WHY ARE MANY OF US STILL HERE?

Phoneman777 · Feb 18, 2019

The two most popular beliefs in the church today are seemingly not really believed by anyone. When heard proclaimed from the pulpit, they are met with a hearty "AMEN!", but that is as far as belief in them goes. They are:

"We don't have to obey the Ten Commandments".
"When we die, we go straight to heaven."

So, my question to those who claim to believe these two is "why are you still here"? If I can break the sixth commandment and kill myself and go straight to heaven to be with Jesus, why would I spend another day down here?

The answer is obvious: people don't really believe we are at liberty to break the Ten Commandments and people are really unsure about their standing with Christ, no matter how much they claim to be "more than conquerors".

The solution is this: make a FULL SURRENDER TO CHRIST, thank Him for each day He wakes you up, and ask Him "what is Thy bidding, Thou wonderful, merciful Savior, blessed Redeemer and Friend?" This life will soon be over and the only thing we'll carry with us to the Judgment Seat of Christ is our character, either molded into Christ's image by the Potter or dried up, cracked, disfigured, and worthy of only the burn pile.

Helen · Feb 18, 2019

...Or, none of us are as keen on death as we pretend to be!

If we wanted to "be with Jesus" quickly...( many christians say glibly,..... " I can't wait for heaven"....
NOT TRUE....if this were true , no one would run to the doctor when they got sick, but they'd ask us all to pray that that we get worse and die!!! LOL

Enoch111 · Feb 18, 2019

Phoneman777 said:
"We don't have to obey the Ten Commandments".
"When we die, we go straight to heaven."

So, my question to those who claim to believe these two is "why are you still here"?

What does your question have to do with the two above statements? They are unrelated.

In any event the Ten Commandments are now written on the hearts and minds of those who are saved, and also incorporated into the Law of Christ. And when Christians die, they do go straight to Heaven.

So why is anyone still here? Because their time is not up. Each one has an allotted time-span on earth. It is that simple.

Trekson · Feb 18, 2019

Phoneman777 said:
The two most popular beliefs in the church today are seemingly not really believed by anyone. When heard proclaimed from the pulpit, they are met with a hearty "AMEN!", but that is as far as belief in them goes. They are:

"We don't have to obey the Ten Commandments".
"When we die, we go straight to heaven."

So, my question to those who claim to believe these two is "why are you still here"? If I can break the sixth commandment and kill myself and go straight to heaven to be with Jesus, why would I spend another day down here?

The answer is obvious: people don't really believe we are at liberty to break the Ten Commandments and people are really unsure about their standing with Christ, no matter how much they claim to be "more than conquerors".

The solution is this: make a FULL SURRENDER TO CHRIST, thank Him for each day He wakes you up, and ask Him "what is Thy bidding, Thou wonderful, merciful Savior, blessed Redeemer and Friend?" This life will soon be over and the only thing we'll carry with us to the Judgment Seat of Christ is our character, either molded into Christ's image by the Potter or dried up, cracked, disfigured, and worthy of only the burn pile.

It is "appointed unto us once to die", obviously God isn't through with me yet. When you give him control of your life you give him control of your death as well. "To be absent from the body is to be present w/ the Lord." Sounds like you're grasping at straws here.

Phoneman777 · Feb 19, 2019

Enoch111 said:
What does your question have to do with the two above statements? They are unrelated.

In any event the Ten Commandments are now written on the hearts and minds of those who are saved, and also incorporated into the Law of Christ. And when Christians die, they do go straight to Heaven.

So why is anyone still here? Because their time is not up. Each one has an allotted time-span on earth. It is that simple.

The reason why Christians who believe

(1) breaking the Ten Commandments is inconsequential and
(2) at death we go straight to heaven

are still here is because when it comes down to it, they are afraid of death because they know they aren't ready to meet Jesus. Plain and simple. Got nothing to do with "well, I"ve still got a work to do for the Lord..."

Trust me, if I believed I'm at liberty to break God's commandments and I go straight to heaven to be with my Jesus at death, I be gone before sunset. But I know that I'm NOT at liberty to break any of His commandments, and those who break His commandments prove that Jesus is not in their heart at all.

Phoneman777 · Feb 19, 2019

"ByGrace" said:
...Or, none of us are as keen on death as we pretend to be!

