The Abomination of Desolation?

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Bible_Gazer

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He is King, high priest and sacrificial lamb in the OT, church age and in Revelation and the MK.

Salvation is still there, so nothing is changed or will change except how he executes those roles and promises.

The Holy Spirit will be removed from the earth so that the AC can be revealed and active. In that removal the church has to go.

And just like when Christ said he had to leave for the Holy Spirit to come as the new comforter, so will the Holy Spirit have to leave for Christ to come in that role.

The church will be removed to protect it Tribulation Period. So the tribulations Saints cannot be church.
Revelation 1:9 (KJV)
9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.
God can protect his people from his own wrath and the wrath of others.
God protect Israel during the 10 plaques poured out on Egypt.


There will be a church for those who come out of there Beast system
Revelation 18:2-5 (KJV)
2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

These people who comes out of the false church need a place to go to the true church.


Jesus and the words and the Holy Spirit of God will be the cause of these people coming out.

The Jews will get there blessing as the nation will be converted and its neighbors will be converted, then out to the world.

Like I said the church has different calling. Our time is getting a bride together to reign with Christ during the next 1,000 period.
The church will continues on, the ministry will be preaching the salvation plan to other, they have their own calling at that time.
The church is not going to fall away again as it did before during the Dark Ages.

The church will be stronger than the Beast system(false church).
 

ScottA

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The abomination of desolation is Christ slain before the foundation of the world.

The end of sacrifices is the cross, the apex (middle) of days/times.

"When you see" it, is when it was manifest in the world.

The call to "flee" is to come when called. This is the first resurrection.
 

Enoch111

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The abomination of desolation is Christ slain before the foundation of the world.
Now you are turning Scripture on its head. Where do you come up with these strange and bizarre notions?

The meaning of abomination is a detestable thing, an abominable thing, an accursed thing. The Hebrew word is shiqquts and the Greek word in Matthew 24:15 is bdelugma.

Strong's Concordance (946)
bdelugma: a detestable thing
Original Word: βδέλυγμα, ατος, τό
Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter
Transliteration: bdelugma
Phonetic Spelling: (bdel'-oog-mah)
Definition: a detestable thing
Usage: an abominable thing, an accursed thing.

So what you are telling Christians is that the sacrifice of Christ was an abominable thing. Shame on you for such bizarre nonsense.
 

Waiting on him

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However, you are forgetting TWO extremely significant things about the Tribulation:

1. The two prophets or witnesses of God (whom I believe are Moses and Elijah) will be preaching and performing miracles during the Tribulation Period. See Revelation 11 (and there are no churches mentioned there).

2. An angel will be flying all across the earth proclaiming the everlasting Gospel during the Tribulation. See Revelation 14.

So there goes your theory about a church or churches on earth during that time. Indeed you will not find the word "church" between Revelation 6 and 18 (the period which includes both the Tribulation and the Great Tribulation).
Matthew 11:14-15 KJV
[14] And if ye will receive it , this is Elias, which was for to come. [15] He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.
Can you receive it
Tecarta Bible
 

CoreIssue

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However, you are forgetting TWO extremely significant things about the Tribulation:

1. The two prophets or witnesses of God (whom I believe are Moses and Elijah) will be preaching and performing miracles during the Tribulation Period. See Revelation 11 (and there are no churches mentioned there).

2. An angel will be flying all across the earth proclaiming the everlasting Gospel during the Tribulation. See Revelation 14.

So there goes your theory about a church or churches on earth during that time. Indeed you will not find the word "church" between Revelation 6 and 18 (the period which includes both the Tribulation and the Great Tribulation).

The two witnesses have to be Enoch and Elijah. Simple fact is Moses died a very long time ago, so he cannot buy again. That would violate the Bible.

After the removal of the church lampstands there is never a mention of church or Christian's on the earth again Revelation. It is all Israel.
 

ScottA

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Now you are turning Scripture on its head. Where do you come up with these strange and bizarre notions?

The meaning of abomination is a detestable thing, an abominable thing, an accursed thing. The Hebrew word is shiqquts and the Greek word in Matthew 24:15 is bdelugma.

Strong's Concordance (946)
bdelugma: a detestable thing
Original Word: βδέλυγμα, ατος, τό
Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter
Transliteration: bdelugma
Phonetic Spelling: (bdel'-oog-mah)
Definition: a detestable thing
Usage: an abominable thing, an accursed thing.

So what you are telling Christians is that the sacrifice of Christ was an abominable thing. Shame on you for such bizarre nonsense.
In that case, you have just told Christians that there was nothing for Jesus to forgive of those who crucified Him.

Is that a log in your eye?
 

Waiting on him

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Now you are turning Scripture on its head. Where do you come up with these strange and bizarre notions?

