before we can believe, ...like Thomas.

We are called believers because we believe. Not because we see something to convince us.
Yes H,
But can we base our faith on something?
Is it a Reasonable faith?

These are very important questions.
I was answered questions a person had for Hours!
I couldn't just keep saying that our beliefs are based on faith and Jesus spoke to our heart.
In this way,,,,we'd never be able to witness. Using this method I mean.

Is it important to you to have solid, reasonable answers available for seekers?
 

GodsGrace

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you saying God sent them to delude the world into following them??

did God send them??
Who deluded the world?
Did you ever read Krishna?
They had whole countries that followed them and still do.

Jesus said, if they are not against us, they are for us.
God has one message.....
 

Marymog

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Answer to number 2 is - You just don't like is answer, so you just keep repeating the question. How come the rest of us understand what Amadeus is saying, and you keep pretending not to!!

Keep pretending not to?????

Are you calling me a liar???

BG......With that statement you make me feel like you are calling me a liar. Would you like to clarify or better articulate that statement?

If you are calling me a liar please just come right out and say it. I don't think you are calling me a liar, but I feel that way. I think you are a kinder person than that.

Mary
 

mjrhealth

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Who deluded the world?
Did you ever read Krishna?
They had whole countries that followed them and still do.

Jesus said, if they are not against us, they are for us.
God has one message.....
If they dont promote Christ than they are not for us...
 

mjrhealth

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Oh.
Everything!!

Jesus was born 2,000 years ago.
What happened before that??

God was always around.
Romans 1:19-20

Krishna (/ˈkrɪʃnə/,[6] Sanskrit pronunciation: [ˈkr̩ʂɳə]; Sanskrit: कृष्ण, translit. Kṛṣṇa) is a major deity in Hinduism. He is worshipped as the eighth avatar of the god Vishnu and also by some as the supreme God in his own right.[7] He is the god of compassion, tenderness, and love in Hinduism,[8][9] and is one of the most popular and widely revered among Indian divinities.[10] Krishna's birthday is celebrated every year by Hindus on Janmashtami according to the lunisolar Hindu calendar, which falls in late August or early September of the Gregorian calendar.[11]

what has Krishna got to do with God ???
 

GodsGrace

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Krishna (/ˈkrɪʃnə/,[6] Sanskrit pronunciation: [ˈkr̩ʂɳə]; Sanskrit: कृष्ण, translit. Kṛṣṇa) is a major deity in Hinduism. He is worshipped as the eighth avatar of the god Vishnu and also by some as the supreme God in his own right.[7] He is the god of compassion, tenderness, and love in Hinduism,[8][9] and is one of the most popular and widely revered among Indian divinities.[10] Krishna's birthday is celebrated every year by Hindus on Janmashtami according to the lunisolar Hindu calendar, which falls in late August or early September of the Gregorian calendar.[11]

what has Krishna got to do with God ???
I'm on a phone and can't write too much.

YOU answer re Romans 1:19-20.....
That's the answer.....
God always revealed Himself.
 

Willie T

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If his answer is so clear then please reveal it to me.

Patient Mary
Amadeus began telling you, way back in posts # 85 and 87... and continuing, that he does not — and never has — needed the miracles and artifacts you seem to need, that you want to keep on saying he also has to need. What more of an answer do you want?
 

gadar perets

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Didn't Jesus give this authority to the apostles in John 29:23?
I assume you meant John 20:23. If so, we all have the authority to forgive the sins of those who sin against us, but neither we, nor the apostles were given the authority to forgive sins that were not committed against us.
 
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Nancy

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Thank you.

Are you suggesting that you understand what he wrote? If so, please show me where he answered my question. He says he answered but I cant find the answer to this question: What evidence did Jesus provide to compel you (amadeaus) to follow and BELIEVE in him? Without the miracles He performed, would you still follow him?

I
may not be able to help educate a person with a low IQ, I have never tried so I don't know. What does that have to do with Amadeus not answering my question after I asked it multiple times and in different ways?

Having a "soft word" and being approachable
does not make one ready to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear. Amadeus is unable to do that in this situation. I believe that once someone starts talking to him they will walk away scratching their heads, confused. Especially when he tells them that he believes that eating/drinking the body/blood of Christ means reading the bible. o_O

@amadeus (non)answers has actually led me to believe that he does not even believe that Jesus performed any miracles and that Jesus was just a wise sage who imparted His wisdom upon the people of his day. I think Amadeus would love The Jefferson Bible.

Mary

PS....I don't "know it all". Only the Church does and I rely on the Church for the Truth. Scripture tells us that the Church is the pillar and foundation of truth. Not you. Not me. The Church. We are also, according to scripture, supposed to go to the Church to settle our differences. So I ask you Nancy: Which Church would you like us to consult to settle this difference amongst us?