If we wanted to "be with Jesus" quickly...( many christians say glibly,..... " I can't wait for heaven"....
NOT TRUE....if this were true , no one would run to the doctor when they got sick, but they'd ask us all to pray that that we get worse and die!!! LOL

One thing's for sure: we don't need prayers for things to get worse...that seems to happen all on it's own!!!

Phoneman777 · Feb 19, 2019

Trekson said:
It is "appointed unto us once to die", obviously God isn't through with me yet. When you give him control of your life you give him control of your death as well. "To be absent from the body is to be present w/ the Lord." Sounds like you're grasping at straws here.

The two ideas: Christians are to give God control of their lives...and...Christians are free to break the Ten Commandments...are contradictory. Yet, most Christians are taught and willingly accept we can break the Ten Commandments all day long and still go to heaven.

So, we're supposed to believe that people really prefer the suffering of this life over the unspeakable joy of heaven? Nah, people are scared of death because they aren't ready to meet Jesus. Plain and simple.

Trekson · Feb 19, 2019

Phoneman777 said:
The two ideas: Christians are to give God control of their lives...and...Christians are free to break the Ten Commandments...are contradictory. Yet, most Christians are taught and willingly accept we can break the Ten Commandments all day long and still go to heaven.

So, we're supposed to believe that people really prefer the suffering of this life over the unspeakable joy of heaven? Nah, people are scared of death because they aren't ready to meet Jesus. Plain and simple.

What you see as breaking the ten commandments, most Christians see the truth of the fulfillment and rest in Christ's finished works. Paul has a lot to say about trying to live for the law, just for the law's sake. We don't ignore the 4th commandment, we just honor it the way God intends and not the way the law says. I'm sure we've been down this road before but stubbornly sticking to the SDA despite the overwhelming evidences that has been shown to you, time and time again. Personally, I'm not at all afraid to meet Jesus because he will judge based on what's in my heart because I'm a sinner saves by grace. We all fail now and again and it really doesn't matter what law finds our weaknesses because we don't proclaim our righteousness over the law, we proclaim His!

Phoneman777 · Feb 19, 2019

Trekson said:
What you see as breaking the ten commandments, most Christians see the truth of the fulfillment and rest in Christ's finished works.

Christ came to MAGNIFY THE LAW (Isaiah 42:21) so that "thou shalt not kill" remains as unchangeable as it has always been, but is also MAGNIFIED to mean we must purify our minds of murderous thoughts. Why do we have to continue to tell you Antinomianists that it's impossible to keep the spirit of the law without by default keeping the letter of the law?

Paul has a lot to say about trying to live for the law

Yes, he said "Ye have not yet resisted unto blood striving against sin", sin being defined in 1 John 3:4 as "transgression of the law". Until your sweat becomes "as it were great drops of blood" in your fight to resist porn watching, unrighteous indignation, etc. please don't talk to me about the virtues of not striving to obey God's law.

We don't ignore the 4th commandment, we just honor it the way God intends and not the way the law says.

So, what God says and what God intends are two different things? God intends that the seventh day Sabbath will be kept in eternity, but we're to believe that He opted for a brief period in Earth history - between the first and second coming - that the devil's day of Sun worship would be a temporarily substitute?

I'm sure we've been down this road before but stubbornly sticking to the SDA despite the overwhelming evidences that has been shown to you, time and time again.

WHAT "overwhelming evidences"??? You've been shown that what God wrote with His own finger in stone is eternal (Psalm 111:7-8), that in the New Covenant He did not alter the thing (His Ten Commandments) gone from His lips (Psalms 89:34), that Christians establish the Ten Commandments (Romans 3:31), and a host of other Biblical proofs that reprove your desire to worship God according to "my will" instead of "Thy will".

Personally, I'm not at all afraid to meet Jesus because he will judge based on what's in my heart

Oh, how I hope that before you meet Him, you'll let the Holy Spirit write the Ten Commandments on your heart, including the seventh day Sabbath commandment to rest and fellowship with God and the brethren...because James says that the Ten Commandment "Law of Liberty" is that which Jesus will judge us by.

because I'm a sinner saves by grace.

If grace is made to be a license to sin, it is no longer grace, it is disgrace.

.We all fail now and again and it really doesn't matter what law finds our weaknesses because we don't proclaim our righteousness over the law, we proclaim His!

No husband is bold enough to insist that he have use of the forgiving heart of his wife as an excuse to cheat on her "now and again". We should be lamenting our failures and begging Jesus to both forgive and change us, not celebrating them because our failure to make a full surrender shuts us out from the overcoming power of Christ to make us "more than conquerors".