The meaning of abomination is a detestable thing, an abominable thing, an accursed thing. The Hebrew word is shiqquts and the Greek word in Matthew 24:15 is bdelugma.

Strong's Concordance (946)
bdelugma: a detestable thing
Original Word: βδέλυγμα, ατος, τό
Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter
Transliteration: bdelugma
Phonetic Spelling: (bdel'-oog-mah)
Definition: a detestable thing
Usage: an abominable thing, an accursed thing.

So what you are telling Christians is that the sacrifice of Christ was an abominable thing. Shame on you for such bizarre nonsense.
Proverbs 17:15 KJV
[15] He that justifieth the wicked, and he that condemneth the just, even they both are abomination to the Lord .

Tecarta BibleWho has justified you?
 
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BARNEY BRIGHT

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Jesus placed the Abomination of Desolation within the life times of his disciples. Saying "when you see (second person plural) the AOD, leave Jerusalem (Matthew 24:15).

This being the case, how did the AOD happen?

The accounts by Mark and Luke provide supplemental details. Where Matthew uses “standing in a holy place,” Mark 13:14 says “standing where it ought not.” Luke 21:20 adds Jesus’ words: “When you see Jerusalem surrounded by encamped armies, then know that the desolating of her has drawn near.” This helps us to see that the first fulfillment involved the Roman assault on Jerusalem and its temple —a place holy to the Jews but no longer the place holy to Jehovah— which began in 66 C.E. Complete desolation occurred when the Romans destroyed both city and temple in 70 C.E. What was “the disgusting thing” back then? And how did it ‘stand in a holy place’? Answers to these questions will help to clarify the modern-day fulfillment.



6 The Jews thought Daniel 9:26, 27; Daniel 11:31; 12:11 applied to the profanation of the temple by Antiochus IV about 200 years earlier. However, Jesus showed otherwise, urging discernment because “the disgusting thing” was yet to appear and stand in “a holy place.” It is apparent that Jesus was referring to the Roman army that would come in 66 C.E. with distinctive ensigns. Such standards, long in use, were virtual idols and were disgusting to the Jews.*When, though, would they ‘stand in a holy place’? That happened when the Roman army, with its ensigns, attacked Jerusalem and its temple, which the Jews considered holy. The Romans even began to undermine the wall of the temple area. Truly, what had long been disgusting now stood in a holy place! —Isaiah 52:1; Matthew 4:5; 27:53; Acts 6:13.

Since World War I, we have seen the larger fulfillment of Jesus’ sign recorded in Matthew chapter 24. Yet, recall his words: “When you catch sight of the disgusting thing that causes desolation . . . standing in a holy place, . . . then let those in Judea begin fleeing to the mountains.” (Matthew 24:15, 16) This aspect of the prophecy must have fulfillment in our time too.

The Romans attacked Jerusalem in 66 C.E., but they abruptly withdrew, which allowed Christian “flesh” to be saved. (Matthew 24:22) Accordingly, we expect the great tribulation to begin soon, but it will be cut short for the sake of God’s chosen ones. Note this key point: In the ancient pattern, ‘the disgusting thing standing in a holy place’ was linked to the Roman attack under General Gallus in 66 C.E. The modern-day parallel to that attack —the outbreak of the great tribulation— is still ahead. So “the disgusting thing that causes desolation,” which has existed since 1919, apparently is yet to stand in a holy place.* How will this happen? And how can we be affected?

The book of Revelation describes a future destructive attack on false religion. Chapter 17 outlines God’s judgment against “Babylon the Great, the mother of the harlots” —the world empire of false religion. Christendom plays a central part and claims to have a covenant relationship with God. (Compare Jeremiah 7:4.) The false religions, including Christendom, have long had illicit dealings with “the kings of the earth,” but this will end in the desolation of those religions. (Revelation 17:2, 5) At whose hands?

Revelation depicts “a scarlet-colored wild beast” that exists for a time, disappears, and then returns. (Revelation 17:3, 8) This beast is supported by world rulers. Details supplied in the prophecy help us to identify this symbolic beast as a peace organization that came into existence in 1919 as the League of Nations (a “disgusting thing”) and that is now the United Nations. Revelation 17:16, 17 shows that God will yet put it into the hearts of certain human rulers who are prominent in this “beast” to desolate the world empire of false religion. That attack marks the outbreak of the great tribulation.