Mary

I would just like to say that Amadeus is very intelligent, loves The Lord and would allow The Holy Spirit to guide him into ALL TRUTH. He knows his scriptures, and how can he possibly tell you, right here and now how he would "witness" to an unsaved person, (other than his own personal experiences) when it is The Holy Spirit gives us the words when and if needed!
You obviously do not understand the dynamics of the online forum. Quite different than your own place of worship, eh? It is SO easy to judge a persons every word, and so easy to spew division and hatred. Somebody on this site cannot possibly go through their own local body, the Elders...to settle differences between forum members! And as I see it, you are like a very hungry dog with a bone
with @amadeus and the "differences" seem to be between you and yourself. You cause division among the brethren here :(
PS: Amadeus is above your badgering so, maybe he thinks your constant nagging question after question is not worthy of his answer?
 

GodsGrace

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I assume you meant John 20:23. If so, we all have the authority to forgive the sins of those who sin against us, but neither we, nor the apostles were given the authority to forgive sins that were not committed against us.
Yes, of course I meant John 20:23.
Thanks.

But we all MUST forgive the sins of others...
why would we need any authority?

I have to say that I agree with Protestant doctrine, but this verse gives me a real problem. Jesus specifically said that whose sins they (apostles) forgive will be forgive....etc.

No authority needed for us to forgive the sins of those who sinned against us.
 
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GodsGrace

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Amadeus began telling you, way back in posts # 85 and 87... and continuing, that he does not — and never has — needed the miracles and artifacts you seem to need, that you want to keep on saying he also has to need. What more of an answer do you want?
Does @Marymog mean we need miracles to believe...
OR
Is she saying that miracles can be a sign that Jesus is God?

Haven't been following along --- sorry.
I don't think she meant that we need miracles to believe.

Maybe she could answer?
 

GodsGrace

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It answers noting, what has Krishna got to do with God
I don't know what you're talking about mj.

Krishna never said he was God.
They worship him "as a god"...because that's what THEY want to do.
Atheists believe this of us, BTW, and even some Christians.

What I'm saying is that God did not come into existence when Jesus was born.
God ALWAYS existed.
He revealed Himself to ALL MEN of ALL TIME.
This is what Romans 1:19-20 says...

19because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.
20For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.


There are particular persons that are in tune with God and some that are not.
We call them believers and unbelievers....but the same exists throughout the world.

Do you think there aren't some in small, secluded tribes that do not understand that there is a God?? A creator...

Do you think only we Christians here in a civilized society understand that there is a God,,,a Creator?

What exactly are YOU saying?
I believe what I'm saying is very clear.

Krishna has to do with God because he was before Jesus and because he taught the NATURAL LAW which is THE LAW OF GOD.

Anyone who preaches the natural law of God is of God...just like we believers are of God because we believe in His laws and in His nature.

(I'm not talking about the laws of Moses).
 

gadar perets

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I have to say that I agree with Protestant doctrine, but this verse gives me a real problem. Jesus specifically said that whose sins they (apostles) forgive will be forgive....etc.
If Yeshua truly meant the apostles could forgive the sins of others, then that is a special authority given only to them as they seem to have had a special anointing of the Holy Spirit for that work. We are not told they could pass that authority on to others. However, it seems to me that such forgiveness is done in Messiah's stead, the apostles acting in his authority as his representatives.

2 Corinthians 2:10 To whom you forgive any thing, I (Paul) forgive also: for if I forgave any thing, to whom I forgave it, for your sakes forgave I it in the person of Messiah;​

Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believes in him shall receive remission of sins.​

Can a murderer be forgiven of murder outside the bounds of the Gospel (without Yeshua's shed blood cleansing him)?
 
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GodsGrace

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If Yeshua truly meant the apostles could forgive the sins of others, then that is a special authority given only to them as they seem to have had a special anointing of the Holy Spirit for that work. We are not told they could pass that authority on to others. However, it seems to me that such forgiveness is done in Messiah's stead, the apostles acting in his authority as his representatives.

2 Corinthians 2:10 To whom you forgive any thing, I (Paul) forgive also: for if I forgave any thing, to whom I forgave it, for your sakes forgave I it in the person of Messiah;​

Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believes in him shall receive remission of sins.​

Can a murderer be forgiven of murder outside the bounds of the Gospel (without Yeshua's shed blood cleansing him)?
No. Of course not.

I did read somewhere, sometime, that the Apostles were given this authority to forgive in the sense that they could determine who could be allowed to enter into the church (small c) and who could not. This made some sense. IOW, if they deemed a person was not "worthy" or really meant to be a Christian, they would not be allowed to enter into fellowship with the newly formed church.

This would seem reasonable.

It does seem that membership in the church was very selective until the year 300 or 400 when it was accepted by the Rome ( Constantine). Then, MAYBE, it became to big for this to continue....

It's been estimated that Christians at the end of the 1st century numbered about 8,000. After the 200's it's not known how many belonged to the Christian church.
 

Enoch111

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Anyone who preaches the natural law of God is of God...
Not really. There are many who have no problem with the natural laws of God, but do have a problem with the God of the Bible and with the Lord Jesus Christ. In fact, many evildoers have no problem with the natural laws of God, but they violate the moral and spiritual laws of God every day.
 
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