Windmillcharge · Feb 19, 2019

Phoneman777 said:
"We don't have to obey the Ten Commandments".

It is interesting how few people remember that Jesus said, 'If, if You Love Me. YOU will keep my commands.'
Strangely Jesus's commands include the 10 commandments.

Trekson · Feb 19, 2019

Phoneman777 said:
Christ came to MAGNIFY THE LAW (Isaiah 42:21) so that "thou shalt not kill" remains as unchangeable as it has always been, but is also MAGNIFIED to mean we must purify our minds of murderous thoughts. Why do we have to continue to tell you Antinomianists that it's impossible to keep the spirit of the law without by default keeping the letter of the law? Poppycock, the main reason Jesus came was because God knew it would be impossible for man to keep the letter of the law, by "magnifying" it the way he did was to show that even those who thought they were righteous by keeping the law, were continually doomed to failure.

Yes, he said "Ye have not yet resisted unto blood striving against sin", sin being defined in 1 John 3:4 as "transgression of the law". Until your sweat becomes "as it were great drops of blood" in your fight to resist porn watching, unrighteous indignation, etc. please don't talk to me about the virtues of not striving to obey God's law. Let's not get carried away with yourself, Jesus didn't sweat blood because he was having a hard time keeping the law. Do you hear how ridiculous that sounds?

So, what God says and what God intends are two different things? God intends that the seventh day Sabbath will be kept in eternity, but we're to believe that He opted for a brief period in Earth history - between the first and second coming - that the devil's day of Sun worship would be a temporarily substitute? There is none so blind as they that will not see. It is kept by faith in Christ's finished works. If you can't understand that simple statement it's because you have no idea what faith is because you spend your life trying to justify yourself by trying to obey the law, which ends up being a one-way trip down to hades.

WHAT "overwhelming evidences"??? You've been shown that what God wrote with His own finger in stone is eternal (Psalm 111:7-8), that in the New Covenant He did not alter the thing (His Ten Commandments) gone from His lips (Psalms 89:34), that Christians establish the Ten Commandments (Romans 3:31), and a host of other Biblical proofs that reprove your desire to worship God according to "my will" instead of "Thy will". A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another. Matt. 22:36-40 - "Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 37Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophet. These are the only two commandments any Christian needs to live by because when we do these we are keeping all ten. "If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed," now what do you think we are free from? We are free from the need to observe the outside law, because the law of liberty/love is greater.

Oh, how I hope that before you meet Him, you'll let the Holy Spirit write the Ten Commandments on your heart, including the seventh day Sabbath commandment to rest and fellowship with God and the brethren...because James says that the Ten Commandment "Law of Liberty" is that which Jesus will judge us by. If grace is made to be a license to sin, it is no longer grace, it is disgrace. Truly you have absolutely no concept of what the law of liberty consists of but than again, how could you because you're still in bondage (to your eternal peril) to the written law. Grace is not a license to sin, it's just the knowledge of 1 John 1:9. Jesus made a habit of breaking the sabbath, are you going to send him to hell too?

No husband is bold enough to insist that he have use of the forgiving heart of his wife as an excuse to cheat on her "now and again". We should be lamenting our failures and begging Jesus to both forgive and change us, not celebrating them because our failure to make a full surrender shuts us out from the overcoming power of Christ to make us "more than conquerors".

Now, you're being obtuse and thinking more highly of yourself and your errant ways than you ought to think. Most of us are striving to live a life that God will approve of, but in the end, at judgement day, he is not going to judge us by OUR righteousness, we will be judged by the righteousness of Christ covering our failures. If you're depending on yours, woe to you!

Trekson · Feb 19, 2019

Windmillcharge said:
It is interesting how few people remember that Jesus said, 'If, if You Love Me. YOU will keep my commands.'
Strangely Jesus's commands include the 10 commandments.

Reduced to two, Matt. 22:36-40.

Keraz · Feb 20, 2019

Trekson said:
Reduced to two, Matt. 22:36-40.

Actually expanded and clarified by Jesus and the Apostles:
The Ten Commandments and the New Covenant:
Exodus 20:3-17:

1/ You shall have no other gods before Me.

It is written: You shall worship the Lord your God and Him only you shall serve. Luke 4:8, Matthew 4:10, Rev. 14:7

2/ You must not make for yourself a carved image, a likeness of anything in heaven, on earth, or under the sea.