Since the start of the great tribulation is yet future, is the “standing in a holy place” still ahead of us? Evidently so. While “the disgusting thing” made its appearance early in this century and has, thus, existed for decades, it will take a position in a unique way “in a holy place” in the near future. As first-century followers of Christ must have keenly watched to see how the “standing in a holy place” would develop, so do present-day Christians. Admittedly, we will have to wait for the actual fulfillment to know all the details. Yet, it is noteworthy that in some lands there is already a detectable and growing antipathy toward religion. Some political elements, in league with former Christians who have deviated from the true faith, are promoting hostility against religion in general and true Christians in particular. (Psalm 94:20, 21; 1 Timothy 6:20, 21)

After foretelling ‘the standing of the disgusting thing in a holy place,’ Jesus warned discerning ones to act. Did he mean that at that late point —when “the disgusting thing” is “standing in a holy place”— many people will flee from false religion and take up true worship? Hardly. Consider the first fulfillment. Jesus said: “Let those in Judea begin fleeing to the mountains. Let the man on the housetop not come down, nor go inside to take anything out of his house, and let the man in the field not return to the things behind to pick up his outer garment. Woe to the pregnant women and those suckling a baby in those days! Keep praying that it may not occur in wintertime.” —Mark 13:14-18.

Jesus did not say that only those in Jerusalem needed to withdraw as if his point was that they needed to get out of the center of Jewish worship; nor did his warning mention changing religion —fleeing from the false and taking up the truth. Jesus’ disciples certainly needed no warning about fleeing from one religion to another; they had already become true Christians. And the attack in 66 C.E. did not motivate practices of Judaism in Jerusalem and throughout Judea to abandon that religion and accept Christianity.

How, then, did the comparatively small number of chosen ones back then act on Jesus’ advice? By leaving Judea and fleeing to the mountains across the Jordan, they showed that they were no part of the Jewish system, politically or religiously. They left fields and homes, not even gathering their possessions from their houses. Confident of the protection and support of Jehovah, they put his worship ahead of everything else that might seem important. —Mark 10:29, 30; Luke 9:57-62.

Consider, now, the larger fulfillment. We have for many decades been urging people to get out of false religion and to take up true worship. (Revelation 18:4, 5) Millions have done so. Jesus’ prophecy does not indicate that once the great tribulation breaks out, masses will turn to pure worship; certainly, there was no mass conversion of Jews in 66 C.E. Yet, true Christians will have great incentive to apply Jesus’ warning and flee.

We must be certain that our refuge continues to be Jehovah and his mountainlike organization. (2 Samuel 22:2, 3; Psalm 18:2; Daniel 2:35, 44) That is where we will find protection! We will not imitate the masses of mankind who will flee to “the caves” and hide “in the rock-masses of the mountains” —human organizations and institutions that may remain for a very short while after Babylon the Great are desolated. (Revelation 6:15;18:9-11) True, times may get more difficult —as they would have been in 66 C.E. for pregnant women who fled Judea or for anyone who had to travel in cold, rainy weather. But we can be sure that God will make survival possible. Let us even now reinforce our reliance on Jehovah and his Son, now reigning as King of the Kingdom.
 
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Waiting on him

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The accounts by Mark and Luke provide supplemental details. Where Matthew uses “standing in a holy place,” Mark 13:14 says “standing where it ought not.” Luke 21:20 adds Jesus’ words: “When you see Jerusalem surrounded by encamped armies, then know that the desolating of her has drawn near.” This helps us to see that the first fulfillment involved the Roman assault on Jerusalem and its temple —a place holy to the Jews but no longer the place holy to Jehovah— which began in 66 C.E. Complete desolation occurred when the Romans destroyed both city and temple in 70 C.E. What was “the disgusting thing” back then? And how did it ‘stand in a holy place’? Answers to these questions will help to clarify the modern-day fulfillment.



6 The Jews thought Daniel 9:26, 27; Daniel 11:31; 12:11 applied to the profanation of the temple by Antiochus IV about 200 years earlier. However, Jesus showed otherwise, urging discernment because “the disgusting thing” was yet to appear and stand in “a holy place.” It is apparent that Jesus was referring to the Roman army that would come in 66 C.E. with distinctive ensigns. Such standards, long in use, were virtual idols and were disgusting to the Jews.*When, though, would they ‘stand in a holy place’? That happened when the Roman army, with its ensigns, attacked Jerusalem and its temple, which the Jews considered holy. The Romans even began to undermine the wall of the temple area. Truly, what had long been disgusting now stood in a holy place! —Isaiah 52:1; Matthew 4:5; 27:53; Acts 6:13.

Since World War I, we have seen the larger fulfillment of Jesus’ sign recorded in Matthew chapter 24. Yet, recall his words: “When you catch sight of the disgusting thing that causes desolation . . . standing in a holy place, . . . then let those in Judea begin fleeing to the mountains.” (Matthew 24:15, 16) This aspect of the prophecy must have fulfillment in our time too.