God is Spirit and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth. John 4:24, Acts 15:20, 1 Cor. 6:9, Ephesians 5:5, 1 Peter 4:3, 1 John 5:21, Rev. 2:14

3/ You shall not take the Name of the Lord your God in vain.

I say to you: do not swear at all…let your yes be yes and your no be no, for whatever is more than these is from the evil one. Matthew 5:34-37, 1 Tim. 6:1, James 2:7

4/ Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.

The Sabbath [seventh day] was made for man, not man for the Sabbath, so the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath. Mark 2:27-28, For Christians that seventh day is Sunday, as the first day of our week is Monday. Acts 20:7, 1 Cor. 16:2

5/ Honour your father and mother.

Children, obey your parents in the Lord, for this is right. Ephesians 6:1, Col 3:20

6/ You shall not murder.

I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, pray for those who abuse you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. Matthew 5:44-45, Matt. 5:21-26, Romans 13:9, 1 Tim. 1:9, 1 John 3:15

7/ You shall not commit adultery.

I say to you whoever even looks at another in lust has already committed adultery in their heart. Matthew 5:28, 1 Cor. 5:11, 1 Cor. 6:18, Galatians 5:19, Hebrews 13:4

8/ You shall not steal.

Neither thieves, the greedy, or drunkards and robbers will inherit the Kingdom. 1 Cor. 6:10, Romans 2:21, Mark 7:21, Ephesians 4:28

9/ You shall not bear false witness.

For by your words, you will be justified and by your words you will be condemned. Matthew 15:19, Ephesians 4:25, Col. 3:9

10/ You shall not covet your neighbours possessions.

Take heed and beware of covetousness, for one’s life does not consist of the things he possesses. Luke 12:15, Romans 7:7, Ephesians 5:3, 1 Tim. 6:10, Hebrews 13:5

Further New Testament scriptures:

John 1:17 The Law was given through Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

Luke 16:16a The Law and the prophets were until John the Baptizer, now the good news of the Kingdom is preached...

Matthew 5:17 I have come not to abolish the Law, but to complete it.

Romans 6:15 Can we sin then because we are not under the Law? God forbid!

Galatians 5:14 The whole Law is fulfilled in this: You shall love your neighbour as yourself.

Are the Ten Commandments still in effect? In principal they still are, now incorporated into the New Covenant, for which Jesus is the mediator. Those Ten Commandments are restated and expanded under the New Covenant, we must obey them and do God’s will for us today. Matthew 5:20, 1 Peter 2:16

mjrhealth · Feb 20, 2019

Keraz said:
Actually expanded and clarified by Jesus and the Apostles:
The Ten Commandments and the New Covenant:
Exodus 20:3-17:

1/ You shall have no other gods before Me.

It is written: You shall worship the Lord your God and Him only you shall serve. Luke 4:8, Matthew 4:10, Rev. 14:7

2/ You must not make for yourself a carved image, a likeness of anything in heaven, on earth, or under the sea.

God is Spirit and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth. John 4:24, Acts 15:20, 1 Cor. 6:9, Ephesians 5:5, 1 Peter 4:3, 1 John 5:21, Rev. 2:14

Are the Ten Commandments still in effect? In principal they still are, now incorporated into the New Covenant, for which Jesus is the mediator. Those Ten Commandments are restated and expanded under the New Covenant, we must obey them and do God’s will for us today. Matthew 5:20, 1 Peter 2:16

No it wasnt, as the bible says, even Christ pointed out,

Joh_7:19 Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law? Why go ye about to kill me?

Who did the law come by..??

Joh_1:17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

How did Christ come

Joh_1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Pity so few believe Him...

marks · Feb 20, 2019

Phoneman777 said:
The two ideas: Christians are to give God control of their lives...and...Christians are free to break the Ten Commandments...are contradictory. Yet, most Christians are taught and willingly accept we can break the Ten Commandments all day long and still go to heaven.

So, we're supposed to believe that people really prefer the suffering of this life over the unspeakable joy of heaven? Nah, people are scared of death because they aren't ready to meet Jesus. Plain and simple.

Hi Phoneman777,

Yes, I believe, that to close my eyes in death here is to open them to the heavenly realm, without a pause. Just 'absent from the body and present with Jesus'.