The Romans attacked Jerusalem in 66 C.E., but they abruptly withdrew, which allowed Christian “flesh” to be saved. (Matthew 24:22) Accordingly, we expect the great tribulation to begin soon, but it will be cut short for the sake of God’s chosen ones. Note this key point: In the ancient pattern, ‘the disgusting thing standing in a holy place’ was linked to the Roman attack under General Gallus in 66 C.E. The modern-day parallel to that attack —the outbreak of the great tribulation— is still ahead. So “the disgusting thing that causes desolation,” which has existed since 1919, apparently is yet to stand in a holy place.* How will this happen? And how can we be affected?

The book of Revelation describes a future destructive attack on false religion. Chapter 17 outlines God’s judgment against “Babylon the Great, the mother of the harlots” —the world empire of false religion. Christendom plays a central part and claims to have a covenant relationship with God. (Compare Jeremiah 7:4.) The false religions, including Christendom, have long had illicit dealings with “the kings of the earth,” but this will end in the desolation of those religions. (Revelation 17:2, 5) At whose hands?

Revelation depicts “a scarlet-colored wild beast” that exists for a time, disappears, and then returns. (Revelation 17:3, 8) This beast is supported by world rulers. Details supplied in the prophecy help us to identify this symbolic beast as a peace organization that came into existence in 1919 as the League of Nations (a “disgusting thing”) and that is now the United Nations. Revelation 17:16, 17 shows that God will yet put it into the hearts of certain human rulers who are prominent in this “beast” to desolate the world empire of false religion. That attack marks the outbreak of the great tribulation.

Since the start of the great tribulation is yet future, is the “standing in a holy place” still ahead of us? Evidently so. While “the disgusting thing” made its appearance early in this century and has, thus, existed for decades, it will take a position in a unique way “in a holy place” in the near future. As first-century followers of Christ must have keenly watched to see how the “standing in a holy place” would develop, so do present-day Christians. Admittedly, we will have to wait for the actual fulfillment to know all the details. Yet, it is noteworthy that in some lands there is already a detectable and growing antipathy toward religion. Some political elements, in league with former Christians who have deviated from the true faith, are promoting hostility against religion in general and true Christians in particular. (Psalm 94:20, 21; 1 Timothy 6:20, 21)

After foretelling ‘the standing of the disgusting thing in a holy place,’ Jesus warned discerning ones to act. Did he mean that at that late point —when “the disgusting thing” is “standing in a holy place”— many people will flee from false religion and take up true worship? Hardly. Consider the first fulfillment. Jesus said: “Let those in Judea begin fleeing to the mountains. Let the man on the housetop not come down, nor go inside to take anything out of his house, and let the man in the field not return to the things behind to pick up his outer garment. Woe to the pregnant women and those suckling a baby in those days! Keep praying that it may not occur in wintertime.” —Mark 13:14-18.

Jesus did not say that only those in Jerusalem needed to withdraw as if his point was that they needed to get out of the center of Jewish worship; nor did his warning mention changing religion —fleeing from the false and taking up the truth. Jesus’ disciples certainly needed no warning about fleeing from one religion to another; they had already become true Christians. And the attack in 66 C.E. did not motivate practices of Judaism in Jerusalem and throughout Judea to abandon that religion and accept Christianity.

How, then, did the comparatively small number of chosen ones back then act on Jesus’ advice? By leaving Judea and fleeing to the mountains across the Jordan, they showed that they were no part of the Jewish system, politically or religiously. They left fields and homes, not even gathering their possessions from their houses. Confident of the protection and support of Jehovah, they put his worship ahead of everything else that might seem important. —Mark 10:29, 30; Luke 9:57-62.

Consider, now, the larger fulfillment. We have for many decades been urging people to get out of false religion and to take up true worship. (Revelation 18:4, 5) Millions have done so. Jesus’ prophecy does not indicate that once the great tribulation breaks out, masses will turn to pure worship; certainly, there was no mass conversion of Jews in 66 C.E. Yet, true Christians will have great incentive to apply Jesus’ warning and flee.

We must be certain that our refuge continues to be Jehovah and his mountainlike organization. (2 Samuel 22:2, 3; Psalm 18:2; Daniel 2:35, 44) That is where we will find protection! We will not imitate the masses of mankind who will flee to “the caves” and hide “in the rock-masses of the mountains” —human organizations and institutions that may remain for a very short while after Babylon the Great are desolated. (Revelation 6:15;18:9-11) True, times may get more difficult —as they would have been in 66 C.E. for pregnant women who fled Judea or for anyone who had to travel in cold, rainy weather. But we can be sure that God will make survival possible. Let us even now reinforce our reliance on Jehovah and his Son, now reigning as King of the Kingdom.
If the Jews rebuild the Temple in the future, do you think God will view it as a holy place?