And of course we are not under the Law as given to Israel, including the 10 commandments. No one could keep them, you are not required to, and if you try, you willing put yourself into needless bondage. Do you really feel that you are not ready for death unless you are perfectly keeping the Law?

But to your point, that I'm still here only because I'm afraid to die. I'm not. I'm at peace with God. I know He loves me, and that when my time here is over, He will carry me safely to Himself, as it were.

And if my only hope for having that peace is if I keep the Law - not just the 10, mind you, James declares it's all one - then that's not much hope at all. But my hope is in Jesus.

Why am I not suiciding? I don't believe that's what God wants me to do. I don't think He wants anyone to do that. So why should I?

To avoid the pain and suffering of this life? But that would be to cheat myself of the rewards and glory in the world to come! There's no way in the world that I want to lose any reward or glory in the coming ages!

This is our one opportunity, so far as what the Bible specifies, in which we can produce fruit, to store treasures in heaven, to grow in glory. The affliction, the suffering, the whatever it is that you find so difficult to trust God for, is so short, so little, compared to the richness of the reward and glory that we will know worlds without end.

Isn't it good to know that Father knows best, and we can trust that He actually is working for our good!

Much love!
Mark

Phoneman777 · Feb 20, 2019

marks said:
Hi Phoneman777,

Yes, I believe, that to close my eyes in death here is to open them to the heavenly realm, without a pause. Just 'absent from the body and present with Jesus'.

And of course we are not under the Law as given to Israel, including the 10 commandments. No one could keep them, you are not required to, and if you try, you willing put yourself into needless bondage. Do you really feel that you are not ready for death unless you are perfectly keeping the Law?

But to your point, that I'm still here only because I'm afraid to die. I'm not. I'm at peace with God. I know He loves me, and that when my time here is over, He will carry me safely to Himself, as it were.

And if my only hope for having that peace is if I keep the Law - not just the 10, mind you, James declares it's all one - then that's not much hope at all. But my hope is in Jesus.

Why am I not suiciding? I don't believe that's what God wants me to do. I don't think He wants anyone to do that. So why should I?

To avoid the pain and suffering of this life? But that would be to cheat myself of the rewards and glory in the world to come! There's no way in the world that I want to lose any reward or glory in the coming ages!

This is our one opportunity, so far as what the Bible specifies, in which we can produce fruit, to store treasures in heaven, to grow in glory. The affliction, the suffering, the whatever it is that you find so difficult to trust God for, is so short, so little, compared to the richness of the reward and glory that we will know worlds without end.

Isn't it good to know that Father knows best, and we can trust that He actually is working for our good!

Much love!
Mark

I too am not afraid to die, for I know that my Jesus in me is what keeps this once professional sinner from daily crucifying Him afresh. If you believe God wants you to stay, by all means do that. However, the question I raise is tremendously provocative.

Can one really be blamed for being suspicious of those who habitually deny our obligation to obey the spirit of the Ten Commandments, day by day, hour by hour, moment by moment - when they give as a reason for not immediately departing this miserable, horrible planet their sudden desire to be obedient to the letter and spirit what they believe is God's will for them: to remain on Earth for the time being?

The outward "letter" of the seventh day Sabbath is that we "rest", but the inward "spirit" of the Sabbath is "rest in Jesus" and the outward rest is a symbol of the inward rest (Hebrews 4:9-10). The one is a memorial to our Creator who made all things and the other is a memorial to our Redeemer Who made in us a new heart.

Again, why should anyone believe that others so unconcerned about obedience to what we know God wrote with His own finger so definitively in stone are all of a sudden concerned about total compliance with what they "believe" based purely on speculation what God wants for them?

marks · Feb 20, 2019

Phoneman777 said:
I too am not afraid to die, for I know that my Jesus in me is what keeps this once professional sinner from daily crucifying Him afresh. If you believe God wants you to stay, by all means do that. However, the question I raise is tremendously provocative.

Why not kill yourself? What is provocative about that? Unless you really mean it, but I don't think that.

I think it's a matter of giving a false alternative, either enter into bondage under the Law, or just off yourself. But I see a different way in Scripture.

Can one really be blamed for being suspicious of those who habitually deny our obligation to obey the spirit of the Ten Commandments, day by day, hour by hour, moment by moment - when they give as a reason for not immediately departing this miserable, horrible planet their sudden desire to be obedient to the letter and spirit what they believe is God's will for them: to remain on Earth for the time being?

I'm not sure what you are saying here, but I guess you are justifying yourself for being suspicious of me becaue I think God wants me here, and I have a sudden desire to obey the Letter and spirit.

But it's so much simpler, even nicer. I know that God wants me here. Here I am.

I'll know when He wants me to go. There I'll go.

And in the meantime, I am content to remain, and even more than content, I want to. I want to bear fruit in others towards their glory, imparting some gift, and to receive the reward of my serving, and the glories of my afflictions.

It sounds like you are asking why would I be concerned about doing what I believe God wants me to do even though it's not what you think I should do.

Is that right?

Much love!
mark

Phoneman777 · Feb 20, 2019

marks said:
Why not kill yourself? What is provocative about that? Unless you really mean it, but I don't think that.

It's provocative not because of it's shock value - but because of the result, which is leaving behind a place of daily heartache, pain, suffering, and death for a place so glorious the Bible says we can't even begin to imagine. Who but an insane person would choose to stay if there's nothing (is there?) preventing his departure?

I think it's a matter of giving a false alternative, either enter into bondage under the Law, or just off yourself. But I see a different way in Scripture.

Since "bondage under the law" refers to one's attempt by obedience to obtain salvation, there is no need to debate this since I'm sure we both agree salvation comes not by the law, but by grace. As for "false alternatives", I'm not offering any alternatives, I'm questioning motivations which such professed beliefs in the OP call into question.

I'm not sure what you are saying here, but I guess you are justifying yourself for being suspicious of me becaue I think God wants me here, and I have a sudden desire to obey the Letter and spirit.

This OP has nothing to do with me. It has to do with those who subscribe to the belief that Christians have no obligation to refrain from killing, stealing, lying, etc. like they claim they have no Sabbath obligation. So, I take it a step further and ask why are you all still here then?

I know that God wants me here. Here I am.

How do you know? Did He tell you because you certainly have not as of yet offered any verse to suggest that. Now, since you keep dragging me into this, I'll tell you how I know I'm not supposed to kill myself: Exodus 20:13

It sounds like you are asking why would I be concerned about doing what I believe God wants me to do even though it's not what you think I should do.

No, I'm asking if you can appreciate how suspicious it sounds when you who are so adamant about not doing what God has plainly written with His own finger in stone all of a sudden become so duty conscientious when it comes to the question of why you guys are still here if you really believe we're not duty bound to "thou shalt not kill" and believe the next stop is eternal joy with Jesus. I'm not saying you're lying, it just sounds so convenient.

I just can't see why those who claim to be so ready to meet Jesus and insist there's nothing stopping them from doing so would rather stay down here a minute longer...except that they really aren't ready, or deep down they really know they are as obligated to "thou shalt not kill" as they are "Remember the Sabbath day.."

marks · Feb 20, 2019

Phoneman777 said:
No, I'm asking if you can appreciate how suspicious it sounds when you who are so adamant about not doing what God has plainly written with His own finger in stone all of a sudden become so duty conscientious when it comes to the question of why you guys are still here if you really believe we're not duty bound to "thou shalt not kill" and believe the next stop is eternal joy with Jesus. I'm not saying you're lying, it just sounds so convenient.

So does Salvation by grace through faith, does it not? Extremely convenient!

But meanwhile, it's a Non Sequitor to say that because I believe God wants me here so I stay, therefore, I must also believe in keeping the 10 commandments.

It's like saying that since I pay taxes in America, isn't there some contradiction considering I don't pay taxes in Japan?

I obey Christ. I am dead to the Law.

And remember. You don't get to choose which laws you do and don't keep. James wrote that if you break one of them, you are a law breaker.

Now. Who is your Levite that is within your gates? Have you given your 10th to him? Have you kept the feasts in Jerusalem? Where is your Levitical priest to whom you show your skin infections, offering the appropriate sacrifices?

After all, God included this is His covenant of Law.

As Paul said, not lawless, but under the Law of Christ.

Tell me . . . in Romans 7, as God uses the example of marriage to explain to us that we are "dead to the law", what does that phrase mean to you?

Much love!
Mark

marks · Feb 20, 2019

Now this part, I think this is great!

Phoneman777 said:
The solution is this: make a FULL SURRENDER TO CHRIST, thank Him for each day He wakes you up, and ask Him "what is Thy bidding, Thou wonderful, merciful Savior, blessed Redeemer and Friend?"

WHY ARE MANY OF US STILL HERE?

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